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Author Topic: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".  (Read 392384 times)

Online synchro1

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #270 on: May 29, 2013, 04:24:40 PM »
Sorry, it is not correct.  The facing pancake surfaces are not comparable for the two cases, that is why I disagree.  See also Magluvin answer here http://www.overunity.com/13460/teslas-coil-for-electro-magnets/msg361720/#msg361720

Gyula

The coils don't have to be connected to cancel the inductance. It's enough that the current is running in the other direction between the conductors in close adjacency to one another.
 
 

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #270 on: May 29, 2013, 04:24:40 PM »

Offline gyulasun

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #271 on: May 29, 2013, 04:35:10 PM »
The coils don't have to be connected to cancel the inductance. It's enough that the current is running in the other direction between the conductors in close adjacency to one another.

Well, nobody wrote that the coils have to be connected to cancel the inductance. Your answer above proves again your typical topic twisting when it is proved what you wrote was not correct. Please change this behaviour, it leads to nowhere.  Thanks.

Online synchro1

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #272 on: May 29, 2013, 06:01:19 PM »
Milehigh just stated there was no comparison between the magnets! The  serial bifilar pancake projects a directional electromagnetic pulse that's focused.  This allows it to broadcast and recieve it's own power, as well as align electron spin. The current electromagnet is merely an modern improvement. All the fundamental forces are at work in those counter facing pancakes. They jolt a field into the scrap first, then produce a low level cling current. You can spark the sigle wire nail wrap all you want, you will never get the kind of impulse magnetization effect the SBC delivers.

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #272 on: May 29, 2013, 06:01:19 PM »
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Offline MileHigh

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #273 on: May 29, 2013, 07:02:52 PM »
I want to correct a mistake that I made:

Quote
All four layers form a giant ampere-turn magnetic field generator that work together.  You can see how the metal casing of the electromagnet takes the "top" flux and channels it to the center and "points" it downwards.  The same "top" flux is also channeled to the outer ring of the casing and is also "pointed" downwards.  So Gyula's "magnetic footprint" drawing is wrong.   If the center circle of his drawing is red, then the outer ring that he has marked in blue is also actually red.  Following Gyula's convention where blue represents the opposite polarity, then what Gyula shows as white should be blue.  In summary, at the inside you have the red circle, then you have a blue ring around that, and on the outside you have a thin red ring.  That's how the electromagnet is designed.

This is poor visualization on my part and I got confused.  Gyula's original comments on the configuration of the "magnetic footprint" of the electromagnet are correct.

MileHigh

Offline MileHigh

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #274 on: May 29, 2013, 07:18:12 PM »
Synchro1:

Quote
Milehigh just stated there was no comparison between the magnets! The  serial bifilar pancake projects a directional electromagnetic pulse that's focused.  This allows it to broadcast and recieve it's own power, as well as align electron spin. The current electromagnet is merely an modern improvement. All the fundamental forces are at work in those counter facing pancakes. They jolt a field into the scrap first, then produce a low level cling current. You can spark the sigle wire nail wrap all you want, you will never get the kind of impulse magnetization effect the SBC delivers.

This "fantasy world" of electronics that you seem to live in is not healthy.  Where do you get these statements from?

I challenge you to post a diagram that illustrates your comment about "projecting a directional electromagnetic pulse that's focused."  Please post a diagram that is annotated with some supplementary information.  Also when you make the posting give us a few paragraphs of text that explain exactly what you mean and explain your annotations in the diagram.  Please tell us all about the electron spin.  Tell us all about the pulse and where it comes from.  Please explain to us all about the "impulse magnetization effect" that you claim is a special property of the SBC.  Please illustrate that with an annotated diagram also and explain the diagram with a few paragraphs of text.

If can you do that then we will comment on your posting.  If you can't do that then you have been caught talking fantasy nonsense.

MileHigh

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #274 on: May 29, 2013, 07:18:12 PM »
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Online synchro1

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #275 on: May 29, 2013, 09:12:40 PM »
@Milehigh,
                  Another miserable homework assignment huh?  Here's one for you: Whats a spark?

Offline MileHigh

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #276 on: May 29, 2013, 10:08:42 PM »
Synchro1:

Busted!  lol

It's like Bioshock Infinity a la Tesla!

Get your protein pills and keep your helmet on!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBOtpwOZSFk

MileHigh

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #276 on: May 29, 2013, 10:08:42 PM »
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Offline Farmhand

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #277 on: May 29, 2013, 10:28:36 PM »
I got your point - but if the windings are almost 90 degrees to your sum flux direction - there wont be an induction phenomenen in the wire - and there should be pretty no contribution to the overall inductivity.
The contribution to overall inductivity would increase if you change the inclination of your windings from 90 degrees towards 45 degrees in  relation to your sum flux / rotational axis.
As long as you donĀ“t exceed flux saturation in your ferro magnetic wire - you will observe increased inductivity - if you saturate the wire, inductivity will fall back to normal - and there will be iron losses in the wire.

rgds.

Hi Fritz, I think i get it now, and it seems basic logic so it makes sense to me. Thank you very much for explaining that in that way. Much appreciated.

So to carry the thinking further to a different situation. If I was to wind an air core steel wire coil, then if I insert a smaller steel coil inside it with the coil terminals open, the inserted coil would not act as core because the turns are in the same plane as the main coil. It would simply act as an open secondary ?

Alternatively if I was to wind a steel coil that was long loops of turns and placed that inside the main coil so the windings were at 90 degrees it would not act as a secondary but as a core, the inserted coil would develop no emf but would support or engage the magnetic flux.

So the in between case would be a steel wire coil with the windings done in a 45 degree cross hatched pattern, ie. one layer at 45 degrees  to vertical from 0 degrees to 180 degrees circumference wise, then progressive layers of 45 degree windings around the coil circumference in 90 degree progressions. Just as a thought experiment such a winding with steel wire should do both, or if two coils wound as such so that one could fit inside the other then the inserted one would act as a coil and a core, it must and the individual coils would also act as coils and cores as long as there was some angle between enough windings within the coil.

Cheers

Offline gyulasun

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #278 on: May 30, 2013, 12:22:09 AM »
Milehigh just stated there was no comparison between the magnets! The  serial bifilar pancake projects a directional electromagnetic pulse that's focused.  This allows it to broadcast and recieve it's own power, as well as align electron spin. The current electromagnet is merely an modern improvement. All the fundamental forces are at work in those counter facing pancakes. They jolt a field into the scrap first, then produce a low level cling current. You can spark the sigle wire nail wrap all you want, you will never get the kind of impulse magnetization effect the SBC delivers.

Synchro1:

I have asked you to to change your behaviour but you try to defend your 'brainchilds' with fire and iron, however you do not show any proof.  Words you desperatly keep repeating or you search on the net for pancake etc and quote others' words on them are not proof.

You showed pictures of some components but you did not show measurements to prove what you claim with those components.
I already also asked you to show the current drop to zero you claim to happen above a certain rpm in your setup. What 'secret' would you lose if you showed it??  Just an Ammeter hooked up to your setup, is that too problematic? Can you rebuild your setup again to have a second identically behaving setup?

When your attitude change to the better, I will pay attention again.

Gyula

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #278 on: May 30, 2013, 12:22:09 AM »
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Offline gyulasun

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #279 on: May 30, 2013, 12:23:28 AM »
I want to correct a mistake that I made:


MH:  okay, no problem.

Gyula

Online synchro1

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #280 on: May 30, 2013, 05:50:54 AM »
@Gyulasum,

                    You guys are real good when it comes to dishing jobs out, why not do the jolt test on your nail coils?

                                                                   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvb39SwTXBE
 
TK shows his SB pancake throwing a larger spark in this video. Go ahead and spark your nail coils and see for yourself wether or not you notice any difference.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #280 on: May 30, 2013, 05:50:54 AM »
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Offline gyulasun

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #281 on: May 30, 2013, 04:25:27 PM »
synchro1

I simply asked you about 'apples' and you answer with 'oranges' as usual.

I did not ask for your setup "blueprints",  I did not ask for any details. I simply asked for showing the input current draw drops to zero with an Ammeter  as you claimed happening above a certain RPM.   If this asking is "a dishing jobs out" for you,  then I think your claims are fishy, that is all. Be happy with your setup.

Offline MileHigh

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #282 on: May 30, 2013, 05:24:51 PM »
Synchro1:

Quote
TK shows his SB pancake throwing a larger spark in this video. Go ahead and spark your nail coils and see for yourself wether or not you notice any difference.

TK is a great guy but he is human and like anyone else he can make mistakes or oversights.  It that clip he does a "swap" as opposed to doing an "A-B" comparison with some kind of reference.  So you have no idea in the second part of his experiment if the SB coil is a better "broadcaster" or if the regular coil is a better "receiver."   So the test is inconclusive.

Electronics is a REAL discipline Synchro1, and it has to be studied for years to understand and apply it properly.  Your actions simply spread disinformation and confuse people like it's all some kind of silly game.  Think about that.

MileHigh

Online synchro1

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #283 on: May 30, 2013, 05:31:30 PM »
The only point TK makes in the video is that the serial pancake generates a larger spark. TK'S spark is not an entertaining rock music video.

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Tesla's "COIL FOR ELECTRO-MAGNETS".
« Reply #284 on: May 30, 2013, 05:36:25 PM »
Synchro1:

TK is a great guy
No argument there...
Quote
but he is human
not according to some you might ask...
Quote
and like anyone else he can make mistakes or oversights. 
Who... me? Oh ye of little faith....
Quote
It that clip he does a "swap" as opposed to doing an "A-B" comparison with some kind of reference.  So you have no idea in the second part of his experiment if the SB coil is a better "broadcaster" or if the regular coil is a better "receiver."   So the test is inconclusive.
That's right, as shown. But this and other tests I've done support the basic conclusion.... that there is a difference in performance between the two coils in the same conditions. This difference is due to the increased inter-turn capacitance and the effect of this capacitance on the coil's total impedance at the stimulating frequencies. Any way you look at it, the bifilar wound coil can store, and release, more energy than the flat pancake coil of the same wire length and geometry.
It is possible to take this simple fact and twist it and warp it around, but the fact remains: you get out what you put in, minus losses.
Quote

Electronics is a REAL discipline Synchro1, and it has to be studied for years to understand and apply it properly.  Your actions simply spread disinformation and confuse people like it's all some kind of silly game.  Think about that.

MileHigh
I'm sure Nikola Tesla would be rolling in his grave, if he wasn't secretly working in some underground government laboratory, being kept alive by periodic jolts from a huge Tesla coil......

 ;)

 

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