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Author Topic: Crystal Cell Research  (Read 161448 times)

Offline Kator01

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #210 on: September 27, 2014, 01:46:10 AM »
Hello Dave,

is this the product Natriummetasilikate you used ?

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Red-Devil-TSP-90-Heavy-Duty-Cleaner-1-lb-Cleans-Floors-Walls-Woodwork-/321471781360?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ad93619f0

If so we will have to find similar product in germany as Amazone listed it here as not available at the present time

Thanks

Kator01

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #210 on: September 27, 2014, 01:46:10 AM »

Offline drodenbe

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #211 on: September 27, 2014, 04:26:13 AM »
Hi Kator01:

Look on ebay under sodium metasilicate.  The very first listing shows a 1 lb bag for 14.00.

David

Offline drodenbe

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #212 on: September 27, 2014, 04:45:14 AM »
Kator01

 I forgot to answer your question.  Yes the product is a cleaner found in the paint section of ace hardware under the name TSP-90.  I am going to buy off of ebay after my current supply runs out.  I think I can get a better price in bulk.  Goes fast.  Used almost 6 lbs.  Using the portland cement helps to stretch out the supply and it also helps to harden the cell a lot faster.  2 hours as apposed to a couple of days.  Using the cement you can seal off the cell with wax or epoxy and keep a little moisture in the cell to get the current.   Good luck!  Hope you liked the circuit.  I am now looking at 1.172 volts and it is still climbing.  I am also charging of sorts three other crystal cells and they are reading 3.609 and they are still climbing.  I am using two radio shack data logging meters to Graph the results.  That way I can do other things and watch which way the voltage is going.  Well the charge batteries just went to 3.610 volts.  I let it run all night. been running for week.  Noticed that the voltage falls a couple thousands of a volt at night then when morning comes the voltage goes back up.  One last thing.  If you are careful in measuring the sodium hydroxide solution as I have stated and make enough to do all your cells if you are making more than one,  you will have great consistency between the cell voltages with that batch.  I did 10 cells to make a 12 volt battery and I got around 1.220 to 1.268 on all the cells.  Other wise the voltage might be all over the place.  At least this is what I found out. 

David

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #212 on: September 27, 2014, 04:45:14 AM »
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Offline 4Tesla

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #213 on: September 27, 2014, 08:12:56 AM »
Hi David,

Thank you for sharing your research!  A lot of new stuff to try!  I've been also doing research in this area.  I have an idea of coating the electrodes with a conductive coating.. there are electrically conductive adhesives, but costs lots.. going to try to make my own.

http://www.atomadhesives.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=79_94
(the prices look low.. but they are for a very small amount)

4Tesla
« Last Edit: September 27, 2014, 05:41:21 PM by 4Tesla »

Offline Kator01

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #214 on: September 27, 2014, 01:49:05 PM »
Hi David,

do you have information about the volumetric or weight percentage of the material-mix including the amount of water you used ?

This would be of great help.

This swiss flyer gives information about a new trend in laundry detergent production indicating that there are different particle sizes available for different purposes. See here

http://www.impag.ch/fileadmin/resources/files/ch/Chemie/Flyer_Natriummetasilikate_2011-02-01_final.pdf

so it would be a good idea to find out the particle size of the Sodium-Metasilikate you bought

Shipping-cost are too high to buy this in USA, have to find it here in germany.

Thanks for sharing

Kator01






Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #214 on: September 27, 2014, 01:49:05 PM »
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Offline 4Tesla

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #215 on: September 27, 2014, 06:09:21 PM »
Hi David,

do you have information about the volumetric or weight percentage of the material-mix including the amount of water you used ?

This would be of great help.

This swiss flyer gives information about a new trend in laundry detergent production indicating that there are different particle sizes available for different purposes. See here

http://www.impag.ch/fileadmin/resources/files/ch/Chemie/Flyer_Natriummetasilikate_2011-02-01_final.pdf

so it would be a good idea to find out the particle size of the Sodium-Metasilikate you bought

Shipping-cost are too high to buy this in USA, have to find it here in germany.

Thanks for sharing

Kator01

Edit:  NM.. not the same.. disregard

I've used Sodium Silicate (aka liquid glass), which is the same thing, but in liquid form.. basically they add the water for you.  Maybe you can find that in Germany.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2014, 09:49:23 PM by 4Tesla »

Offline plengo

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #216 on: September 27, 2014, 07:26:50 PM »
@drodenbe[/size]

[/size]
excellent work. I will also try the joule thief mod of yours. Now to the work.[/size]

[/size]
I am happy you are using the graph, extremely important. Please share pictures of the graph zoomed and the whole graph so far. I want to see the curves and the spikes.[/size]

[/size]
The metasilica works well but will create sodium oxides that will smell like ammonia which will kill the cell with time because of its resitive properties, in other words, it will kill the cell by creating an isolation layer.


In one of my videos I show a big cell running a 25 watts  light. That cell I use something similar to what you are doing, charging the cell with a power supply. This creates a thin layer over the other metal (not copper) that will work like a super capacitor (another huge line of research to pursue) BUT it will also create an isolation layer with time. That one problem is VERY WORTHY to research and try to eliminate and then one can contain the humidity inside the cell and sealed, like you are doing.


Concrete will absorb the water and kind of work this is WHY: the water MUST flow back and forth inside the cell so the concrete will absorb and release that water as the cell needs. In your case the meta-silica (liquid glass) will with time soak the cell and cause the ammonia problem and cause the cell to inflate and crack open. You will see it. Amazing pressure it will create, another great line of research to solve.


Someone mention the conductive grease, that works BUT it will eventually open a hole and allow water to contaminate the metals.


The graph you are using IS CRUCIAL to understand what the cell is doing inside and tell you if she will survive for a long time before that time comes. Please share that.


I am using the following elements:
- Alum
- Epson salts
- Rochelle salts (3 different crystal for 3 different growth rates and "conflicting" starvation)
- Activate carbon to reduce internal resistance of the cell and compound "unification" (one could try different inert options)
- try using (depending of the formulas you are using) a teta or even higher hydrates. They are the "dirt" where the crystal grows but avoid nitrogen based, they will crack the cells open with time and corrode copper like butter.
- Quartz crystals already grown to help in the piezo effect. You can try different compounds of inert quartz crystals. River sands?!




Well, now, the cell DOES fluctuate during the day and night in a very specific pattern. That is ALSO CRUCIAL. We need to see that. The cells is very sensitive to the moon (I know it sounds crazy but its all based on the empirical data) and the solar intensity, also of your presence.


With your cell try not YET to seal it and run the graphs and share it too. I would like to see the "evaporation" level of the water - based on the curve of the graph. This will show the level of crystal growth based on the amount of water it will retain and the piezo effect inside the cell, besides off course, of the power over time.


Also use a 100 ohms resistor as a load to became close to real application devices and have a more repetitive and empirical data to measure (base line). With this technique you will be able to use your meter to graph not only the voltage but current and "internal resistance" of the cell all at one shot.  ;D


Those are a few questions and tips I have to observe your testing and one can branch from your work and share results.


Keep up your great work, man and THANK YOU for actively now participating in this forum.


I have been waiting for people DOING THE WORK to participate so that I CAN SHARE. I don't want to share with "chair sitters".


Fausto.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #216 on: September 27, 2014, 07:26:50 PM »
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Offline drodenbe

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #217 on: September 27, 2014, 08:30:49 PM »
Hi again:  Kator01

I am measuring by volume.   4oz ( Dixie cup) with 4oz cement (Dixie cup).  I looked up the msds sheet for the tsp-90 and is lists the ingredients as sodium meta silicate pentahydroxide.  But the label on the bag just lists sodium meta silicate.  Not sure what the difference is.  I am not a chemist.  I found the product on ebay I don't know if that is a problem with where you are or not.  If it is not ace hardware usa or Ebay, I am not sure where you can get it! 

Fausto:  Thanks for all your input and comments.  I have all your videos and as I have said before, you have saved us all a lot of work and money.  Money short supply! Retired!  I will try to get you the shots in a while.  Recently went through a divorce.  Lost all my stuff and information...  No camera no equipment.  Trying to replace slowly.  Did spring for scope and two logging meters.  Not sure if I can save a pict file from logging program or not.  Will look into.  Will need to get a camera soon. 

I will try to supply you with some data as you requested.  I don't have the experience with the cells as you do and I don't even want to try to match wits with you because I would loose.  You have done extensive research into this subject and your videos prove that!  I know very well about the possible outcome of the cells after time.  Been there and one of the reasons I quit for a while. Had renewed interest with the increase voltage output of this compound.  So as you know so well.  Time will tell!  I just looked and my joule thief is running the Led at high brightness and the cell is at 1.180 volts and rising was 1.172 last night at midnight.   Charge cells at 3.601 was 3.591 last night as well.

David

Offline plengo

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #218 on: September 27, 2014, 08:51:37 PM »
Hi again:  Kator01

I am measuring by volume.   4oz ( Dixie cup) with 4oz cement (Dixie cup).  I looked up the msds sheet for the tsp-90 and is lists the ingredients as sodium meta silicate pentahydroxide.  But the label on the bag just lists sodium meta silicate.  Not sure what the difference is.  I am not a chemist.  I found the product on ebay I don't know if that is a problem with where you are or not.  If it is not ace hardware usa or Ebay, I am not sure where you can get it! 

Fausto:  Thanks for all your input and comments.  I have all your videos and as I have said before, you have saved us all a lot of work and money.  Money short supply! Retired!  I will try to get you the shots in a while.  Recently went through a divorce.  Lost all my stuff and information...  No camera no equipment.  Trying to replace slowly.  Did spring for scope and two logging meters.  Not sure if I can save a pict file from logging program or not.  Will look into.  Will need to get a camera soon. 

I will try to supply you with some data as you requested.  I don't have the experience with the cells as you do and I don't even want to try to match wits with you because I would loose.  You have done extensive research into this subject and your videos prove that!  I know very well about the possible outcome of the cells after time.  Been there and one of the reasons I quit for a while. Had renewed interest with the increase voltage output of this compound.  So as you know so well.  Time will tell!  I just looked and my joule thief is running the Led at high brightness and the cell is at 1.180 volts and rising was 1.172 last night at midnight.   Charge cells at 3.601 was 3.591 last night as well.

David


I know the problem of lack of money very well.  :D


Do not worry about comparing with me. I am like a say a "monkey scientist", only that and I have love for this research.




I don't need a picture than, just draw in a piece of paper as close as possible to what you see in the graph, like I show on my videos too. I am interested in the Ups and Downs by time/sample and the "spikes", how tall are they compared to the whole "long wave" curve.


Voltage rising now will not mean much (after hundreds of tests I kind figure that) BUT they tell me how the cell is "running inside".


The whole thing is based on the water "execution" inside the cell and the curves tells part of this story.


Fausto.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #218 on: September 27, 2014, 08:51:37 PM »
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Offline 4Tesla

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #219 on: September 27, 2014, 08:57:06 PM »
Hi Fausto,

Thanks for sharing your electrolyte materials.

Yep, I haven't had much luck with Sodium Silicate either.

I'm going to try electrically conductive adhesive for coating the electrodes.

Have you tried graphite powder (also carbon based) to reduce internal resistance?  I'm also looking at aluminum powder.

http://www.amazon.com/West-System-Graphite-Powder-423/dp/B002MYWI8Y/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1411687597&sr=8-8&keywords=GRAPHITE+POWDER

Also I'm looking into using Barium Titanate powder.  It is piezoelectric and non-soluble.

I do believe that polarizing does help, but I don't use a power supply.. I just put the cell under load while the crystals form.

Since everyone is sharing, here is a list of materials I've been researching..

Soluble Crystal Materials:
Sodium Borate (Borax) - Na2B4O7•10H2O
Magnesium Sulfate (Epson Salt) - MgSO4•7H2O
Potassium Aluminum Sulfate (Alum) - KAl(SO4)2•12H2O
Potassium Chloride (Ingredient in Salt Substitute) - KCl
Potassium Sodium Tartrate (Rochelle Salt) - KNaC4H4O6•4H2O
Calcium Sulfate (Gypsum) - CaSO4•2H2O
Calcium Carbonate (Calcite) - CaCO3
Sodium Hydroxide (Lye, Caustic Soda) - NaOH   -- just added to list  8)

I'm happy to see continued research in this area!

4Tesla

Offline plengo

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #220 on: September 27, 2014, 09:08:50 PM »

Sodium Borate (Borax) - Na2B4O7•10H2O                                    -> will clean the surface of the metal (no need - in my humble opinion)
Magnesium Sulfate (Epson Salt) - MgSO4•7H2O                            -> will give you the first week of power. It will become grayish in color and will become an isolation layer.
Potassium Aluminum Sulfate (Alum) - KAl(SO4)2•12H2O                -> Alum, good
Potassium Chloride (Ingredient in Salt Substitute) - KCl                  -> This is the piezo BUT will with nitrogen form a corrosive element.
Potassium Sodium Tartrate (Rochelle Salt) - KNaC4H4O6•4H2O      -> good.
Calcium Sulfate (Gypsum) - CaSO4•2H2O                                     -> good to hold water and unify the compound. Will also become very hard with time.
Calcium Carbonate (Calcite) - CaCO3                                            -> more of the calcium above. No need.
Sodium Hydroxide (Lye, Caustic Soda) - NaOH                              -> with time will become ammonia and "inflate" the cell to rupture level. It is only good in the beginning to "suck" the salts and eliminate their reactive properties BUT again, will kill the cell, specially if water is still present.




Off course my input is only a humble opinion of mine and in no way diminish your work.


Keep up.


Fausto.   

I'm happy to see continued research in this area!

4Tesla

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #220 on: September 27, 2014, 09:08:50 PM »
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Offline 4Tesla

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #221 on: September 27, 2014, 09:20:27 PM »
Hi Fausto,

Thanks for adding your input on the materials.. that will help!

4Tesla

Offline drodenbe

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #222 on: September 27, 2014, 09:23:57 PM »
Fausto:
 
Just figured out how to get you the information.  I just do a printscrn and save it to the paint program and save it as a jpg.  Works great!  Will be a while before camera and Hollywood productions.  I need to know how you want the experiment set up.  I just put a 100 ohm resistor across the cell and all I get is so far a downward discharge curve has not leveled out yet.  My not may just head right into the gorund!  So to speak!  it seams to be slowing down at 1.060 volts don't have the spikes you are talking about.  Need to explain how you want to set this up. 

Also :  The sodium meta silicate is not like the sodium silicate.  It is not the same and doesn't react the same!!!!  I have use the sodium silicate and have had similar results with the cells as every one else.  I never saw the improvement until the sodium meta silicate.  You don't need to use the magnesium to get over one volt.  I just use the aluminum with a thick coating of aluminum oxide on plate.  This protects from corrosion.  Have had 10 cells running for over a month without any signs of corrosion.  The cells were at 1.25 volts when made and they are still at the same or a little higher or lower by about a couple thousands of a volt.  I also heat treat the copper to red hot then let cool. I don't remove the black coating.  I leave it there. But as we all know so well time will be the real test!!!

here is a video where I got the idea of the oxide coating on the aluminum.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7y8ek9aASQ

Marus Reid Crystal Cell Technology.  Look at all his videos but this one shows the diagram of the inside.

Offline profitis

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #223 on: September 27, 2014, 09:25:42 PM »
If you have a slow galvanic corrosion process going in any totaly sealed container one of two things will happen: either hydrogen gas will be slowly released and puncture the container,or oxygen gas will be consumed inside the container and puncture it.

Offline plengo

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Re: Crystal Cell Research
« Reply #224 on: September 27, 2014, 09:32:46 PM »
If you have a slow galvanic corrosion process going in any totaly sealed container one of two things will happen: either hydrogen gas will be slowly released and puncture the container,or oxygen gas will be consumed inside the container and puncture it.
Absolutely CORRECT. This is ONE of the signs I know corrosion of out of the question.


Fausto.

 

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