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Author Topic: 1850 Watts free energy power ? New GEGENE circuit by JL Naudin shows COP = 2.8  (Read 210869 times)

Offline tagor

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When claiming gains like this and asking people to replicate, all it's doing is causing people to spend time on this rather than something useful!

so !! what are doing on this thread ?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Madebymonkeys

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so !! what are doing on this thread ?

Trying to stop people wasting their time and hopefully drawing people's attention to things that have been missed or measured poorly.

What are you doing on the thread :)

Offline tagor

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Trying to stop people wasting their time and hopefully drawing people's attention to things that have been missed or measured poorly.

What are you doing on the thread :)

to stop the TROLLS

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Offline Madebymonkeys

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Trying to stop people wasting their time and hopefully drawing people's attention to things that have been missed or measured poorly.

What are you doing on the thread :)

I was originally on the thread because I was intrigued - spotting the issues prompted me to post.
Are you happy for people to replicate something which doesn't work?
Can you tell me why the power is measured reliably?
Ta!

Offline tagor

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I was originally on the thread because I was intrigued - spotting the issues prompted me to post.
Are you happy for people to replicate something which doesn't work?
Can you tell me why the power is measured reliably?
Ta!

ok you are wright
 
but a troll repeat the same thing again and again ...
stop trolling

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Offline Madebymonkeys

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ok you are wright
 
but a troll repeat the same thing again and again ...
stop trolling

I agree, I have mentioned that PF should be considered a couple of times.
Nobody has disputed this yet, I could be wrong - does PF play a big part in the core measurements of this system? Is it the single most important measurement in terms of validation? All the claims are based on power measurements, all I am saying is that they aren't measured properly. Are you saying they are or are you just looking for an argument, I sure wasn't - I thought this info was useful?

Seems to me a troll is someone who points out things which are (not might be) wrong - this benefits others! Dont label people trolls just because they offer sensible advice which you don't like.

Sorry if that appears a little harsh.

Have you replicated the cct or do you have anything to offer to the people who might - or are you simply here to belittle the people who don't blindly believe something is correct?

I don't consider myself a troll although your little outburst certainly makes me feel that you are.

Offer some useful info - don't just bully people who offer sensible info and opinion. There are more opinions than yours. What was wrong with the info or the way it was presented?

You're the troll :)

PS: Are you happy for people to repeat test setup a which aren't correct? Why wouldn't you want to help people? Oh, and helping people isn't necessarily just cheer leading and back slapping - sometimes it's educating people on common measurement errors - this is important as its all part of the validation process......unless you think 'doing things properly' is wrong?

Offline ramset

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MBM
Your Benevolence is getting a bit "strong",Naudlin has been doing this a long time,I don't think he's a hotplate salesman looking to "score" a big month.
 
The Recent Mix is even more interesting ATM .
 
Thx
Chet
 
 

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Offline JouleSeeker

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Trying to stop people wasting their time and hopefully drawing people's attention to things that have been missed or measured poorly.

What are you doing on the thread :)

So, madebymonkeys, you keep telling us that this Gegene device is "measured poorly" and to stop "wasting time." 

IF you are not a troll, tell us HOW to measure the input power PROPERLY. 

I challenge you to do it, and stop wasting our time, if you are not a troll.

Offline Madebymonkeys

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So, madebymonkeys, you keep telling us that this Gegene device is "measured poorly" and to stop "wasting time." 

IF you are not a troll, tell us HOW to measure the input power PROPERLY. 

I challenge you to do it, and stop wasting our time, if you are not a troll.

There is a link in post#94 - I added that link so people could see how to measure it. Have a read, if any of it is confusing so let me know and I will do my best to answer your questions.

If you have a better way of measuring it with accuracy do post it.

MBM.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Madebymonkeys

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There is a link in post#94 - I added that link so people could see how to measure it. Have a read, if any of it is confusing so let me know and I will do my best to answer your questions.

If you have a better way of measuring it with accuracy do post it.

MBM.

There are also a lot of meters on the market to do the job although they are quite pricey, here is a brochure for one which has some good reviews although there are many. Do note the comment in the brochure about PF being the most important measurement when determining power.

http://c418683.r83.cf2.rackcdn.com/uploaded/BUWT1800_00EN_020.pdf

Without a dedicated meter you need to take some decent bandwidth (to catch harmonics) voltage and current measurements over time and do the math shown in my previous link.

It's not straightforward but it's important to do it right otherwise you end up with a product which is illegal to connect to the grid and also some unbelievable power measurements (output significantly larger than input etc).

It's worth doing right.

I use a local test house to do testing as they have the equipment (I don't) - costs about 30mins in time although our test house is quite flexible (some have a minimum of a half day).

Sorry if the above sounds 'trolly' - just trying to point in the right direction because its important - things not done right cause lots of confusion......see 'cold fusion' and its measurement errors, it went from 'wow, the planet is saved' to 'wow, really, you didn't measure that quite right did you' ;)

Offline frankidel

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There is a link in post#94 - I added that link so people could see how to measure it. Have a read, if any of it is confusing so let me know and I will do my best to answer your questions.

If you have a better way of measuring it with accuracy do post it.

MBM.

Eille le singe, ce qui est drole cé quand une personne a une bonne idée, elle fonctionne et voilà que les singes arrivent en ville.......

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Madebymonkeys

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Eille le singe, ce qui est drole cé quand une personne a une bonne idée, elle fonctionne et voilà que les singes arrivent en ville.......

The monkeys were already in town...taking bad measurements with $10 power meters!
Stop trolling and add something useful maybe?

Offline JouleSeeker

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Madebymonkeys -- thanks for the pointer to the WT1800.

Are you saying that the Gegene will show WILL DEFINITELY show more input-power usage when measured by the WT1800 or equivalent, than when measured by a standard (utility-provided) power meter?

(Referring to a utility-provided power meter, not a "cheap" power meter such as the kill-a-watt meter)




Offline Madebymonkeys

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Madebymonkeys -- thanks for the pointer to the WT1800.

Are you saying that the Gegene will show WILL DEFINITELY show more input-power usage when measured by the WT1800 or equivalent, than when measured by a standard (utility-provided) power meter?

(Referring to a utility-provided power meter, not a "cheap" power meter such as the kill-a-watt meter)

It depends on a number of factors such as whether the utility meter expects the items in the home to adhere to the law or 0.9 or better PF. Outside of this range all bets could be off.

In short, what's the measurement accuracy/resolution of the utility provided meter and can it measure PF outside of legal limits (or will it bottom out at 0.9)?

In short, I don't know for sure what the readings will be with more accurate gear but as a first step I would remove the grid tie and use a resistive load - an incandescent bulb is a good, high-PF load.
Oh, and characterise the hob on its own prior to connecting to other things - get a feel for its PF.

I am about to leave the house but will try and draw a pic of where to measure etc as well as outlining the uncertainties in the measurements - none are 100% accurate.

I am a skeptic (as you probably know) but I am knowledgable on some things. I have made too many measurement errors in the past to let others do the same!

Alternatively, pay a $100 or so and visit a local test house - they should have the right gear for measuring power quality. JLN should have done this before making big claims!
Making big claims only to have them proven incorrect really batters credibility - best to be as sure as possible first!

Offline crazycut06

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How about looking at the meter base when the induction cooker is in use with the load, try to count the power within minutes used, then do the same with the halogen lamps only and see if theres any difference on consumption, then calculate for efficiency... Maybe easier to clarify than using a watt meter?

 

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