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Author Topic: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles  (Read 73111 times)

Offline hoptoad

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #15 on: March 22, 2013, 05:47:05 AM »
snip...

I think you are conducting experiments on AUL since 2003 which is since a decade.  But so far you have failed to make the system perpetual.  I don't think it is possible with  your method.  (sorry to say that)

Don't be sorry for expressing your views and sharing your knowledge. Your view on this phenomenon is shared by myself and many others who have extensively explored AUL since the 1980's/90's, after Robert Adams resurrected interest in it in the 1970's.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline vineet_kiran

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #16 on: March 22, 2013, 09:31:43 AM »


When generator accelerates under load it will also rotate the motor rotor at higher speed since both are coupled.  When motor rotor rotates at higher speed,  it will cause more back emf induced in the rotor winding which in turn automatically reduce the torque of motor.



You are right.  That is the reason why you have to first convert torque motor to speed motor so that when generator accelerates under load,  it will not  have much effect on performance of motor and this process has to be done in stages.
Just to refresh your memeory : (Reply # 573)
http://www.overunity.com/11350/confirming-the-delayed-lenz-effect/msg353548/#msg353548
See this also : (Reply  # 410  - Magnetic Chain Reaction)
http://www.overunity.com/11350/confirming-the-delayed-lenz-effect/msg303530/#msg303530
 
 

Offline DeepCut

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2013, 11:20:32 AM »
Thanks Newton and HopToad for your input.

We've now established you don't believe this sytem works.

I won't waste your time or mine by trying to convince you that it does, and i'm not having this thread turn into a war of views on the subject, the first post in this thread explains its purpose.

I'm going to be a complete fascist and say that, anyone who posts in the thread with their only objective being to keep repeating the fact that they think it won't work, will be blocked from posting in it again.

I know that's not democratic but i really don't want this thread to turn into a flame war so that's my cards on the table.


All the best,

DC.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2013, 11:20:32 AM »
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Offline Newton II

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #18 on: March 22, 2013, 01:53:07 PM »
Thanks Newton and HopToad for your input.
h
We've now established you don't believe this sytem works.



Dear DC Sir,


I would wait till you post a video and desing details of your above said working system.   Now I am 62 years old.  If I remain alive till such time,  I will be the first person to congratulate you.

Thanks


 




Offline DeepCut

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #19 on: March 22, 2013, 01:59:32 PM »

Dear DC Sir,


I would wait till you post a video and desing details of your above said working system.   Now I am 62 years old.  If I remain alive till such time,  I will be the first person to congratulate you.

Thanks

Dear Newton Sir,

respect to your seniority and implied wisdom.

I don't have a working system, Thane does.

If you want videos all of the relevent videos and documents are posted at the beginning of this thread.


All the best,

DC.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #19 on: March 22, 2013, 01:59:32 PM »
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Offline Farmhand

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2013, 01:15:07 AM »
Thane you state that a shorted output is an infinite load or like an infinite load, but how can it be defined like that ?

eg. a 25 Watt light globe dissipates 25 Watts out of the system as heat and light if powered by a supply that is suitable.

How much energy does a short circuited output dissipate out of the system as heat and light or whatever else ?

I guess it depends on the nature of the output, it's impedance ect.

I think a short circuit is quite different to a resistive load, unless the short circuit has significant resistance in itself and
there is significant current as well. The fact that the acceleration can be seen with a load as well but only when a
voltage drop is seen, to me shows the load on the prime mover is reduced because the voltage produced is reduced.
And this is what I see on the scope. The generator in the video at lower speeds acts as a regular generator and reduces speed under load.

Accelerating a rotor under load is easy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFWin-crxQY

The input power reduces as it accelerates under load or short circuit. Are you saying I produced OU ?

Because it most certainly didn't look like it to me. I've also done the reducing input under load with a transformer,
that didn't look much like OU or free energy either. Oh and I can do it with a pair of Tesla transformers too, one as the AC generator
and the other as the output transformer, in all cases the reduction in input is because of a reduction in the load on the prime mover,
or the source of EMF in the case of the transformers, I can see this with the transformers because the battery loaded voltage increases with load
as there is a decrease in input from the battery indicating less loading on the battery, which is an indicator of the load causing a reduction
of load on the source as compared to when there is no load. With a motor this would cause the rotor to accelerate.

Idle power consumption is considered in motor, transformer and generator efficiency because the idle losses can be reduced
as the devices are loaded up more, the power factor and efficiency can improve.

In this field of endeavor I think we are concerned more with the total efficiency of the entire process.

The overall efficiency of a motor, transformer or generator can be improved by reducing it's actual or (real) idle input power (no load running input power) .

The way I see it a generator that uses 300 Watts input at idle with no load, then when a 100 Watt load is applied the generator input reduces to 200 Watts
then that generator is 50% efficient with a 100 Watt load. How can it not be ?

Anyway proof is in the pudding if you can produce a self running machine using those methods you will have the last laugh.

Cheers 

Offline Overschuss

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2013, 03:47:50 AM »
Thane you state that a shorted output is an infinite load or like an infinite load, but how can it be defined like that ?
[...]
I think a short circuit is quite different to a resistive load, unless the short circuit has significant resistance in itself and
there is significant current as well.
[...]


You're right !
Everyone who has already 'played' with Coils, Magnets, Motors/Dynamos knows that this statement is absolutely correct.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2013, 03:47:50 AM »
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Offline THANE HEINS

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2013, 02:40:58 PM »
Thane you state that a shorted output is an infinite load or like an infinite load, but how can it be defined like that ?

eg. a 25 Watt light globe dissipates 25 Watts out of the system as heat and light if powered by a supply that is suitable.

How much energy does a short circuited output dissipate out of the system as heat and light or whatever else ?

I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO PUT A 25 WATT LIGHT BULB IN ONE OF YOUR YOUR HOUSE AC SOCKETS AND THEN PUT A DEAD SHORT ACROSS ANOTHER SOCKET AND LET THE CIRCUIT BREAKER TELL YOU WHICH LOAD IS HIGHER AND IS DISSIPATING MORE POWER. :o

Quote
I think a short circuit is quite different to a resistive load, unless the short circuit has significant resistance in itself and
there is significant current as well.

NOW PUT A SHORT CIRCUIT [INFINITE LOAD] ACROSS YOUR LEAD ACID BATTERY TERMINALS AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS...

GET READY TO PUT OUT THE FIRE WHEN THE HIGH CURRENT FLOW THROUGH NEAR ZERO OHM LOAD SETS THE WIRE'S INSULATION ON FIRE OR BLOWS UP THE BATTERY. :P

LOAD RESISTANCE IS A INDICATOR OF HOW MUCH CURRENT CAN FLOW THROUGH IT.

A HIGH RESISTANCE LOAD I.E. 10,000 OHMS IS A VIRTUAL NO-LOAD, OPEN CIRCUIT CONDITION BECAUSE VIRTUALLY NO CURRENT FLOWS.

A LOW RESISTANCE LOAD I.E. 0.01 OHMS IS A VIRTUAL INFINITE LOAD, SHORT CIRCUIT CONDITION BECAUSE MAXIMUM CURRENT FLOWS.

THIS IS ELECTRICITY 101 FRIENDS - BUT SADLY MANY PhDs DON'T EVEN KNOW THIS SIMPLE FACT. :-\

Quote
Accelerating a rotor under load is easy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFWin-crxQY

YES IF YOU SATURATE THE CORE.

Quote
The input power reduces as it accelerates under load or short circuit. Are you saying I produced OU ?

ABSOLUTELY IF YOU ARE NOT SATURATING THE COIL'S CORE... :D

Quote
Idle power consumption is considered in motor, transformer and generator efficiency because the idle losses can be reduced as the devices are loaded up more, the power factor and efficiency can improve.

NOT TRUE AT ALL BECAUSE AN UNLOADED MOTOR, TRANSFORMER AND GENERATOR ALL HAVE ZERO OUTPUT AND ZERO EFFICIENCY! ???

Quote
In this field of endeavor I think we are concerned more with the total efficiency of the entire process.

The overall efficiency of a motor, transformer or generator can be improved by reducing it's actual or (real) idle input power (no load running input power) .

The way I see it a generator that uses 300 Watts input at idle with no load, then when a 100 Watt load is applied the generator input reduces to 200 Watts then that generator is 50% efficient with a 100 Watt load. How can it not be ?

I WOULD ALSO ENCOURAGE YOU TO GET EDGEMUCATED AND READ THE WORK ENERGY PRINCIPLE AND THE LAW OF CONSERVATION OF ENERGY WHICH STATES THAT "THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FREE LUNCH" AND "ENERGY CANNOT BE CREATED OR DESTROYED"

SO IF A GENERATOR IS ABLE TO DELIVER EVEN AN INFINITELY SMALL AMOUNT OF POWER WITH NO INCREASE IN ON-LOAD INPUT THEN IT IS CREATING ENERGY (INTERNALLY) AND IS OU ;D - AS LONG AS THE LOSSES ARE NOT BEING REDUCED SOMEHOW IN THE PROCESS.

Quote
Anyway proof is in the pudding if you can produce a self running machine using those methods you will have the last laugh.
Cheers

I THOUGHT THIS OU FORUM WAS A SELF RUNNING MACHINE?

WELL A SELF RUNNING IGNORANCE MACHINE 8) ANYWAY...

ANY SYSTEM THAT IS RUNNING (ROTATING) AT A STEADY STATE SPEED NO MATTER HOW INEFFICIENT HAS A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF KINETIC ENERGY STORED IN IT (INERTIA/POTENTIAL ENERGY) AND CAN ONLY DO SO MUCH WORK.

IN ORDER TO INCREASE THE SPEED, THE KINETIC ENERGY, THE INERTIA, AND THE POTENTIAL ENERGY - WORK MUST BE DONE ON THAT OBJECT, ENERGY MUST BE PUT INTO THE SYSTEM FROM THE OUTSIDE TO BRING IT TO A HIGHER POTENTIAL ENERGY...

(ANYONE WHO HAS DRIVEN A CAR, RODE A BICYCLE, OR WALKED UP A FLIGHT OF STAIRS [NO MATTER HOW FAT AND OUT OF SHAPE/INEFFICIENT IN ORDER TO INCREASE THEIR POTENTIAL ENERGY BEFORE THEY JUMPED OFF KNOWS THAT THIS STATEMENT IS ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!) :-*

WHEN YOU CAN DO ANY WORK (EVEN A SUPER SMALL AMOUNT OF WORK) WITHOUT PUTTING ENERGY IN FROM THE OUTSIDE (OR CONSUMING MORE POWER) OR DECREASING THE INITIAL INEFFICIENCY THEN YOU ARE DOING SOMETHING (WORK) FOR FREE WHICH IS THE ESSENCE OF OU AND THE ESSENCE OF FREE ENERGY NO MATTER HOW SMALL.

THIS "SELF RUNNING MACHINE" IDEA WAS PROBABLY PLANTED BY A OIL COMPANY MOLE TO KEEP OU PIONEERS FROM REALIZING THEIR OWN AWESOME ACCOMPLISHMENTS IN ORDER TO PERPETUATE THE COMPLETELY FALSE LAW OF CONSERVATION OF ENERGY HOAX AND TO KEEP TEACHING THIS CRAP TO OUR CHILDREN INSTEAD OF CORRECTING THE PHYSICS BOOKS.  :-X
 
REGARDS
T
 
Thane C. Heins
President & CEO
Potential +/- Difference Inc. R & D
"Change catalysts using our potential to make a positive difference"
Email: thaneh@potentialdifference.ca
Cell: 613.795.1602
YOUTUBE http://www.youtube.com/user/pdicanada1 
Linkedin http://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=107557432&trk=tab_pro
slideshare http://www.slideshare.net/ThaneCHeins 


Offline THANE HEINS

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2013, 03:06:31 PM »
From Thane:
Not necessarily so. It could also mean that the efficiency of the generator was increased from some original value below 100%, to some higher value than the previous one, but still less than 100%.

SO IF A GENERATOR IS ABLE TO DELIVER EVEN AN INFINITELY SMALL AMOUNT OF POWER WITH NO INCREASE IN ON-LOAD INPUT THEN IT IS CREATING ENERGY (INTERNALLY) AND IS OU  :D - AS LONG AS THE LOSSES ARE NOT BEING REDUCED SOMEHOW IN THE PROCESS.

IF THE SYSTEM HAS ACCELERATED (ITSELF) AND THE ON-LOAD KINETIC ENERGY OF THE SYSTEM IS HIGHER THAN THE INITIAL NO-LOAD CONDITION THEN THERE IS MORE OUTPUT POTENTIAL ENERGY (ON-LOAD) THAN THERE WAS ON NO-LOAD AND IS OU!  ;)

IGNORANCE IS NOT BLISS...

CHEERS
T

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2013, 03:06:31 PM »
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Offline DeepCut

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #24 on: March 23, 2013, 03:19:23 PM »
Work-Energy Principle :

"The change in the kinetic energy of an object is equal to the net work done on the object."

Net work = (0.5*mV^2 final)-(0.5*mv^2 initial)

Do the maths.


All the best,


DC.

Offline THANE HEINS

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #25 on: March 23, 2013, 03:20:53 PM »
@DeepCut,
 
             You can do without any further postings on this thread from me. Both you and Thane Heins are completely obnoxious assholes!

WELL AS OBNOXIOUS AND NOXIOUS MY ASSHOLE CAN BE SOME TIMES IT CERTAINLY DOES SERVE A VERY IMPORTANT SERVICE  TO GET THE CRAP OUT AND INTO THE CESSPOOL (OF IGNORANCE) WHERE IT BELONGS.  :P

OTHERWISE WE'D ALL BE FULL OF CRAP...

HAPPY TRAILS DUDE.
T

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #25 on: March 23, 2013, 03:20:53 PM »
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Offline THANE HEINS

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #26 on: March 23, 2013, 03:32:23 PM »
Work-Energy Principle :

"The change in the kinetic energy of an object MUST BE equal to the net work done on the object."

THE PHYSICS PERVEYORS OF DUNCE  :-[ ARE SWEATING NOW...  YEH!  ;)

T

Offline MileHigh

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #27 on: March 23, 2013, 03:39:40 PM »
Thane:

Quote
SO IF A GENERATOR IS ABLE TO DELIVER EVEN AN INFINITELY SMALL AMOUNT OF POWER WITH NO INCREASE IN ON-LOAD INPUT THEN IT IS CREATING ENERGY (INTERNALLY) AND IS OU  (http://www.overunity.com/Smileys/default/cheesy.gif) - AS LONG AS THE LOSSES ARE NOT BEING REDUCED SOMEHOW IN THE PROCESS.

The assumption is that losses are being reduced (a.k.a. the motor is running more efficiently) when you add a load to the generator coils.  So "speed up under load" is just reducing the fraction of input power that is lost as waste heat, and increasing the fraction of input power that becomes the mechanical output power of the motor.  Even if your input power decreases when you add a load, this change in waste heat as compared to mechanical output can explain the speeding up to the new steady-state RPM of the rotor.

That's why I explained a method for measuring the mechanical output power of the rotor to Deep Cut.  If you can measure the mechanical output power of the rotor and the input electrical power of the motor then you can derive the waste heat power.  Without knowing these values you are operating in the dark.

Quote
IF THE SYSTEM HAS ACCELERATED (ITSELF) AND THE ON-LOAD KINETIC ENERGY OF THE SYSTEM IS HIGHER THAN THE INITIAL NO-LOAD CONDITION THEN THERE IS MORE OUTPUT POTENTIAL ENERGY (ON-LOAD) THAN THERE WAS ON NO-LOAD AND IS OU!

This statement is simply not true.  For starters, "accelerating itself" is a poor choice of words.  What we are really talking about is the motor going to a higher steady-state RPM after you add a load.  The motor always finds a balance point to a new non-accelerating steady-state RPM.  Why would having more kinetic energy in the spinning rotor (giving you more potential energy to drive a load from the spinning moment of inertia of the rotor) be an indication of OU?  All that means is that the motor went from a lower-RPM steady-state to a higher RPM steady-state over a certain period of time.  The energy to do this came from the input electrical power to the motor.  So the spinning rotor can absorb and store some of the input electrical power that was supplied to the motor over a certain period of time.  That is not OU.

MileHigh

Offline THANE HEINS

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #28 on: March 23, 2013, 03:58:12 PM »
"The Earth Needs Rebels" interviews electrical inventor Thane Heins, a MUST-listen recording re global warming, energy independence, economic stability and growth, and sustainability.
 
http://quantumfires.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=1393 [Part I]
http://wp.me/aXG3K-mt                                                     [Part I shortlink]
 
http://quantumfires.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=1394 [Part II]
http://wp.me/aXG3K-mu                                                    [Part II shortlink]


Offline Newton II

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Re: PDi Regenerative Acceleration and BiTT Principles
« Reply #29 on: March 23, 2013, 04:28:52 PM »
Work-Energy Principle :

"The change in the kinetic energy of an object MUST BE equal to the net work done on the object."

THE PHYSICS PERVEYORS OF DUNCE  :-[ ARE SWEATING NOW...  YEH!  ;)

T



Dear Thane Heins Sir,


Change in kinetic energy of  an object  can also come from conversion of  some other form of energy imparted on the system.   

For example  an object kept at a height from the ground will have only potential energy and its kinetic energy will be zero.   When it is dropped from that height, its potential energy slowly vanishes and kinetic energy rises.  When it hits the ground it will have maximum kinetic energy and zero potential energy.   

If kinetic energy developed by  the object is more than the potential energy stored in it,  then it can be called as 'overunity fall'.    Using this kinetic energy you can again send it up making the up and down journey perpetual.

Similarly AUL can occur at the cost of some other energy form input to the system.   If total output developed by AUL system is more than the total input to the system,  then it can be called as OU device.

If total output of AUL device is more than total input,  then you shouldnot have any problem in making the system perpetual. (self running)

Correct me if I am wrong.  I am poor in physics.










 

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