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New theories about free energy systems => Theory of overunity and free energy => Topic started by: pauldude000 on February 05, 2013, 07:29:24 PM

Title: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: pauldude000 on February 05, 2013, 07:29:24 PM
I do not think that much of anyone has actually realistically and logically asked the question: "If overunity exists, why hasn't it been replicated?"


I know the question has been asked to death. I just do not think it has been given due diligence of logical thought. By definition, if overunity is posible it would HAVE NO CHOICE but be both extremely difficult to obtain, and equally hard to duplicate. You may well be asking why at this point.


Otherwise it would occur commonly and often in nature.... If such were to be common or easily attained, then this entire universe would have a problem. It would destroy itself due to sudden random discharges of enormous amounts of energy when the 'easily attained' situations happen to be present which are common. The universe itself probably would not have lasted long at all in such a scenario.


Does anyone see the problem?


This is not to say either that overunity is impossible, just that the universe would have natural physical laws which would either govern or moderate such energy release, and that it would be a very complex interaction required for said release so that it would be an extremely rare natural occurance.


The next question is: Is it even possible?


Overunity is only possible due to our own ignorance. Please bear with me on this.


All energy must come from a source of potential, and have a gradient upon which it can return to that potential. We as humans, especially in these over egotistical times, think we have a handle on things. Realistically there is far more that we don't know, than we do know. It is PROBABLE that there are innumerable things which we neither have comprehended nor detected. This could be anything from, fields, forms of energy, who can even realistically guess?


However, we can realistically assume for the moment that everything physical interacts in some manner and to some degree with everything else. Whether you are talking fields, particles, matter or motion, these things all tie together somewhere in every conceivable scenario. For example, matter in motion through a field can cause physical motion, energy flow, or even a different field generation, or even all of the above.


Realistically, we as humans have a working knowledge of some of these things. However this working knowledge is often put forth as absolute. That is where ignorance comes in.


Ignorance is the lack of knowledge. People can be smart in one area, and quite ignorant in another. It is not an insult to be ignorant, as ALL HUMANS are ignorant. Stephen Hawkins may not know squat about cooking or internal combustion engines, as a for instance. A physicist does not have the same knowledge set as an engineer, or a chemist, or a biologist, or a mathematician. All of these are specialized in their own right, and draw from both common and specialized information sets. Ignorance is changed with the acquisition of knowledge on a subject.


All that is required for overunity to be possible is ignorance concerning an undiscovered or misunderstood energy source. That is it. The odds are actually high that such a thing could or even probably does exist. Why does this matter?


Extraneous energy present in any system must be accounted for in any system, otherwise no laws of thermodynamics have been violated. These laws are specific to the concept of a system. However, we as humans do not get the luxury of defining "the system".


The laws of thermodynamics are often misapplied concerning this subject. Before anyone gets irate please understand that I do not think everyone doing so does such intentionally. I think it is a matter of shortsightedness.


As an oversimplified 'for instance':


You see a circuit placed in front of you. You see a battery, a switch, and a light bulb which is dimly lit. You measured the resistance of the bulb, and the voltage of the battery. In your mind you have determined both power source, and amount of power. Unknown to you is a hidden battery with another switch not controlled by you. The switch is activated by circumstances determined by the circuit itself.


All of a sudden the light glows brightly, but you cannot determine the existence of the second battery. You know more energy is present than provided by the known battery. It appears to be a violation of the first and second laws of thermodynamics, as the energy within the system is now greater than can be determined by the known power source and has apparently appeared suddenly and for no known determinable reason from no-where. The determined system is the battery and the light bulb.


This is an oversimplified example, but it gets across the point.


The second battery not known or accounted for is part of the system and has always been part of the system. The laws were never violated . What was wrong was that the observer discounted an extraneous power source.


Overunity then is ignorance of an existent power source, which is possible only because there are many things we as humans do not yet know. Once said power source is known, then a circuit determined to be at overunity today, is then at or below unity once the source is determined.


This is one form of overunity.


Another form of overunity has to do with efficiency. If the basis for efficiency is inaccurate in any scenario, then any increase of efficiency is determined as overunity. However this may well be caused by an incorrect baseline of efficiency for the common model. For instance, if the way a thing was traditionally done was extremely inefficient to begin with, then using it as a baseline for comparison is preposterous and leads to misapplication of the first and second laws of thermodynamics yet again.


(Hint... Electrolysis for one example, which baseline of measurement was set before AC was even discovered or pulsed DC even considered.)


These are some things to consider.


However, access to a true "Overunity" power source of any unlimited or even very large potential obviously would not be easy to tap into as a usable power source, as we still exist and the universe with us. It would be probably by accident initially. Replication or even duplication would be next to impossible as it was by accident, then principles behind at best guessed at.


Does that mean don't try? OH HECK NO! That is what science is all about; the attempt to discover the unknown, and quantify the known.


Advice and opinion:


Believers: If you discover something, keep accurate records of your efforts so that you at least have a chance at repeating the event. Even a notebook journal is better than nothing, so long as you keep track of the build in the journal, and testing notes including instrument settings. Don't automatically assume anything.


Unbelievers: If you cannot be reasonable with those doing the work of scientists here, then simply back the heck off and shut the heck up, and go see a shrink. You chose to come here and be a troll by definition.


Skeptics: Be polite, but remind the believers of things they may well be overlooking. Keep them honest. Remember that the unbelievers are posing as skeptics.... what you do there is up to you within the limits of reason. If someone claims overunity, do what you can to help and replicate or try to discover the source of energy, but don't be surprised if you cannot. If it was by nature easy or simple, it would be everywhere and discovered by now.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: FatBird on February 05, 2013, 11:53:48 PM
Very BRILLIANT Dissertation.
 
Thanks for sharing.
 
 
.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Eighthman on April 13, 2013, 08:20:31 PM
 :)   Yes !  Great minds think alike !!!!
 
I've already posted this same thought:  if we didn't have the Laws of Thermodynamics to protect us, we wouldn't exist.  Free energy would be spilling out, endangering everything.
 
However,  there is a possible exception - transients. Brief contradictions of Energy Conservation could exist without wrecking everything.  There was a paper on "Energy Creation" by Pappas that suggested this some years ago.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: conradelektro on April 13, 2013, 09:23:55 PM
An other way of thinking:

We have free energy, it is the sun (heat and photo voltaic), it is the wind (driven by the sun), it is the tides (driven by the moon), it is the plants (growing by themselves if we do not destroy them), it is hydroelectric power (because the rain falls on the mountains and the water is running down into the oceans where it evaporates again), and so on.

What we can not manage is the harvesting of this free energy in a way that helps everybody.

There is striving for power, greed and jealousy. And this causes a failure in the just distribution of energy and everything else humans need.

In short: we have free energy, but we can not come up with a policy to use it for the common good.

Why is that: because me and you, we fail at politics, ethics and common sense.

Greetings, Conrad
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: TechStuf on April 13, 2013, 11:05:37 PM

Quote
Otherwise it would occur commonly and often in nature.... If such were to be common or easily attained, then this entire universe would have a problem.

This large assumption is itself, yet another example of our shared ignorant condition.  Nothing in our universe is as simple as it appears.  Nothing.  So, man's logic tends to break down where he continually fails to rise to the occasion of being even a remotely relative observer.  Magnetics researcher, Howard Johnson, is quoted to have said:

"I don't know how the electrons got started spinning, and I don't know how to stop them, do you?"

Perpetual motion is everywhere and mankind lacks even a crude understanding of how 'relative' that motion is, much less it's origin.  Take for example, the flagellar motor.  Arguably the most efficient electric motor known, it was discovered to be the inboard motor inside the bodies of certain bacteria.  The flagellar motor is complete with sensors, switches, stator, rotor, bushings, drive shaft, universal joint, propeller....etc.

http://www.pnas.org/content/103/5/1260/F1.large.jpg (http://www.pnas.org/content/103/5/1260/F1.large.jpg)

Examine the pictures closely....How does one honestly ascribe such an engineering feat as a self replicating electric motor, so small that 8 million of them would fit end to end in the thickness of the root of an average human hair, to blind, dumb, chance?  Man is so clumsy in comparison....actually, there is really NO comparison.  Which means that if one is of the atheistic stripe, one is left to face the stark "apparent" reality that the very "pinnacle" of evolution, 'mankind', is rather infinitely LESS than the sum of his parts!

Many a sciential geek extraordinaire would jump for joy when he can make a two piece macro object with moving parts in a common 3d printer! (myself included)

Take the lowly human red blood cell for instance.  Do not the 'hallowed' halls of higher learning teach that homo erectus was the first to walk upright?  Here, the truth teaches us that man's assumptive nature often makes giant, foolhardy leaps in logic! We see that the inside of our trillions of cells is each like a harmonious city, replete with high tech gadgetry....sky scrapers, rapidly self assembling/dis-assembling highways, timely trash collectors, gears, cogs, levers, ....and BIPEDAL organisms walking upright on those magic highways, hauling giant bags of cargo to and fro.  And why do they do the things they do?  They operate with "HIGH PURPOSE" and are much more advanced than the small packets of 'protoplasmic goo' that the arrogant PHDs had so many believing them to be for decade upon decade.

No....'evolution'....mindless, blinded, nothingness did not assemble such fine Masterwork.

That the brain of mankind is 'wired' into space time, and capable of seeing future events innately, has been proven statistically in the lab, and categorically in the observations of many among the world's populations at large.

Why does the human pineal gland contain photo receptor cells similar to retinal cells, even a rudimentary lens?  A 'third eye'?  Why put flouride in water to be ingested, if it's just for teeth and labelled NOT for ingestion?  It is known to 'calcify' the pineal gland....our 'WiFi' connection to a reality much greater than our own.  Who would want to sabotage man's link to the higher realm?

Taken on the whole,  (sad little pun) our 'reality' our 'universe' owes it's existence, it's combined energy to something much more advanced.  Some One.  And that Some One, is about to "bring to ruin, those ruining the earth". 

Which is more important at this, the most critical juncture in human history?  Pondering the infinite? or Pondering whether or not we should have a place in it and what is required for 'perpetuation that matters'?

Ponder this:  It is written that God made Eve by causing Adam to sleep and then taking a rib while he slept.  Many a "high mind" has ridiculed this "primitive myth" over the ages.  Yet what is occurring today?  Do not surgeons remove up to six ribs at a time from some one that 'they' cause to fall asleep?  And why do they do this?  For bone marrow transplants and genetic research!  Why ribs?  Because they are the only bones in the human body that grow back every time they are carefully removed!  The One that invented us knows a thing or two about cloning, I'd say.  Do you, dear reader, find it a bit hypocritical to laugh at the story of our Inventor performing surgery to obtain copious DNA material for the purpose of making a mate, when 'scientists' of today are playing like infants at doing the same?  Again, our view of reality is rather like a child's view of the delivery room from inside it's mother's womb.

Please consider the following:

It is revealed at Revelation 13:18 in God's Word :

“Here is WISDOM. Let him that hath UNDERSTANDING count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six."

I have capitalized the words, wisdom and understanding, so that the reader may observe that Christ is here revealing a clue to the identity and mark of the ‘beast’. If one looks back to the books of Kings and Chronicles, one finds the man of whom Christ is speaking. What man is recorded in both books to have exacted gold tributes of 666 talents? What man was gifted with wisdom and understanding above every other of his day? What man fell away from worshiping the One True God, following after the false gods of his many wives?   

Surely by now, the reader can discern what man! Solomon! The man that took the ‘star of chemosh’ as his own personal seal, afterward to be known as the ‘seal of solomon! Later, to be referred to, (as a cover up) as the “star of david”. The HEXagram has no historical link to David of the Bible. It IS however, linked with the fallen solomon. And what organizations today USE the six pointed star?

The ‘free’masons are founded upon the fallen solomon and have revered him highly throughout their organization….and ‘who’ else shares this symbol, steeped in demonic ritual? One cannot now look at C-span without seeing the six pointed star on the national seal, and a HEXagram between each and every member of congress. Soldiers are now asking why it is that each officer sword of all branches of the military have the HEXagram on the hilt of every blade. The HEXagram is a geometric reference to the number 666. The cwhoreporation, Digimarc, for instance, (designer of driver’s licenses and ID’s for various U.S. states) has an interesting logo…. look at the colored spoked wheels inside the circle. Notice (at the link below) the color key on the outside edge? Using those colors, one may find 3 six spoked ‘stars’ superimposed upon one another. 6-6-6…..and on forms of citizen identification no less!

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/799f8af9fb.jpg (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/799f8af9fb.jpg)

Take a dollar bill from one’s back pocket and see that the HEXagram mark of the beast is emblazoned above the eagle, which is their way of indicating that ‘they’ rule ‘over’ america.  But why believe me? See for yourselves:

http://leavethecult.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/satur-six-pointed-star-temple-canada.jpg (http://leavethecult.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/satur-six-pointed-star-temple-canada.jpg)

Google – six pointed star mark

Google – 666 talents of gold

Google – D.C. Jerusalem masonic shrine

Google – Shriner lucifer

Google – lucifer telescope

Youtube – walmart guard towers. They have made their deal with the devil, so to speak and are considered, “too big to fail”. Their workers already wear the six pointed ‘star’ on the foreheads. (of their hats anyway) Can the reader now see that, after all the smaller retail food outlets have diminished or dried up and blown away, that only the largest retail giant in the land will have food rations? That is why they have the guard towers? And what is their “mark”? The same as the mark of the beast! It’s not hard to see food lines and many minions, having signed their lives away, lining up with their ‘marks’ handy, in order to obtain rations.
 
Google – Walmart six pointed logo

Google – soldiers ask why six pointed star now on all officer swords

Google – talmud truths

The hour is late, the harvest is great and the workers are few…. See the signs He has promised us…

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/ciencia_earthchanges31.htm (http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/ciencia_earthchanges31.htm)

The story “Huge Media Blackout regarding earth and moon orbital changes” used to be hosted at Beforeitsnews.com but the story was deleted several times. This information is of vital importance to all who wish to make informed decisions regarding the lives of their loved ones and themselves. Many were warned, yet because of the “HUGE MEDIA BLACKOUT” when the great flooding on the missouri river took place in 2011 as a direct result of the markedly increased solar radiation now hitting the northern latitudes in spring and summer months, not many took heed to the warnings. And who knew beforehand??? I attended the army core of engineers meeting after the disaster and addressed the Truth. The cowards sat silent and guilty, and there is no way they couldn’t have known well before hand as I and many others knew and tried to warn others.  Study and see that Luke 21:25-28 is in fulfillment at this time. And see that when God says that the heavenly bodies will shake, and there will be signs in sun, moon and stars, while the nations will be in anguish over the great agitation of the oceans…..He Means It. Isaiah 24:20, He means it. Revelation 16:8, He means it!

http://science.time.com/2013/03/08/recent-heat-spike-unlike-anything-in-11000-years/ (http://science.time.com/2013/03/08/recent-heat-spike-unlike-anything-in-11000-years/)

Christ also means it as He reassures us, “When you see the beginning of these things, STAND UP and LIFT UP your heads, for your redemption draws near”. TOO many are instead doing just the opposite, sitting down and hanging their heads! IF ONE IS AFRAID of what is coming upon the world, it is only because, deep down, you believe YOU HAVE IT COMING to you!

DO YOU? Kneel and repent of sin, live STRONG in HIS WORD, His SON, Jesus Christ, and be forgiven, and you will instead find GREAT REASON to stand and raise your heads, even your voices, to God and to your fellow man.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7dpGWYZMDc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7dpGWYZMDc)

He forgave Kirk Martin, He can forgive you too….Try Him. Soon.
For those who truly seek to know God’s ways, If He exists, where is his signature on Creation….I tell you the time is short, the harvest is great, and the workers are few. See:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnSxRYx82Gk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnSxRYx82Gk)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJyUtbn0O5Y (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJyUtbn0O5Y)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7dpGWYZMDc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7dpGWYZMDc)

http://arkdiscovery.com/noah's_ark.htm (http://arkdiscovery.com/noah's_ark.htm)

http://arkdiscovery.com/sodom_&_gomorrah.htm (http://arkdiscovery.com/sodom_&_gomorrah.htm)

 
God's Word told the end from the beginning, and SO MANY are missing out on account of ignorance, prejudice, intellectual cowardice, etc...!

Don't be among them.

Blessings friends, in Jesus Christ!

And remember, the hour is late, and It is HIGH TIME to STAND UP and LIFT UP your heads, for your redemption draws near!!!
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Eighthman on April 15, 2013, 02:05:10 AM
The free energy you describe is diffuse and requires storage media.  In fact, if they could develop a Really Good Battery, most of our energy problems would disappear but that hasn't happened.  I was hopeful about Ceramatec's lower temperature Sodium Sulfur battery but that seems to have gone nowhere.
 
The new Aluminum Air battery (Phinergy) has the range but needs cheap smelting, as far as I know. 
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: TechStuf on April 15, 2013, 05:21:10 AM
Eighthman, Youtube - Graphene....

In a word, whoa!

If a layer an atom thick stretched over a coffe mug can hold up a car, imagine a million layers (about a thumbnail's thickness)

Also, it holds a charge like no other material ever discovered, can be charged very quickly, and is being made in lightscribe DVD drives....


TS

Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: TechStuf on April 15, 2013, 10:55:37 PM
Precisely, Webby1.....yet another 'grand reach' of ignarrogance.


"Energy can neither be created nor destroyed".....blah...blah...


TS
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Neo-X on April 16, 2013, 04:56:56 AM
I have very simple answer to this... It is because all matter and energy are undergo in stable state. When the matter and energy is in stable state, it was difficult to make it unstable to release its own energy.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Tzecoatl on August 27, 2014, 08:50:17 AM
Here is one source of overunity energy with electrical experiences :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchange_interaction

Here is one explanation with Davey-Dumas dispositif (sorry, in french : http://leblogdejc.com/effetdumas/?page_id=2).

Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: gauschor on August 27, 2014, 11:38:09 PM
@OP: You are right. Case closed. Let's shut down the forum.

Just kidding. No, seriously. It sounds reasonable if overunity can only happen if we somehow tap an energy source we do not know exists, but which is active in this device. Sometimes I remember Daniel Pomerlou with his magic free energy devices and I believe he can only make them work because he sees things common people can't see. These things might not be free energy either, but he knows how to tap into them.

However:
If the universe is infinite, and every singe being can extend the universe by simple imagination, then overunity could definitely be possible. Because it's not a limited box with limited energy, but an unlimited box with unlimited energy. Though it seems our 3rd dimensional existence lacks the appropriate knowledge to recognize it. If we could tap into this source it would be utter random luck. A chance one in a bazillion. A working device delivering overunity would probably never be replicable because of a miniscule detail which is active in that specific device, but is ignored by us or cannot be understood by our simple minds.

All speculation and philosophy.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: pauldude000 on August 28, 2014, 03:43:17 AM
@OP: You are right. Case closed. Let's shut down the forum.

Just kidding. No, seriously. It sounds reasonable if overunity can only happen if we somehow tap an energy source we do not know exists, but which is active in this device. Sometimes I remember Daniel Pomerlou with his magic free energy devices and I believe he can only make them work because he sees things common people can't see. These things might not be free energy either, but he knows how to tap into them.

However:
If the universe is infinite, and every singe being can extend the universe by simple imagination, then overunity could definitely be possible. Because it's not a limited box with limited energy, but an unlimited box with unlimited energy. Though it seems our 3rd dimensional existence lacks the appropriate knowledge to recognize it. If we could tap into this source it would be utter random luck. A chance one in a bazillion. A working device delivering overunity would probably never be replicable because of a miniscule detail which is active in that specific device, but is ignored by us or cannot be understood by our simple minds.

All speculation and philosophy.


Too many speculations and assumptions. There is no proof or evidence demonstrating that the universe is any manner infinite. Anything based on that line of thought is mere philosophical assertion.


However, the odds of finding a new, previously unknown source of energy would be, naturally, quite large. Philosophically speaking, mankind's largest arrogance is a claim of scientific piety mixed with a demonstrative penchant for an unspoken claim of absolute knowledge. We know very little in the grand scheme of things, but ask us what we know and there is seemingly little left to learn.


Stiff shirts, straight ties, arrogant attitudes, and pompous claims about lines we have drawn in the sand concerning things we only understand a simple overview of all summarize our nature, as beings, quite well.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: ARMCORTEX on August 28, 2014, 04:20:22 AM
The reason is simly because you must take much time, energy, money.

And go fully to that project.

These aree all things of value, in a world of fast fast gimme gimme, 99.5%, the not so sophisticated fail.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: gauschor on August 28, 2014, 02:39:43 PM
Philosophically speaking, mankind's largest arrogance is a claim of scientific piety mixed with a demonstrative penchant for an unspoken claim of absolute knowledge. We know very little in the grand scheme of things, but ask us what we know and there is seemingly little left to learn.

On a sidenote this makes youth after school go "huh... what shall we do? what's left to learn if we already know everything"
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: conradelektro on August 28, 2014, 02:48:58 PM
Over Unity is already here, it is called "the sun"!

The sun drives the growing of all plants and animals. The sun drives the rivers, the tides and the wind.

There are very simple means to harvest energy from the sun light (solar panels), to harvest energy from flowing water (power stations or water wheels) and to harvest power from the wind (wind mills, sailing boats).

For us mere humans the sun is limitless (a few more milliard years) and therefore free OU. And there are trillions of suns in the universe.

But we have come up with an economic system that makes everyone pay for energy. Therefore no OU.

Even if some one invents an OU mechanism (OU as imagined and defined by many OU enthusiasts), it will not be free for long. And besides that, it would destroy us. Just imagine free OU energy in the hands of an army. Or even worse, free OU energy in the hands of the politicians. Or the worst case scenario: free OU energy in your hands or in my hands!

Greetings, Conrad
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Qwert on August 28, 2014, 03:11:50 PM
Another simple means to harvest energy from the sun light is Stirling Engine; some sources say, it's much more efficient over solar panels.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: forest on August 29, 2014, 08:44:24 PM
Conrad

Somebody does not need to invent a device.It was done many times in the past. We have already one big wheel available for everyone... Wheelwork of nature ;-)  We only need to persuade all people to stop stupid wars and concentrate on really important topics.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Doug1 on August 30, 2014, 04:57:23 PM
Pauldude

 What is possible does not always make something better, sometimes it makes it worse.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: SchubertReijiMaigo on August 30, 2014, 07:24:11 PM
Dark energy violate first law (Universe expanding) and that energy keep it's density the same (constant) ...
Oh no we are going to perish in a hellish fire because if the first law violated we are going to have an energy overload  ::)
Aside that I agree that finding OU will be difficult and will be tapering into an "unknown energy source" if we discover one, but that doesn't mean this energy source is limited (like dark energy).
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Farmhand on August 31, 2014, 06:17:46 AM
Well golly jeepers,, the Universe is expanding at an increasing rate,, is that not run away creation.

and that would be energy.

The definition of the Universe to me is "everything in existence".

I think it is a stretch to say that the Universe is being "added to" from nowhere. All that is, is already contained in the Universe
by definition. The Universe expanding if it is is nothing more than a similar effect to a bullet when fired from a gun, the bang
goes off but the bullet accelerates up to it terminal velocity, the bullet does not instantly go fro rest to terminal velocity it must
gain velocity at a given rate, and that rate changes throughout the course of the projectiles flight.

Same with the Universe, the big bang was not the creation of everything from nothing, it was simply the beginning of another
cycle, everything in the Universe at some stage contracts to a dense point of mass, then it goes "Bang" and it all expands at
an accelerating rate for a certain period before it slows down then contracts again.

It can be the only way. Everything that exists now and will forever is contained within the Universe. The Universe expands and
contracts and at some point will be expanding at an accelerating rate and at another point it will be contracting at an
accelerating rate.

Surely we can all agree that "something" cannot come from "nothing".

Time is a mental construct to make sense of the passing of events, there is no end to "time" or the Universe and there was no
beginning to "time" or no beginning to the Universe, after all if it began where did it come from.

Simple answer is that all that is is the Universe and all that is is all that has ever been, things just change.

...
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Pirate88179 on August 31, 2014, 09:07:05 PM
The definition of the Universe to me is "everything in existence".

I think it is a stretch to say that the Universe is being "added to" from nowhere. All that is, is already contained in the Universe
by definition. The Universe expanding if it is is nothing more than a similar effect to a bullet when fired from a gun, the bang
goes off but the bullet accelerates up to it terminal velocity, the bullet does not instantly go fro rest to terminal velocity it must
gain velocity at a given rate, and that rate changes throughout the course of the projectiles flight.

Same with the Universe, the big bang was not the creation of everything from nothing, it was simply the beginning of another
cycle, everything in the Universe at some stage contracts to a dense point of mass, then it goes "Bang" and it all expands at
an accelerating rate for a certain period before it slows down then contracts again.

It can be the only way. Everything that exists now and will forever is contained within the Universe. The Universe expands and
contracts and at some point will be expanding at an accelerating rate and at another point it will be contracting at an
accelerating rate.

Surely we can all agree that "something" cannot come from "nothing".

Time is a mental construct to make sense of the passing of events, there is no end to "time" or the Universe and there was no
beginning to "time" or no beginning to the Universe, after all if it began where did it come from.

Simple answer is that all that is is the Universe and all that is is all that has ever been, things just change.

...

I totally agree.  The universe is indeed expanding but,  the mass remains the same, only the space and distance between the mass is increasing.  So, no more mass exists now than what was there as the original input.  No something from nothing.  I too also agree that this is cyclical.  It has probably been going on from the beginning of time, and will continue to do so.  Start and End are human concepts and nature does not really have to follow this model.

Bill
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: lancaIV on August 31, 2014, 09:42:39 PM
                      "Ruhe"masse : Bewegungsmasse under 4D space-time condition (Minkowski)
                       f.e. Photon-Ruhe =299728 Km/s(Vacuum)

         

                        A.H.  Lorentz Gleichung Formula (E or e) E=mc² ~ relativistic Energy


                             
                             Massenzunahme shortly  m
                                                          =e/c² 
                             analog
                             FitzGerald Gleichung
 
                                                         Voll-/Halb-/Nullwert
                                                          radioactive energy

                                      Halbwert-Time(=Zeit)-Formula     `'decay'             

Time is a mental construct to make sense of the passing of events, there is no end to "time" or the Universe and there was nobeginning to "time" or no beginning to the Universe, after all if it began where did it come from.


                           Tesla time Formula T=mc²


mc²=  is a mental construct to make sense of the passing of events, there is no end to "mc²" or the Universe and there was no beginning to "mc²" or no beginning to the Universe, after all if it began where did it come from.
                                                 ::) 
                    Dank U ,Ranchhand, now is mir alles klar
                    Albern Einstein : " Bin ich verrueckt,oder die anderen ?!"
                    Albern,melde mich freiwillig ! 

     overunity is a thermodynamical fusion process ~ f.e. LCR circuit

     
A nice week
                   OCWL   
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: sarkeizen on September 01, 2014, 07:56:13 AM
However, the odds of finding a new, previously unknown source of energy would be, naturally, quite large.
Please provide a calculation which demonstrates this.
Quote
Philosophically speaking, mankind's largest arrogance is a claim of scientific piety mixed with a demonstrative penchant for an unspoken claim of absolute knowledge.
This. when it isn't vague seems like a rather large and unfounded generalization.
Quote
We know very little in the grand scheme of things, but ask us what we know and there is seemingly little left to learn.
Whatever constitutes the "grand scheme of things" is conveniently left out of this sentence.  Not to mention that it's probably irrelevant.  One doesn't have to know everything about everything to show that something is impossible (or highly unlikely)

From where I stand peoples desire to take complex problems and pretend that they are easily captured by awkward prose (like your own) is among the more arrogant things I see in a day.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: forest on September 01, 2014, 11:12:01 AM
ant is riding on the elephant , is that free energy ?  ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: lancaIV on September 01, 2014, 11:58:27 AM
ant is riding on the elephant , is that free energy ?  ;D ;D ;D ;D


Is this a philosophistical question  ::)  or to become answered by strong Helmholtz & al. standpoint view  ??? ? Six feeth under  :P ? Then you will have to wait ! ;)


S
  OCWL



Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 01, 2014, 02:55:30 PM
Lol lanca what's the elephant riding on.a big wheel lol.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: forest on September 01, 2014, 04:30:57 PM
no, it's the real answer
for ant this is free energy but not for elephant but should ant care about this ? not really
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: gauschor on September 01, 2014, 05:23:49 PM
I totally agree.  The universe is indeed expanding but,  the mass remains the same, only the space and distance between the mass is increasing.  So, no more mass exists now than what was there as the original input.  No something from nothing.

You don't know that. In a universe, where simple thoughts mean creation, every new thought will extend the universe a little bit more. We can't prove we live in such a universe and we can't prove the opposite.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 01, 2014, 06:14:50 PM
Woooooo @forest I feel sorry for you buddy.here's a challenge for you: prove to the audience that the MnO2-nickel-air profitis battery obeys the 2nd law of thermodynamics please.remember,it has about 3 times karpens original power density..
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: pauldude000 on September 01, 2014, 06:31:33 PM
One doesn't have to know everything about everything to show that something is impossible (or highly unlikely)

From where I stand peoples desire to take complex problems and pretend that they are easily captured by awkward prose (like your own) is among the more arrogant things I see in a day.


Interesting. You are right in that you do not have to know everything about everything to show that something is impossible, you merely have to know everything about one thing, which we do not. That is an argument from incredulity, since you bring in the concepts of formal and informal logical fallacies.


Since we are on that topic now anyway, is it not arrogant to challenge an argument and then end your short dissertation with an argumentum ad hominem?


Here is a 'heads up', so to speak -- You do not have a sole lease or ownership of logical, rational thought. Either agreement or disagreement are both allowed and encouraged. Both positions are often highly subjective states anyway, since in very few cases that I have witnessed have the positions been determined logically, but instead tend to be based upon personal bias and emotional preference.


Me stating something you dislike or disbelieve does not inherently make me arrogant.


Simple fact: The 1st law of thermodynamics (energy is neither created nor destroyed), as a physical law, only applies within the framework within which it was proposed (within a closed system). Application of this law outside of that framework invalidates it's applicability. Many scientist seem to have forgotten that little principle concerning physical laws, in that they are only laws within a very specific situation.


If any system is not closed, then the first law does not apply.


We also do not get the privilege of defining ad hoc what is, or is not, a closed system by definition. The definition does not get to change at a whim, or the law is invalidated. We also do not get the logical privilege of limiting the system to suit our desired outcome.


Any unknown energy source that does exist within any system is already a part of the system being examined. Our lack of knowledge concerning said energy source does not allow us to exempt said energy source from the system -- with either an argument from ignorance or probability. To do such is true arrogance.







Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: forest on September 01, 2014, 08:59:46 PM
"Unknown" energy source can be in balance in normal state.  ;)   
For example ant can ride on elephant  :D without knowing it  ???
C'mon, you have to knwo what I mean , right ? ::)
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Pirate88179 on September 01, 2014, 09:22:05 PM
"Unknown" energy source can be in balance in normal state.  ;)   
For example ant can ride on elephant  :D without knowing it  ???
C'mon, you have to knwo what I mean , right ? ::)

Now, if we can just get the elephant to ride on the ant, THAT would be overunity.

Bill
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 01, 2014, 09:30:11 PM
Ant don't need elephant no-more
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Farmhand on September 01, 2014, 10:57:32 PM

Interesting. You are right in that you do not have to know everything about everything to show that something is impossible, you merely have to know everything about one thing, which we do not. That is an argument from incredulity, since you bring in the concepts of formal and informal logical fallacies.


Since we are on that topic now anyway, is it not arrogant to challenge an argument and then end your short dissertation with an argumentum ad hominem?


Here is a 'heads up', so to speak -- You do not have a sole lease or ownership of logical, rational thought. Either agreement or disagreement are both allowed and encouraged. Both positions are often highly subjective states anyway, since in very few cases that I have witnessed have the positions been determined logically, but instead tend to be based upon personal bias and emotional preference.


Me stating something you dislike or disbelieve does not inherently make me arrogant.


Simple fact: The 1st law of thermodynamics (energy is neither created nor destroyed), as a physical law, only applies within the framework within which it was proposed (within a closed system). Application of this law outside of that framework invalidates it's applicability. Many scientist seem to have forgotten that little principle concerning physical laws, in that they are only laws within a very specific situation.


If any system is not closed, then the first law does not apply.


We also do not get the privilege of defining ad hoc what is, or is not, a closed system by definition. The definition does not get to change at a whim, or the law is invalidated. We also do not get the logical privilege of limiting the system to suit our desired outcome.


Any unknown energy source that does exist within any system is already a part of the system being examined. Our lack of knowledge concerning said energy source does not allow us to exempt said energy source from the system -- with either an argument from ignorance or probability. To do such is true arrogance.

The only truly closed system is the Universe itself, the Universe is everything so nothing can enter because there is nowhere to
enter from and nothing can escape because there is nowhere else to escape to. The Universe is a closed system and logically
the conservation of energy applies to it.

..
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Farmhand on September 01, 2014, 11:00:01 PM
ant is riding on the elephant , is that free energy ?  ;D ;D ;D ;D

Yes it is free energy, neither the elephant nor the ant have any money and so there was no fee for the energy the elephant
dissipated, no one paid for it, and it cost nothing to harness. Totally free energy.

..
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Farmhand on September 01, 2014, 11:05:55 PM
Woooooo @forest I feel sorry for you buddy.here's a challenge for you: prove to the audience that the MnO2-nickel-air profitis battery obeys the 2nd law of thermodynamics please.remember,it has about 3 times karpens original power density..

For a battery to be OU it must output more energy than is stored within all the material the battery is made from.
Proving anything to be OU is the job of the claimant.

..
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 01, 2014, 11:23:22 PM
@farmhand.proving that the laws of physics are still valid is the job of the disclaimant.you have to show how the cell dies out or how it extracts energy from chemical combustion.you will fail on all counts.your closed universe theory doesn't negate local negentropy phenomena
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: lancaIV on September 01, 2014, 11:46:32 PM
                                   fisia and physics:


Galaxis A to Galaxis B : B cannibalistic behaviour or copulating ? best worst case discussion
probably a help:
 bioanalytics: fetus/baby in mother body behaviour: cannibalistic !


S
  OCWL


poste scriptum I : "cell dies out ": bio-watch ? +/- 40 cell recuperation phases : then midlife-crisis
                                                                              1 cell phase : 9 months   
 
p.s.II : Thank you,"GOD junior"(written: GOD   spoken: IOS or YOS ; phonetic ! ):
  The Universe is a closed system and logically the conservation of energy applies to it.
                                 

But in my "Goetterwelten"(with myriad of GODs) there is the existence of many universums,summa summarum.
                            Das Wort ist heilig         
                            Das LOGOS ist heilig
                            LOGOS~Crisis~Deo Criste                 crisam
                            Der Kreis ist heilig
                                     rise

                            Pi- or Py-tagoras , Pi-or Py-ramid student,Hellenismus ,
                            + Konzil von Nicaae


                           classical Hellenismus: nonplusultra     "FORMAT"
                           modern :                                          In-FORMAT-ik


                                                  procedere,process:

    in dubio ?                         pro reo !                de advocato angelii (gen.) or advocato diabolii(gen.)
       doubt                                  Offen/Bar-Legung 
       duvida Kyrill : b~v               Testimonial
      Zweifel


                          Messias,written      Mahdi,written       spoken ? phonetic laws ?
                                                         Messi,F.C.Barcelona

                                              fatum,Schicksal,Kismet written :
                                    f.e. (K)isme(t) spoken
                                  but not in anglo-saxonical kind :like  'Aesme'  in saxonic phonetics : 'isme'


                                  mater(maé),matrem,matre
                                  mother
                                  Mutter
                                  Madre De IOS        Madre D'IOS      Madre Dios     
                                  Madre DE AEOS      Madre D'AEOS   Madre DAEOS ~Madredeus


                                  Asia translated: Orient  Europe: Okzident

                                                   The O is holy  ::) 
                                                   The A 'l`co-holy ? ;)

                                           Europe: Marien=Madredeus-Kult
http://recognoscere.wordpress.com/2012/06/08/die-bedeutung-und-der-ursprung-der-europaflagge/
                http://fatima.ch/1987/10/maria-und-europa-uber-den-ursprung-der-eu-flagge/ (http://fatima.ch/1987/10/maria-und-europa-uber-den-ursprung-der-eu-flagge/)


                          Fatima/Ourém :      http://www.holymary.info/howfatimacametobe.html (http://www.holymary.info/howfatimacametobe.html)


                                         From   holyfisia,Olymp to holymary


                                                     logos and ratio/racio
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: Farmhand on September 01, 2014, 11:52:19 PM
@farmhand.proving that the laws of physics are still valid is the job of the disclaimant.you have to show how the cell dies out or how it extracts energy from chemical combustion.you will fail on all counts.your closed universe theory doesn't negate local negentropy phenomena

Well I'm not trying to prove the Laws of physics are still valid. I am stating logic. And logic agrees with some of the "Laws" of Physics.
You are the one who is claiming the Laws are not valid but do not say which ones. I simply stated the Universe is everything and
it is the only truly closed system. Also that a battery is made from materials that contain stored energy, if the battery is physically
changed by the output of energy then the questions must be asked.

1) How much energy is stored in the materials of the battery ?

2) How much of the battery is being transformed into output ?

3) What is the difference between the two values if 2) is subtracted from 1) ?

4) Is there energy dissipated as waste heat or radiations ?

5) When 4) is added to 3) and 2) does it exceed 1) ?

..
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 01, 2014, 11:56:30 PM
Profitis, given premise A that is well evidenced and claim A' that contradicts A and is not previously well evidenced, it should be obvious where the burden in any debate of A versus A' lies. 
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: sarkeizen on September 01, 2014, 11:56:48 PM
Interesting. You are right in that you do not have to know everything about everything to show that something is impossible, you merely have to know everything about one thing, which we do not.
Not really.  I can truthfully state there are no integer solutions for 2x = 5 (under ZF) without even knowing everything about math or even just everything about algebra. 
Quote
That is an argument from incredulity, since you bring in the concepts of formal and informal logical fallacies.
Clearly I'm not making an argument based on the completeness of my knowledge.
Quote
Since we are on that topic now anyway, is it not arrogant to challenge an argument and then end your short dissertation with an argumentum ad hominem?
If you're implying that I did that then please provide a formal proof for that.
Quote
Here is a 'heads up', so to speak -- You do not have a sole lease or ownership of logical, rational thought.
Never said I did.   That said you haven't shown me anything that demonstrates you having a very good grasp of those things.

Apologies but I deleted a lot of the stuff you wrote between the above quote and the next since it doesn't appear to have anything to do with what was being discussed.
Quote
Simple fact: The 1st law of thermodynamics (energy is neither created nor destroyed), as a physical law, only applies within the framework within which it was proposed (within a closed system). Application of this law outside of that framework invalidates it's applicability. Many scientist seem to have forgotten that little principle concerning physical laws, in that they are only laws within a very specific situation.

If any system is not closed, then the first law does not apply.

We also do not get the privilege of defining ad hoc what is, or is not, a closed system by definition. The definition does not get to change at a whim, or the law is invalidated. We also do not get the logical privilege of limiting the system to suit our desired outcome.

Any unknown energy source that does exist within any system is already a part of the system being examined. Our lack of knowledge concerning said energy source does not allow us to exempt said energy source from the system -- with either an argument from ignorance or probability. To do such is true arrogance.
If this is supposed to be an argument demonstrating that it is likely that there is some 1st or 2nd law breaking energy source?  If so, it isn't very clear.   Let me know when you can make a better one.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: lancaIV on September 02, 2014, 12:08:33 AM
         If any system is not closed, then the first law does not apply.


        Bingo,the german academic thermodynamic "perpetuum mobile" science treats "closed cycles",
        not about ambiental open,energy absorving,machines .


S
  OCWL
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 12:43:00 AM
Geez @mark E.he's got the blueprint for the thing,cheapshit ingredients,let him play with it and come show us how its not a perpetuum mobile.should be the easiest thing for the poor soul to do.he's the one barking about the concrete laws of physics not me.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 12:52:33 AM
@farmhand replace nickel metal with nickel hydroxide and this rules out all possibility of chemical combustion within the thing.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: john_doe on September 02, 2014, 02:00:49 AM
@All

F.E.S. or more commonly known as "Flywheel Energy Storage" is the answer to "free energy".  Combining both "Time" and "Mass" gives us free energy we're just too stupid to demand answers.  E=mc2. It's all in that equation.

FES is being used right now utilising Halbach array's to "spin up" the flywheels to around 150,000RPM. Because our energy is provided to us at 60hz it's very easy to see how to build it to provide "free" energy.
If anyone here understands how a "Distributer cap" works on an old carby V8 engine it isn't a stretch to see how building 60 (or even 120) "Flywheel Energy Storage" devices with the output routed to a "Distributor" that only draws power for 1 second out of every minute then allowing it to build speed back up for the other 59seconds via the "Halbach Array".

Source:
http://beaconpower.com/
http://www.launchpnt.com/portfolio/transportation/electric-vehicle-propulsion/ <<<<<< They did have PDF's outlining how they were drawing large amounts of power for very short times and the Halback array would build speed back up to the stable RPM's prior to drawing any power. I don't have the pdf anymore and they don't have it on their website but if someone could find it, you'd have "Ultimate" proof the power company has built these things.

How we would build something small enough to put in the boot of your car might take a little time and replicating something capable of 30kRPM in your garage is a recipe for disaster.
"Free" energy is available we just need to learn how to build it mechanically instead of confusing ourselves with irrelevant almost meaningless drivel. 
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 02:07:58 AM
Geez @mark E.he's got the blueprint for the thing,cheapshit ingredients,let him play with it and come show us how its not a perpetuum mobile.should be the easiest thing for the poor soul to do.he's the one barking about the concrete laws of physics not me.
Profitis these are things such as the supposed blueprint are just things that you allege.  If you know of a way to realize the extraordinary result of free energy, then it is up to you to support your claim or see it dismissed.  Extraordinary claims are false on their face.  Only strong evidence can prove them.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 02:09:26 AM
@All

F.E.S. or more commonly known as "Flywheel Energy Storage" is the answer to "free energy".  Combining both "Time" and "Mass" gives us free energy we're just too stupid to demand answers.  E=mc2. It's all in that equation.

FES is being used right now utilising Halbach array's to "spin up" the flywheels to around 150,000RPM. Because our energy is provided to us at 60hz it's very easy to see how to build it to provide "free" energy.
If anyone here understands how a "Distributer cap" works on an old carby V8 engine it isn't a stretch to see how building 60 (or even 120) "Flywheel Energy Storage" devices with the output routed to a "Distributor" that only draws power for 1 second out of every minute then allowing it to build speed back up for the other 59seconds via the "Halbach Array".

Source:
http://beaconpower.com/
http://www.launchpnt.com/portfolio/transportation/electric-vehicle-propulsion/ <<<<<< They did have PDF's outlining how they were drawing large amounts of power for very short times and the Halback array would build speed back up to the stable RPM's prior to drawing any power. I don't have the pdf anymore and they don't have it on their website but if someone could find it, you'd have "Ultimate" proof the power company has built these things.

How we would build something small enough to put in the boot of your car might take a little time and replicating something capable of 30kRPM in your garage is a recipe for disaster.
"Free" energy is available we just need to learn how to build it mechanically instead of confusing ourselves with irrelevant almost meaningless drivel.
I think that you misunderstand that these are low loss energy storage devices.  They are potentially very useful.  Unfortunately Beacon couldn't get their business going and filed for bankruptcy.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: john_doe on September 02, 2014, 02:30:20 AM
Oh woops (Re: Beacon) I'd researched other power companies and lost the links thanks to a pc meltdown.

I understand they are low loss storage devices though the pdf by Launchpoint clearly outlined how they'd drawn large power in short bursts and their motor had returned to the rpm it was at prior to drawing any power. So to be clear, it was spinning at 25kRPM*, they drew power from it in a short burst for 1 second and it dropped to 17kRPM* and then over the next 59seconds it accelerated back to 25kRPM*. *(Not actual figures, unfortunately I lost the real ones)

Here's a short vid of their early prototype though it isn't nearly as interesting as their PDF they removed from their site...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFGCHlCNhq8

I'm not trying to say one way or another which company can do what though, my actual message is that we're mis-stating and misunderstanding what it is we're trying to achieve. "Free" energy to me is simply energy that is "free" (we don't have to "pay for it) and I believe it will be in terms of the Flywheel.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: pauldude000 on September 02, 2014, 02:38:20 AM
The only truly closed system is the Universe itself, the Universe is everything so nothing can enter because there is nowhere to
enter from and nothing can escape because there is nowhere else to escape to. The Universe is a closed system and logically
the conservation of energy applies to it.

..


You hit that nail square on the head, Farmhand. The problem is that others try to limit the 'system' to an individual item, such as a circuit, without considering that other energy sources may be affecting the 'circuit' besides the original power source. In my book, OU is merely a statement describing the neglect of an unknown energy source that was not calculated properly into the system. If all energy sources are accounted for, then the system is still within the boundaries of unity, and no energy is being either created or destroyed.


Basically, an actual demonstration of OU is a clerical error due to the current level of ignorance of science.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 03:20:38 AM
Lol @mark E. You'd think that 3-5 times power density would lower the bar a bit.lower the bar toward unanimity.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 03:37:23 AM
@pauldude I don't know what book you've got there but its utter crap.energy does not have to be created or destroyed to transend unity barriers,even by wikipedia's definition of perpetual motion (ie.ppms of the 2nd kind)
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 04:05:50 AM
Lol @mark E. You'd think that 3-5 times power density would lower the bar a bit.lower the bar toward unanimity.
You keep laughing, but you never seem able to demonstrate the free energy generators that you keep saying are so easy to realize.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: lancaIV on September 02, 2014, 04:14:58 AM
Oh woops (Re: Beacon) I'd researched other power companies and lost the links thanks to a pc meltdown.

I understand they are low loss storage devices though the pdf by Launchpoint clearly outlined how they'd drawn large power in short bursts and their motor had returned to the rpm it was at prior to drawing any power. So to be clear, it was spinning at 25kRPM*, they drew power from it in a short burst for 1 second and it dropped to 17kRPM* and then over the next 59seconds it accelerated back to 25kRPM*. *(Not actual figures, unfortunately I lost the real ones)

Here's a short vid of their early prototype though it isn't nearly as interesting as their PDF they removed from their site...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFGCHlCNhq8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFGCHlCNhq8)

I'm not trying to say one way or another which company can do what though, my actual message is that we're mis-stating and misunderstanding what it is we're trying to achieve. "Free" energy to me is simply energy that is "free" (we don't have to "pay for it) and I believe it will be in terms of the Flywheel.


 "Free" energy to me is simply energy that is "free" (we don't have to "pay for it)

                               Gibbs Free energy is not "energia for gratia"

   a.You will have to pay for the FE-system !


b.If you are living off-grid and can not use more than 20% from the FE-machine capacity you will actually find the result -by calculation-that with a 1500 US$/KW installationinvestment the KWh-price for this energy-on-demand system will not greatly differ from the price from your actual electricity provider  !
                                      the problem: KWpik/peak


FE-beginners first job: decreasing the KWp -on-demand, cheap energy storage (water/battery)
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 04:21:06 AM
Ok mark E.I like that challenge.let's see what maximum peak demo I can do here with that device.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: lancaIV on September 02, 2014, 04:35:17 AM
  Basically, an actual demonstration of OU is a clerical error due to the current level of ignorance of                                                                       science


                                                 clerical error: Haeresie ?

                                     How old are the thermodynamic laws ?


                   And how old is the scientifically defined "radio-active energy" ?
                                       alpha/beta/gamma-.... radiation


                   Is it ,now,not possible to calculate the total in/out-put relation ?


    `                           Who is accusing whom about what ?
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 04:53:15 AM
  Basically, an actual demonstration of OU is a clerical error due to the current level of ignorance of                                                                       science


                                                 clerical error: Haeresie ?

                                     How old are the thermodynamic laws ?


                   And how old is the scientifically defined "radio-active energy" ?
                                       alpha/beta/gamma-.... radiation


                   Is it ,now,not possible to calculate the total in/out-put relation ?


    `                           Who is accusing whom about what ?
It is generally agreed that if a black box outputs far more energy than can be accounted for entering and/or stored in the box that the box appears to be OU.  There are some disagreements between people as to whether this behavior would mean that the extra energy would be from some presently unrecognized source, or that a process in the box makes something from nothing.  The latter argument is pointless until such time as we observe a black box that seems to deliver surplus energy.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 05:01:41 AM
@mark E if you are judging for overunity it is pointless to even look at a black box unless you know exactly what's inside.it is however not necessary to know what's inside a black box if its going to power your ipod cheaply and for a long time.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: john_doe on September 02, 2014, 05:17:37 AM
@   lancaIV
I'm referring to the energy such a device would provide. Obviously the device would need to be paid for the same way solar panels need to be purchased.
Based on observations around this forum and humanity in general, I feel we need to evolve pretty quickly if we're to avoid such futures as the one theorised in the classic TV series "Firefly".
I don't really understand the direction this thread and most of others has gone when it comes to discussing ideas around the "Free energy" or "OU" subject.
That statement isn't an attack or an attempt to put anyone down rather just an expression of frustration regarding, what looks to me, an unfortunate case of chest beating. Think gorilla saying hey pay attention to me.

The universe is huge. If we don't hurry up and get out there, another species will claim suitable planets before us and we'll be confined to a resource depleted planet arguing between ourselves.
Anyway, another pointless argument attempting to clarify words said by those who can't even agree on what those words mean even though you're speaking the same language.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 05:59:29 AM
@mark E if you are judging for overunity it is pointless to even look at a black box unless you know exactly what's inside.it is however not necessary to know what's inside a black box if its going to power your ipod cheaply and for a long time.
If we know the mass and dimensions of a black box then we know what the maximum stored energy is using any recognized energy source.

"Cheaply" and "long" are both subjective.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 09:15:19 AM
Woooow reaaallly @mark E so calculate for us the exact potential energy storage in precisely one gram molar nickel hydroxide(Ni(OH)2) coupled to one gram molar MnO2 under air in 1M NaOH then.I got him by the balls now @lanca (-:
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 12:23:39 PM
Woooow reaaallly @mark E so calculate for us the exact potential energy storage in precisely one gram molar nickel hydroxide(Ni(OH)2) coupled to one gram molar MnO2 under air in 1M NaOH then.I got him by the balls now @lanca (-:
Profitis: you would first have to show that for that volume and weight The available energy from those reagents is euqal to or greater than any other known potential energy store of the same mass and volume, which you of course cannot. 
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 01:26:41 PM
Heeeeheeee @lanca look at mark E squirm now lol! @Mark E did you pass your high-school electrochemistry grades or not.please calculate the energy density of one gram nickel hydroxide coupled to one gram MnO2 in alkali under air at 25degree c..I'm not going to let you get away with this this time.please consult your standard potential table
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 03:33:28 PM
Heeeeheeee @lanca look at mark E squirm now lol! @Mark E did you pass your high-school electrochemistry grades or not.please calculate the energy density of one gram nickel hydroxide coupled to one gram MnO2 in alkali under air at 25degree c..I'm not going to let you get away with this this time.please consult your standard potential table
If you think that configuration is anything close to the maximum energy density by weight or volume that one can pack in a black box, then you have another thing coming.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 04:28:59 PM
@mark E all we want from you is the calculated power density from one gram mole Nickel hydroxide coupled to one gram mole MnO2 in alkali under air.can you do this for us please.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 07:31:04 PM
@mark E all we want from you is the calculated power density from one gram mole Nickel hydroxide coupled to one gram mole MnO2 in alkali under air.can you do this for us please.
All I want is a house in Malibu, and I don't even have to pretend I am a we to want that.  If you can establish that chemistry is the mist energy dense known to man then I will sit down and work out the value you seek.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 07:56:31 PM
@mark E your own words   was quote 'if we know whats in the black box we can calculate the maximum allowable energy from the thing'.indeed this is the basis of mr farmhands objection too.why are you hesitating to give US a  ballpark figure on the maximum allowable energy contained in a molar nickel hydroxide/MnO2 galvanic couple..we(the overunity crowd) are rather perplexed and stunned 
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 09:26:07 PM
@mark E your own words   was quote 'if we know whats in the black box we can calculate the maximum allowable energy from the thing'.indeed this is the basis of mr farmhands objection too.why are you hesitating to give US a  ballpark figure on the maximum allowable energy contained in a molar nickel hydroxide/MnO2 galvanic couple..we(the overunity crowd) are rather perplexed and stunned
LOL, you'll have to try a bit harder if you want your fabricated quotes to be convincing.

Perhaps you are not familiar with the black box concept.    The internals are not exposed to inspection.The whole idea of a black box is that we don't know what is inside, nor do we care.  It's called a "black box" because it is opaque.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 10:09:57 PM
@mark E why are you describing a black box? We know what a black box is thanks.mr farmhand had laid down a very specific criteria for protocol judgement here and we respect it.all we demand from you is a ballpark figure of maximum power outage expected from one molar nickel hydroxide vs one molar MnO2 in alkali under air.we demand it because you demand the aforementioned demanded protocol.therefore we demand what you demand,and that is a ballpark estimate for power outage.please comply or we will be forced to work it out for ourselves
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 02, 2014, 11:09:03 PM
@mark E why are you describing a black box? We know what a black box is thanks.mr farmhand had laid down a very specific criteria for protocol judgement here and we respect it.all we demand from you is a ballpark figure of maximum power outage expected from one molar nickel hydroxide vs one molar MnO2 in alkali under air.we demand it because you demand the aforementioned demanded protocol.therefore we demand what you demand,and that is a ballpark estimate for power outage.please comply or we will be forced to work it out for ourselves
Do you smoke a lot of marijuana? 
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: ARMCORTEX on September 02, 2014, 11:19:00 PM
OU is possible.

If you do exactly as I tell you and give me all your money, I will give you OU.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 02, 2014, 11:34:50 PM
@mark E no but you want me to organise you some?  An nickel hydroxide/MnO2/air couple is expected to have exactly Zero power outage by standard galvanic protocol. Therefore if we do see anything there we know we have something definitely worth looking into.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: lancaIV on September 03, 2014, 12:51:18 AM
                                             profitis,this here is not a battle !


@markE :
                                      an japanese inventor idea:

The present invention is an LED which is characterized by comprising a power generation unit in order to solve the problems described above, including a light emitting section for emitting light using an LED, a power generation panel to the generator receives the light of the light emitting portion configuration of a power generating apparatus utilizing, and characterized by comprising a light emitting unit for emitting light by providing many LED on a substrate, and a power generation unit generating power by receiving the light of the light emitter provided on the power panel on a substrate configuration of a power generating apparatus using an LED for a light emitting section for emitting light provided many LED on the front surface and the rear surface of the substrate is sandwiched from above and below the light emitting portion provided on a power panel on a substrate, receives light emitting portion a light emitting portion of the plurality of emitting light provided many LED on the front surface and the rear surface of the substrate and the configuration of a power generating apparatus using the LED which is characterized in that and a power generation unit of the two sheets for generating power, and the surface of the substrate consists of a power generation unit generating power by receiving the light of the light emitter provided on the power panel on the back, provided with a power supply unit as a power source to the light emitter, and a storage unit for storing the power generated by the generator unit configuration of a power generating apparatus using the LED which is characterized by providing the configuration of the power generating apparatus using the LED which is characterized in that it is using the electric double layer capacitor to the storage unit and the power supply unit, a solar panel to the power unit configuration of a power generating apparatus using the LED which is characterized by using,Configuration of a power generating apparatus using an LED which is characterized in that it used a solar cell power generation unit, a power generation unit including a light emitting unit for emitting light using an LED, a power generation panel to the generator receives the light of the light emitting portion to obtain a configuration of a power generating apparatus using vinegar and LED characterized in that it is housed in the frame of the box-shaped with a door that can be opened and closed a power generating apparatus using an LED made of.

   Question : a. solar cell/panel efficiency -light emission bandwith related ?
                       b. electricity to light L.ight E.mitting D.iode efficiency
                       c. double layer capacitor losts ?

                         This above  light -not black(Miau-Miau)-box concept -
                         under this light source condition :


                         http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/186773-the-polariton-laser-with-250x-lower-power-consumption-could-this-be-the-answer-to-on-chip-optical-interconnects (http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/186773-the-polariton-laser-with-250x-lower-power-consumption-could-this-be-the-answer-to-on-chip-optical-interconnects)


                        conventional L.A.S.E.R. efficiency X 250= ?


and a kind of Raman Laser http://phys.org/news172497349.html#nRlv (http://phys.org/news172497349.html#nRlv)
light amplifier /accelerator :
http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=7&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=19931012&CC=US&NR=5252176A&KC=A (http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=7&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=19931012&CC=US&NR=5252176A&KC=A)
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 03, 2014, 02:09:50 AM
@mark E no but you want me to organise you some?  An nickel hydroxide/MnO2/air couple is expected to have exactly Zero power outage by standard galvanic protocol. Therefore if we do see anything there we know we have something definitely worth looking into.
Your chaotic and confused lines of reasoning suggest game playing or impairment of some kind.  Now you have veered completely away from the discussion topic.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: MarkE on September 03, 2014, 02:24:57 AM
                                             profitis,this here is not a battle !


@markE :
                                      an japanese inventor idea:

The present invention is an LED which is characterized by comprising a power generation unit in order to solve the problems described above, including a light emitting section for emitting light using an LED, a power generation panel to the generator receives the light of the light emitting portion configuration of a power generating apparatus utilizing, and characterized by comprising a light emitting unit for emitting light by providing many LED on a substrate, and a power generation unit generating power by receiving the light of the light emitter provided on the power panel on a substrate configuration of a power generating apparatus using an LED for a light emitting section for emitting light provided many LED on the front surface and the rear surface of the substrate is sandwiched from above and below the light emitting portion provided on a power panel on a substrate, receives light emitting portion a light emitting portion of the plurality of emitting light provided many LED on the front surface and the rear surface of the substrate and the configuration of a power generating apparatus using the LED which is characterized in that and a power generation unit of the two sheets for generating power, and the surface of the substrate consists of a power generation unit generating power by receiving the light of the light emitter provided on the power panel on the back, provided with a power supply unit as a power source to the light emitter, and a storage unit for storing the power generated by the generator unit configuration of a power generating apparatus using the LED which is characterized by providing the configuration of the power generating apparatus using the LED which is characterized in that it is using the electric double layer capacitor to the storage unit and the power supply unit, a solar panel to the power unit configuration of a power generating apparatus using the LED which is characterized by using,Configuration of a power generating apparatus using an LED which is characterized in that it used a solar cell power generation unit, a power generation unit including a light emitting unit for emitting light using an LED, a power generation panel to the generator receives the light of the light emitting portion to obtain a configuration of a power generating apparatus using vinegar and LED characterized in that it is housed in the frame of the box-shaped with a door that can be opened and closed a power generating apparatus using an LED made of.
That reads like machine translated text.
Quote

   Question : a. solar cell/panel efficiency -light emission bandwith related ?
                       b. electricity to light L.ight E.mitting D.iode efficiency
                       c. double layer capacitor losts ?
The entire description is one of a device that converts and stores energy.  Each of the listed processes are lossy.
Quote

                         This above  light -not black(Miau-Miau)-box concept -
                         under this light source condition :


                         http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/186773-the-polariton-laser-with-250x-lower-power-consumption-could-this-be-the-answer-to-on-chip-optical-interconnects (http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/186773-the-polariton-laser-with-250x-lower-power-consumption-could-this-be-the-answer-to-on-chip-optical-interconnects)


                        conventional L.A.S.E.R. efficiency X 250= ?
Semiconductor LASER are typically less than 0.1% efficient.  So in the best case this would be about 40% efficient.  It is still a huge breakthrough worth watching for its impact on computing and communications.
Quote


and a kind of Raman Laser http://phys.org/news172497349.html#nRlv (http://phys.org/news172497349.html#nRlv)
light amplifier /accelerator :
http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=7&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=19931012&CC=US&NR=5252176A&KC=A (http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=7&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=19931012&CC=US&NR=5252176A&KC=A)
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: tinman on September 03, 2014, 04:12:36 AM
Your chaotic and confused lines of reasoning suggest game playing or impairment of some kind.  Now you have veered completely away from the discussion topic.
They do that you know.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: ARMCORTEX on September 03, 2014, 04:42:37 AM
If you wish OU.

Then you will send me approx 300$ , and a high quality saw workbench.

Then, I will contact you 3 months later with plans.

So if you sell your house, think of me. I will repay my debts.

I was always nice with you guys.

Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 03, 2014, 08:05:42 AM
@lanca I know its not a battle! *gigle* :-) ..I'm just having fun here lol. A japanese guy also invented a far infrared panel that up-converts far infrared to visible light in one step on a single sheet! Exellent for military. Thers another guy called Thomas Prevenslik who invented silica nano-shells that give perpetual intense white-light glow via double-step up-then down-conversion against 2nd law:far infrared-ultraviolet-visible.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 03, 2014, 08:14:39 AM
@mark E..crap man.how is 3-5 times karpen power density offtopic don't be ridiculous.and this coming from nickel hydroxide not nickel metal.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 03, 2014, 11:06:45 AM
Here's nickel hydroxide vs MnO2 under air.look at the power for the size of electrodes.bare graphite anode is compared to Ni(OH)2 coated graphite anode prepared from pure Ni(NO3)2 via pyrolysis and subsequent reduction of NiO2 coat.
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: lancaIV on September 03, 2014, 12:40:20 PM
That reads like machine translated text.


100% correct.

The entire description is one of a device that converts and stores energy.  Each of the listed processes are lossy.

Also correct.

Semiconductor LASER are typically less than 0.1% efficient.  So in the best case this would be about 40% efficient.  It is still a huge breakthrough worth watching for its impact on computing and communications.


2009: ceramic L.A.S.E.R. with over 65% efficiency.
 
       Phillips CD-player L.A.S.E.R. pointer production costs : < 1 Euro.


MarkE(Pardon-me,for markE), a(-n: aga/heights in front)) house in Malibu do not interest me.
                                                                                              ( Saint-Andrew-grave)
                     They have the Pacific Ocean in front,I the Atlantic Ocean.

          I only need to look out of the ocean-sided window,to see the sea-water current/stream.
                Or I go out, to the Terra-sse,to feel and receive also the wind current/stream.


                     Tsunamis are there and here possible and here the great last:   1755
                                                                                                                        Terra-motto,See-Beben
                    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

                                                  Hypo-/Thesis: 
                                            1 candela  ~   1  Wolfram-fiber Watt
                               f.e.: 6000 candela  ~ 23 energy saving lamp Watts
                     
         http://translationportal.epo.org/emtp/translate/?ACTION=description-retrieval&COUNTRY=DE&ENGINE=google&FORMAT=docdb&KIND=A1&LOCALE=en_EP&NUMBER=102010035706&OPS=ops.epo.org/3.1&SRCLANG=de&TRGLANG=en (http://translationportal.epo.org/emtp/translate/?ACTION=description-retrieval&COUNTRY=DE&ENGINE=google&FORMAT=docdb&KIND=A1&LOCALE=en_EP&NUMBER=102010035706&OPS=ops.epo.org/3.1&SRCLANG=de&TRGLANG=en)


                                   
[0006]

                                  OSRAM has been explicitly confirmed to me:

1 cd = 1 candle light abundance; Watt earlier, the light intensity indication of a tungsten filament lamp.

ENERGY SAVING LAMPS deliver high cd (candelae) at only slightly smaller wattage recording.

                          -              -               -               -                -              -                -
 Lux/Lx,lumen,cd per cm² ir-/radiation area and light°angle and metrical emissor/receiver distance are other parameters
+
light (photon-particle/phonon-wave) thermionic(Plasma-Aggregatszustand) con-/trans-verter efficiency optimizing.

Sincerely
              OCWL 
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: lancaIV on September 03, 2014, 01:41:25 PM
@   lancaIV
I'm referring to the energy such a device would provide. Obviously the device would need to be paid for the same way solar panels need to be purchased.

Right !

Based on observations around this forum and humanity in general, I feel we need to evolve pretty quickly if we're to avoid such futures as the one theorised in the classic TV series "Firefly".
I have never seen "Firefly". So I do not know their prophecy.

I don't really understand the direction this thread and most of others has gone when it comes to discussing ideas around the "Free energy" or "OU" subject.

Some has many free-time. Gaming with play-consoles or in forums-just for fun,probably ??? ::) ;)

That statement isn't an attack or an attempt to put anyone down rather just an expression of frustration regarding, what looks to me, an unfortunate case of chest beating. Think gorilla saying hey pay attention to me.

Photografical memory( ~R.A.M.-chip,video-signal) and phonographical(R.A.M.-chip,audio-signal)memory:
New Wave era, Soft Cell( Marc Almond et .) ,"Non Stop Erotic Cabaret" : Fru,Fru..,Fru....,Frustration
 I feel with you  :'(  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKaM9pPwZmM

And about gorilla : Amory Lovins,Rocky Mountains Institute ,Boulder "Alternative-Nobel-Price-Award"
                              He pays attention,too. ;)  http://www.rmi.org (http://www.rmi.org)

The universe is huge.

You are right,greater than our house garden which waits to become cultivated/cutted.


 If we don't hurry up and get out there, another species will claim suitable planets before us and we'll be confined to a resource depleted planet arguing between ourselves.

That is not my problem. If their chief has a nice daughter/nice daughters( Vive le pluralisme ! :-* ) then
I will accept this political change.

Anyway, another pointless argument attempting to clarify words said by those who can't even agree on what those words mean even though you're speaking the same language.

Couples during and after marriage/ divorce can/will tell/write you endless stories about this ,really human,stand-point.



But , up to today organisation:


                                          Do you know exactly your Watt-peak consume in your house-hold ?
                                          The best technical room heating/cooling process and wattage-consume per °C/sqm ?
                                          The kitchen/bath-room appliances work priority ?
                                          How many sqm are your personal physical need versus your actual personal use ?


        Autonomy is something relative, it is not a Tarzan/Jane or Robinson/Friday living-standart orientation !


                               Trust/Confidence: sustainable development


                   "Illegal pressure - autonom living" in rural and urban areas. This is the Target.


        FE can also be delivered by culturing land,sub-and surface ,
later REPRAP-system controled and executed like the plans for the moon/Mars surface minerals exploration :


                                 40.000 Liters bio/cellulosic-syn-fuel per terrestric ha
                                                        synthetic hydro-carbon liquid/gas


                           +                Liters CO2 in Air- captured CO2-Fuel-recycling


                           +                Liters bio-photosynthesis-reactor per maritime ha   
                               
                                         
Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: ARMCORTEX on September 03, 2014, 02:05:56 PM
I think OU is really related to strategy , and good use of limited ressources, wich are rare commodity in this stupid filled world.

learning,building, gathering money, researching, all this takes time.

The poorer you are, the more you have difficulty to achieve your goals.
The richer you are, the more busy you are, like doctor for example, he does not know about this.

See the paradox ?

TIME, to assimilate data and reflect.

WILL, to make your time worth it, and to truley reflect upon studies.

MONEY and TIME, to make the build happen.

TIME WILL MONEY. All commodity.


Title: Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
Post by: profitis on September 03, 2014, 08:59:29 PM
Ego is also a good motivator @armcortex check this shot.check this out @lanca.I used slightly better Ni(OH)2 coat this time.