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Author Topic: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.  (Read 13509 times)

Offline HH

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Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« on: August 21, 2013, 08:44:27 PM »
Hi.
As inefficient the peltier modules are for cooling , they seem to be over 100% efficient in reverse.  :o
Please check this website and have a look at the heating picture.
http://www.memmert.com/?id=199
Scaled up to 6kW input would give 9.2kW heat output.
Interesting ?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline truesearch

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Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2013, 09:12:31 PM »
@HH


That is very interesting information. What I got out of their data is that it apparently takes ambient heat energy and adds it in to arrive at the COP > 1 effect.


Now, if it were practical and  possible to construct a real/functional high-efficiency (90%-95%) Tesla-turbine and generate steam with the peltier module then we could drive a generator and get more electrical power out than was supplied. . . .


truesearch

Offline HH

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Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2013, 09:22:02 PM »
I don't think it would work, with so many convertions, introducing losses. But looks interesting for home heating.
The winter is getting closer, so I'm freaking out again about the cost of heating  :D. Cheers

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2013, 09:22:02 PM »
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Offline Magluvin

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Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2013, 03:39:40 AM »
Hi.
As inefficient the peltier modules are for cooling , they seem to be over 100% efficient in reverse.  :o
Please check this website and have a look at the heating picture.
http://www.memmert.com/?id=199
Scaled up to 6kW input would give 9.2kW heat output.
Interesting ?

Interesting. Hmmm.  Ive played with these modules. Never thought about its use as a heater nor bothered to measure the output in heat.  If its true, could it be that the 'hot' sides heat energy is a combination of heat pulled from the cold side, plus heat developed by current through the device?

One would have to have an apparatus set up to test this 'more heat out than what came from the cold side' possibility. And if there is more heat out than Pin, then the conversion from the hot side to the cold side, I would say, could possibly be extremely efficient.

Heating a home with them might be difficult. It is hard to pull heat from the cold outdoors. the heat has to come from somewhere. Man, that cold side would be even colder than the outdoors. It would be like putting the cold side in your freezer and pump heat out. The coils on the back of the fridge produce heat, but not enough to heat the house

Not saying there is no heat in snow or ice. ;D   This could all be simulated on a bench. Cold outdoors and the indoor environments can be done with beer coolers.


Not being a skeptic. Just pointing out some things from my experience with these devices. Now, if we closed the loop on the hot and cold sides, like have a block of aluminum with a slot cut out in the middle of one side, that the module could be inserted, with heat sink paste, so that the cold and the hot side are connected to each other through the heat conducting block. Now we power up the module and measure V, A and temperature of the block over time. Probably insulate the outside of the block to eliminate heat losses for more accuracy.   Most likely the block will heat up, due to losses by current through the device and should equal ratios for power in and the amount of heat produced. If it does, then the conversion effect from hot to cold side just may be free. Like, what this thread is about. More heat out than was pulled from the cold side.  Dunno. Would have to be tried. ;)


Mags

Offline HH

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Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2013, 01:05:11 PM »
Hi Mags
Thank you for your input.
Back in the days I was also playing with peltiers. Cooling cpu's  :)
Had pentium 3 overclocked from 300 to 500 MHz at -2 deg.   8)
Tonns of heat do dissipate on hot side.
You are correct, It is a resistive heater plus benefit of transported heat from outside.
Very similat to commercial heating systems with heat pumps.
With temperatures outside above 0 deg celsius, it's possible to take heat straight from air.
If it's colder you can use ground or pond, to have contant temp above 0.
Max delta T those modules are capable is 80 deg celcius if I remember correctly.
Cheers

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2013, 01:05:11 PM »
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Offline truesearch

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Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2013, 04:35:56 PM »

I agree, there appears to be "heat-energy" being moved from the "colder-side" to the "hotter-side" with this devise, much like a conventional heat-pump.What I hope to see is a "high-efficiency" conversion of HEAT-TO-ELECTRICITY. With that figured out, we possibly could "close-the-loop" and have a stand alone unit to power a vehicle or other applications.
truesearch

Offline lumen

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Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2013, 05:22:50 PM »
I like the idea of a solid state heat pump, but a COP of 1.5 is a bit low since heat pumps now have a COP of around 4.0 or better.
 
I'm sure this will change soon with some of the new graphene technology coming out.
 

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2013, 05:22:50 PM »
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Offline HH

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Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2013, 06:33:34 PM »
@lumen
It's a valid point and I'm aware of the efficiency difference of the peltier module vs vapor compression.
The thing is, peltier system would be relatively cheap and possible to diy and you still getting more out then in.
Cheers

Offline HH

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Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2013, 07:28:35 PM »
@truesearch
Once someone comes up with the idea of efficient heat to electricity conversion, we could have devices running on ambient heat.
That would be great.
Cheers

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Heating with peltier module as heatpump.
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2013, 07:28:35 PM »
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