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Author Topic: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.  (Read 34416 times)

Offline Qwert

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #15 on: August 28, 2014, 03:11:50 PM »
Another simple means to harvest energy from the sun light is Stirling Engine; some sources say, it's much more efficient over solar panels.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline forest

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #16 on: August 29, 2014, 08:44:24 PM »
Conrad

Somebody does not need to invent a device.It was done many times in the past. We have already one big wheel available for everyone... Wheelwork of nature ;-)  We only need to persuade all people to stop stupid wars and concentrate on really important topics.

Offline Doug1

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #17 on: August 30, 2014, 04:57:23 PM »
Pauldude

 What is possible does not always make something better, sometimes it makes it worse.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #17 on: August 30, 2014, 04:57:23 PM »
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Offline SchubertReijiMaigo

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #18 on: August 30, 2014, 07:24:11 PM »
Dark energy violate first law (Universe expanding) and that energy keep it's density the same (constant) ...
Oh no we are going to perish in a hellish fire because if the first law violated we are going to have an energy overload  ::)
Aside that I agree that finding OU will be difficult and will be tapering into an "unknown energy source" if we discover one, but that doesn't mean this energy source is limited (like dark energy).

Offline Farmhand

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #19 on: August 31, 2014, 06:17:46 AM »
Well golly jeepers,, the Universe is expanding at an increasing rate,, is that not run away creation.

and that would be energy.

The definition of the Universe to me is "everything in existence".

I think it is a stretch to say that the Universe is being "added to" from nowhere. All that is, is already contained in the Universe
by definition. The Universe expanding if it is is nothing more than a similar effect to a bullet when fired from a gun, the bang
goes off but the bullet accelerates up to it terminal velocity, the bullet does not instantly go fro rest to terminal velocity it must
gain velocity at a given rate, and that rate changes throughout the course of the projectiles flight.

Same with the Universe, the big bang was not the creation of everything from nothing, it was simply the beginning of another
cycle, everything in the Universe at some stage contracts to a dense point of mass, then it goes "Bang" and it all expands at
an accelerating rate for a certain period before it slows down then contracts again.

It can be the only way. Everything that exists now and will forever is contained within the Universe. The Universe expands and
contracts and at some point will be expanding at an accelerating rate and at another point it will be contracting at an
accelerating rate.

Surely we can all agree that "something" cannot come from "nothing".

Time is a mental construct to make sense of the passing of events, there is no end to "time" or the Universe and there was no
beginning to "time" or no beginning to the Universe, after all if it began where did it come from.

Simple answer is that all that is is the Universe and all that is is all that has ever been, things just change.

...

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #19 on: August 31, 2014, 06:17:46 AM »
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Offline Pirate88179

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #20 on: August 31, 2014, 09:07:05 PM »
The definition of the Universe to me is "everything in existence".

I think it is a stretch to say that the Universe is being "added to" from nowhere. All that is, is already contained in the Universe
by definition. The Universe expanding if it is is nothing more than a similar effect to a bullet when fired from a gun, the bang
goes off but the bullet accelerates up to it terminal velocity, the bullet does not instantly go fro rest to terminal velocity it must
gain velocity at a given rate, and that rate changes throughout the course of the projectiles flight.

Same with the Universe, the big bang was not the creation of everything from nothing, it was simply the beginning of another
cycle, everything in the Universe at some stage contracts to a dense point of mass, then it goes "Bang" and it all expands at
an accelerating rate for a certain period before it slows down then contracts again.

It can be the only way. Everything that exists now and will forever is contained within the Universe. The Universe expands and
contracts and at some point will be expanding at an accelerating rate and at another point it will be contracting at an
accelerating rate.

Surely we can all agree that "something" cannot come from "nothing".

Time is a mental construct to make sense of the passing of events, there is no end to "time" or the Universe and there was no
beginning to "time" or no beginning to the Universe, after all if it began where did it come from.

Simple answer is that all that is is the Universe and all that is is all that has ever been, things just change.

...

I totally agree.  The universe is indeed expanding but,  the mass remains the same, only the space and distance between the mass is increasing.  So, no more mass exists now than what was there as the original input.  No something from nothing.  I too also agree that this is cyclical.  It has probably been going on from the beginning of time, and will continue to do so.  Start and End are human concepts and nature does not really have to follow this model.

Bill

Offline lancaIV

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #21 on: August 31, 2014, 09:42:39 PM »
                      "Ruhe"masse : Bewegungsmasse under 4D space-time condition (Minkowski)
                       f.e. Photon-Ruhe =299728 Km/s(Vacuum)

         

                        A.H.  Lorentz Gleichung Formula (E or e) E=mc² ~ relativistic Energy


                             
                             Massenzunahme shortly  m
                                                          =e/c² 
                             analog
                             FitzGerald Gleichung
 
                                                         Voll-/Halb-/Nullwert
                                                          radioactive energy

                                      Halbwert-Time(=Zeit)-Formula     `'decay'             

Time is a mental construct to make sense of the passing of events, there is no end to "time" or the Universe and there was nobeginning to "time" or no beginning to the Universe, after all if it began where did it come from.


                           Tesla time Formula T=mc²


mc²=  is a mental construct to make sense of the passing of events, there is no end to "mc²" or the Universe and there was no beginning to "mc²" or no beginning to the Universe, after all if it began where did it come from.
                                                 ::) 
                    Dank U ,Ranchhand, now is mir alles klar
                    Albern Einstein : " Bin ich verrueckt,oder die anderen ?!"
                    Albern,melde mich freiwillig ! 

     overunity is a thermodynamical fusion process ~ f.e. LCR circuit

     
A nice week
                   OCWL   

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #21 on: August 31, 2014, 09:42:39 PM »
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Offline sarkeizen

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2014, 07:56:13 AM »
However, the odds of finding a new, previously unknown source of energy would be, naturally, quite large.
Please provide a calculation which demonstrates this.
Quote
Philosophically speaking, mankind's largest arrogance is a claim of scientific piety mixed with a demonstrative penchant for an unspoken claim of absolute knowledge.
This. when it isn't vague seems like a rather large and unfounded generalization.
Quote
We know very little in the grand scheme of things, but ask us what we know and there is seemingly little left to learn.
Whatever constitutes the "grand scheme of things" is conveniently left out of this sentence.  Not to mention that it's probably irrelevant.  One doesn't have to know everything about everything to show that something is impossible (or highly unlikely)

From where I stand peoples desire to take complex problems and pretend that they are easily captured by awkward prose (like your own) is among the more arrogant things I see in a day.

Offline forest

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #23 on: September 01, 2014, 11:12:01 AM »
ant is riding on the elephant , is that free energy ?  ;D ;D ;D ;D

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #23 on: September 01, 2014, 11:12:01 AM »
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Offline lancaIV

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #24 on: September 01, 2014, 11:58:27 AM »
ant is riding on the elephant , is that free energy ?  ;D ;D ;D ;D


Is this a philosophistical question  ::)  or to become answered by strong Helmholtz & al. standpoint view  ??? ? Six feeth under  :P ? Then you will have to wait ! ;)


S
  OCWL




Offline profitis

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2014, 02:55:30 PM »
Lol lanca what's the elephant riding on.a big wheel lol.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2014, 02:55:30 PM »
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Offline forest

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #26 on: September 01, 2014, 04:30:57 PM »
no, it's the real answer
for ant this is free energy but not for elephant but should ant care about this ? not really

Offline gauschor

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #27 on: September 01, 2014, 05:23:49 PM »
I totally agree.  The universe is indeed expanding but,  the mass remains the same, only the space and distance between the mass is increasing.  So, no more mass exists now than what was there as the original input.  No something from nothing.

You don't know that. In a universe, where simple thoughts mean creation, every new thought will extend the universe a little bit more. We can't prove we live in such a universe and we can't prove the opposite.

Offline profitis

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #28 on: September 01, 2014, 06:14:50 PM »
Woooooo @forest I feel sorry for you buddy.here's a challenge for you: prove to the audience that the MnO2-nickel-air profitis battery obeys the 2nd law of thermodynamics please.remember,it has about 3 times karpens original power density..

Offline pauldude000

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Re: Why overunity MUST be difficult or even impossible to replicate.
« Reply #29 on: September 01, 2014, 06:31:33 PM »
One doesn't have to know everything about everything to show that something is impossible (or highly unlikely)

From where I stand peoples desire to take complex problems and pretend that they are easily captured by awkward prose (like your own) is among the more arrogant things I see in a day.


Interesting. You are right in that you do not have to know everything about everything to show that something is impossible, you merely have to know everything about one thing, which we do not. That is an argument from incredulity, since you bring in the concepts of formal and informal logical fallacies.


Since we are on that topic now anyway, is it not arrogant to challenge an argument and then end your short dissertation with an argumentum ad hominem?


Here is a 'heads up', so to speak -- You do not have a sole lease or ownership of logical, rational thought. Either agreement or disagreement are both allowed and encouraged. Both positions are often highly subjective states anyway, since in very few cases that I have witnessed have the positions been determined logically, but instead tend to be based upon personal bias and emotional preference.


Me stating something you dislike or disbelieve does not inherently make me arrogant.


Simple fact: The 1st law of thermodynamics (energy is neither created nor destroyed), as a physical law, only applies within the framework within which it was proposed (within a closed system). Application of this law outside of that framework invalidates it's applicability. Many scientist seem to have forgotten that little principle concerning physical laws, in that they are only laws within a very specific situation.


If any system is not closed, then the first law does not apply.


We also do not get the privilege of defining ad hoc what is, or is not, a closed system by definition. The definition does not get to change at a whim, or the law is invalidated. We also do not get the logical privilege of limiting the system to suit our desired outcome.


Any unknown energy source that does exist within any system is already a part of the system being examined. Our lack of knowledge concerning said energy source does not allow us to exempt said energy source from the system -- with either an argument from ignorance or probability. To do such is true arrogance.








 

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