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Author Topic: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !  (Read 73921 times)

Offline MeggerMan

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Re: Graham Gunderson´s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #30 on: January 26, 2007, 03:37:57 PM »
Hi Nali,
Yes point taken, OK that just leaves putting two holes either side of the magnet, to pick up on that "sweet spot".
The input coils would need to be wound as many layers in a smaller area too, as drawn in the simulation.

Hi Marcel,
One more point, are you doing a push-pull on each pair of coils, so at any one time, one coil is energized and one is not?

I am not sure if it mentions how to pulse the input windings in the patent but this would seem the logical way of switching the flux.
You can use a TL494 IC and a couple of mosfets to perform this, and if you really want to get a nice clean square pulse use a power mosfet driver IC between the TL494 and mosfets like the UCC37324:
UCC37324P

it's hip to be square ;o)

Regards
Rob

Offline neptune

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #31 on: January 26, 2007, 08:11:39 PM »
Hello again. Whilst I respect other peoples opinions, I disagree with Kingrs, About filling the holes with iron filings, or using iron wire. The patent states that the flux flows around the holes like the thread flowing around a bolt. Overtone says this device will not be overunity with a ferrite core. This is puzzling because the patent is for a GENERATOR. If it is not overunity, it becomes an inverter, converter, or transformer. Yet the patent actually calls for a ferite core!
         Also, why use a square wave input. If you apply a square wave to a tuned or resonant circuit, the net result is a sine wave . Sometimes I feel that patents are not worth the paper they are written on. The patent has little or nothing to say about input /output ratios. If this device has any merit , we are now reduced to "wait and see " just like the 10 million other ideas. Sadly, wishing doesnt make it so. Sorry, feeling cynical tonight, neptune.

Offline MeggerMan

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #32 on: January 26, 2007, 09:24:26 PM »
Hi Neptune,
The iron filings was just an idea to try. I saw on page 2 another replication that look promising using a linear example. Good proof of concept.
I think generator windings are an odd thing, the flux does not really cut through them as such, its almost as if it has its own inverse field that reaches out into core and pulls in electrical energy.
But I stand by my square pulses, I have seen what odd shaped traces you get as output without a clean drive into the mosfet.
You need to start off with square waves and then allow the inductor to turn it into a nice curve.
If you think you can get a sine wave out of a mosfet then be my guest.
Its not efficient,i.e.wasted volts drop across the device to get the curve and serves no purpose.

Regards
Rob

Offline Nali2001

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #33 on: January 26, 2007, 11:48:55 PM »
The core material is highly likely a crystalline type core material like metglass suitable for high frequency and high permeability. Laminates have a permeability that might be suitable, but don't handle high frequencies (above 300hz or so) very well. So ferrite is good for the high frequencies but than again the permeability is lowww. Metglass takes the bests from both. High permeability and (very)high frequency. But you guessed it, very expensive. Maybe soma alloy is suitable. But expensive also because they probably have to custom make it for you.

Patents when fully open are actually quite handy. They are a worldwide free to get instruction Manuel. Unless they hide stuff.... But still patents give us many ideas to work on.

Power conversion and generation is a curious thing if you think of it. Lots of time magnetism does not really 'cut' any wire and still it generates of transforms good power. Look at the attached picture. Here you see a toroid transformer and a 3phase transformer.  These are proven devices. And keep in mind that the flux will stay 99% inside the core material, never comes out to cut the wires of the secondary (?output?) coil. And of course the works like 80% efficient. How?  The flux never ?comes out? of the core material. So there are many devices where the flux does not really 'cut' the coils and yet work?

Offline MeggerMan

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Re: Graham Gunderson´s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #34 on: January 27, 2007, 12:55:17 AM »
Hi Nali,
Metglas you say, expensive you say, do you mean like this:
AMCC-320?

(http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m25/kingrs/DSCN4765.jpg)

or this

(http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m25/kingrs/DSCN4733.jpg)

Sorry, permission to look smug sir....?

Regards
Rob

Offline Nali2001

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #35 on: January 27, 2007, 01:05:49 AM »
Nice one. No need to tell you they are not cheap I think. So with that core you could test this Graham Gunderson system. Just start drilling those holes... ;) and hope it works.

Offline MeggerMan

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #36 on: January 27, 2007, 01:28:13 AM »
Hi Nali,
They are not that expensive, about 107 GBP including courier charges.
No I will not be drilling holes in this core, mainly because this is for my MEG replication project and secondly it is very delicate.
Regards
Rob

Offline neptune

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #37 on: January 27, 2007, 08:07:55 PM »
Hi all. I must confess that I have never tried to get a sinewave out of a mosfet. Per haps the square wave is best. but, I still stand by my idea of having an oscillator with feedback[see erlier] to ensure that the input waveform stays synchronised with the resonant frequency of the input resonant circuit. Perhaps one of you computer whizzkids could post a diagram based on my erlier description of this cicuit please?

Offline Marcel

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #38 on: January 27, 2007, 10:08:08 PM »
@Kingrs

Thanks for your tips.
The input coils are serialy connected.
I will try a new Mosfets driver, and a new Iron core I have purchased on Ebay.
Micrometals T400-26.

Offline Overtone

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent applcation
« Reply #39 on: January 28, 2007, 05:10:02 PM »
I posted back last October that the application has been superseded. A new patent application will cover factors we discovered are necessary for this invention to exceed unity.

Cores that will work are, as some have suggested, expensive. They must have little known characteristics. They must be processed using very costly equipment. This invention cannot exceed unity otherwise.

Therefore, sad to say, it is extremely likely that any attempt to build the device by individuals is almost certain to fail. (Error posted previously in this line is now corrected.)

To repeat, the first prototype worked and exceeded unity.

Commercial variations are under development.

For reasons of international patent law, such as Taiwan and South Korea, where publication instantly negates patentability, we will not reveal the critical additional information until the second patent application is published.

Mark Goldes
Chairman & CEO
Magnetic Power Inc.

« Last Edit: January 28, 2007, 07:29:47 PM by Overtone »

Offline Overtone

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent application
« Reply #40 on: January 28, 2007, 07:10:52 PM »
Whoops. Error.

I meant to say that given what we have learned since the original patent application was filed, any attempt to build this device, by an individual, is extremely unlikely to succeed!

Should have had more coffee before previewing my earlier post :).

Mark

Offline acp

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #41 on: January 28, 2007, 07:24:39 PM »


Quote
I posted back last October that the application has been superseded. A new patent application will cover factors we discovered are necessary for this invention to exceed unity.

Cores that will work are, as some have suggested, expensive. They must have little known characteristics. They must be processed using very costly equipment. This invention cannot exceed unity otherwise.

Therefore, sad to say, it is extremely unlikely that any attempt to build the device by individuals is almost certain to fail.

To repeat, the first prototype worked and exceeded unity.

Commercial variations are under development.

For reasons of international patent law, such as Taiwan and South Korea, where publication instantly negates patentability, we will not reveal the critical additional information until the second patent application is published.

Mark Goldes
Chairman & CEO
Magnetic Power Inc.


Ha ha ha,  you are so funny..........

Offline MeggerMan

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Re: Graham Gunderson´s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #42 on: January 28, 2007, 08:00:43 PM »
Hi Marcel,
Could be the inventors are getting twitchy about people replicating their baby?
I have just done the simulation again in Femm to check my comments I made previous to you and it looks like I gave you the wrong info or not all the info.

The coils can indeed be connected in series, but the pulse does need to be AC.
To achieve this requires a "H" bridge of mosfets to allow the coil supply to be AC.
This will give the greatest flux change.

Saying that though, to simplify things you can do as I suggested before and use a push-pull DC pulse applied to the two sets of coils to the right and left of each magnet.

I think what Mark is trying to say is that the balance of current, magnet choice and core material are all critical to this working at over unity.
From my simulations, it can be seen that only a very tiny current and voltage is required to get the field to switch (20mA @ 0.5V) and anything greater will saturate the core.
Using a magnet too powerful for the core material, will yes, saturate the core.

Also try using ceramic 5 or ceramic 8 magnets to start with.
I suspect Neo magnets are too powerful for the core material.

The good thing is that Mark's company will be buying off the shelf cores just like you and I.  Metglass make them, we use them.

Hi Mark,
Given that you cannot give any details about the new patent, can you at least say what level of over-unity you have achieved?
Does the core material drop in temperature as per the MCE theory?
http://emwiki.info/MEMM
How long before you are ready for a production product?

Regards
Rob 

Offline neptune

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #43 on: February 05, 2007, 08:31:15 PM »
....and the silence was deafening. Can anyone else hear the crickets chirping ? Just yet another Bullshiner then......

Offline Overtone

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Re: Graham Gunderson?s dragless generator patent, Lenz law violation !
« Reply #44 on: February 10, 2007, 05:27:39 PM »
Hi Rob,

Hard as it may be for folks here to believe, I hardly ever see this forum. We are extremely busy.

Sorry. No technical information will be released except in patent applications.

If all goes well, we will provide potential licensees with pre-manufacturing prototypes later this year.

We have no control over the time it takes them to gear up for production.

There are also parts required which are not presently mass produced as they have no existing market. That factor is also one over which we have no control and it may well slow up production, although I would think small quantities of self-powered generators might be in the market by the end of this year.

Since development is still much slower than it might be with additional funding, all estimates are subject to change. Adequate funds might be en-route. If, and when, they arrive we will be able to accelerate development.

At this point it is all engineering...

See the attached Press Release.

Mark