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Author Topic: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE  (Read 1639705 times)

Offline ALVARO_CS

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #375 on: October 26, 2013, 07:49:24 PM »
hello all
Stupify: I have been working last weeks with this subject, (Figuera), but not about the rotating field.
As I centered in the 1908 patent, in which the mag. fields are alligned, not rotating but rather fluctuacting from one side to the other (flip-floping ??)

IMHO the way to avoiding Lenz in the two series of inductors, is by means of the progressive addition of resistances after the commutator, (make before brake). So the input V never pases below 0 volts and therefore, no BEMF nor polarity reversal.In addittion, the air gap allows the collector to "produce" AC not influencing the inducing coils.
In my experiments, I reduced the number of resistors, and use a 12 pieces commutator, 3 resitors 100 ohms and 3 direct shunts (see schematic A).
Observed the following:
Spikes are produced at the brushes and also red light observable with one leg of neon bulb.
Variable DC Voltage at the collector higher than the input (after rectified & E. cap), but works with inductive loads, and not with resistive loads. (no amperage readdings yet).

I have been readding your posts very attentively, here and in the other forum, as well as the a.king21 ones.

I will give a try to this schematic you posted so will you be kind to help me with it ?

Is the toroid complete, or with 4 air gaps ?
Is it ferromagnetic ?, (I can make one with plastified iron wire,bailing wire)
Are the two primary winded over a secondary? if yes, should be these secondary in series as one coil ?
And lastly, what do think of using a commutator as B in the attached schematic ? I know that the ON will be longer that the OFF, but equal for both primary sets. It is moved by a small printer DC motor, so the rpm will be not so high (frequency)
thanks
cheers
Alvaro

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline stupify12

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #376 on: October 27, 2013, 04:51:38 AM »
hello all
Stupify: I have been working last weeks with this subject, (Figuera), but not about the rotating field.
As I centered in the 1908 patent, in which the mag. fields are alligned, not rotating but rather fluctuacting from one side to the other (flip-floping ??)

I have been readding your posts very attentively, here and in the other forum, as well as the a.king21 ones.

I will give a try to this schematic you posted so will you be kind to help me with it ?

Is the toroid complete, or with 4 air gaps ?
Is it ferromagnetic ?, (I can make one with plastified iron wire,bailing wire)
Are the two primary winded over a secondary? if yes, should be these secondary in series as one coil ?
And lastly, what do think of using a commutator as B in the attached schematic ? I know that the ON will be longer that the OFF, but equal for both primary sets. It is moved by a small printer DC motor, so the rpm will be not so high (frequency)
thanks
cheers
Alvaro

The toroid is a complete ring no air gaps on this machine, no toroid splits on the annular ring..The magnetic flow on this machine never collide but moves like "catch me if u can"

Ferromagnetic=if you mean powdered iron,Tesla prefer soft iron which so many splits like a laminated. Ferromagnetic Powdered Iron is the best choice for the annular ring.

The primary is wounded first on the ring, The secondary is wound above the primary. Primary is first layer, Secondary is second layer but what ever how you wound the primary and secondary anything will work.. The patent on Tesla Toroid/Transformer shows how to wind the primary and secondary direction. All coils=primary and secondary wound started with CW. 
The secondary can be wired series or parallel it depens upon your choice, for there is also 4 wound coils of secondary on top of the Primary.

Any commutator will work. but you should put in mind the change of polarity on each Primary.

First, Lets say the COIL A is left=positive and right=negative.

 Second:The next On is COIL B, Top=positive and Bottom=negative,
Third : The next ON Coil is COIL A in reverse polarity, Left=negative and Right=Positive.
Fourth: The next ON Coil is COIL B in reverse polarity, Top=negative and Bottom=positive.

Keep in mind that when the commutator is about to change to the next coil, There is a time that the BOTH COIL A and COIL B turns ON before it proceed to Another Quarter. Like the First Quarter and Second Quarter will ON Together before it proceed to Second Quarter.

First Quarter> First Quarter + Second Quarter> Second Quarter> Second Quarter+ Third Quarter> Third  Quarter>Third Quarter + Fouth Quarter> Fourth Quarter> Repeat from the beginning. ;D ;D

I think I have answered your question correctly. Good luck and Take care ::)

Meow ;D ;D

Offline ALVARO_CS

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #377 on: October 27, 2013, 09:47:47 AM »
Stupify
thanks for the detailed answer
I´ll have to diggest it slowly, and take my time.
I see that the polarity reversal is not possible with my present comm. setup.
will study how tesla did it. (I´m not skilled in electronics)

I understand the lenzless efect, but still do not catch where comes the excess of energy from a rotating mag field. I have got to see it with a working device, as my imagination has its limits !! :P

Alvaro

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #377 on: October 27, 2013, 09:47:47 AM »
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Offline Doug1

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #378 on: October 27, 2013, 03:13:51 PM »
Reversing the fields will never yield a self runner.Too much waste in fighting self induction, reluctance. Hannon you were on the right path in Reply #375.  Every stich of flux has to leave the induced from inducer in cyclic order. One is declining but in order for it to totally be evacuated the opposing has to push the remaining reminance completely back to where it came from. Any number of lines left behind will defeat the action by the same amount acting like a brake. The greatest amount of change in the induced in a stationary device can only be had by filling up with the magnetic flux then removing it completely. The only way to remove it totally is to have the opposite push out the remaining with another of the same which fortunately constitutes a 2nd pulse on the induced. If the window of activity is too small it will be a week effect and generate heat. The space for the induced will have to be adjusted to the effective working area of the inducers the measure of space where the fields can move back and forth based on the strengths of the inducers fields. Since you have decided to build by way of winging it. Your restricted in the physical size of your device because you placed the build of the cores before the desired output. Electromagnets are considerably stronger then perm magnets and the amount of voltage and current placed into an electromagnet may be far less then your imagining it should be.The amount of wire also makes a stronger magnet.
   You can also take into account some well documented facts about transformers. A trafo with no load other then to keep itself magnetized is 5 to 7 percent of the rated load output. For it to just sit there bouncing its field back and forth or round it;s core depending your point of view ,very little power is consumed. Until you place into the same magnetic path another coil that supplies a load with power. The same field is then threading both coils in a complete circle in a transformer ,the translation is one of a direct nature in a transformer.All the power must be supplied directly by the shared flux passing both coils. Avoid sharing and you avoid the drain on resources. Better still have two competing fields and the drain on resources is reduced with a greater output just like in the real world The only effect you need look for is the changing flux that resides in the induced. The ultimate load or work cares little how you changed the flux so long as it is changing. The more it changes the better so make the change a complete one. I believe the removal of the flux will be harder in the circular version.A inductive load may well be required to make it work but the news paper article mentioned he had a number of lights and a 20hp motor running in his home. The motor may have had some positive effect to counter the resistive load of the lights. I do not recall any mention to the motor actually being used to perform any task or work leading me to think it may have been an unloaded motor used to reinforce the timing in the induced circuit.

Offline Schiko

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #379 on: October 28, 2013, 07:12:40 PM »
@ Doug1
I agree with you!
Every explanation will end in simple voltage inverter optimized, not autorun device.  :(

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #379 on: October 28, 2013, 07:12:40 PM »
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Offline forest

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #380 on: October 28, 2013, 08:33:41 PM »
no, but you would not see the difference  :-[

Offline Schiko

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #381 on: October 28, 2013, 10:01:24 PM »
no, but you would not see the difference  :-[
Hi
Well, nowhere in the patent I read something about "more power output than in input" quite the contrary ...
So what do you say? You could see?

Part of Tesla patent 390.413 posted on previous page...

"In these systems, as I have described them, two independent conductors were employed for each of the independent circuits connecting the generator with the devices for converting the transmitted currents into mechanical energy or into electric currents of another character; but I have found that this is not  always necessary, and that the two or more circuits may have a single return path or wire in common, with a loss, if any, which is so extremely slight that it may be disregarded entirely."

Mas se alguém conseguir auto-execução eu pago a cerveja!!!
But if someone can autorun I pay the beer!!!  ;)

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #381 on: October 28, 2013, 10:01:24 PM »
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Offline stupify12

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #382 on: October 29, 2013, 01:15:40 AM »
Hi
Well, nowhere in the patent I read something about "more power output than in input" quite the contrary ...
So what do you say? You could see?

Part of Tesla patent 390.413 posted on previous page...

"In these systems, as I have described them, two independent conductors were employed for each of the independent circuits connecting the generator with the devices for converting the transmitted currents into mechanical energy or into electric currents of another character; but I have found that this is not  always necessary, and that the two or more circuits may have a single return path or wire in common, with a loss, if any, which is so extremely slight that it may be disregarded entirely."

Mas se alguém conseguir auto-execução eu pago a cerveja!!!
But if someone can autorun I pay the beer!!!  ;)

I think your one of the people that really dont understand easily the patent of Nikola Tesla. On that quote he was comparing the old Induction system to the New Nikola Tesla Induction System. Well you need more readings and review look for the Twice the revolution on the Induction System.

Offline Schiko

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #383 on: October 29, 2013, 04:29:33 AM »
I think your one of the people that really dont understand easily the patent of Nikola Tesla. On that quote he was comparing the old Induction system to the New Nikola Tesla Induction System. Well you need more readings and review look for the Twice the revolution on the Induction System.

I like to tease the "Forest" he is very critical and sagacious, it causes good discussions.

I deserved this comment, no problems, but honestly what I understood of the patent was following: is a device or more efficient method to coupling a generator or source to a load, just this.
But if you've discovered a way to optimize the device or method, I'm happy for you, and please teach us how to replicate your method or device with details.

Thanks, in advance.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #383 on: October 29, 2013, 04:29:33 AM »
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Offline forest

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #384 on: October 29, 2013, 11:13:15 AM »
sorry Schiko, I have give you answer and it is always in experiments. Because I have no way to show you results and prove my point that's all I can say. You would see no difference if you don't follow the experiment which can open your eyes

Offline Schiko

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #385 on: October 29, 2013, 05:22:31 PM »
sorry Schiko, I have give you answer and it is always in experiments. Because I have no way to show you results and prove my point that's all I can say. You would see no difference if you don't follow the experiment which can open your eyes

No problem my friend, I understand your point, but I want to make clear that I have done many experiments. Because of this sometimes I seem skeptic with some subjects, but it is only appearance.
Experiments is that some apparently very promising in theory but in practice fail gloriously.
My point is: apparently no one will take away power useful FE devices without using complicated electronics.
But I'm open eyes.   :o
I keep trying.   8)

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #385 on: October 29, 2013, 05:22:31 PM »
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Offline forest

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #386 on: October 29, 2013, 05:53:42 PM »
Schiko, my friend


I'm not sure if I understood your comment, but the process of complication of FE devices using electronics is known to me and I can assure you that the more complicated it is the less usable output it can produce.  ;) 
The best inventions was simple, even without using electronics or using old vacuum tubes for example.
Those were the most covered up and lost from public space because if you cannot complicate things up to the certain level you cannot stop ordinary people from "escaping from the system" when they start  building own resources system...

Offline ALVARO_CS

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #387 on: October 29, 2013, 07:48:25 PM »
 hello all
this discussion is very interesting, and I have got something to say too:
This thread is dedicated to Clemente Figuera patents, replicas and experiments/ and opinions on their principals, which is a very concrete field. I therefore do not understand why Tesla patents have to be extensively discussed everywhere.
I understand that these kind of devices are all related, and also that the Tesla concepts/devices are very captivating, but there are already hundreds of places dedicated to it.
Understand me well please, it is NOT that I am trying to censor anyone in anyway, it is just the tiredness to get Tesla in every soup.
I felt very often this Schiko statement about people that promotes things but doesn’t show any auto-run device which is the goal of many experimenters here, me included.
At least, some of them as Bajac show their attempts and their failures too, which is a constructive way of contribution.
Hope not having offended anyone. :-[
Regards
Alvaro

Offline Schiko

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #388 on: October 30, 2013, 06:59:42 AM »
@forest
My friend, if you permit, I will disagree with you.
Electronics of Power has evolved a lot today.
You've heard about "Cascade Multilevel Inverter"?
Imagine the machine of Mr. Figuera coupled in this technology, we could easily get to Megawatts.
If we can make the machine of Mr. Figuera do work, of course.
Let's be more pro-active if we leave aside the "conspiracy theory".
I agree that some things were purposely suppressed, I'm not EE, but I'm sure that many of these patents do not pass the examination in the departments of standardization.
Some have dangerous radiation, others are unstable and many do not deliver what they promise.
If the ancients were able, we also be able, but we must use techniques and modern knowledge and get the best possible result, not being locked into exotic ideas of the past.
This link is for you to think and modernize their thoughts.  <<Cascade Multilevel Inverter>>

Forgiveness, if any phrase be strange, because I do not write well in your language, but I think pass the message.  :-[

@ALVARO_CS
Thanks for your words!
Do you speak Portuguese?

Offline ALVARO_CS

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #389 on: October 30, 2013, 10:47:17 AM »
 @Doug:
Reread your post, and find very close meanings to my own thoughts.
Quote: “Reversing the fields will never yield a self runner”- is something I have suspected but only may stand it as an intuitive feeling, not rational nor proven fact.
Quote: “Avoid sharing and you avoid the drain on resources. Better still have two competing fields and the drain on resources is reduced with a greater output “ -IMO here is the function for the air gap
In general (talking about the 1908 patent),your description of the mag fields remanence in the inductors, and the way both push one to the other is what I see.
I have posted here several times that the voltage (wave) never falls under 0V, and so never occurs  
a polarity reversal, but there is a kind of ping pong game between the two inductors.(but no one  here has commented in agreement or dissent  :-X )
Do not know why the patent refers  to the inductors as “electromagnets”, and the induced as “induced coils”, could it be that the induced is just an air core coil ? :o :o

 

 
@Schiko:
Very interesting the link about cascade multilevel inverter, I read  some articles from it. Unfortunately I am stuck with this concept of no polarity reversal. ;D
Unfortunately also I do not speak Portuguese, only Spanish, French and English, but I can read  and understand  it if slowly spoken.
Will be glad to have this beer you offered as soon I get my autorun device !!! ;D ;D ;D
muito obrigado pelo convite ;)

 

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