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Author Topic: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE  (Read 2231106 times)

Doug1

• Hero Member
• Posts: 763
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #750 on: February 23, 2014, 09:48:09 PM »

Position A = If you slid the coil between the north and south magnets you would not cut any more or less lines of force. If you strengthened the or weakened the magnets the coil would not cut any more or less lines of force.The lines still thread through the coil just stronger or weaker.Best you could get is a piss poor transformer. The coil when rotated changes the amount of flux it cuts and the number of lines.Till it reaches position C and is now facing the other way and continues to turn and the effect is reversed. A and C are simply a way to get rotation to reach B and D. Get rid of A and C.
Treat the N and S magnets as the motor. If you face the magnets N,N or S,S you have obviated another rotation.That is the magnets do not have to swap poles N,S/S,N because that takes more work.The point where the two fields meet will have a shear line seperating them like two window fans blowing at each other.The air will circulate around the fan like discrete bubbles circling each fan. The center point of collision of the air has two opposite direction of flow. If your hand is more close to one fan it feels the air flow and direction from that fan and if closer to other it feels the opposite. If the fans are alternately slowed down and sped up the collision/wall will move side to side. There will exist a positive pressure between the two fans all the time.
N-S< (induced) >S-N. The induced is AC the poles in the induced alternate. The induced is not consuming of the inducers. The only consumption is the initial power used to establish the fields in the inducer magnets. After they start shifting they sustain themselves the same way any ordinary generator does with movement,you do not input current into a generator from a outside source while using a gas engine as a prime mover to generate electric do you? You just pull the cord start the engine and poof out comes the juice. Long as there is rotation or movement it will expand to it's effective limit and pour out the good stuff till you do something stupid or neglectful to stop it.The real question,the right question is how does a generator work in the first place.Because it does in fact get more magnetic field out then it started with even though no one added any current or greater field strength from an outside source. If something is not true today then it was not true yesterday and wont be true tomorrow.

Doug1

• Hero Member
• Posts: 763
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #751 on: February 23, 2014, 10:20:18 PM »
Sorry about that image garbage at the top of the post.It's not letting me in to edit it out.
I will keep trying.

gyulasun

• Hero Member
• Posts: 4119
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #752 on: February 23, 2014, 10:38:48 PM »
Sorry about that image garbage at the top of the post.It's not letting me in to edit it out.
I will keep trying.

Hi Doug,

You try to click on the Modify icon in the upper right hand side of your above post, right?  If it does not work, click on the Report to moderator or write a personal message to hartiberlin perhaps.

Gyula

EDIT  you have just solved it, ok.

SolarLab

• Hero Member
• Posts: 965
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #753 on: February 24, 2014, 04:02:02 PM »
Possibly useful related background information... since some of you fellows may not be familiar with:

He does investigate, amongst other things, Back EMF suppression in a resonance coil using a single Primary with two Secondary windings - but NOT two Primaries with a single Secondary. Somewhat enlightening in any case!

NoMoreSlave

• Newbie
• Posts: 41
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #754 on: February 24, 2014, 05:25:31 PM »
hi dieter,

Quote
Just out of curiosity and since I have an old, 2phase 3 motors steppermotor control card (smc 800)  here, did anyone in here actually manage to get this thing working?

I did not got to work, I m testing it with a 12 VDC nut it is rectified, and i got a sine wave in the output even if ther is no rotation of the commutator, so i have to buy a bettery to see how the signal looks like with a pure DC input...

Beste regards,
NMS

NoMoreSlave

• Newbie
• Posts: 41
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #755 on: February 24, 2014, 05:39:09 PM »
hi Doug1,
Quote
Position A = If you slid the coil between the north and south magnets you would not cut any more or less lines of force. If you strengthened the or weakened the magnets the coil would not cut any more or less lines of force.The lines still thread through the coil just stronger or weaker.Best you could get is a piss poor transformer. The coil when rotated changes the amount of flux it cuts and the number of lines.Till it reaches position C and is now facing the other way and continues to turn and the effect is reversed. A and C are simply a way to get rotation to reach B and D. Get rid of A and C.
Treat the N and S magnets as the motor. If you face the magnets N,N or S,S you have obviated another rotation.That is the magnets do not have to swap poles N,S/S,N because that takes more work.The point where the two fields meet will have a shear line seperating them like two window fans blowing at each other.The air will circulate around the fan like discrete bubbles circling each fan. The center point of collision of the air has two opposite direction of flow. If your hand is more close to one fan it feels the air flow and direction from that fan and if closer to other it feels the opposite. If the fans are alternately slowed down and sped up the collision/wall will move side to side. There will exist a positive pressure between the two fans all the time.
N-S< (induced) >S-N. The induced is AC the poles in the induced alternate. The induced is not consuming of the inducers. The only consumption is the initial power used to establish the fields in the inducer magnets. After they start shifting they sustain themselves the same way any ordinary generator does with movement,you do not input current into a generator from a outside source while using a gas engine as a prime mover to generate electric do you? You just pull the cord start the engine and poof out comes the juice. Long as there is rotation or movement it will expand to it's effective limit and pour out the good stuff till you do something stupid or neglectful to stop it.The real question,the right question is how does a generator work in the first place.Because it does in fact get more magnetic field out then it started with even though no one added any current or greater field strength from an outside source. If something is not true today then it was not true yesterday and wont be true tomorrow.

That is what I was trying to show here, but it seems that we are here just to copy schematics and not trying to understand the effect.
Figuera started by obvserving the existing generatos, then he made a solid state version, evryone can do the same, JUST by LOOKING TO THE MOVEMENT in a slow motion:
reduce the numbers of the coils just to 3 , because they are the pattern-base for evry rotating generator, or alternator or dynamos....

with 2 primary coils in complimentry exitation mode, the induced current is made by BOTHE magnetic fileds (N & S): I_total = I_n + I_s (abstract formula), see the sign of the current!

I have to leave this forum for now, i must continue with muy experiments (hard to find material in this small town    )

@ ALL : Good luck

Best regards,
NMS

marathonman

• Hero Member
• Posts: 860
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #756 on: February 24, 2014, 10:34:13 PM »
some times i have to visualize some things to get it (sorry for Pics). im better with moving parts than abstract. i would like to comment on the SN/ Y \SN in line coils and cores. when SN coil is energized the flux influences Y coil. when Y coil Current begins to flow it reverses to counter balance SN'S magnetic flux influences so they are of same polarity opposing one another but because you have SN in line opposite end it to will oppose Y coil flux as they are same polarity because current has to flow at all times in order not to get BEMF. SN{NS}SN this my friend will end up with you searching for pee-wee herman's Bicycle on a Sunday mourning .......UNLESS you bring opposite coil down to almost zero before cut off ??    then it is possible to loose the magnetic rotation that was spoken of  earlier.
Food for thought ...might want to use this program Dip Trace free, my boards turned out great.

Farmhand

• Hero Member
• Posts: 1583
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #757 on: February 24, 2014, 11:55:30 PM »
I think in order to visualize the function of the setup to make a wave drawing we need to imagine the brush rotating around the inside (or outside) of the cylinder and the brush making contact with at least two of the cylinder contacts at any one time. The brush making contact with two cylinder contacts at any one time should minimize sparking. I'm thinging the brush rotates around the inside of the cylinder similar to an old automobile distributer, but the brush is a contact brush, it could go around the outside or inside.

The brush only has one wire attached to it, but the cylinder has many, it is definitely the brush that rotates around the cylinder. So from this knowledge we should be able to ascertain the current through the coils at any given stage of rotation. And from that we can get a wave drawing for each coil and the phase as compared to each other.

..

P.S. Sorry bout the coffee stain, I made two copies and cut the cylinder out of one so I could spin it on the second drawing. The cylinder doesn't spin but it has the same effect if we look at the current through the brush.

..

dieter

• Hero Member
• Posts: 938
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #758 on: February 25, 2014, 04:02:41 AM »
Surprising that after 50 pages the device is still interpreted so vaguely.

IMHO the cylinder does rotate, but there is the 2nd half of stator contacts missing on the drawing, and each wire on the cylinder has 2 brushes. So this way it's really simple to create two sinoids, independently. Anyway, we know the goal: to get two sinoids that are overlapping, actually not sinoids but triangle sawtheeths! Tho, the exact shape may not be critical.
You could take mains grid ac (transformed to 24vac for small scale test), "fold up" the negative part of the wave by reversing the poles (after extracting it with 2 diodes), additionally do this a second time, but 90deg out of phase using a cap. This would give you two phases with constant pulses, overlapping by half of their pulsewidth. Actually exactly what is described in the patent, except that they are sinus and not triangle. Why figuera didn't do it that way? Most likely there was no mains grid at that time on canary islands.

From the initial patent we also realize that the main goal is to create an alternating magnetfield in the induced coils core. The idea is, that moving a magnet along a coil requires mechanical work that varies in electrical efficiency, depending on the  distance of the magnet, which chanches repeatedly. By inducing the magnet with stationary coils, this mechanical work is not neccessary.

It should be mentioned that in a good generator the only mechanical work is the lotentz force, the rotor should spin with low resistance when no load is connected.

Anyway, this brings up the question: if there is no motion, is there also no lotentz force to fight?? Now that would be interesting. But then again, why are ordinary transformers not OU, they are doing basicly the same, inducing over a core a secondary coil.

Seems like everybody in here has a diffrent view of the device. Like the image of the window generator somebody posted. I yet have to see a clear diagram of the coils. Seems also, the topic starter has left the building, did he?

The only thing that is really interesting, is the convincing story about figuera.

dieter

• Hero Member
• Posts: 938
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #759 on: February 25, 2014, 12:55:32 PM »
The many views and opinions, how this works were rather confusing. Nevertheless I was thinking about it and it seems to me, in simple terms, it works like this:

Two strong, opposing fields on the same core with eddy suppression, between them a gap. Here's the bloch wall, where the two Ns os Ss' hit and get radially compressed.

In the gap (Probably the 3 coils share a single ferrite core) there's a pancake coil. It is capable of picking up the radially compressed bloch wall field. While the two inductors don't consume energy as long as they have the same strength, no matter how strong they are (turning on not in calculation and assuming no inductive loads) , they are capable of moving the bloch wall a few mm left and right, just by variing their voltage slightly in alternation. As soon as the bloch wall is left to the pancake, the pancake sees himself on the north pole of a strong magnet, when the blochwall then goes a few mm to the right, the pancake is south to the magnet. And here's the point: It's got a full ac cycle at the voltage of the strong opposing magnets that are consuming only the variation of the bloch wall.

Obviously, the bloch wall is not affected by the lorentz force, at least this would explain the source of energy.

So if I get it right, it should be very simple to build a test device.  It may even be interesting to simply play with two neodyms and a pancake coil.

Please note, I used the term "bloch wall", I mean the "wall" between two opposing magnets, like n vs n.

marathonman

• Hero Member
• Posts: 860
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #760 on: February 25, 2014, 03:36:24 PM »
I agree. what if Mr Figueras drew his invention for simplicity like most patents do. instead of winding the coils on separate cores for visualization purposes, what if it was wound on one core alternating NS Y SN winding layers.( NS Y SN Y NS Y SN ect.) then tying the out puts together and varying the current to NS SN coil layers. this would cause the required magnetic rotation needed for proper AC output in the Y coil Please watch this Video to visualize what i am talking about. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awrUxv7B-a8
please ignore the subject and rotor and pay attention to the rotating magnetic flux fields. this is what is taking place in Figueras invention and i am darn near convinced i am right on this one....please advise ! .........this would cause the magnetic rotation in the wires and the iron core will significantly magnify this event. he then series and or paralleled the outputs to required voltages and Ampers. with the NS Y SN coils being so close in proximity and magnetically coupled together the Lorentz effect would be eliminated as the Lorentz effect is only applicable to same like charges ie..NN or SS...++ or --.   yes it could be possible for the Y coil to be sanwiched in between to pick up bloch wall events. things that make you go Hmmmmmm.

dieter

• Hero Member
• Posts: 938
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #761 on: February 25, 2014, 05:08:49 PM »
Thanks, I double that hmmmm. Ive made a diagram to illlustrate how dramaticly  and effectively field lines can be compressed by the bloch wall. The lorentz force will act on the pancake, so it must me fixed well. Iron core may cause eddy current losses, so I said ferrite. A magnet field monitor foil from wondermagnets.com makes finding the bloch wall easy.

Also, permanent magnets probably may be used to setup the basic bloch wall, and only an additional emagnetfield is applied to do the oscillation.

NRamaswami

• Sr. Member
• Posts: 490
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #762 on: February 25, 2014, 07:44:37 PM »
Dear All:

I have a doubt. It is a basic and fundamental theoretical doubt. Could any one of the friends here clarify on this point please. I would be very obliged.

Now I have a doubt.

The induced emf in secondary called counter emf or voltage is based on the following factors as I know.

1. Number of turns of the secondary.
2. Rate of change of mangetic flux or frequency
3. Length vs Diameter ratio
4. Core material used as it determines magnetic permeability.

There is another variable present here. Magnetic Field Strength.

Now The magnetic field strength is based on the Number of turns multiplied by the amperage applied. If we increase one or both of them the intensity of the magnetic field or the magnetic field strength would increase.

My doubt is very specific..

What is the effect of the intensity of the magnetic field or what is the effect of increasing the amperage on the solenoid..Would it increase the induced emf or would it reduce the emf.

Please consider that in both the situations the applied current is either AC or pulsed DC. As is known the impedance of the wire carrying current is reduced when the current is pulsed DC.

So how would the intensity of the magnetic field strength would affect the induced emf in both these cases. I checked all material online and am unable to find answers. Could you please answer this please? I would be obliged.

Ramaswami

marathonman

• Hero Member
• Posts: 860
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #763 on: February 25, 2014, 08:10:21 PM »
Good Point i'll have to get back to you on that one, but i do know that if the magnetic field is increased ( i.e Currant or Ampur turns) to much it has a decreasing effect in relation to the efield which we don't want to happen. the rest i will get back. i have a drawing that could help....very bad attempt at paint though. Dieter i though the bloch wall is only relevant to North and South poles.

hanon

• Hero Member
• Posts: 616
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #764 on: February 25, 2014, 10:20:39 PM »
Hi Ramaswami,

In a solenoid the magnetic field B  maybe calculated from B = nu·N·I/Length . Therefore the intensity and the turns determine the final magnetic field.

As Faraday Law  the induce emf depends on the rate of change of the magnetic field, dB/dt: it is the sames going form 100 to 80 than going from 30 to 10, because in both case the variation is 20 units.