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Author Topic: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal  (Read 1580600 times)

Offline skribat

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #735 on: June 14, 2014, 12:13:32 PM »
this is the greyscale which is a little easier, but really gives very little new.

Offline xhacks

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #736 on: June 14, 2014, 02:07:06 PM »
Can someone upload Nenad Savic's videos to another place, please.


Cheers,
Adrian

Offline skribat

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #737 on: June 17, 2014, 08:28:37 PM »
This is the latest news I received from my contact in Brazil about the Captor progress ..  9th May 2014
--------
They are negotiating a deal with investors outside Brazil. Yesterday i had a long talk with the Brazilian middleman of this, but he is under a NDA... Anyway those investors have intentions to open the technology very close of a Open Source style.
Much will happen until the end of this year... And next year it is absolutely certain that we will have here at the www.fisl.org.br a Captor powering a portion of the event.
Tomorrow we will have the lecture of Sterling Allan, you can find the schedule at

http://papers.softwarelivre.org/papers_ng/public/new_grid?day=7

Today will happen a lecture about Barbosa technology but it will be in Portuguese.

Out live streaming are at

http://softwarelivre.org/fisl15/ao-vivo

Best
---------


Offline Farmhand

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #739 on: June 25, 2014, 05:11:32 PM »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbNvUZT4NC4

That's a good video showing exactly whats going on, note he mentions he had to bypass the RCD (safety switch) because it kept tripping open.

At the end we clearly see the grid is supplying 2.4 amps from the active (phase) wire and that current is caused to pass through
the ground back to where the neutral is connected to the ground stake near the fuse/meter box, thus bypassing the measuring
arrangement in the meter and fooling it. Weather or not the meter on the house is being fooled is neither here nor there, if t is
fooling the house meter the power is being stolen, if it isn't fooling the house meter then the power is being paid for.

Seeing the around 80 volt drop on the load when the current is forced through the ground makes sense and someone with the
ability could determine the ground resistance that way maybe.

Maybe someone with knowledge of exactly how a meter box is wired could make a drawing to show the current loop in the
"captor" mode and in the usual mode of power use.

Bypassing the RCD could be very dangerous, that is why they exist, many people died so a safety fix was needed. Here they are mandatory.

...

Offline skribat

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #740 on: June 25, 2014, 07:57:56 PM »
I also enjoyed the video but I don't remember any reference anywhere to the A/C-D/C  conversion as in the Captor units? .. I must assume that the coils and connections have been replicated, but why did Leal and Barbosa include a/c-d/c converters and a magnetic pulse sensor unit if they aren't necessary?

Offline Farmhand

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #741 on: June 26, 2014, 12:19:53 AM »
It would be necessary for one reason because of the huge voltage drop, he isn't getting 240 volts AC powering the hair dryer,
he's getting way under 200 volts and a lot of household appliances would reject that. SO the drop could be fixed by using a AC to
DC converter then converting back to AC at the proper voltage. The voltage drop makes the 160-180 volts almost unusable for a
lot of things.

Seeing the huge voltage drop we can clearly see that the arrangement is very inefficient, the voltage drop represents a big loss of
power due to the ground resistance.

Basically if the house meter is fooled (which is the goal of the device) then power is being stolen and it is being used very inefficiently.
More or less the missing voltage is consumed by the ground resistance.

Going by the drawings in the patent the only drawing that works is the one with the active grid line directly connected to the High
Current loop
and it is obvious what the result of that would be. Which is the voltage across the load is the potential between the
active grid wire and the ground, the ground taking the place of the neutral line (return line), this is how the meters cannot
measure the power because there is no return current through the meter.

EDIT: The system can never operate in that iteration with a working RCD (safety switch) in place and that is hard evidence that
the entire thing is a scam.

Trying to say the output is free from the ground is ridiculous. The power is supplied by the grid and the meters are bypassed.

My own experiments showed this if you looked.

I'll consider the device valid if the current from the active line does not feed the load with a return through the ground.

Barbosa and Leal should be in Jail as well if they are in fact trying to develop and distribute for use a system that bypasses the
meters, and most importantly bypasses the RCD (safety switch), because people will die. And they will be to blame if their device
is the cause of a death.

Think about it, a Death, a persons life cut short due to a knowingly dangerous device. Imagine it to be your own much loved relative.

Unless we are electricians and trained with an assistant present we should not be messing with the grid power at all
behind the socket.

..

Many electricians do work alone on dangerous power systems, but they should take all the proper precautions. If I was an
electrician I would feel better if I had an assistant working with me in case I was rendered unconscious.

Being a boilermaker (metal fabricator) I run the risk of high current electrocution as well as other things that could render me
unconscious if care and precautions are not taken. I refuse to work in potentially dangerous situations without an assistant, an
apprentice with first aid training or an observer with first aid training. As with many other industrial occupations people get killed
and maimed, so we undergo a lot of on the job safety training and are instructed in electricity basics as apprentices in college,
those of us that took notice learned a bit about the dangers of electricity and how it can do odd things.

ie, arc drift in DC arc welding. For years I spent a good portion of the day watching an arc through a lens and dealing with power
cables around rail wagons ect. and around very dangerous stuff, I've seen people get electrocuted and have been electrocuted
myself more than once by 240 volts from the grid, even if it doesn't kill you it will do damage, I've also been electrocuted by
hundreds of amps output arc welders at low voltage with sweat from working as a conduction aid. Low voltage high current
electrocution is slow and I felt myself fading to black before falling and luckily pulling the Earth cable from the job. This happened
over 20 years ago. Safety is now much better mostly because of people demanding it because of seeing people harmed or
maimed. People cut off fingers and do all kinds of things.  :o

I can assure you if you survive a hit from the 240 grid you are lucky and will endeavor to never do it again while giving stern
warnings to those who do not take care as it is a matter of duty of care for anyone witnessing unsafe practices.
I would hope if someone seen me doing something very dangerous they would warn me of the danger immediately.

..

Offline Mancha

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #742 on: June 26, 2014, 08:29:44 AM »
Farmhand wrote: Basically if the house meter is fooled (which is the goal of the device) then power is being stolen and it is being used very inefficiently.
More or less the missing voltage is consumed by the ground resistance.

my respond:
I am not sure that house meter is fooled.

Offline Neo-X

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #743 on: June 26, 2014, 10:18:50 AM »
I was give up on this. In spite of simplicity of the patent no one can replicate this.  :(

Offline skribat

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #744 on: June 26, 2014, 10:37:26 AM »
DON'T GIVE UP ..  it took a long time to get gold from the ground, and longer still to learn how to process it.
we need to remember that  the electricity company took away the Captor to test it, they also believed it was a device which fooled the meters .. they then tested it (them) to see if they could find that they are unsafe .. when they found nothing the devices had to be returned.
Another point to remember is that the Captor was independently tested whilst running from a battery and the result verified as being six times OU  (6xOU) not more as was found previously when a test measurement was found to be inaccurate.  They have plans to self loop a battery powered unit .. You can be sure that the  (french) electricity company would have stopped them if it could have.  Just the fact that they have not been able to stop them might indicate three things, 1)  it works .. 2)  it needs more development before they see it as being a serious threat .. 3) it doesn't steal electricity.

Just my thoughts, as with the GEET device and developments with Plasma, people are getting closer, the only thing big business can do is to buy up the developments as they hit the market in order to keep the wraps on .. remember  Genpax hydrogen (on demand) electric car developed in Japan .. now controlled by big business but exist it does .. AND IT WORKS .. as do lots of other things.

Offline nelsonrochaa

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #745 on: June 26, 2014, 02:11:34 PM »
Hi to all, I make my simple replication and one thing i can tell , something strange happens.
See the video   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qsnEchKlc8.
In the moment i prepare a improved version to test.
Any suggestions :)

Offline captainkt

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #746 on: June 26, 2014, 08:43:27 PM »
@Farmhand, in the UK the earth is the neutral and I can assure you 100% that running a load/house with live to earth will not alter your meter reading one jot, it is the same as running live to neutral. PME system look up on wikipedia. I tried it for 6 months when my earth leakage trip blew so bypassed the neutral. Readings and bill stayed the same.
Regards
Keith       
PS. I guess I am one of those people that mess with 240V mains and more all the time, even survived a full 440 3 phase mains shock at work from one hand to the other, although it did render me unconscious for a few minutes.

Offline Farmhand

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #747 on: June 26, 2014, 10:37:15 PM »
Which meter the House meter or the energy meter showing a few watts just before the device.

Yes it all depends on how the residence is wired, every house in the world is not wired the same way.

The guy showed the meter being fooled right on video, the neutral was bypassed and the ground became the return no doubt
about it. I seen the video and it was clear. If one meter can be fooled so can two.

As I said weather the house meter is fooled or not is neither here nor there, if the house meter is not fooled the power is paid for
anyway, if the house meter is fooled the power is stolen.

It's not up to me who messes with what, as long as I give warnings, I'm satisfied.

....

Offline Farmhand

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #748 on: June 26, 2014, 10:40:08 PM »
I was give up on this. In spite of simplicity of the patent no one can replicate this.  :(

In order to replicate this the RCD must be bypassed as in the last video, that was a replication and it was a successful one. It just
didn't show what Barbosa and Leal claimed, instead it showed the real picture.

Take it or leave it and replicate it your self. Just don't die trying please.

..

Offline Farmhand

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Re: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal
« Reply #749 on: June 26, 2014, 10:59:53 PM »
DON'T GIVE UP ..  it took a long time to get gold from the ground, and longer still to learn how to process it.
we need to remember that  the electricity company took away the Captor to test it, they also believed it was a device which fooled the meters .. they then tested it (them) to see if they could find that they are unsafe .. when they found nothing the devices had to be returned.
Another point to remember is that the Captor was independently tested whilst running from a battery and the result verified as being six times OU  (6xOU) not more as was found previously when a test measurement was found to be inaccurate.  They have plans to self loop a battery powered unit .. You can be sure that the  (french) electricity company would have stopped them if it could have.  Just the fact that they have not been able to stop them might indicate three things, 1)  it works .. 2)  it needs more development before they see it as being a serious threat .. 3) it doesn't steal electricity.

Just my thoughts, as with the GEET device and developments with Plasma, people are getting closer, the only thing big business can do is to buy up the developments as they hit the market in order to keep the wraps on .. remember  Genpax hydrogen (on demand) electric car developed in Japan .. now controlled by big business but exist it does .. AND IT WORKS .. as do lots of other things.

Yes well if the setup does not steal power and is not dangerous in itself, the energy company can do nothing.
It's only when people disable their RCD and use the actually "fooled" energy meter reading before the device to claim OU that
there is a problem
. And if power is not being stolen then it's none of their concern. Why would they even care if no power is
actually being stolen.

The energy company can do nothing about a con man and a stand alone energy meter being fooled. Nothing

But how do you explain the fact that the only iteration of the device that works is the one that does trip the RCD open. And if it
does trip the RCD then it cannot be used as a permanent house installed device. And it is using the ground as the return, which is
inherently very dangerous for household appliances.

If you encourage people to experiment with a device knowing it is dangerous and one of those people you encouraged gets killed by the
device then you ought to take some responsibility for that. Think about that. What are your qualifications skribat ?

...