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Mechanical free energy devices => mechanic => Topic started by: e2matrix on September 30, 2013, 07:27:23 PM

Title: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on September 30, 2013, 07:27:23 PM
     Since Stefan has now posted a video of it and I don't yet see any discussion here about it I'll venture to start some discussion on yet another self runner.   The video is currently the top video on the main page here.   There has been some discussion at the EF forum on this and I managed to get in touch with the guy.   He has this web site :  http://valyenergistar.ro/    where he is selling this device as well as some more traditional energy systems (wind, solar etc.).   He has a 5 year warranty on all his items.   The video of the self runner shows it needs power from the grid to get started (only about 30 seconds) but once started powers itself and additional devices.   It's shown running an angle grinder (usually 10 to 15 amps), a table saw and a welder all of which have fairly high power demands.   The device appears to be another along the lines of a Bedini - Watson motor gen with a big flywheel.  Chas Campbell's device as seen in Patrick Kelly's free energy book is also similar and I've seen at least 4 other devices over the past few years using similar setups.   


   Valky is the inventor apparently.   I've had a couple emails with him and have gotten brief answers.   He speaks Romanian so I've had to write in that language using Google translate to him and his replies come in Romanian.   So far the only answers I've gotten to a number of questions are that it will be ready to sell in 3 weeks and the cost will be 1.20 Euros per watt (or about $1.62 U.S. dollars per watt at current exchange rates.)   The device appears to be quite heavy and I doubt it would be reasonable for anyone in the U.S. to buy one (if they really work as stated) due to shipping costs on top of a fairly high initial price.   On the other hand if one could buy a small unit and already had an inverter/battery bank setup one could use this to keep the battery bank charged and an average home could probably do fine with a small generator like this except for air conditioning and cooking stoves.   One might realize savings after a year or two.   


   However I'm sure the biggest question is does this really work?    Would you be selling something that does not work?   Sure some people would and probably make a couple sales but the world being what it is now with the Internet you won't go too far without being exposed.   And he does have the stated 5 year warranty.   I'm not sure what laws are in place in Europe or Romania to protect consumers but I suspect one could not easily claim that and expect to sell a bogus device and get away with it easily.   
I personally have come across enough info and evidence that there is something in the flywheel and time control effect that I believe this could be the real thing.   
Some people who have used this concept:
Bedini
Watson
Chas Campbell
French company close to selling:  http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Power_JMD  - believed to be a self looped motor generator
Pete Sumarack (Zero Amp technology)
Michael at http://www.backgauges.com/Gen-E-Sys%20II/index.html
A Russian inventor with a complete packaged unit (I was never able to get more info by email but his unit appears to be one of this type)
This device shown in a video appears similar: http://technokontrol.com/en/products/generator.php
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Geoffrey_S._Miller's_Energybat_Labs
Charles (forget the last name but was recently discussed her in the last couple months - home built unit)
and a number of others who for various reasons seemed to have accidents or sudden reversals after going public with their claims.
There are others some of which may or may not have flywheels but this type of device seems to be the type that most attracts the suppressors (call them what you want, MIB's, Oil barron thugs, or whatever) so I tend to believe these devices hold the most promise for providing real usable power.
Anyone here from Romania?   

Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on September 30, 2013, 07:32:10 PM
I see this device has hit the radar of www.peswiki.com .   Sterling said on there the price is one Euro per watt.   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tak22 on September 30, 2013, 07:44:57 PM
Hmmm... I wonder why one of the wooden frame supports is longer and runs under the workbench?  :( Surely if you can make such a tidy unit you could cut two pieces of wood to the same length?


tak
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ariovaldo on September 30, 2013, 07:55:43 PM
It looks like a normal motor and normal generator.
There is another video that I saw sometimes ago.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=98aiISB2DNw


What do you think?


The configurations looks like approximately the same.

Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on September 30, 2013, 08:34:15 PM
It looks like a normal motor and normal generator.
There is another video that I saw sometimes ago.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=98aiISB2DNw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=98aiISB2DNw)


What do you think?


The configurations looks like approximately the same.


Yes that is yet another one I've seen but forgot when writing the OP.   He may have something also but if I recall his method of showing input and output are lacking as he only shows one I believe.   
I've been looking further at the French company I mentioned above.   They also need to start (at least their Prototype 1) by plugging it into the wall for a minute then once running they unplug it.   They say they are working with lawyers in the U.S. to protect IP and have plans to manufacture it in the U.S. after getting complete testing done (apparently so it can be UL certified?).   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: totoalas on September 30, 2013, 11:43:39 PM
Jasondaz2009  has shown  in YT his recent Meralco bill wayback in May2013 and was also featured in Peswiki
 
totoalas :)
 
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 01, 2013, 12:34:09 AM
Jasondaz2009  has shown  in YT his recent Meralco bill wayback in May2013 and was also featured in Peswiki
 
totoalas :)
Yes I saw that one also and while it looks good it doesn't seem to involve a flywheel.   It does appear he will be selling it in his country and possibly plans too.   If enough of these type machines come out at the same time I think it will be hard to stop the revolution that may come about.   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinu on October 01, 2013, 12:48:29 AM
 Hi e2matrix and all,
However I'm sure the biggest question is does this really work?   
Lights flickers several times during start up – that’s normal, of course. But what’s abnormal is they flicker when the "self-powering switch" it turned on (at 01:08). Go figure…
 
Again, part of the wiring is done through the metal chassis?! And, like tak22 noticed above, the contraption is conveniently placed on wooden boards and, moreover, quite close to the power outlet despite the fact that power cord is several meters long. Also, I’m pretty sure that the wooden board extending under that working bench (and under that wooden box too!) was pure accidentally placed there and nothing is hidden underneath…
Not to mention that if I’ve had a device like that, it is absolutely certain I would’ve started it mechanically. Wouldn’t you?!
 
On the other hand, if you can agree with the inventor for a close inspection (with measurements and everything), I can do it for you  assuming he’s not too far from my location. But please get the agreement; from what I’ve seen already, imho it’s not worthy to spend the time for even a phone call. Contact data is on their site. Oh, almost forgot to mention that their site says that: “autonomous systems will be manufactured within 3 months after signing the contract”.  That’s 3 months not 3 weeks. <Autonomous system>  in Romanian language is <sistem autonom> and <months> is <luni>.
 
Best regards,
Tinu
 
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinman on October 01, 2013, 12:40:23 PM
It looks like a normal motor and normal generator.
There is another video that I saw sometimes ago.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=98aiISB2DNw


What do you think?


The configurations looks like approximately the same.
This was done by a fellow australian years ago(Chas Cambell).
25 globes at 100 watts each=2500 watts,but watt meter says 2100 watts-400 watts missing some where?.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinman on October 01, 2013, 01:18:54 PM
Guy's
Please tell me your not falling for this one?.
As tinu said-one short piece of wood under one set of legs,and a long piece that go's under a box,under the table.Motor power cable inside box section,so as cant be seen where it is running-through to the switch and down the leg,then under the board to a power supply i suspect.
Take note of how much energy(power) was required to build the flywheel speed up to running speed. Once up to speed,you now have one large energy reserve.
The angle grinder may be rated at 2000 watt's,but will not draw that much when up and running,unless fully loaded down. Only a short burst of high startup current would have been required to get the grinder up to speed. Using the grinder as he was,would not use any where near it's rated power capacity.Same go's for the table saw-a quick burst of startup current(dampend by the flywheel),then a small piece of wood cut.
Then when he used the welder,you could hear the flywheel winding down quickly-this is why he only did a few quick runs with the welder.

This is clearly a fake-scam,and the warranty would only cover parts-not a Guarantee of a self runner.
Every part in that setup runs at a loss,as far as mechanical to electrical go's.
Electric motor=loss,due to heat disipation and ohmic losses
Bearing's=loss,due to heat and friction
Belts=loss,due to heat and friction
Generator=loss,due to heat and ohmic losses
Flywheel=loss-due to air friction.A flywheel will only ever give back what you put into it-nothing more.

Your first look should be to find where gains might be made. If you only come up with losses(as listed above)and no gains-then you have your answer.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on October 01, 2013, 04:28:00 PM
Lights flickers several times during start up – that’s normal, of course. But what’s abnormal is they flicker when the "self-powering switch" it turned on (at 01:08). Go figure…

Hi Tinu and all,

to be fare to this experimenter I must bring to your attention that what you think is lights flickering when he switches to loop mode may not be correct.
The change in light density is caused by the camera panning and the cameras arpature changing for the different light condition compared to the work bench. Notice the light density changes before you here the click of the switch.

Again, part of the wiring is done through the metal chassis?!

Yes, he used parts the chassis as wire conduit!... I would of done the same to protect the wires and make the device look clean. Noticed his shop is clean and organized. So his device will also be made this way.

And, like tak22 noticed above, the contraption is conveniently placed on wooden boards and, moreover, quite close to the power outlet despite the fact that power cord is several meters long. Also, I’m pretty sure that the wooden board extending under that working bench (and under that wooden box too!) was pure accidentally placed there and nothing is hidden underneath…

Do you not think it's possible that one wood support board was purposely extended so to give a little extra side to side support in case someone or something would bump into it?... as he made his frame very narrow, probably to save space and claim it takes a small footprint. The wooden box looks like it has things in it and could be used as a weight.

Not to mention that if I’ve had a device like that, it is absolutely certain I would’ve started it mechanically. Wouldn’t you?!

Judging the size of the induction motor I would say it is 3 to 5 HP so, are you saying you would start it mechanically by hand?... if so I don't think a person can output that much HP
 
From my most recent experience, I would not be so quick to say this device is a fake.

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 01, 2013, 07:22:41 PM
tinu,  thanks for your response in clarifying some things.  It was in a personal email to him that he said they would be ready in 3 weeks.   In regards to his wood base on the metal frame -- if I had built that I would have also put it on a wood base.   It looked to me like his shop had a dirt floor and the way that setup runs and the weight of that big motor it would probably dig itself into the dirt and be less stable.   I could see it easily tipping over without some long boards attached to the base.   I won't be so quick to dismiss this as fake either.  He has a regular business seling wind, solar and so on.   Does he want to risk his business by selling something that does not do what he claims?   


tinu,  Are you in Romania?   If so don't you think it would be at least worth talking to the guy even if there is only a 1% chance that this is the real thing?   I have seen enough evidence over the last 20 plus years that flywheel based setups may be tapping energy in a way we have been kept in the dark about.   There are a lot of people that have stated this is possible including some very well known and respected researchers / inventors.   

 
I had a friend some years ago from Romania who was a scientist.   She is in the U.S.  and although I've lost contact with her if I could find a way to contact her I might try seeing if she can help out with this as she regularly would visit Romania.   Unless someone else checks this out I won't give up hope on this just based on speculation.   



gotoluc,  thanks for your input on this too.   



tinman, since your in Australia have you ever tried to contact or see Chas Campbell's setup?   He seemed sincere in his work and wasn't asking for any money and wasn't even trying to sell his concept.   Seems I remember it was more of a "This is my free gift to the world" sort of deal.   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinu on October 01, 2013, 10:33:59 PM
 Hi Gotuluc,
 
I’ve already considered the possibility of light flickering due to panning but it was obvious to me the case here is a change in light coming from the bulb not in aperture.  A change in aperture would affect the luminosity of the whole image not just of parts of it. Here, the change in light intensity is visible in the left side of the image, most notably on the workbench but not on other sides, namely where the light from the bulb is either not casted or is too low in intensity due to distance. Also, it seemed almost certain to me that the camera is fixed aperture (and fixed focal length) but I suspect we are departing from the main subject.
 
However, I made a slight error because time is not exactly 01:08 like I wrote yesterday but fractions of a second before 01:08. That is before panning (read walking) toward the control panel. Flickering is clearly visible on the workbench and simultaneously the sound of accelerating motor is heard. That’s when the young guy turns on the “Mot ON” switch and its sound is there too, although not very clear. Please note there are two switches, the one under the voltmeter is turned on a second later and its sound is more clear but of no relevance here.
 
So yes, I might be wrong in principle but I insist there is strong evidences in this particular instance I’m right. I firmly believe that “Mot ON” switch supplies power to the motor which is taken from the outlet and the incandescence bulb proves it without much doubts imho.
 
Regarding other issues, I can agree with you but not when one pretends he has discovered the creation of energy from nothing. “An extraordinary claim requires extraordinary proof.” -  Marcello Truzzi
 
By mechanical start I was thinking to a friction device apart from the system and ideally powered by anything else except electricity, eventually a small gasoline engine. That way I could have drove with it into the woods and proving with fewer doubts the device really works as advertised.
 
I look forward to hear from your recent experience,
Tinu
 
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinu on October 01, 2013, 10:36:03 PM
 Hi e2matrix,
 
On issues:
Floor is concrete. Not of the best quality and quite thin and cracked but still concrete.
I couldn’t see a single client in his portofolio so I can’t tell if he really has a business or just a website claiming that.
As for contacting him, I am 100% convinced he is a fraud so I would do more harm than good.
Yes I’m in Romania but I’m in Bucharest and by the phone number they are in North of Romania, some 500km away.
Don’t use google translate for Romanian language. It sucks. Better use Spanish instead – I read their website saying they’ve came back from Spain so presumably they shall speak Spanish. Alternatively, I can help translating your messages (assuming you will not fall in love so to write each other huge letters). PM me if you want it.
Despite the distance from my residence, I still might be able to do a field check in several weeks if you get their agreement for it. That’s the area where I could really help, especially because of my beliefs (of fraud, in this case)[/font]. I have enough expertise  (I’m physicist) but unfortunately not much testing equipment to take with me at their location. But do you really think you’ll ever get their agreement for inspecting the “merchandise” before anything else?
Wanna bet? ;)
 
Best regards,
Tinu
 
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Temporal Visitor on October 01, 2013, 10:46:15 PM
Hello E2,

Notice you mention; "I have seen enough evidence over the last 20 plus years that flywheel based setups may be tapping energy in a way we have been kept in the dark about."

I'll point out that the "energy" that keeps this type of device (if not a cheat - and I do not judge it) in motion is simply kinetic energy developed in the solid matter of the flywheel when in motion.

Kinetic energy that is converted to mechanical energy and again converted to electrical power.  Of course we know the motor uses only electricity to produce mechanical energy known as Horsepower.

Folks: you are all intelligent - please do not say you "Just don't get it". - you "want data" - if that is true then look here:http://www.backgauges.com/Gen-... find and download the "calculator".
Watch the short 10 minute video presentation about DEVELOPING Kinetic energy & HORSEPOWER.

You can do it also, and I would enjoy trying to help you.

My frame by frame close up review of Valy's video and the suspect board leads me to believe it is simply a board with a side that did not clean up as many low quality boards exhibit the same appearance. I just do not know one way or the other for certain, keep an open mind.

Best wishes to all................. till we meet again. Hopefully very sooooooooon.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Farmhand on October 02, 2013, 12:21:23 AM
Hi e2matrix and all,Lights flickers several times during start up – that’s normal, of course. But what’s abnormal is they flicker when the "self-powering switch" it turned on (at 01:08). Go figure…
 
Again, part of the wiring is done through the metal chassis?! And, like tak22 noticed above, the contraption is conveniently placed on wooden boards and, moreover, quite close to the power outlet despite the fact that power cord is several meters long. Also, I’m pretty sure that the wooden board extending under that working bench (and under that wooden box too!) was pure accidentally placed there and nothing is hidden underneath…
Not to mention that if I’ve had a device like that, it is absolutely certain I would’ve started it mechanically. Wouldn’t you?!
 
On the other hand, if you can agree with the inventor for a close inspection (with measurements and everything), I can do it for you  assuming he’s not too far from my location. But please get the agreement; from what I’ve seen already, imho it’s not worthy to spend the time for even a phone call. Contact data is on their site. Oh, almost forgot to mention that their site says that: “autonomous systems will be manufactured within 3 months after signing the contract”.  That’s 3 months not 3 weeks. <Autonomous system>  in Romanian language is <sistem autonom> and <months> is <luni>.
 
Best regards,
Tinu

I think I agree with the board hiding a wire to the grid. My original suspicion was that there was a battery and inverter in the white box, however now that I look closely at the board in question there is a definite sussness to it.

If we look at the frame at 2:21 minutes we can see that the right hand leg of the frame sits on the board and the board is flat to the ground because of the weight on it. However if we look at the left side of the board and all the way under the box there is a gap under the board extending from the left leg of the device frame to under the box which is under the bench near where the grid power may be. Te gap under the board is consistent with the thickness of a mains cable, either a three in a row cable or even a regular two or three wire cable, the right hand side of the board is flat on the ground the left hand side of the board is above the ground even with the device sitting on it. I say it is cable fed from the grid under the board on the floor. And possibly has a battery inverter setup as well in the white box so he can show it "just runs" anywhere, or so he can show the light globe lighting from the input cable, none of the devices being powered means much at at all. That welder has got to be the smallest welder I have ever seen, If I plugged my MIG welder in and began welding 15 mm steel plate continuously I would say the machine would slow dramatically.

With all the equipment he has it would have taken about 10 seconds to trim that board off so it was long enough to just fit under the two legs of the frame, why extend it all the way to the box.

Honestly these fakes are tiresome. This guy ought to be blackballed.

Cheers



Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on October 02, 2013, 12:37:07 AM
Hi Gotuluc,
 
By mechanical start I was thinking to a friction device apart from the system and ideally powered by anything else except electricity, eventually a small gasoline engine. That way I could have drove with it into the woods and proving with fewer doubts the device really works as advertised.
 
I look forward to hear from your recent experience,
Tinu

Hi Tinu,

thanks for your reply and clarification of the mechanical start. I do agree in those condition it would be had to disprove it does not work.  I think you have an excellent idea if he is open to proving it really works. However, we have to be realistic as it would be a big job to move this 1000 pounds+ device just to please the skeptic. But who knows, he may do it.

I think there is a strong possibility the induction motor (prime mover) is operating on reactive power.  Once switched to loop mode, the current for the prime mover could be supplied by the generator.
I don't think the flywheel is used to tap into some hidden energy. I think it's there to keep the balance and momentum going between the induction motor and the generator of sudden changes in current loads, as I think you wouldn't want a direct drive between prime mover and gen as it would be a rough ride. You can think of the flywheel as maybe like a shock absorber.

Now, if the generator is supplying reactive current to the prime mover, then there should be something in the circuit (between gen and prime mover) which can do this. If the prime mover is only using reactive power from the gen then the gen should not feel the prime mover as a load since it's not using real power. If this is the case then you would expect the gen to continue its momentum without needing much more mechanical power (other than friction losses) to keep turning.
Now if the gen does not loose its momentum and the prime mover is able to use the reactive power and convert it to mechanical torque, then it could be possible for the gen to keep turning. This could all be a balancing act of energy conversions.

One thing I have observed of circuits working with reactive power is, the more load you put on then the more efficient they get. I know it's hard to believe but that is my experience

Now, if this is how this device works, you may want to ask yourself, humm ::) ... what could be the part in the circuit that could be converting the gens current to a reactive current for the prime mover to use?

I have not seen anyone mention anything about and unusual part on this device!

Please note: this is how I believe this device could works and may not be factual.

Luc
 
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Farmhand on October 02, 2013, 01:30:10 AM
Reactive power is only the difference between the applied power and the consumed power, all reactive power is derived from the supply.

Reactive power does not come from nowhere it comes from the supply and is the unconsumed portion of the applied power, if it comes from the supply and does not return it is not reactive power, any power from the supply is metered and reactive power is un-metered so to speak. If "reactive" power is used it immediately becomes real power and is metered and paid for because it does not return to the supply to un-meter the "reactive" amount from the consumed amount.

Reactive power is either not used or converted to real power.

Any power that powers a load to produce work output is "real power".

Cheers
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on October 02, 2013, 01:37:53 AM
Hi e2matrix,
 
On issues:
Floor is concrete. Not of the best quality and quite thin and cracked but still concrete.
I couldn’t see a single client in his portofolio so I can’t tell if he really has a business or just a website claiming that.
As for contacting him, I am 100% convinced he is a fraud so I would do more harm than good.
Yes I’m in Romania but I’m in Bucharest and by the phone number they are in North of Romania, some 500km away.
Don’t use google translate for Romanian language. It sucks. Better use Spanish instead – I read their website saying they’ve came back from Spain so presumably they shall speak Spanish. Alternatively, I can help translating your messages (assuming you will not fall in love so to write each other huge letters). PM me if you want it.
Despite the distance from my residence, I still might be able to do a field check in several weeks if you get their agreement for it. That’s the area where I could really help, especially because of my beliefs (of fraud, in this case)[/font]. I have enough expertise  (I’m physicist) but unfortunately not much testing equipment to take with me at their location. But do you really think you’ll ever get their agreement for inspecting the “merchandise” before anything else?
Wanna bet? ;)
 
Best regards,
Tinu

Tinu, could you please translate what he is taking about in this video:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=PFeFyKSOrHU#t=11

This video seems to be before he built the device and he seems to be describing how he is going to build it with the parts in his workshop.

Thanks

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on October 02, 2013, 01:49:58 AM
Reactive power is only the difference between the applied power and the consumed power, all reactive power is derived from the supply.

Reactive power does not come from nowhere it comes from the supply and is the unconsumed portion of the applied power, if it comes from the supply and does not return it is not reactive power, any power from the supply is metered and reactive power is un-metered so to speak. If "reactive" power is used it immediately becomes real power and is metered and paid for because it does not return to the supply to un-meter the "reactive" amount from the consumed amount.

Reactive power is either not used or converted to real power.

Any power that powers a load to produce work output is "real power".

Cheers

Hi Farmham,

thanks for your post.

If I had an electrical device operating on reactive power and an oscilloscope was attached to measure the voltage and current, what would the scope shot look like?

Thanks for your help

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ariovaldo on October 02, 2013, 04:51:52 PM
Hi Farmham,

thanks for your post.

If I had an electrical device operating on reactive power and an oscilloscope was attached to measure the voltage and current, what would the scope shot look like?

Thanks for your help

Luc


Ok, I'll gave my face to be punched.. and probably I'll be called crazy, but doesn't matter....
One year ago I started a project and I stopped before to test. I got sick and I could barely walk.
Anyway. The project is similar to this one and I have 2 options:
1) Disassemble ( is in the back yard and my wife is mad with me)
2) Go ahead and test, making the necessaries changes to speed up to the nominal generator speed. ( I need to review the sheaves sizes)
The motor is a 4 poles, single phase 1 hp. The generator is 7.5 kw.
What do you think?
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Liberty on October 02, 2013, 05:57:05 PM
Guy's
Please tell me your not falling for this one?.
As tinu said-one short piece of wood under one set of legs,and a long piece that go's under a box,under the table.Motor power cable inside box section,so as cant be seen where it is running-through to the switch and down the leg,then under the board to a power supply i suspect.
Take note of how much energy(power) was required to build the flywheel speed up to running speed. Once up to speed,you now have one large energy reserve.
The angle grinder may be rated at 2000 watt's,but will not draw that much when up and running,unless fully loaded down. Only a short burst of high startup current would have been required to get the grinder up to speed. Using the grinder as he was,would not use any where near it's rated power capacity.Same go's for the table saw-a quick burst of startup current(dampend by the flywheel),then a small piece of wood cut.
Then when he used the welder,you could hear the flywheel winding down quickly-this is why he only did a few quick runs with the welder.

This is clearly a fake-scam,and the warranty would only cover parts-not a Guarantee of a self runner.
Every part in that setup runs at a loss,as far as mechanical to electrical go's.
Electric motor=loss,due to heat disipation and ohmic losses
Bearing's=loss,due to heat and friction
Belts=loss,due to heat and friction
Generator=loss,due to heat and ohmic losses
Flywheel=loss-due to air friction.A flywheel will only ever give back what you put into it-nothing more.

Your first look should be to find where gains might be made. If you only come up with losses(as listed above)and no gains-then you have your answer.

My 2 cents worth about why conventional generators/alternators can not produce more energy out than in.

When a magnet source (either magnet or electromagnetic coil source) passes by a wire or coil, the higher the efficiency of the generator (the better the magnetic coupling) the more it loads down the source that turns the generator.  Imagine a magnet passing by a coil.  The source will always be greater than the coil output due to air gap and resistance of wire and other losses.  The better the magnetic coupling (the higher quality the generator/alternator), the more physical resistance will be coupled back to the movement of the magnetic source. 

Therefore, the output of a standard generator/alternator will always be less than the input required (always under-unity).  Adding a flywheel can help absorb peak load usage from the generator, to help maintain average speed, but adds no energy to the system.  It only stores previous energy input from the source, having the effect of leveling or averaging out the output under a pulse load.

The only way a generator can perform OU is to stop or reduce the counter magnetic force or magnetic drag of the electromagnet that generates power output.  That is where my research is centered.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinu on October 02, 2013, 07:42:04 PM
Tinu, could you please translate what he is taking about in this video:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=PFeFyKSOrHU#t=11 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=PFeFyKSOrHU#t=11)

This video seems to be before he built the device and he seems to be describing how he is going to build it with the parts in his workshop.

Thanks

Luc

 Ok, Luc.
(And I apologies for misspelling your username on my previous post!)
 
In the video various generators are being shown.
First one is a dynamo of 28kW based on Nd magnets that delivers either 690V or 400V (+/- 5% he says). Then it’s functioning is demonstrated by hand cranking, on a load of 2.5kW Bosch Flex. He explains the setup, estimating an rpm not more than 50 and specifying that only one of three phases is used. It is recommended by the inventor to be used for hydraulic or water turbines or windmills or “perpetual”(lol). The inventor’s words are “perpetual, for those who understand what perpetual means”.
 
Then he moves to the second generator, which is 7.5kW at 300 rpm, based on Nd magnets too. “Low rpm, high energy production”. Then, after excusing for not having prepared a better setup, he demonstrates it’s functioning with a 12V/21W bulb, with emphasis on the small movement of the rotor and the possibility of exceeding 21W and thus of burning out the bulb. This one can also be used for hydraulic or water turbines or windmills. (No “perpetual” this time?! Why?! )
 
Now, he moves on that paper listing the generators and he invites interested persons to get in contact with him.
 
Translation of the paper:
 
“INSTALLATIONS FOR YOUR OWN ELECTRICAL ENERGY  (note: hand writing on top; actually the wording is unclear/poorly chosen in Romanian language, the exact three words are “installations”, “current”, “own”)
 
T.M.V.
 
Installation of 3000W – 4000EUR
Installation of 5000W – 7000EUR
Installation of 20kW – 20.000EUR
Installation of 30kW – 25.000EUR
Installation of 50kW – 35.000EUR
Installation of 100kW – 45.000EUR
 
Guarantees: 5 years
 
Alternating current 220V-380V 120A 240A
 
We’ll fulfill the orders only after 60% of the contract value is paid in advance. Manufacture will be completed in 60 days after signing the contract.
 
The beneficiary obliges himself to make available an indoor surface of 10 sqm for the equipments to be installed for him.
 
…”
 
There are two more paragraphs written with smaller fonts but I can not read them accurately – they are about the obligations of the supplier.
 
Then he presents their capability of delivering solar systems and he moves onto describing the "original" 165W Japanese ("Not Chinese!") solar panel.
On the end he explains the contractual terms (basically what’s on the paper), the advance payment of 60% and the final payment of 40% after the installation in completed. However, he is saying that manufacture may take up to but no longer than 90 days (that would be due to the parts that need to be purchased). All components are new (no second hand). He also shows the three-phase station and he ends with their capabilities of manufacturing electrical systems appropriate for regular houses, cabins and even hotels, in the range of up to 100kW.
 
Sorry, but there are no clues on the energy generation out of nothing…
 
My personal feeling (and here I admit I may be wrong but I’ve seem the same case a few times already) is that they are the typical hard-working and intrepid kind-of-fellows but only with a moderate level of education (possibly as electrical or electro-mechanical technicians) who just have learn something leading them to believe that motor-generator combination can be made perpetual. It may be the case they are no aiming to fraud (I hope) but instead they’re so confident their setup will somehow work (if stronger magnets or larger windings are to be used etc), up to the point they already declare having it done and thus filming the other (and fake, imho) movie on their website. By the pronunciation, accent and wordings, I suspect they’ve come only relatively recent to work with NdFeB magnets and with their use in PM generators.
 
Best regards,
Tinu
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 02, 2013, 07:49:14 PM
Everyone please take a look at this.   It explains why there can be Over Unity in the Flyweel:
 http://www.resonantfractals.org/Magnetism/Flywheel.htm (http://www.resonantfractals.org/Magnetism/Flywheel.htm)
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 02, 2013, 08:01:18 PM
Hi tinu,  thanks for taking time to write out everything in that video.   Rather than trying to communicate further with this inventor with Google Translate I'll leave it up to you to contact him by email if you decide you want to.   His email is on his web site and it works but his contact direct through the web site did not seem to work for me so just email him if you want to.   It would be great if you could ask a few questions since you have the same language maybe he will be more open to answering some questions.   I still have hope that he may have stumbled on to the effect I believe others have found and is related to info in my previous post from this web site: 
http://www.resonantfractals.org/Magnetism/Flywheel.htm


ariovaldo,   That's nice what you have built and it would be a shame to not test it after all that work.   Please continue with your project if possible while staying out of trouble with the wife ;)    Your setup looks good but I'm not sure you will see COP > 1 without having some way of controlling the input motor (pulsing circuit or some way to create a timing for energy use versus energy extraction). 

Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinu on October 03, 2013, 12:44:09 AM
 Hi E2,
 
You’re welcome. If there is more related to my country and/or language, I’ll be glad to help for this topic as well as for others. 
 
Since I see you believe so much in the chance of OU here, I’ll try to give him a phone call, either tomorrow or the day after. If you have specific questions, please PM me or post them here. If real deal, are you interested in purchasing a system or shall I speak for myself in an attempt to get their agreement for a visit to their workshop (visit which I see not only helpful for the case but the only way to solve it)? Please note that his youtube account http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTM_EQim5JE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTM_EQim5JE) has interesting comments. Unfortunately answers are in Romanian language but here are some of them:
 
Misha25able: What principle in two words?
valy valentin: Mechanics
Misha25able: Thanks. But where energy source? Is gravity?
No answer
 
Petventures: If this is legit it could change the world and you could become one of the wealthiest inventors of all time
valy valentin: You’re right. Thanks.
 
jpmastertech: Ohhh and a Rotorverter motor from my uncle Jose Torres(the original inventor)
valy valentin: Possibly yes, but I have no knowledge about your uncle
valy valentin: But then tell me more about him
 
Donald Tejones: something hiding underneath on wooden board right footer through under the table...remove it wooden board to prove it no hidden wire to power the tools should be test
django4444: yes, you are right. There is a hidden wire, at 2:44 you can see where it comes out of the frame , then leads into the box. clearly a Fake imo
valy valentin: That box is a capacitor for stabilizing the current spikes.
Note: he admits there are hidden cables!
 
theoneagain: looks promising pal whats the deal using power caps or what?
valy valentin: I don’t understand the translation. Write in Spanish
Note: Voila, like I assumed you may write him in Spanish. Google translate does a good job for Spanish but very bad for Romanian language (at least at present times).
 
ady0187 (Ro): Ok, I can’t wait but aren’t you afraid because of the “men in black”to sell such device? (Note: the original comment is written in Ro, hence the brackets after the username)
valy valentin: My darling, but I’m not selling anything for the moment. First of all I want to document it, to fill in for a patent and then we’ll see. (1 week ago)
Note: So, is he selling it or not?! Because a refuse to sell after advertising is a sign of fraud: avoidance.
 
ady0187 (Ro): Hello. I’m member of a foreign site and they discuss about your generator in particular being …“scam” and having hidden wires under the wooden board on the right side. I too agree it looks suspicious of having that board placed under a box? Explanations?
valy valentin: Yes, you’re right but in several days the generator will be completed a you’ll see everything is true. (1 week ago)
Note: Is ady0187 here or he is on another OU forum? Please, I’m too lazy to look for members. I suppose he’s elsewhere; a week ago current topic did not exist here.
 
theoneagain: to good to be true defenitely a HOAX !!!
valy valentin: It is true.
Note: I assume he wanted to say “”it is for real” ;)
 
theoneagain: il need to see this running with my own eyes
valy valentin: ok
 
mihaisl (Ro): How much would it cost your machine? (2 months ago)
valy valentin: Current device is not yet completed. I’m still working on it. It is a 28kW out of which 3kW is for itself. What you see is for testing; when finalized it will weight around 1000kg. My price is 1EUR per watt meaning 10kW=10000EUR.
Note: Well, is he selling or not? Or is it that two months ago he wanted to sell it and by the time he replied to ady0187 (1 week ago, look above) he has changed his mind already?!
Another note: It seems from the above he believes an electrical generator takes same amount of mechanical power regardless of the load. I had the same feeling in the movie I’ve transcript above, where he uses a 2.5kW load as a “fact” but that flex motor is probably running idle on 50W or less… It looks bad. But at least we know that it takes 3kW to spin a big flywheel.
 
There are few more interesting comments but I’ll stop here. Unfortunately, my assumption he has education as an electrical technician is probably wrong. He does not seem to know what the value of a capacitor is:
MsAndru79 (Ro): I would be interested to know the capacitance of the capacitor.
valy valentin: Capacitor 13857v 125kv  50hz
neither clearly what a capacitor is used for and how in AC:
MsAndru79 (Ro): And how is the capacitor used? In series or parallel circuit?
valy valentin: Capacitor is for “reactive” and as “voltage mediator”.
nor he is acquainted with “my uncle” Mendeleev:
MsAndru79 (Ro): I assume your generator is built using neodim magnets
valy valentin: Yes, the generator is built using neodium magnets.
 
That’s all for today E2 and folks.
I hope you’ll enjoy as much as I had a really good laugh while writing it here.
 
Have fun,
Tinu
 
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on October 03, 2013, 01:16:51 AM
Great translation job Tinu!!!

I don't think he is the brain behind how this really works. He must of been given the information on how to build it or he has a friend that is camera shy who built it for him.

Noticed he said the magic word: reactive

At least he knows on what principle it's working on!

I guess I'm the only one seeing that and the unusual part on the unit.

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on October 03, 2013, 01:23:23 AM

Ok, I'll gave my face to be punched.. and probably I'll be called crazy, but doesn't matter....
One year ago I started a project and I stopped before to test. I got sick and I could barely walk.
Anyway. The project is similar to this one and I have 2 options:
1) Disassemble ( is in the back yard and my wife is mad with me)
2) Go ahead and test, making the necessaries changes to speed up to the nominal generator speed. ( I need to review the sheaves sizes)
The motor is a 4 poles, single phase 1 hp. The generator is 7.5 kw.
What do you think?

In the second post on this page  I have explained the possible principle this unit is working on.

Your device will not work with just a flywheel.

You will have to understand what reactive power is, how to create a circuit that will maintain it and send it to your prime mover.

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ariovaldo on October 03, 2013, 02:15:51 AM
In the second post on this page  I have explained the possible principle this unit is working on.

Your device will not work with just a flywheel.

You will have to understand what reactive power is, how to create a circuit that will maintain it and send it to your prime mover.

Luc
As I said, I didn't test and adjustment is necessary in the system. Also I'm very aware about reactive and I will be testing several configurations.
Thanks


Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 03, 2013, 06:46:47 PM
Thank you once again tinu for your interpretations!   valy seems to be confusing some questions about what some think is a wire under the board with the HV capacitor.   And his reply on the capacitor value is either a misunderstaing, misinterpretation or he does not have even basic understanding of a capacitor,  OR maybe he does not want to share that info.   There are a lot of questions at this point.   I would not be able to purchase a unit myself and especially with shipping costs from Romania.   I also would not be interested in buying one given the terms of needing 60% up front and having to wait up to 90 days.   I think that will put most people off from buying.   But I do know one member here who has been looking to purchase something, likely has the means to do so and may be interested in this if he can see it in person.   I haven't talked to him lately but most people here know Steven Jones - aka PhysicsProf.   He's been looking for some time.   


As far as quesstions to ask valy I think you know the basic things everyone would want to know.   A couple things that come to mind right now:

-  I would ask him what is the box on the handle which appears to have an LCD screen.  Is that a off-the-shelf motor controller or a special circuit?


- Are motors off the shelf or do they need rewiring or reworking?  (was this already answered? - need more coffee ;)  )


- Ask him if he would he please make a video that clearly shows his setup away from any possible external wiring - as in elevated to convince everyone there are not hidden wires going to the unit from an external source. 


- Ask him the Farad value of his 'capacitor'.   


Anyone else with some fairly straight forward questions please post ASAP.  I have the impression he is not willing or able to answer extensive detailed questions about his device, especially if he is seeking to get a patent on it.   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 03, 2013, 06:53:28 PM
As an afterthought to one of my above questions for valy.   It might be easier for him if we suggested he make another brief video showing the unit running while completely disconnected from external power and then having the unit shut off and then tilted over slightly on each side with the camera showing a closeup under the boards so everyone can see there are no wires going to it hidden under them.   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: MileHigh on October 03, 2013, 06:59:54 PM
E2matrix:

Like I posted on another thread:

At 1:03 the guy unplugs the small motor.

At 1:06 the guy reaches over and switches on the large motor.

You can hear the switch close!  The drop in speed that you can easily hear stops.

It's that simple.  He reaches over and flips a switch on the control panel near the big motor.  Look at the way the bench is made, the wire runs under the 2x4 and then it is snaked up the square-tubular frame of the bench.  It emerges in the nest of wires and whatnot underneath the control panel.  So from the start of the clip when he gets it going with the small motor and is careful to not trip his breaker, to the end of the clip, the setup is powered from the mains  power essentially the whole time except for the three seconds when he does the switchover.

That's what's happening in that clip. 

MileHigh
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 03, 2013, 07:13:25 PM
MH,  I just wrote a reply on your thread you started on this but since you are here now I'll say yes I'm aware of all that but I assume he needs to flip the switch to transfer input and outputs to a different configuration once it is unplugged.   Flipping the switch in itself proves nothing.   But I fully agree there is some possibility he could have a hidden external wire under a board.   Even though to me it just looks like a shadow I agree he needs to clearly show it elevated or make it obvious in another video that there are no external wires going to the unit as I suggested in the last two posts I made.   
Have you read the web page I posted back a few posts on how one can get more power from a flywheel?  ( http://www.resonantfractals.org/Magnetism/Flywheel.htm )   What are your thoughts on that?   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: MileHigh on October 03, 2013, 10:16:06 PM
E2matrix:

I read some of the document and skimmed through the rest.  The stuff about analyzing a flywheel at the atomic nanoscale is not convincing.  Here is where you just trust your instincts and your senses.  Do you think that you can get more out than in for a flywheel?  What about a shopping cart that you push through the supermarket?  Both a flywheel and a shopping cart are just energy stored in the form of moving mass.

The flywheel can be modeled as an inductor or a capacitor.  If you think about a flywheel as an energy storing device that may help some demystify the whole idea.

MileHigh
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 04, 2013, 01:56:23 AM
MileHigh,   thanks for your reply on that.   It was a page I just stumbled across I had saved while looking for something else.   It sounded fair but a little bit out there in some ways.   But it hints at what I've been picking up from other sources regarding flywheels.   I think a much better explanation can be found here:  http://www.backgauges.com/Gen-E-Sys%20II/wpimages/wped62b58c_06.png (http://www.backgauges.com/Gen-E-Sys%20II/wpimages/wped62b58c_06.png)    and in a lot of other pages on that site.   I think the text from that picture gives evidence of a way flywheels can be used to get extra energy out of a system. 
Because the text in that picture is fairly hard to read due to it's low resolution I took the time to type it out (OCR didn't work on it) :


"5 KEYS OF UNDERSTANDING

THE LIBERTY ENGINE - ELE - SELF SUSTAINING POWER PLANT CONCEPT IN A NUTSHELL

1.  Comprehending Newton's 2nd law of motion.   Understanding that kinetic energy (KE)
QUADRUPLES with each doubling of velocity of a constant amount of mass in motion.

2.  Having and using a system of a SIMPLE mechanics that provides at least two distinctly
different speeds and directions for the mass to travel, with each having a minimum of
2:1 ratio of difference in speed.  Lift vs. Drop, lift to develop potential energy (PE)
position is at least two times lower velocity than the velocity of the mass in motion
traveling to developed kinetic energy (KE) position.

3.  Having and using a system of SIMPLE mechanics that provides a method of capture,
transmission, and storage of developed kinetic energy (KE) in a flywheel rotating at a
designed speed.

4.  Having and using a system of SIMPLE mechanics that provides kinetic energy (KE) to
the mechanics used to lift or recycle the mass back to the potential energy (PE) position
while drawing less energy than is developed by the descending mass and less than the
kinetic energy (KE) which is stored in the flywheel(s).

5.  Having and using a SIMPLE motor and generator in the system that run each other, with
the above mechanics in between developing power to add a designed amount of additional
energy (both PE & KE) that then becomes surplus and such surplus can be drawn of as
electrical power for work outside the system.

Footnote:
  Understanding that if you do not understand what is being revealed, or do not have facilities
  to construct and on your own you can still have a power plant yourself and learn it all by several
  different methods.

   a.  Hire someone who does understand it to help you until you do understand.
   
   b.  Contract with someone to build the parts or an entire powerplant for you."


NOTE:  The above text is not from valy or about the system in the opening post.   It is a system that may have some similarities but is from a different person and web site which I believe has a lot more info on how such a system may actually work.     As stated above it is from here:  http://www.backgauges.com/Gen-E-Sys%20II/ (http://www.backgauges.com/Gen-E-Sys%20II/)   This is OU member Temporal Visitor's web site. 
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Temporal Visitor on October 04, 2013, 02:06:07 PM
e2matrix (and others) please understand I do not know any other way to say what I have written, and the way I wrote it, when I wrote it.

Thanks for recognizing the "5 KEYS ..... " as evidence, because they are. Beyond the writing there were many actual tests done on the very real full scale machines. Several reconfigurations, several complete redesigns and new constructions were done, each time tested and changed to explore the consistent results observed to the limits of my ability and resources. The "ELE" still exists (though partially robbed for parts) in its last version, and remains operable by hand to this day. It stands as irrefutable iron proof, clear and convincing evidence of a functional Mechanical ENERGY Amplifier that proves Man can develop mechanical energy with matter in motion as fuel to achieve output exceeding the original input. Horsepower to do useful work with from matter in motion, without "fuel" as we presently have been "educated" to "understand".

Unfortunately much of our "education" is regurgitated lies Parroted to train new Parrots who then perpetuate the lies. Think: "Birds of a feather ...."

There is much to share, little time left and none to waste.

Truth stands on its own and it is stranger than fiction.

Truth is: "You ain't seen nothin yet"

Hurry up .............. search4truth@centurytel.net

Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ARMCORTEX on October 04, 2013, 02:45:37 PM
I will send 30$ paypal to the person who saves every single word of this man, every image, complete site etc, EVERYTHING.

I have to go work now , would do it myself but I will be back in 10 hours and I have to pick up somebody @ the airport.

also, plz save all those beautiful flywheel motor videos, those are super important.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ARMCORTEX on October 04, 2013, 02:48:06 PM
BTW, never have I seen such beautiful truth, the man who wrote this deserves praise.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 04, 2013, 07:37:30 PM
ARMCORTEX,   I'll save the entire site for you but please get in touch with Temporal Visitor above and send him the $30.   It is his web site.   I do have the ability to save an entire site.   I may not be able to get to this until later this afternoon but PM me and I can get it done for you if you don't get it yourself first.   I'm glad to see someone else is recognizing the treasure in Temporal Visitor's web site. 
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ARMCORTEX on October 05, 2013, 08:12:30 AM
Irrefutable iron proof! So can anyone make me a convincing speech why I should believe this ? I have seen those videos, I doubt that they were edited and that the guy actually passed wires through concrete,

To embark on this project or not ? The text has so much truth I am aggravated by my pettiness and feel thise person is right.

I know someone who will weld some scrap for me

So all motors can be layed in a horizontal line or any 3d arrangement as long as the pulleys are following the right order. perpendicular to gravity.

Question to Temporal

Unlike all concrete floowsI have floating floor here and neighbor  ( Yes I know, the formaldehyde is killing me ! ;D ). Can the setup reach a point where it is stable from a vibration standpoint ( it has to ?) ?

I'm guessing if its all rotation it cant be that bad If I sit something on a big plywood sheet..?







Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Temporal Visitor on October 05, 2013, 09:07:33 PM
Irrefutable iron proof! So can anyone make me a convincing speech why I should believe this ?

"Irrefutable iron proof!" are my words concerning the ELE power plant of my construction. (No videos of it have been released at this point.)
As for making a speech; I am not into making "speeches" per say, since the machine is a thing that exists; it speaks for itself.

I have seen those videos, I doubt that they were edited and that the guy actually passed wires through concrete,

Any doubts I have about the video of Valy's machine go more to the mechanics and lack of certain things. My similar attempts did not result in what I see in the video - but he is or may be doing certain things I have and did not.

To embark on this project or not ? The text has so much truth I am aggravated by my pettiness and feel thise person is right.

Which text? & Which person?

I know someone who will weld some scrap for me

So all motors can be layed in a horizontal line or any 3d arrangement as long as the pulleys are following the right order. perpendicular to gravity.

There is much more involved that simply slapping a bunch of random stuff together. - You need the right stuff and it all must be designed to work together or you will have a sculpture rather than a power plant.

Question to Temporal

Unlike all concrete floowsI have floating floor here and neighbor  ( Yes I know, the formaldehyde is killing me ! ;D ). Can the setup reach a point where it is stable from a vibration standpoint ( it has to ?) ?

I'm guessing if its all rotation it cant be that bad If I sit something on a big plywood sheet..?

If by "setup" you mean the "5 Keys" of the ELE power plant,  concepts of it the answer is NO. - The ELE is and was a learning project. It lead to other types, methods, designs, far more powerful and practical in all respects.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: MileHigh on October 06, 2013, 01:06:32 AM
E2matrix and Temporal Visitor:

I spent 20 minutes looking at Temporal Visitor's web site and to be honest it looks quite similar to 30 or more websites I have seen in the same genre.  There is often a lot of philosophizing and searching for the "Truth."  The terminology gets mixed up sometimes.  There is no magic associated with kinetic energy or flywheels.  A flywheel just stores the energy you put into it and then returns the same energy back less friction losses.  It can return the energy back over a long period at low power levels or over a short period at very high power levels (the famous back spike from a coil) and it's just all normal.

Temporal Visitor you claim that you have a device or machine but it has not been shown yet.  So when do you plan to show it?  What precisely do you plan to show in terms of the input and output for the device?  How do you plan on making your measurements?

Thanks,

MileHigh
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: captainfletcher on October 06, 2013, 10:25:33 AM
Beware Temporary Guest! only 6 posts in this forum and you direct us to your website with the intention of receiving money.
Your website pushes open doors.
We are tired of reading long written Journès types claiming to have discovered a new machine and Overunity without providing solid evidence.
Try to collect money unnecessarily is repressible by the law of all countries.
It may be that one day someone will complain against you, it may cost you.
If you're really honest, give humanity that you claim to have invented. If this is still the blank as usual.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ARMCORTEX on October 06, 2013, 01:52:35 PM
I dont believe he has asked anything.

Donate doesnt work on the site.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: vince on October 06, 2013, 10:21:58 PM
Hey Guys
If you are following this thread, please take the time to view Temporal Visitors site more thoroughly. I think you will see that he is not asking for money or anything else. In fact he's is freely sharing his experience and knowledge on the subject. His design is openly displayed with many details albeit sometimes in low resolution. The machine he has constructed is quite impressive and shows someone who has put a lot of thought, work and money into it. 
@ Temporal visitor,
Thankyou  for sharing your design and information but I'm sure that a few questions answered might help us better understand. Why did you scavenge the machine for parts? Was it for an improved design? when the machine did run did it self power?
 As I understand it, what you are basically telling us that the secret to self powering machines is in the simple lever and flywheel.  Your solution as I have perceived it is to rotate a heavy flywheel with a motor and extract power from it in pulses by using cleverly designed links or levers to tap the energy at specific points in rotation. You do this in various stages and isolate the load from the prime mover in doing so.


It's a clever notion but not entirely unique.  The pendulum pump uses a method not too different from yours in that a large pendulum (flywheel) moves an axel in and out and taps the out stroke momentarily to operate a pump thereby using a pulse of the energy to power a pump.  The pendulum is kept moving with relatively less energy than would be required to operate the pump from human input.


I am truly fascinated by your design and hope you will share more information on your build and it's performance.




Vince











Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Temporal Visitor on October 07, 2013, 03:59:28 AM
Hello Vince,

Hey Guys
If you are following this thread, please take the time to view Temporal Visitors site more thoroughly.

Very nice, I could not have written it any more clearly. Page skimming will not allow you to see what is freely presented in an effort to HELP you all.

I think you will see that he is not asking for money or anything else. In fact he's is freely sharing his experience and knowledge on the subject.

What is asked for is your help to go  further.  Though not complete, anyone can find a rough idea for help is laid out. Few even click on any of that. Think carefully as you read "Helping Hands" and the  underlying pages, know that alone no man can do it all. - Not a one of you - us - or myself. Read it all - even the parts of  it many of you reject.

His design is openly displayed with many details albeit sometimes in low resolution. The machine he has constructed is quite impressive and shows someone who has put a lot of thought, work and money into it.

I design and build machines for a living - this cost me plenty - doing websites is not my specialty. Low res for several reasons, primarily software related. Anyone care enough to volunteer their help???

@ Temporal visitor,
Thankyou  for sharing your design and information but I'm sure that a few questions answered might help us better understand. Why did you scavenge the machine for parts? Was it for an improved design? when the machine did run did it self power?

You are very welcome. (A refreshing reply for a change, thanks Vince.)

Why? = Because the "ELE" like every design has been a test bed and learning tool. Not a "final production" unit. Each has provided challenges and realizations/revelations that caused and causes revisions.  Revisions on top of revisions are not always pretty. The ELE was scavenged for the more expensive parts to be reused in subsequent designs, why buy them over and over. The main problem with the ELE is not a lack of "power", "force", "energy", "output"  but rather TOO MUCH. So much so that it was breaking mechanical parts.

Was? = Yes, many things were learned and a complete redesign (actually many) were done, built and also tested, the results were similar.

When? = Yes and no. Yes because it did have the "energy" to do so, No because it lacked several KEYS that are required to do so, and those KEYS were not even recognized at that time.

It, Gen-E-Sys II is a technology not a device. All efforts have been and remain toward a production worthy unit that is practical.

As I understand it, what you are basically telling us that the secret to self powering machines is in the simple lever and flywheel.  Your solution as I have perceived it is to rotate a heavy flywheel with a motor and extract power from it in pulses by using cleverly designed links or levers to tap the energy at specific points in rotation. You do this in various stages and isolate the load from the prime mover in doing so.

You are sharp, but no - know it is not just lever and flywheel. They are major KEYS that need to be understood before moving forward, and why I chose to provide the basic flywheel calculator first. Nor am I clever - I just work hard - and frankly it is getting harder to continue.

It's a clever notion but not entirely unique.  The pendulum pump uses a method not too different from yours in that a large pendulum (flywheel) moves an axel in and out and taps the out stroke momentarily to operate a pump thereby using a pulse of the energy to power a pump.  The pendulum is kept moving with relatively less energy than would be required to operate the pump from human input.

Concerning the "ELE" I agree, it is straight forward physics - common sense - classical mechanics - using off the shelf motors, generators and other parts. The advanced designs: well, they are something(s) entirely different.

I am truly fascinated by your design and hope you will share more information on your build and it's performance.

Vince, so you know: I am honored, and impressed by your reply (several others also) and I truly hope more will follow your example and style. I have given what I can.
Share more = Think: "Helping Hands" and as you look at the photo of the old man, sitting alone, ask yourself: How much can one man give?
Everyone wants something different. - Sharing works best as a two way street.
Please make "Contact" on the site for more information.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 07, 2013, 04:11:18 AM
vince,  great to see you here!    For info for Temporal Visitor,  vince was part of a group that was involved in investigating another motor generator from a somewhat mysterious person who suddenly disappeared shortly after I put a web site forum together at his request so we could work in a semi-private group with that person.   vince was in that group and probably did more toward building and trying various motor setups than anyone else in the group.   
I've had some private messages with Temporal Visitor and have been trying to get the time to talk to him as I really believe he has some great knowledge.   I also know some things I won't discuss here as it's personal to Temporal Visitor but I'll just say it will be good to have as much contact with him as soon as possible regarding his work.   I need to get my own butt in gear in that regard too.   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on October 07, 2013, 04:20:05 AM
Beware Temporary Guest! only 6 posts in this forum and you direct us to your website with the intention of receiving money.
Your website pushes open doors.
We are tired of reading long written Journès types claiming to have discovered a new machine and Overunity without providing solid evidence.
Try to collect money unnecessarily is repressible by the law of all countries.
It may be that one day someone will complain against you, it may cost you.
If you're really honest, give humanity that you claim to have invented. If this is still the blank as usual.
LOL,  beware captainfletcher with only 3 posts here telling others to beware of someone I know well from another forum who has only been here a little but is known to me as one of the 'Good Guys' and BTW he is very altruistic IMO and not at all looking for money.   I very well understand where he is coming from in that regard and while I feel I can't openly discuss some of the info in this regard I know he is not a scammer looking just for $$$ .   He really wants to give something to the people of this planet and may need a little help in various ways to do so for reasons I won't discuss here.     I'm not trying to be secretive but he has shared some things with me that I'm not sure he wants public (nothing in regards to how the device works - just personal).   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: markdansie on October 07, 2013, 06:05:06 PM
Having traveled to many countries and seen similar devices I can assure you there is no overunity, free energy on this. This is actually a bad faked device. I have seen much better, especially out of Africa.
Kind regards
mark
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ariovaldo on October 07, 2013, 08:29:28 PM
Having traveled to many countries and seen similar devices I can assure you there is no overunity, free energy on this. This is actually a bad faked device. I have seen much better, especially out of Africa.
Kind regards
mark


Even knowing that was not possible, I built that using a conventional motor/generator (sculpture)...Guess what?...Didn't work. I tried several capacitor values. Next steps, disassemble it.
Kind regards...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=5Njxw-Y2zPU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=5Njxw-Y2zPU)
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ariovaldo on October 07, 2013, 08:29:57 PM

Even knowing that was not possible, I built that using a conventional motor/generator (sculpture)...Guess what?...Didn't work. I tried several capacitor values. Next steps, disassemble it.
Kind regards...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=5Njxw-Y2zPU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=5Njxw-Y2zPU)
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: vince on October 07, 2013, 09:48:46 PM
Hi Mark
I'm not sure which machine you are referring to in your comment. Are you talking about the original machine with a flywheel that this thread is about or the one that Temporal visitor is developing? 
I agree that many of the motor flywheel machines are fakes , having built a few myself that did not run. However the machine (system) that Temporal Visitor is working on has a unique design that  really should be explored further.  He himself has said that a mere motor generator coupling ,even with a flywheel will never work.


Vince
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: MileHigh on October 08, 2013, 12:49:51 AM
Vince:

I am pretty sure that I saw on Temporal Visitor's web site that his machine is up and running or very close to be up and running and it will be unveiled soon.

So I asked Temporal Visitor the following:  "Temporal Visitor you claim that you have a device or machine but it has not been shown yet.  So when do you plan to show it?  What precisely do you plan to show in terms of the input and output for the device?  How do you plan on making your measurements?"

He completely ignored my basic questions.  Yet on his website there is all sorts of talk about his machine including diagrams and a picture or two.   This is not confidence inspiring.

For all I care the machine could be inside a black box, I just posed some reasonable questions and got no answers.

MileHigh
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on October 08, 2013, 01:44:52 AM

Even knowing that was not possible, I built that using a conventional motor/generator (sculpture)...Guess what?...Didn't work. I tried several capacitor values. Next steps, disassemble it.
Kind regards...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=5Njxw-Y2zPU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=5Njxw-Y2zPU)

Hi ariovaldo,

nice attempt to replicate!... Thanks for making a video of your device under test.

I noticed that you don't have the components in your device that can be seen in Valy's video which I think could be responsible for creating the -90 degrees phase shift between voltage and current (reactive power) condition needed for the motor to turn the generator without causing a load to the generator.

I find it interesting that so far no one has mentioned anything about that unusual component.

At this time I cannot confirm for sure if the principal works but what I can tell you is, a week prior to seeing Valy's video I was doing some tests on a reactive circuit and seeing that unusual component leads me to believe it could possibly work as I've described in my post on page 2 of this topic.

Unfortunately, I will not be publicly sharing information until I have made all the tests to prove it can work or not.
Once I have confirmed it, I will be freely shared the information (working or not) so others can try if they wish.

So until you have identified that component and know what to do with it, your replication attempt may not be complete.

Thanks for sharing

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: vince on October 08, 2013, 02:26:07 AM
Hi Gotoluc
In the last two attempts I made at coupling different motors to generators with flywheels I got the same results.  I got the units running with the flywheels at high speed and had voltmeters on the generator output. When I flipped the switch from mains to loop mode it always did the same thing. Within a fraction of a second after the switch ,voltage degrades so quickly that no motor could even run for a short time.
I remember seeing a an article (don't remember where) of a person using a(sta-volt) in his system to compensate for voltage decay in the first moments after switching modes. As I understand it a sta-volt is a brand of voltage regulator that can adjust voltage when it drops or increases within it's range.
Could this be one of the missing components coupled to some type of capacitor array?


Vince
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on October 08, 2013, 03:13:18 AM
Hi Gotoluc
In the last two attempts I made at coupling different motors to generators with flywheels I got the same results.  I got the units running with the flywheels at high speed and had voltmeters on the generator output. When I flipped the switch from mains to loop mode it always did the same thing. Within a fraction of a second after the switch ,voltage degrades so quickly that no motor could even run for a short time.
I remember seeing a an article (don't remember where) of a person using a(sta-volt) in his system to compensate for voltage decay in the first moments after switching modes. As I understand it a sta-volt is a brand of voltage regulator that can adjust voltage when it drops or increases within it's range.
Could this be one of the missing components coupled to some type of capacitor array?


Vince

Hi Vince,

no, that is not the missing component I'm talking about. Look at Valy's looped generator video and you should see something that is very visible and no one has mentioned it yet.

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Temporal Visitor on October 08, 2013, 03:46:10 AM
MileHigh

Vince:

I am pretty sure that I saw on Temporal Visitor's web site that his machine is up and running or very close to be up and running and it will be unveiled soon.

I am very sure that is not the case, at the "Helping Hands" page it reads verbatim: "You have been presented with evidence that allows you to decide for yourself the Verity of my “Words” and the Gift being offered to you. There is much more detail to be presented and will be presented first to those with Helping Hands.

With that understanding I ask you to join in and consider giving the Gift of your help in what ever way you might see fit and be able to."

BTW: Since the website went up several months have passed, and I have not seen any email from you commenting, inquiring or offering to help through the "Contact" page, which is my preferred method of initial correspondence . 

So I asked Temporal Visitor the following:  "Temporal Visitor you claim that you have a device or machine but it has not been shown yet.  So when do you plan to show it?  What precisely do you plan to show in terms of the input and output for the device?  How do you plan on making your measurements?"

On the "Contact" page you will find my preferences to "break the ice" so to speak and this: "P.S. Some people may have plenty of time to fritter away, I do not. Know that I’ll read it because there are no stupid questions, just some I will not bother with, Some I should not answer, Some I have no answer to, Some I will not answer, .........." (end quote) and so forth. * * * Yes I can answer those questions - when I choose to.

He completely ignored my basic questions.  Yet on his website there is all sorts of talk about his machine including diagrams and a picture or two.   This is not confidence inspiring.

Do you think I am obligated to supply answers on demand? After all, elsewhere I have read your comments to and about others, their work, devices. It did not inspire my confidence in you. 

For all I care the machine could be inside a black box, I just posed some reasonable questions and got no answers.
MileHigh

We don't know each other and please understand this reasonable answer: I'm not a dancing Bear and I don't dance to every tune played.
No contact has been made, no contract has been entered into, therefore at this point neither of us are obligated to do a thing. 

So I ask: Are you in a position and ready to change that, and make "Contact" though the website according to my preferences ?

Or not?

You have been answered.

Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: MileHigh on October 08, 2013, 06:30:19 AM
Temporal Visitor:

Is this the Beatles meeting the Maharishi Yogi in the Himalayan mountains to contemplate Lotus flowers or do you have a box that's supposed to output free mechanical energy?

I'm not getting any harmonic vibrational messages from the five perfect solids telling me that you have a Prony brake in your future.

MileHigh
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinman on October 08, 2013, 01:31:03 PM
It's starting to sound all to !UFOpolotics! for me MH.
Looks like i might be up for another replication for testing,as straight answers dont seem to flow to easy from Temporal Visitor.
Although i already know it will be a waste of my time and money.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ariovaldo on October 08, 2013, 01:42:44 PM
Hi ariovaldo,

nice attempt to replicate!... Thanks for making a video of your device under test.

I noticed that you don't have the components in your device that can be seen in Valy's video which I think could be responsible for creating the -90 degrees phase shift between voltage and current (reactive power) condition needed for the motor to turn the generator without causing a load to the generator.

I find it interesting that so far no one has mentioned anything about that unusual component.

At this time I cannot confirm for sure if the principal works but what I can tell you is, a week prior to seeing Valy's video I was doing some tests on a reactive circuit and seeing that unusual component leads me to believe it could possibly work as I've described in my post on page 2 of this topic.


Unfortunately, I will not be publicly sharing information until I have made all the tests to prove it can work or not.
Once I have confirmed it, I will be freely shared the information (working or not) so others can try if they wish.

So until you have identified that component and know what to do with it, your replication attempt may not be complete.

Thanks for sharing

Luc


Thank you for the tips and I'll keep the set assembled for some more tests.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Temporal Visitor on October 08, 2013, 02:24:07 PM
MileHigh, that is kinda cute though ridiculous. - A Magical Mystery tour awaits and it just may "blow your little mind".

I am pretty sure you have read some proposed rules elsewhere, particularly rule #3 the PAY ATTENTION rule:
YES a working mechanical amplifier and NO it isn't in a box. - So what! It is not best of the of what has also been prepared for those "helpers" I hope to meet while still this side of the grass.

While a Prony brake could be used for the mechanical amplifier(s) - So what! - "We don't need no stinking Prony brakes" - because load bank(s) work just fine on complete power plant(s).

For all I know you might be High, in more than one way, thus operating on differing frequencies but that does not mean we cannot become "buds".
Or does it?
Because I don't do hallucinogenics - What sayeth thee O MileHigh ?

So I ask: Since I answered you and you blew off my questions will you tell me directly that you prefer to malinger in the shadows like a dog nipping at my heels or should I plan on you riding your MileHighHorse with your Prony into my future privately???

You don't need to answer here - just make contact to become a "bud"- or "buzz off" - YOU DECIDE, while I go back to my plow.



Temporal Visitor:

Is this the Beatles meeting the Maharishi Yogi in the Himalayan mountains to contemplate Lotus flowers or do you have a box that's supposed to output free mechanical energy?

I'm not getting any harmonic vibrational messages from the five perfect solids telling me that you have a Prony brake in your future.

MileHigh
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: MileHigh on October 08, 2013, 02:47:29 PM
Temporal Visitor:

What are you here for?  I am assuming that you are here to discuss your alleged "mechanical amplifier," the one where we see pictures and diagrams on your web site.

So, it's a mechanical device?  What's the power output?  How do you measure it?  Does it require and input and if yes how do you measure the input?  When do you plan on making this alleged device available?

I remember this guy Wayne of HydroEnergy Revolution:

Quote
The key "Principle" on our path to "success" has  been our group working by Faith, Hope, and Determination..... the result has  been an awesome to Collaboration of competent open minds.
The result and character of those "open minds" has  propelled us beyond standard limitations.........we are building onto the understanding of mechanical physics as they are know and taught today - and for  one reason - a better future.

The guy could never answer a straightforward question.  He is still apparently spinning his wheels and going nowhere fast.
You can't answer a straightforward question either.  You allege that you have a free energy device but you balk and do a song and dance when somebody asks you what the power output is and how you measure it.  Those are reasonable commonsense questions.
You won't see me posting in this thread anymore unless you show a working system.  Good luck on that deliverable.

MileHigh
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: TinselKoala on October 08, 2013, 04:04:39 PM
Reasonable scientific discourse goes like this:

A claimant makes some claims, and _PROVIDES EVIDENCE_ from experiments of his or her own or from the work of others.
Interested and knowledgeable parties then discuss the EVIDENCE, that is, the data and the experiments and apparatus that generated the data. They discuss the DATA, its quality, its relevance to the issues, its interpretation. They may discuss the "theory" that motivated the experimenter, or serendipitous discoveries made along the way, or interesting bits of apparatus that further the investigation, or problems and glitches they have experienced. They may discuss problems they see in the work of others, and how to solve them.

What is NOT APPROPRIATE is dropping hints without evidence to support them, making claims based on bogus or improperly gathered evidence, or not providing ANY EVIDENCE AT ALL for the claims made. Also very inappropriate are the ad-hominem abusive attacks and insults against other people, however incompetent, stupid, ugly and smelly, stoned out of their gourds, certifiably insane, they might be.

So... Temporal Visitor.... I challenge you: State your claim clearly, and provide EVIDENCE for it. Then let's discuss your evidence, what it means, how you obtained it and what you plan on doing next. Let's also discuss why you cannot self-loop your system and why your home is still connected to the electricity grid.

 :P



Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Temporal Visitor on October 08, 2013, 04:05:07 PM
MileHigh, your assumptions are incorrect. I have answered your questions although you may not like the answers.
Remember: In the past I have asked questions you refused to answer. - You continue to refuse to answer. - You are the hit and run type as I told you before. Remember that? - You have nothing over me.

Your silence speaks volumes about you.

Your Silence can only be equated with fraud. ........ so run along. 


Temporal Visitor:

What are you here for?  I am assuming that you are here to discuss your alleged "mechanical amplifier," the one where we see pictures and diagrams on your web site.

So, it's a mechanical device?  What's the power output?  How do you measure it?  Does it require and input and if yes how do you measure the input?  When do you plan on making this alleged device available?

I remember this guy Wayne of HydroEnergy Revolution:

The guy could never answer a straightforward question.  He is still apparently spinning his wheels and going nowhere fast.
You can't answer a straightforward question either.  You allege that you have a free energy device but you balk and do a song and dance when somebody asks you what the power output is and how you measure it.  Those are reasonable commonsense questions.
You won't see me posting in this thread anymore unless you show a working system.  Good luck on that deliverable.

MileHigh
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: Temporal Visitor on October 08, 2013, 05:04:08 PM
Yawn ......... and only because you still have yet to rise up to the challenge put to you, and back on or about August 09, 2013.

Please recall the one wherein I wrote: "Let's see you show the math to be incorrect. With or without any digits of precision."

Did you do that? Can you? ....... Respectfully I do not think you can - or you would have already jumped on that opportunity.

I am going to repeat myself to ANY and ALL "UNHEALTHY skeptics" - go read this in its entirety! http://www.backgauges.com/Gen-E-Sys%20II/skeptic.html
I did not come here to fight. - I just have no time for "challenges" from the "challenged", or any who have previously failed to "man up".

FYI - I'll excuse you and welcome you to "Contact" me through the website. That's being reasonable.

Reasonable scientific discourse goes like this:

A claimant makes some claims, and _PROVIDES EVIDENCE_ from experiments of his or her own or from the work of others.
Interested and knowledgeable parties then discuss the EVIDENCE, that is, the data and the experiments and apparatus that generated the data. They discuss the DATA, its quality, its relevance to the issues, its interpretation. They may discuss the "theory" that motivated the experimenter, or serendipitous discoveries made along the way, or interesting bits of apparatus that further the investigation, or problems and glitches they have experienced. They may discuss problems they see in the work of others, and how to solve them.

What is NOT APPROPRIATE is dropping hints without evidence to support them, making claims based on bogus or improperly gathered evidence, or not providing ANY EVIDENCE AT ALL for the claims made. Also very inappropriate are the ad-hominem abusive attacks and insults against other people, however incompetent, stupid, ugly and smelly, stoned out of their gourds, certifiably insane, they might be.

So... Temporal Visitor.... I challenge you: State your claim clearly, and provide EVIDENCE for it. Then let's discuss your evidence, what it means, how you obtained it and what you plan on doing next. Let's also discuss why you cannot self-loop your system and why your home is still connected to the electricity grid.

 :P
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: powercat on October 08, 2013, 05:14:34 PM
Yawn .........


@@Temporal Visitor,
clearly you are rude and arrogant, with nothing real to offer this group apart from your own ego trip,
you are not the first with this approach and unfortunately you won't be the last.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: vrand on October 08, 2013, 06:20:12 PM
Hi ariovaldo,

nice attempt to replicate!... Thanks for making a video of your device under test.

I noticed that you don't have the components in your device that can be seen in Valy's video which I think could be responsible for creating the -90 degrees phase shift between voltage and current (reactive power) condition needed for the motor to turn the generator without causing a load to the generator.

I find it interesting that so far no one has mentioned anything about that unusual component.

At this time I cannot confirm for sure if the principal works but what I can tell you is, a week prior to seeing Valy's video I was doing some tests on a reactive circuit and seeing that unusual component leads me to believe it could possibly work as I've described in my post on page 2 of this topic.

Unfortunately, I will not be publicly sharing information until I have made all the tests to prove it can work or not.
Once I have confirmed it, I will be freely shared the information (working or not) so others can try if they wish.

So until you have identified that component and know what to do with it, your replication attempt may not be complete.

Thanks for sharing

Luc


First off, thank you ariovaldo for posting your build, nice work!
Hope you can continue your "free energy" research if your wife lets you  :)


Luc, interesting suggestion on  creating the -90 degrees phase shift between voltage and current (reactive power). 
Something like that is needed to bring this simple mechanical off-the-shelf design to the marketplace.
Maybe phase shift the voltage and current to be in phase like Tesla Longitudinal wave?



Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: TinselKoala on October 08, 2013, 11:25:28 PM
Yawn ......... and only because you still have yet to rise up to the challenge put to you, and back on or about August 09, 2013.

Please recall the one wherein I wrote: "Let's see you show the math to be incorrect. With or without any digits of precision."

Did you do that? Can you? ....... Respectfully I do not think you can - or you would have already jumped on that opportunity.

I am going to repeat myself to ANY and ALL "UNHEALTHY skeptics" - go read this in its entirety!

I did not come here to fight. - I just have no time for "challenges" from the "challenged", or any who have previously failed to "man up".

FYI - I'll excuse you and welcome you to "Contact" me through the website. That's being reasonable.

Yawn..... so I am refuted thusly? I laugh at you. If you want to pay me my daily consulting fee then I will gladly look at your website and tell you the other places where you have made a foolish error or an ignorant claim. Otherwise, you will have to capture my interest with something other than BS and veiled insults.
And again you lie: you most certainly did come here to fight. But you won't fight fairly, by openly discussing your claims and ideas, refuting your challengers with references and data that can be confirmed.

And YES, your "math" is incorrect because it claims FALSE PRECISION, and I have given you plenty of references as to why and how. No charge for this one, you get another freebie from me.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinman on October 09, 2013, 09:03:00 AM
Yawn ......... and only because you still have yet to rise up to the challenge put to you, and back on or about August 09, 2013.

Please recall the one wherein I wrote: "Let's see you show the math to be incorrect. With or without any digits of precision."

Did you do that? Can you? ....... Respectfully I do not think you can - or you would have already jumped on that opportunity.

I am going to repeat myself to ANY and ALL "UNHEALTHY skeptics" - go read this in its entirety! http://www.backgauges.com/Gen-E-Sys%20II/skeptic.html
I did not come here to fight. - I just have no time for "challenges" from the "challenged", or any who have previously failed to "man up".

FYI - I'll excuse you and welcome you to "Contact" me through the website. That's being reasonable.
Your a true peanut TV,nothing more.
The reason you wont show anything that is OU,is because you have nothing that is OU-never did,and never will. Your lies are just to redirect trafic to your website.
You took some one elses work,and called it your own-just to get a name for yourself.Then you start dodging all questions asked of you ,about your device,and answer with dribble.

So why dont !you! just run along now,as we have far to many con men already out there in the FE comunity.
Your first mistake was saying that you had pulled the original apart for part's. Who in there right mind would dissaemble a self running machine for parts??-thats right,one that never had a self runner in the first place.

What you are now,is number one target for those that have had enough of scamers trying to take hard earned cash away from those that know no better.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ARMCORTEX on October 09, 2013, 01:26:27 PM
I talked to this guy on Skype.

He doesnt have a working device, he has an idea and needs investors.

Do not give any more attention to temporal.

Back to the original intention of this thread, the Valy machine.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: ARMCORTEX on October 09, 2013, 04:51:26 PM
Just see the Valy Machine, and temporal's words as related and a puzzle for you figure out if you got the brains and the tools. IF you think you can do it alone ?

Helping hand should not be reciprocating help. Sometimes you have to raise other people around you and they will raise you afterwards, in gratitude. You are turning this concept upside down.

So many ways to be a THINKING man, why bother with OVERUNITY ( Pardon me if I said OVERUNITY  :o :o OOPS!! I meant free energy  ;D ;D) I thought we were ALL created equal no matter if we have such a device or not ?





Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: MileHigh on October 10, 2013, 12:29:28 AM
The Valy machine is just as bad if not worse.  It's nothing more than a small electric motor powered from the mains, and then he switches over to the large electric motor powered from the mains.  There is a three second interval where there is no power applied.  It's just a con to get wire transfers of down payment money.  The guy will never deliver anything.  It's just another variation on the Nigerian email scam industry where if you give them all of your banking information including a copy of your signature, you will make hundreds of thousands of dollars in "assisting" a government financial transaction.  The reality is that they will clean out your bank account.

MileHigh
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: romerouk on November 11, 2013, 11:30:11 AM
new video released by ValiEnergyStar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qa3MmdqdQ0
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinman on November 11, 2013, 04:22:01 PM
Hey,he even went to the trouble to paint the concrete floor under the device-while the device was inplace,as he painted the timber under the legs aswel lol.

I also see the upgrade-we now have a blue welder stuck on the side of the frame-looks flash.

Come on guys-this one has to be for real.
I mean ,it has bearings, and belts, and motors, and flywheels,and a speacial box where all the magic happens-it's even got two switch boards.

I wonder if he would agree to mount it on a trailor,so as once its up and running,he could wheel it out of the shed-then i would take a little more notice.
But hey,nothing like watching a comedy at 11pm.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: a.king21 on November 12, 2013, 05:24:45 AM
Looks to me like it's based on the Bedini Watson motor of 1984, so it's patent free (if Bedini patented it).
Romero, do you have any plans to visit Romania in the near future?
Most of us would trust your opinion.
Thanks for posting the link.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on November 12, 2013, 06:30:46 AM
The Valy machine is just as bad if not worse.  It's nothing more than a small electric motor powered from the mains, and then he switches over to the large electric motor powered from the mains.  There is a three second interval where there is no power applied.  It's just a con to get wire transfers of down payment money.  The guy will never deliver anything.  It's just another variation on the Nigerian email scam industry where if you give them all of your banking information including a copy of your signature, you will make hundreds of thousands of dollars in "assisting" a government financial transaction.  The reality is that they will clean out your bank account.

MileHigh

Hi MileHigh

To me this device looks real and would operate on reactive power (90 degrees phase shift of voltage & current) between PM Alternator (power source once looped) and Induction motor (prime mover)

The flywheel is not a source of energy but is there to store momentum when he switches to loop mode and also to keep the device running when a high current demand hits the Alternator as a reactive power condition can easily be disturbed. As you can see in the video he even needed a few tries to get it going.

Please tell me (short simple explanation) why this would not work

Regards

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: TinselKoala on November 12, 2013, 07:01:09 AM
(raises hand)

"Conservation of Energy?"

(auditorium cracks up laughing...)

 :o

Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: markdansie on November 12, 2013, 07:12:40 AM
TK
check you PM will you lol
If you reply to my last one I have an update taht will put a smile on your face
Mark
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on November 12, 2013, 08:07:48 AM
(raises hand)

"Conservation of Energy?"

(auditorium cracks up laughing...)

 :o

Hi TinselKoala,

You always make me laugh with your sense of humor ;D

but seriously, you can also tell me why you think reactive power would not work!

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinman on November 12, 2013, 08:38:42 AM
Hi TinselKoala,

You always make me laugh with your sense of humor ;D

but seriously, you can also tell me why you think reactive power would not work!

Luc
Hi Luc

Where would this reactive power come from-the motor itself?
Here is the problem with reactive power.
In an AC motor, reactive power dosnt present a load to the motor,however it dose apply a load to a generator. As we need both a motor,and a generator to run the motor,we can asume in a best case scenario that the net gain would be 0. But as we have heat and resistances,then the reactive power output would be lower than the needed power to run the motor.
Another thing is,how would you collect this reactive power?,if reactive power is the power that flows between the inductive windings.If we place more windings between the inductive windings,and try to draw from them,then we get the lenz force effect-game over.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: romerouk on November 12, 2013, 02:48:22 PM
Looks to me like it's based on the Bedini Watson motor of 1984, so it's patent free (if Bedini patented it).
Romero, do you have any plans to visit Romania in the near future?
Most of us would trust your opinion.
Thanks for posting the link.
Hi a.king21,

just came back from Romania not long ago and I might go again for Easter.
Where this guy lives is very far from my home there.
I have seen one of these in operation (not this one) and it did work but the generator part was modified and I don't know what exactly.
I have tried myself to see if it can be done but no good results so far, check here to see my attempts... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nF8La5RaNWA

Regards,
Romero
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on November 12, 2013, 04:07:01 PM
Hi Luc

Where would this reactive power come from-the motor itself?

No, I think it is sent to the motor.

Here is the problem with reactive power.
In an AC motor, reactive power dosnt present a load to the motor,however it dose apply a load to a generator. As we need both a motor,and a generator to run the motor,we can asume in a best case scenario that the net gain would be 0. But as we have heat and resistances,then the reactive power output would be lower than the needed power to run the motor.

As I have suggested above, the permanent magnet alternator creates the power for the induction motor (prime mover). However, there is something between the two which converts the alternators power to reactive power so the induction motor (load) doesn't reflect back to the alternator. Interestingly I have mentioned this twice (in earlier posts) that there an unusual electrical component on this device and no one is saying anything.
As for the loses, I'm quite sure the alternator is a 3 phase 600vac and the induction motor is at most is one phase 220v and maybe even 120v. So even if there are loses the alternator voltage is many times higher and could compensate for it.

Another thing is,how would you collect this reactive power?,if reactive power is the power that flows between the inductive windings.If we place more windings between the inductive windings,and try to draw from them,then we get the lenz force effect-game over.

I have a small reactive circuit which I've been working on for some time now to study the effects of reactive power. At this time I can pull over 15 watts (resistive load) of power from it and it doesn't reflect back (Lenz free). So, I think it's possible to upscale this and that's why the unusual electrical component on Valy's device struck me.

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinman on November 12, 2013, 04:54:12 PM
No, I think it is sent to the motor.

As I have suggested above, the permanent magnet alternator creates the power for the induction motor (prime mover). However, there is something between the two which converts the alternators power to reactive power so the induction motor (load) doesn't reflect back to the alternator. Interestingly I have mentioned this twice (in earlier posts) that there an unusual electrical component on this device and no one is saying anything.
As for the loses, I'm quite sure the alternator is a 3 phase 600vac and the induction motor is at most is one phase 220v and maybe even 120v. So even if there are loses the alternator voltage is many times higher and could compensate for it.

I have a small reactive circuit which I've been working on for some time now to study the effects of reactive power. At this time I can pull over 15 watts (resistive load) of power from it and it doesn't reflect back (Lenz free). So, I think it's possible to upscale this and that's why the unusual electrical component on Valy's device struck me.

Luc

Quote: I have a small reactive circuit which I've been working on for some time now to study the effects of reactive power. At this time I can pull over 15 watts (resistive load) of power from it and it doesn't reflect back (Lenz free).

Mmm,careful on this one Luc,some one here will be all over this like a bad rash lol.
I too have a transformer that shows no reflection on the P/in when the output is loaded-BUT this is only with a resistive load on the output-same as your load. But when i place a resistive inductive load on the output,in way of an electric motor-all hell breaks loose. P/in go's ski high. This is something you should try with your setup,and see what happens to the P/in,as your reactive power will be driving a resistive/inductive load-in the form of the electric motor.

The other thing to take into concideration is-how much power are you consuming to create this 15 watts of reactive power?.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: romerouk on November 12, 2013, 04:58:39 PM
the new red special box is a decoy, the real 'special box' is the blue Welder K100
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on November 12, 2013, 05:55:34 PM
Hi RomeroUK,   Thanks for jumping in here.   I am assuming you can speak Romanian as I recall you lived there before.   Maybe you could give this inventor a call if you can't visit him although a visit would be great.   I think if you got him on the phone with your knowledge you could get a good feel for what he has and if it's really valid.    Although I wouldn't trust his way of selling this I think he may have something valid.   I am guessing that his 'white box' is some sort of variable-frequency drive (VFD) controller commonly used with larger AC motors.   
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: romerouk on November 12, 2013, 06:32:58 PM
Hi RomeroUK,   Thanks for jumping in here.   I am assuming you can speak Romanian as I recall you lived there before.   Maybe you could give this inventor a call if you can't visit him although a visit would be great.   I think if you got him on the phone with your knowledge you could get a good feel for what he has and if it's really valid.    Although I wouldn't trust his way of selling this I think he may have something valid.   I am guessing that his 'white box' is some sort of variable-frequency drive (VFD) controller commonly used with larger AC motors.
Hi e2matrix,
I do speak the language, is my mother language, I was born there.
I did contact him but I didn't get much more info. He is saying that who is interested to go there and see it in action.
For less than £200 anyone interested can get a return plane ticket and go there (UK-Romania).
There is something in this last movie that I am not happy with but I will leave MileHigh to discover and spread the word... :)

Regards,
Romero
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: e2matrix on November 12, 2013, 06:43:52 PM
Thanks for additional info.   I also have some thoughts on that latest youtube he did.   My concern is the extra boxes he has on the unit which could be housing fairly big batteries.   However I still want to give him the benefit of the doubt until someone can visit him and check it out up close.    I got the info below roughly translated by Google translate and myself from a picture you had from him (I assume off his web site).   He seems to have a good guarantee on his device and appears he is strongly protecting his 'secret' based on the text below:


Below was OCR'd from an image and then translated roughly but there were unreadable portions neither I nor GT could get. 


VEL GENERATQR.   Our Generators are electro magnetic and are able to work without any class energy are self powered automatically.  This generator generates clean energy elecromagnetic.  Generator can be operated for 50 years without stopping at least a properly seruis VEL generator not noisy protected against electrocution and not radiate or emit hazardous waste that can damage surrounding medium.  Generator laintrarea switchboard connects the consumer directly'5 ¢ EnEmmrE | E have power and phase maicima of Zolcw treifazic Generator can be used 14 hours a day 24 of GE = f lE = fHTDI'E | E = the manufacturer guarantee for 5 years.  Generators are equipped with satellite control system so not try copying this technology.  If it is found that has been copied by the buyer It is bound by its dissolution by contract to compensation 2,000,000  Euro.  Generator can be purchased from SC VAL Energi STAR SRL` elDD4CI ? 5534Îf ' ? 11 Romaniatranghely @ = , rahoo.esFrom sem na re raotului account within days ED command workers.  Buyer will be honored Ftceste generators are produced to order with no advance tralor (unreadable).
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on November 12, 2013, 07:49:59 PM
Quote: I have a small reactive circuit which I've been working on for some time now to study the effects of reactive power. At this time I can pull over 15 watts (resistive load) of power from it and it doesn't reflect back (Lenz free).

Mmm,careful on this one Luc,some one here will be all over this like a bad rash lol.

My post was inviting him to come play, so I don't have a problem with it. I must say I curious as to why he didn't take the invitation ???

I too have a transformer that shows no reflection on the P/in when the output is loaded-BUT this is only with a resistive load on the output-same as your load. But when i place a resistive inductive load on the output,in way of an electric motor-all hell breaks loose. P/in go's ski high. This is something you should try with your setup,and see what happens to the P/in,as your reactive power will be driving a resistive/inductive load-in the form of the electric motor.

Yes, I did see your magnet core transformer. Seems to be quite close to unity.  I just don't know how accurate the current meter reading on the return to battery with pulses in the kHz range?

Yes, insert an Inductor and everything changes!... but don't worry about that, if you have something working on resistive loads only, that's fine as there's other ways to extract power. Keep up the great work.

The other thing to take into concideration is-how much power are you consuming to create this 15 watts of reactive power?.

Yes, of course that needs to be considered

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: tinman on November 12, 2013, 09:21:43 PM
!!BANG!!-got him

The machine is a fake,and the proof is in the video-he has shot himself in the foot.
We needed to find signs that the power was being drawn from the grid,and i did.

Watch the video in full screen(even in normal size),and pay carful attention from 7.45 when he unplugs the electric motor. You will see the lights(lighting) gets brighter,and when he switches over to (so called) self running mode-the lights (lighting) suddenly dim.

!!GAME OVER!! ;D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qa3MmdqdQ0
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: TinselKoala on November 12, 2013, 11:06:52 PM
Why is there a heavy cable coming out of the device's frame itself?

@gotoluc: there isn't much I can add to tinman's explanation. Also... voltage is not power, as you know, so a step-up in voltage doesn't necessarily mean a step-up in power. The huge capacitor, with the High-Voltage multi-kV standoffs but "220 V" painted on it, is kind of hilarious too. Unless the presenter moves the apparatus to show that there isn't any connection to outside power.... there isn't any point in getting all excited about anything.

When someone goes to visit, the device will be torn down for repair, awaiting a replacement part that failed just before the visitor's taxi arrived... and which will be delivered just after the visitor has to leave for home. Or the visitor will not be allowed to do a full inspection.

Steorn, Mylow, Chuckie Pierce, Yildiz, Wayne Travis... the list of cynical fakers who invite people to come and look, but never actually show the visitors what they claimed to be able to show, goes on and on. If anyone does decide to travel, be sure to get, in advance, a statement of just exactly what will be shown, and an agreement to some kind of financial penalty in the event that what is promised is not shown for _any_ reason other than the visitor simply not showing up.
I predict that if the visitor puts this simple condition on the visit... the invitation to visit will disappear.

@markdansie: I must have missed another PM, I'll check and see. Thanks again!



(ETA it's never a good idea to look at the arc from an arc welder without protective goggles on. Especially if you are wearing contact lenses.)

Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on November 13, 2013, 03:46:45 AM
@gotoluc: there isn't much I can add to tinman's explanation. Also... voltage is not power, as you know, so a step-up in voltage doesn't necessarily mean a step-up in power.

Hi TK,

agree!  voltage is not power. However I'm getting some interesting results when I raise the voltage in the reactive circuit tests I'm doing at this time. In certain conditions raising the voltage actually increases phase separation and power consumption goes down. Too bad my variac only goes to 157vac :-\   as I would love to see how far the effect can go. I guess I'll have to connect it directly to 220vac

The huge capacitor, with the High-Voltage multi-kV standoffs but "220 V" painted on it, is kind of hilarious too.

So you think that's a capacitor!... I was thinking it's a utility line step down transformer. Would that not explain the 220 V painted on it?

Anyways, always value your experience.

Luc

Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: PiCéd on November 13, 2013, 02:24:47 PM
Lorentz force ? Laplace force ?
Electricaly not conservative but magneticaly conservative...
For the moment I don't think it work but I hope I''m wrong.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: wattsup on November 15, 2013, 09:07:53 PM
Hello to all.

Hehehe, I have been off for the last three months building my long planned garage. This will enable me to free up lots of space in our home and especially the overcrowded utility room next to my office so it can be dedicated for OU experimenting. I needed more room Hehehe. I will put up some photos, videos and soon a time lapse of my garage build. Lost 30 pounds but my knees have taken a beating. I never built anything before like this. It was a great challenge for me and it enabled me to sort of deprogram myself from the never ending TKisms, SMisms, etc.

Anyways about this video of this guy showing that multi-motor-generator set-up, looks so great but I see some bad things.

1) First off, mechanically speaking it just does not make any sense. The pulley ratios are almost the same from one motor to the next and all that pulley action should have created so much energy loss but instead the guy is showing so much output while free running. There is no way those components in that set-up can do that. So we look for a discrepancy.

2) When I look at such videos I will always ask myself what does not belong. Right away something jumps out at me. They are the two pieces of wood that are on the cement floor onto which that device is standing on. So, why would you do that when you have a nice solid cement floor. Cannot be because of an uneven floor because you would not use two identical pieces of wood to make something level. You usually level something from one end like when you sit at a restaurant table that wobbles, you insert some folded paper under one of the legs to make it steady.

So the two pieces of wood are there but notice, you can see the entire left wooden piece but not the right wood piece that seems to go into the base of a wooden box that seems also to have been cut especially so that wood piece can pass through. Now why would you want to do all the work when it would have been so easy to reposition the wood. hehehe. Does not smell good just because of this one discrepancy in that video can spell outside energy feed.

wattsup
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: TheCell on November 15, 2013, 09:49:49 PM
The turks seem to have similar devices.
www.ucuzaenerji.net
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CmKQSbDx5o
Look at 0:46 ; all you see is mechanical, no other trick needed .
In this one from another 'inventor' , nothing to see , but you can hear a belt running.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GRTpUJC-eJY
I can remember a story where a guy was experimenting with belts and had 2 similar devices.The first one which he observed overunity and the second one which was an exact replication of the first with no overunity. On day he decided to change the belt of the first one, because it was old and loose. The first device was no overunity anymore . Accidently he found out that if the belt is mounted loosely the overunity effect appears. This maybe total bs , but maybe it is important to use belts and no gears.

Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: gotoluc on November 15, 2013, 11:20:32 PM
Hi everyone,

I invite you to look at a topic I've started today on freely sharing my test results on the topic of Reactive Power.

http://www.overunity.com/14013/reactive-generator-research-for-everyone-to-share/msg377107/#msg377107

Luc
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: PiCéd on November 23, 2013, 02:19:43 PM
I stay sceptical but this video seem to be not faked because they use 750(?) watts and the wattmeter indicate aproximately 2000 watts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hx3szYzyniw
Sceptical because the power input is not visible in the video.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: a.king21 on November 23, 2013, 02:43:35 PM
I stay sceptical but this video seem to be not faked because they use 750(?) watts and the wattmeter indicate aproximately 2000 watts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hx3szYzyniw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hx3szYzyniw)
Sceptical because the power input is not visible in the video.
Richard c Hoagland has been the subject of an NSA disinfo campaign. Where the energy comes from is here:-
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/exopolitica/exopolitics_vonbraun02.htm


Once you understand the source of power, the rest is simple.
So try before you buy, or just build the device. It's up to the younger generation.
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: forest on November 23, 2013, 03:58:03 PM
a.king21


Did somebody computed the total energy of rotating Earth mass ?
Title: Re: Self Running Motor Generator - for sale in 3 weeks
Post by: a.king21 on November 23, 2013, 05:16:10 PM
a.king21


Did somebody computed the total energy of rotating Earth mass ?
I have not researched it, because for me it is not important.
It is an academic issue, I am more into practical building.
But Hoagland's analysis explains that Newton was wrong in saying
that it did not matter if the mass was rotating or stationary.
If you follow Hoagland's blog he shows the similarity between Bruce De Palma's device.
The experiments using a drill to rotate a metal ball and side by side a stationary ball
proves Newton wrong.


Sad but true.




That's how it goes Sir Isaac!