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Author Topic: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile  (Read 93347 times)

Offline AnandAadhar

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #105 on: February 20, 2013, 10:33:12 AM »
Here are some drawings I made. I need more pics to finish/correct.
The last drawing is just because the replica I saw of it was a joke. The angles while not right, yet alone aligned. Was not to scale on any level. It was like watching someone put an engine together wrong and then wonder why is does not work. When then pistons are miss aligned or the timing is off. Please do it right or not at all. Because it is only a hindrance! I'm not trying to sound mean, just making an important point.

Ah, wait a minute, now I understand. With 'the last drawing' you refer to my replication of the 'hammer' design. Well, that is not Finsrud but another inventor/artist/impression maker called George Delk. Delk is discussed at http://www.overunity.com/8568/new-magnet-powered-perpetual-motion-machine/nowap/#.USSdD44QPIc Nobody ever succeeded in getting any sensible information from Delk about his kinetic artwork. He never said it was a working perpetuum mobile. He proposed his thing with a question mark. He said somewhere that it was running for three years. I tried something and posted it. He responded by saying:

Quote
"Very nice job. I especially like the pivoting side magnets. Possibly weight above the pivot point of the pendulum is needed. The design that I am now working on uses very small neodymium magnets and extremely lightweight materials. They do take considerable time to built and adjust."

Nobody could copy his result without cheating, as far as I know, nor did we see his latest 'lightweight neodymium version'.
By the way, see also this failed attempt to replicate Delk: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=iduT53y0sxY


Concerning your grumpy remarks about my work here I posted another question at Delk's Youtube page about it. Maybe he will answer this, but I doubt it. Artists as a rule never properly answer questions about their work because they exploit the illusion they create.

He in 2010 wrote:
Quote
"Actually, it has been runnning for almost three years now. Thank you for the 4 stars. If your friend can produce these and sell them profitably, more power to him. It does invite interesting conversation. Cheers"

Yes, 'conversation' he says. That is his idea of his effect... That is not very serious if you would be breaking the known laws (or principles) of nature with this thing... So he throws you in doubt. He plays a game so it seems. Or it his psychology of coping with his own genious... and that latter supposition I give little credence.

But, admitted, what I did could be done better, you are right, better magnets, better angles, alignment, proportions, weights  etc., and maybe I will try a better replication even though, as I said in my Youtube movie about it, I cannot see any reason why the damn thing shouldn't stop in the middle... apart from the idea that the magnetic gravitational action of the sliders is overruling the pendulum action and thus breaks away from the laws of thermodynamics and the dead middle.  If Delk would have defended it as perpetual motion, I would have tried better.... but he did not. And without the claim it is still "considerable time to build and adjust" He responded more like an artist interested in likewise renderings of this created illusion. For how can you replicate a PM claim that is not proposed actually?

Thanks for opening this discussion again. You ask me to do it right or not at all, and I will give it a try again maybe..., but do not hesitate to do something yourself right too. Don't point your finger at me. This blog is not just for armchair nerds who themselves try nothing in reality. Passive bystanders have easy commenting, but no right to speak actually. But okay, you are virtually involved and committed now, thanks, and lets be friends on this. Delk's is certainly an easier thing to replicate than Finsrud's.

links and description about Delk and my 'clumsy failing' with it:
http://peswiki.com/index.php/OS:Perpetual_Magnetic_Pendulum_by_George_Delk
Delk's only presentation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZjNbjhxgt4


Another interesting candidate of an almost Perpetual Motion is this balancing pendulum (see picture) making 40.000 oscillations/day which does seemingly better than Finsrud running for longer than a life time on about two billionths(!) of an amp:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZDxzaNsI7Q

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #105 on: February 20, 2013, 10:33:12 AM »

Offline ace569er

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #106 on: February 21, 2013, 03:03:24 AM »
I was actually referring to you, yes. Just kind of felt bad saying it, but still felt, it needed to be said. Like I said though, I was referring to the last drawing only. The hammer one. Which still may need a cheater magnet to run.  First an exact replica must be made. Then there is the time to calibrate it, which will be rough. To be able to rule it out.

Offline ace569er

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #107 on: February 21, 2013, 06:58:53 AM »
OK, I like the second replication. It more or less killed my desire to build it...It even appears to move at the same angle of degree. Thanks for the vid. That last one doesn't do much for me. Can't think of a way to draw work from it. Nor do I find it appealing art wise. It's is a very good design though.
   I have been testing the 12 magnet placement(if it is even 12). For the base in Finsrud's Main forth pendulum. I think I might have their placement. Most likely not, but from what I test I think maybe. Sadly I'd have to build it. To rule out, that my powered, simulation of the spring torque, and outer pendulums can run the center one. Then in return themselves. In which I do not see me getting the pieces I'd need to make it any time soon. So if any one wants this Sketchup file, let me know.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #107 on: February 21, 2013, 06:58:53 AM »
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Offline AnandAadhar

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #108 on: February 21, 2013, 08:52:02 AM »
OK, I like the second replication. It more or less killed my desire to build it...It even appears to move at the same angle of degree. Thanks for the vid. That last one doesn't do much for me. Can't think of a way to draw work from it. Nor do I find it appealing art wise. It's is a very good design though.
   I have been testing the 12 magnet placement(if it is even 12). For the base in Finsrud's Main forth pendulum. I think I might have their placement. Most likely not, but from what I test I think maybe. Sadly I'd have to build it. To rule out, that my powered, simulation of the spring torque, and outer pendulums can run the center one. Then in return themselves. In which I do not see me getting the pieces I'd need to make it any time soon. So if any one wants this Sketchup file, let me know.


Share what you have, the more we know the greater the chance of success in this matter.

Offline ace569er

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #109 on: February 21, 2013, 11:33:55 PM »
Here you are. Please fix anything you think is off and send it to me. I'll try to compile the ideas together. Hope enough people, do it. There is a few things I am not happy with, mainly the wire, pendulum tripper. I can't get the angles to match the distance...... So something is wrong. Also I don't see how the base is separated from the, track support, arms and attached the spring. So the track can tilt. Would love feed back from anyone who has seen it in person. The file is a compressed sketch up file, enjoy.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #109 on: February 21, 2013, 11:33:55 PM »
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Offline ace569er

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #110 on: February 22, 2013, 12:24:05 AM »
Tho I posted this else where to  answer a question. I paste it here to because I think it appeals;


Though this is just an educated guess....I think the center pendulum is moved by the magnet that tilts the spring as well as the balls weight on the tilted wheel putting pressure on the spring(big one). Also the 3 pendulums are off set to the same side as the very large magnet, on them, is offset on. I think this helps push the center pendulum. If I arrange all repelling magnets in the position shown. Then stop it and just touch it it want to go in that pattern about 2-7 rotations. if you kick it with just one of the three off sets you can keep it going around. I think this is at least somewhat close to what makes the center pendulum move. Sadly everything relys on everything else to run, in my option. so it is hard to test, with a controlled pendulum to push it. yet alone the ball and spring factor. Unless it is completely  built. So I hope this model helps a working replication to be made. Because I want one!!!!!!!!

Offline AnandAadhar

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #111 on: February 22, 2013, 11:39:22 AM »
Here you are. Please fix anything you think is off and send it to me. I'll try to compile the ideas together. Hope enough people, do it. There is a few things I am not happy with, mainly the wire, pendulum tripper. I can't get the angles to match the distance...... So something is wrong. Also I don't see how the base is separated from the, track support, arms and attached the spring. So the track can tilt. Would love feed back from anyone who has seen it in person. The file is a compressed sketch up file, enjoy.
Thanks, nice work to see it three dimensionally....

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #111 on: February 22, 2013, 11:39:22 AM »
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Offline AnandAadhar

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #112 on: March 03, 2013, 02:34:22 PM »
I have created a second replication.
The video is at:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2QsWr5r7PM
please your comments..
« Last Edit: March 03, 2013, 05:38:38 PM by AnandAadhar »

Offline AnandAadhar

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #113 on: March 03, 2013, 05:37:17 PM »
I have designed a second replication.
The video is at:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2QsWr5r7PM
please your comments..


-------

B.t.w.see also this earlier failed attempt of someone else.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxU3MjL35R0

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #113 on: March 03, 2013, 05:37:17 PM »
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Offline ace569er

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #114 on: March 25, 2013, 05:54:54 AM »
Nice I like it it looks good.

Here is my finished, Finsrud's PMD 3-D replication.
 
Curious if anyone who downloaded it, modified or improved upon it? Please if so upload them, I am, very, interested in seeing them!

Offline AnandAadhar

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #115 on: March 25, 2013, 09:33:59 AM »
Nice I like it it looks good.

Here is my finished, Finsrud's PMD 3-D replication.
 
Curious if anyone who downloaded it, modified or improved upon it? Please if so upload them, I am, very, interested in seeing them!


Great job! Is there also an animation or 3d  manipulable file to study your design from all sides?
I'm not sure what that green cogwheel thing at picture six would be in Finsrud's machine...
And what do you think would be the magnetic arrangement inside in the base?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #115 on: March 25, 2013, 09:33:59 AM »
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Offline ace569er

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #116 on: March 26, 2013, 05:20:33 AM »
That is something I'm building. I am using several ideas combined to achieve my goal, hopefully. I'm personally very surprised, no one has used magnets in this array. Which gets both the simulated mono pole effect of a V gate.  As well as the counter push and pull,(non-single pole drive) to weaken the gates sticky point(lock). Making the lock no longer ten times, plus, stronger than the gates push, but instead, far, weaker than it.  While keeping the simulated monopole effect that drives(and locks) the movement. While at the same time increasing the drive force.
 Making the lock point calibrate-able. Weakening to lock, or if overdone relocating, the lock. So that 11 armatures pushing the 1 can be far stronger than the lock. Instead of just strong enough, to move it. Also to get those degrees, wider then the flux field. It had to be 8 foot around, not good enough. Breath could stop it, unless....You could calibrate the lock, without weakening the drive. Then I figured out how.
 Moving it out of the lock range, is useless. Because you must use more energy to move it out of range. Then more to put it back and more keep it there. Which is equal to or more than it would take to just push through the lock. Even though it is 7-15 times stronger then the drive. Depending on the the degree it opens within the length of the gate. After so much, the drive weakens. So Calibrating the lock is the only way to overcome it. Without going very, very large. To make sure there are no two armatures, are in a lock's field at the same time. While keeping the degree separating to achieve The same drive at all 12 points. At all times.
 Then Just for fun add a overbalance and use Finsrud's design to till it as it moves, as well as some other use of springs, pendulums, & a few other ideas. Of which I have never seen any of these ideas I have, even partly combined. If even thought of, to hopefully make a beautiful, working, work of art. I'll tell more if anyone can guess what I mean, with my vague riddle like statements.

Offline ace569er

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #117 on: March 26, 2013, 05:29:57 AM »
here's the file. Of Finsrud's art masterpiece.

Offline maw2432

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Re: Finsrud's Perpetuum Mobile
« Reply #118 on: March 26, 2013, 10:12:55 PM »
ace
Nice work.   
Bill

 

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