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Author Topic: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE  (Read 1639862 times)

Offline forest

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #675 on: February 17, 2014, 08:33:03 AM »
just guessing here ...but maybe it would be possible to use electric kettle resistive heating elements ( for example from scrap yard )  in series as a resistive divider to lower voltage to 220V. It doesn't need to work for a long time just enough to connect the bank of incandescent bulbs to have clear evidence of output power. I think a few seconds is enough. What do you think ? Surely caution is required , but all that setup is cheap and can be put in some heat resistance metal box grounded and insulated from outside, and operated from distance by a switch.

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Offline NRamaswami

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #676 on: February 17, 2014, 09:03:13 AM »
Hi All:

Ammeters are always connected in series. Patrick J Kelly my mentor has advocated low voltage and low amperage to give to devices and those devices did not work. For they were huge the and input voltage and amperage was less to make any effect at low frequency.

We have connected ammeters and voltmeters properly. But NewtonII could be correct in his statements for we had many Ammeters burn out and we avoided that problem by having fuzes to the primary input to control the current and I can tell you we have probably lost about 100 fuses. So what Newton tells me makes sense.

Even wikipedia says that Lenz law does not apply to charges that are opposite to each other is not included in the textbooks.

Actually Tinselkoala appears to be a very knowledgeable person with a lot of hands on experience. He initially rejected the idea that the inductor itself would not transmit the electricity to the primary and the current stops dead in the electromagnet without going to the load lamps but then very quickly figured it out why it does that and gave a very cogent  and convincing explanation that the resistance of the iron rods becomes very high and the magnetism would be very high and electricity may not show at all in the lamps..He has also shown the Tesla coil to claim that it has an input of 75 watts and an output of 30000 watts. Whether that 30000 watts is useable energy or not he has not answered. But I believe that it is useable energy. How we can use that.. Let me try to answer that..

What I have seen at 50 Hz ( I repeat the frequency for it is very important and not understood in Electricity) current is, as we give higher voltage the electromagnet performs well to produce output in the secondary. If we give 440 volts and 4 amps in the primary, it would then produce a very significantly higher voltage in the step up transformer set up of Figuera but because the stepped up voltage would also increase the amperage in the device, the output amperage would also be higher..

Now the other friend has just pointed out that the other designs all have a steep spike and then a steep dive things in other devices of this type. This is essentially done to increase the frequency. the rotary device has 16 points for making sparks and sparks turn the frequency in to very high frequency.

I can show two patents on the importance of frequency. A common sense approach.  I can say that if we use a bicycle dynamo if we petal faster the bulb would glow brighter. From practical experience I'm making this statement.

When we petal the cycle faster, the dynamo magnet rotates very fast and it increases the rate of rotation or increases the rate of change of magnetic flux and therefore the induced emf being directly proportional to the rate of change of magnetic flux increases. When the induced emf increases the output increases. Increasing the rate of change of magnetic flux is increasing the frequency. Nothing more. Nothing less. So higher the frequency of the input current, greater would be the output. The Tesla coil that produces 30000 watts output at 75 watts probably uses Radio frequencies. There is no magic to that. 

However iron core would heat up so much at high frquencies and it is not practical to have an iron core based transformers at high frquencies. There is a common notion that iron would not respond to frequencies above 500 cycles or 1000 cycles. But I have taken information from a Prof who teaches Metallurgy that iron would respond at high frequencies to generate magnetism but would heat up enromously.

Now the Tesla coil actually agitates the atmosphere and has an earth connection. We have all seen the 1901 patent of Tesla on Radiant Energy Apparatus. As simple as it sounds, if you give high voltage high frequency current to the plate on the top and then loop the wire down, put the current through a series of capacitors immersed in salt water and then through the other end connect it to the earth again using a lot of coils for the wire. This is nothing but tesla coil in the reverse.

Now the current can be taken both from the capacitors as DC and from the earth connection. The output would be far higher than the input.

Now you check US8004250 Pyramid Electric Generator where a Pyramid configuration declared as an essential ingredient of this set up. There you have a USPTO patent for a device which claims 100 times the output as the input and uses the same principles as above by giving high voltage. It gives a low inital voltage but then steps it up to high voltage using a step up Tesla coil to the capacitor and then gives it to the Tesla antenna plate. It takes the output from near the ground point.

If you look at the patent of Don Smith which was rejected which projected that capacitors in series loaded on a high voltage high frequency rod without the opposing primary, it is also based on the same above principles. That opposite primary is a missing thing in the  patent of Don Smith.

All these things are common. Figuera's original device also has the spark plugs in the form of the rotary device and in the form of the resistor array combination for steep hike and steep dive for frequency increase of the interrupted dc current.

It is very difficult to perform that particular rotary device. It probably required a very custom design and custom built to his specifications but essentially that is the real purpose of the device. That is where many of us have failed. I have also tried to replicate exactly as he did and then failed and then I realized that the device was manufactured in Pre world war I Germany which was known for its precision work and the manufacturer wanted to know why Figuera wanted this device and Figuera would not let them take a look at his set up.. This is there all in the Newspapers. So a very competent manufacturer custom built this rotary device for Figuera to his specifications and this is why the device worked. Pre World War Germany was an industrial power known for its perfection in Engineering to this day..So we have all failed in replicating the rotary device..

Having understood the purpose of the rotary device, I made it a simple Ac mains drive device. As we realized that if we give mains voltage, it takes a lot of amps automatically to drive high output in the set up.

There is a problem here. The Inductor -capacitor theory states that as the Electric field collapses the magnetic field increases and as the magnetic field collapses the electric field increases. In other words you need to have a weak magnet, that is highly vibrating to get high output in secondary and that is achieved at low frequencies by using high voltage. If you use high voltage and high frequencies, the input current would drop for the output amps would increase if you increase the input frequency..But such devices would not produce useable electricity unless the set up of Radiant energy appratus of Tesla is used. The capacitor converts this to DC and this can be charged to battery and then the battery can use an inverter to give out useable electricity. I think Tesla also used high power capacitors immersed in salt water or solvents but that is now considered a lost science. That lost science is a key to mastering energy production.

The key here is that either you must increase the voltage:Amperage ratio at fixed frequency. (That is dangerous at low frequency of the mains. But that low frequency is needed as majority of the machinaries are made up of steel and only then it is useable.) or you must increase the frequency to increase the output. Increasing the frequency is impractical for we have devices made up of iron and other metals which may heat up by using electricity at high frequency.

Now you check the claims of Figuera that where is the electricity coming from? It comes from the interactions of the atmosphere and the magnetic field of the earth..It makes sense. I'm theorizing and certainly I have not carried out these experiments but you can see you tube videos of copper and aluminium plate capacitors which are round shaped and which are separated by a rubber strip and then immersed in salt water generating electricity to run a computer fan.

Tineselkoala has not answered my question whether the energy of his 30000 watts output and 75 watts input  can be used at all and the answer is yes it can be used and it can be done only through the process of electrostatics and not magnetics. The key for that is the Teslas patent on method of using Radiant Energy apparatus.  But he can very well say that I'm saying all this as theory and he is perfectly correct in that for I have not done the experiments but given this information a lot of people can do a lot of things now..Again I guess so..You can very well say these are wild guesses and not experimental observations and you are perfectly correct in that..I have not validated any one of these things..

Offline Marsing

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #677 on: February 17, 2014, 11:12:28 AM »
Hi All:

Ammeters are always connected in series. Patrick J Kelly my mentor has advocated low voltage and low amperage to give to devices and those devices did not work. For they were huge the and input voltage and amperage was less to make any effect at low frequency.

We have connected ammeters and voltmeters properly. But NewtonII could be correct in his statements for we had many Ammeters burn out and we avoided that problem by having fuzes to the primary input to control the current and I can tell you we have probably lost about 100 fuses. So what Newton tells me makes sense.

Even wikipedia says that Lenz law does not apply to charges that are opposite to each other is not included in the textbooks.

...........


hi.. NRamaswami

thanks for sharing here.

last time you said,  you  measured without load,
my question is.
 
- did you connect both terminal of analog ampmeter when you measure the amperage to output?
- did you measure amperage and voltage at once or separately?
 
Please born in mind, everyone only want to know how you make it,
at least me, i can not be patient.    :) 
short answer will be very appreciated.   

About TK, it was a joke, example, you can find  build-up amplifier in electronics store, where output will be labeled 3000 watts , input  only consume 100 - 200 watts.
but, you can see after 3000 watts there is a big letter "PMPO" .
newton II or someone else have  explanation about this. i forget  the reply number.

thanks again.   

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #677 on: February 17, 2014, 11:12:28 AM »
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Offline NRamaswami

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #678 on: February 17, 2014, 01:29:26 PM »
Hi:

The input is like this..

Input wire - Ammeter one terminal 1 - Ammeter other terminal - Input wire to load Phase or mains or live wire..

Ammeter one Terminal 1 above - Voltmeter terminal 1 - voltmeter terminal 2 - Neutral wire.

In other words we connected the ammeter in series and voltmeter in parallel. We had a trained electrician Narayanan who passed away due to illness.

You can go here to see how we connect the Ammeter and voltmeter and all your doubts would be over..

http://www.tmptens.com/agricultural-water-turbine/

There are five videos and the meters set up is clear there. It is a water turbine for agricultural pumpsets. The bespectacled man who is lean and who wears a green shirt is Narayanan..He is no more now..




Offline Newton II

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #679 on: February 17, 2014, 02:10:19 PM »

 ... we had many Ammeters burn out and we avoided that problem by having fuzes to the primary input to control the current and I can tell you we have probably lost about 100 fuses.



Those are the clear indications that you are drawing more current from input mains.  With this method you can never say whether your output power is more than input power because megawatts of power will be available in power supply mains.   We cannot rely on measurements due to various reasons.

The best way to verify your device would be :


1) Get one motor- alternator set having standard power output

2) Start the motor by connecting it to lab power supply

3) Take the alternator output and connect it to your figuira device.

4) If figuira device output is 630 Volts,  reduce it to motor voltage using a stepdown transformer.

5) Now connect the output power from your device to motor in synchronisation with existing power supply.

6) Finally disconnet the input from lab power supply.

If output power of your device is more than the input,   the entire setup now should run on its own without taking any power input from any external source.   So, you have a ever running overunity device. (setup)

Wish you best of luck.


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #679 on: February 17, 2014, 02:10:19 PM »
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Offline RandyFL

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #680 on: February 17, 2014, 02:12:51 PM »
Hello All

First time posting here...
Will read the previous posts

All the Best
Randy

Offline gyulasun

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #681 on: February 17, 2014, 02:13:20 PM »
hi..  all

NRamaswami stated some where ( i forgot ) that he was helped by some electrical engineer,
so pre-assumed that there was no wrong measurement, maybe only miss communication.
 
however, any sketch/drawing "how to use ampmeter and voltmeter" from gyulasun or others should be good to posted, i agree with what you said gyulasun about measurement. i have ever seen from webpage someone measure amperage by connecting ampmeter to output directly.

i guess, only with sketch/drawing will reduce miss communication, as Alvaro_CS (thanks for drawing) who have posted "drawing" help us to look it as start point. those all will save much time from reading and arguing everything. and also, English is not my daily language, sorry for that.

...

Hi Marsing,

I edited Alvaro's schematic and included input and output voltage and current meters. 

Gyula

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #681 on: February 17, 2014, 02:13:20 PM »
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Offline NRamaswami

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #682 on: February 17, 2014, 02:26:45 PM »
Forest:

I have already tested the output in a safe way..I have indicated that the output voltage under such conditions is reduced to 240 volts and 250 volts. That is a very inefficient set up but a safe set up. I have already indicated that as the voltage keeps increasing the wattage starts dramatically shooting up beyond 240 volts. that increase would continue at a higher rate at 630 volts.

I cannot take your suggestion to test like that. I can safely say put up about 80 x200 watts lamps in series and lit them all together and see what is the voltage. If one of the fuses out all of them would not work. If we put all of them in parallel we need to device an expensive board.

But that is a risk we can safely take. But rather than all that I would prefer to do a step down transformer and check the output of the step down one in a safe way. Output even in step down method would not diminish in this configuration. Amps would go up and voltage would come down. I will try a self sustaining replication and explain as to how all hav to be wound and then explain how and why it happens. As I understand it which may well be incorrect.


Offline gyulasun

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #683 on: February 17, 2014, 02:45:22 PM »
Hi Gyula:

You see the picture of the Ammeter at the bottom. Up to 5 amps I would not know what is the amperage. I have better ones than this but they are little more costly. I can order what is needed over the phone.
....

Hi NRamaswami,

Yes, you are correct that up to 5 Ampers the meter (I gave the link to) has no scale to see how many Amps flow below 5A but this is a 30A moving iron type ammeter, this is why it has a small nonlinearity in its scale.  There are such meters with 5A full deflection or 3A full deflection  but I know that we all do not like to use so many meters.  The problem is that moving iron or moving coil  analog meters  usually are not so precise in the first 20-30% of their full scale.     
Perhaps you have a normal digital hand held AC/DC multimeter with true RMS measurement feature for AC, these have a 10 or even 20A current measuring range which can serve nicely below 5A currents once you most likely have a sinusoid 50 HZ AC output. 

When using bulbs for the load, they have a cold resistance which is much much lower value than the hot resistance, this is a reason why the input or the output current is very high at the switch-on moment.   A solution could be to use 5 to 10 bulbs of identical wattage each in series and after the switch-on moments when these bulbs work with say half brightness you could short circuit some of them (with a switch) to increase the load on the output i.e. let 3 or 4 bulbs work from the 600-700V output.

Gyula

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #683 on: February 17, 2014, 02:45:22 PM »
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Offline NRamaswami

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #684 on: February 17, 2014, 02:53:29 PM »
Newton II:

All that is going to cost a lot of money and I do not have it here now..We have an economic problem and nearly 300 clients are not paying my bills and slowing down payment.. All are honest to the core people and all are having problem..So I can not invest money in this set up.

I will do a simple wires only set up. Give it a one shot current for a second.. Then remove it. If the device continues to produce electricity afteer the source power is removed, then you have a self sustaining generator..That is fairly simple to do than the expensive method you describe. The output would be lower but it would continuously come. As a proof of concept device. If that is fine, then I can do that. What output would come, I do not know now but I'm not really bothered about it either. Any continuous output should satisfy all including me.
Is that ok..give me four or five days..

But please do test at increased voltage to the device. You would know for yourself. However remember the fact. Magnets act as focussing point for getting electricity from the atmosphere. So the larger the magnetic core, whether it remains stagnant or rotating the larger would be the output. I have already explained in my earlier long post what is the role of the frequency and voltage in producing output as I understand it now..Let me build a small device and then let us see.


Offline Doug1

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #685 on: February 17, 2014, 03:29:34 PM »
NRamaswami Properly wound coil does not need capacitors.

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #685 on: February 17, 2014, 03:29:34 PM »
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Offline Newton II

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #686 on: February 17, 2014, 03:35:06 PM »

I will do a simple wires only set up. Give it a one shot current for a second.. Then remove it. If the device continues to produce electricity afteer the source power is removed, then you have a self sustaining generator..That is fairly simple to do than the expensive method you describe. The output would be lower but it would continuously come. As a proof of concept device. If that is fine, then I can do that. What output would come, I do not know now but I'm not really bothered about it either. Any continuous output should satisfy all including me.
Is that ok..give me four or five days..


That would be fine.  No need for any time limit.  Take your own time and give us the feedback.   But how will you inject 'one shot current for a second'  in a short circuit ? 

To make the device self sustaining, you have to connect output terminals from secondary to the input terminals of primary.   When you inject ' one shot current' ,  this current will pass through both primary and secondary wires but for your device to work,  you have to see that ' one shot current'  passes only through primary wire.   How will you achieve it ?

Offline NRamaswami

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #687 on: February 17, 2014, 03:51:21 PM »
Bride rectifier at feedback would make the current not to flow back to the feedback unit. It becomes pulsed DC then. Pulsed DC is less efficient then AC but since it is feedback, it is ok. Otherwise we need to use the method of Amplidyne patents where the initial current is fixed and the feedback is given as 1 volt to add as pulsed DC feedback. For each watt of feedback, amplidyne patents claim an increase of 20000 watts of output increase in secondary.

Offline Newton II

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #688 on: February 17, 2014, 04:31:41 PM »
Pulsed DC is not same as AC.  When you use pulsed DC the idea of transformer itself will be lost. This device with primary and secondary is a transformer and your current has to be AC only. Better consult an electrical engineer for solution.

Good luck

Offline NRamaswami

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #689 on: February 17, 2014, 04:35:03 PM »
Newton II:'

Your question itself is wrong. Primary and secondary currents go in the opposite directions and phases and would not merge. Feedback units is a different thing. Feedback must be in phase with primary input so whether the current goes in both directions intially really irrelevant. It is the lack of information on feedback unit that keeps all this things a mysterious device.

 

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