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Author Topic: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY  (Read 8441575 times)

Offline itsu

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12345 on: February 21, 2016, 02:24:55 PM »
Look, your scope has 5 channels now!
The 5th channel shows the current flowing through the Drain connected to the OPPOSITE winding.

Anyway, take a look at the currents in the "gray zone".  The TVS current rises rapidly and it decreases slowly (over ~2μs) while the negative drain current is increasing. (negative increase looks like falling visually)

This is an illustration of unusual current sharing between the TVS diode and the MOSFET body diode.  It is unusual because the forward voltage drop of the body diode is 1.2V but the clamping voltage of the TVS diode is 54V, so the diode with the lower voltage drop should bear the majority of the current, but that is not what happens in the "gray zone".

Could the body diode be that slow?

Do you have a 100V Schottky diode that you can put in parallel with the opposite MOSFET's body diode, just to see how much speedup we can get by helping the body diode?


Bat 46 diode across the other MOSFET drain / source (anode to source, cathode to drain):

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12345 on: February 21, 2016, 02:24:55 PM »

Offline verpies

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12346 on: February 21, 2016, 03:54:20 PM »
But for my understanding, your grey area is not really our problem, the problem is the light blue area where the MOSFET is already on while its gate is off.
In a way because the blue area begins with the gray area...in the opposite primary winding half (and the other MOSFET).

Do i understand correctly that the fact that yellow MOSFET is on (light blue area) is caused by the grey area effect caused by the other MOSFET?
Yes.

The confusion is caused by lack of TL494 output designators.  Lets call them Channel A and Channel B for the future.

Offline verpies

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12347 on: February 21, 2016, 04:02:30 PM »
First screenshot is zoomed in on the gray area.  I fail to see  the body diode's forward voltage -1.2V there.
Because you should zoom in vertically (even up to the point of clipping) in the area that I have marked in a white ellipse.
The forward voltage drop of the body-diode (VF) can be different.  The Datasheet states -1.3V max, so it could be e.g. -0.8V

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12347 on: February 21, 2016, 04:02:30 PM »
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Offline itsu

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12348 on: February 21, 2016, 04:21:06 PM »

Right,.....    -1.2V it is,   amazing!    (this is with the Bat46 still in on the other MOSFET).


Offline verpies

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12349 on: February 21, 2016, 07:57:34 PM »
Right,.....    -1.2V it is,   amazing!    (this is with the Bat46 still in on the other MOSFET).
OK so putting it all together:

Ch0: Voltage across the disconnected primary half (Winding B)
Ch1: Voltage between Source & Drain connected to Winding A
Ch2: Gate voltage of the MOSFET driving Winding A
Ch3: Gate voltage of the MOSFET driving Winding B
Ch4: Current through the TVS diode connected to Winding A, when Winding B is disconnected.
Ch5: Current through the TVS diode connected to Winding A, when Winding B is connected.
Ch6: Current through the MOSFET driving Winding B, when that winding is connected.

But for my understanding, your grey area is not really our problem, the problem is the light blue area where the MOSFET is already on while its gate is off.
Let's revisit this issue

Why do you think that the MOSFET is ON?
Let me guess - You probably think that it is ON because the voltage on its Drain is LOW.
...but Drain voltage is not a good indicator whether the MOSFET is ON !
The proper indicator is the current flowing through the Drain of this MOSFET.  Notice that this current is ZERO in the blue area!

Do i understand correctly that the fact that yellow MOSFET is on (light blue area) is caused by the grey area effect caused by the other MOSFET?
That question should be rephrased:
"Do I understand correctly, that the fact that yellow Drain voltage is LOW (light blue area) is caused by the grey area effect caused by the other MOSFET?"

The answer to that rephrased question is: "YES"

I anticipate the next question:
If the MOSFET B is not responsible for driving the voltage on its drain LOW, then what is?"

The answer to the anticipated question is:
"The 1:1 autotransformer effect transforming the positive "flyback" voltage spike on Winding A into a negative voltage spike on Winding B.  That negative voltage drives the Drain of the B MOSFET  LOW"

Note that, at the beginning of the gray zone, there is a lot of magnetic flux stored in the core and the leakage inductance.
When MOSFET A turns OFF, the MOSFET B has already been OFF for a long time.  Thus there is no path for any current to maintain that flux in the core, and the inductance attempts to prevent the change of flux.
The inductance attempts to maintain the flux and the current generating that flux, by finding ANY path for the current to continue to flow.  Thus the inductor increases the voltage on the Drain of MOSFET A until something breaks down and allows the current to continue.  Fortunately there is a TVS diode there to break down at +70V.  If the TVS weren't there, then the MOSFET's A Drain/Source junction would break down...or air would spark.
Anyway, once the TVS diode starts conducting, the current continues flowing through Winding A but it encounters a lot of resistance to this flow because this TVS diode has a 70V voltage drop (so a 1A current would dissipate 70W in it !). Such dissipation represents a huge energy loss and as a consequence the current and magnetic flux in the core decrease rapidly.

The rapidly decreasing flux in the core causes a negative voltage to be induced in Winding B by the 1:1 autotransformer action.
You can see that negative voltage as -15V on Ch0 in the scopeshot below.
Note, that at the beginning of the gray zone, Ch1 jumps up 70V and Ch0 drops down 65V.  That's almost the same voltage change illustrating the 1:1 transformer action (it is not exactly the same because the transformer is imperfect).

On that scopeshot, the -15V is measured on the disconnected winding B.  However when this winding is connected to the MOSFET B then its body diode starts conducting and clamps that -15V  to -1.2V.
This voltage (-1.2V) is so close to 0V that at low vertical magnification it looks like 0V and makes you think that MOSFET B is ON because the voltage at its drain is 0V.  But that is an illusion! 
In fact, MOSFET B is OFF (there is no current flowing through its Drain) and the LOW voltage on its Drain is caused by the autotransformer action explained above.

I anticipate a next question:
"How long is the autotransformer action capable of driving the Drain of MOSFET B LOW ?"

The answer is: "As long as there is magnetic energy stored in the core"

A negative voltage is induced across Winding B as long as the flux in the core is decreasing.  Once the magnetic energy is exhausted and the flux stops decreasing (because it reached zero), the negative voltage stops appearing across Winding B and on the Drain of MOSFET B.

As you decrease the duty cycle, you can see that energy getting exhausted and the voltage at the Drain jumping back up before MOSFET B really turns ON.  This is because shorter pulses store less energy in the core, and less energy lasts for a shorter time.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2016, 01:56:11 AM by verpies »

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12349 on: February 21, 2016, 07:57:34 PM »
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Offline itsu

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12350 on: February 21, 2016, 08:40:05 PM »
Quote
Ch4: Current through Winding A.  Please verify (this trace is from this scopeshot)

oops,  that would be the current through the TVS connected to Winding A like the one on CH5 (but because of the disconnected Winding B it changed)


So Ch4 and Ch5 could read:

Ch4: Current through the TVS diode connected to Winding A, when winding B is disconnected.
Ch5: Current through the TVS diode connected to Winding A, when winding B is connected.

Itsu

Offline verpies

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12351 on: February 21, 2016, 09:03:36 PM »
I noticed this before reading your last post and made the same corrections ;)

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12351 on: February 21, 2016, 09:03:36 PM »
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Offline Jeg

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12352 on: February 22, 2016, 07:55:26 AM »
Excellent and detailed analysis. Thanks guys :)


Offline verpies

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12353 on: February 22, 2016, 11:25:25 AM »
Also puzzled about the gate signals which seems to "lag" its drain signal, how can that be?
Revisiting this issue once again in a graphical manner.

The 1st scopeshot shows how the drain voltage waveforms appear with the body diodes present.
The 2nd scopeshot shows how the drain voltage waveforms would appear with the body diodes absent.


P.S.
If you look very closely, you can see that the drain voltage is 1 pixel lower when these body diodes conduct, even on the 1st scopeshot.  That's the -1.2V forward voltage of these diodes at low vertical magnification.  At less V/div and very high acquisition averaging, this could be seen even more clearly.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2016, 01:55:00 PM by verpies »

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12353 on: February 22, 2016, 11:25:25 AM »
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Offline itsu

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12354 on: February 22, 2016, 01:37:51 PM »

I agree with Jeg,   excellent and detailed analysis.

Nice anticipation on the questions too, thanks for the answers.
As always, things are more complex then first thought of.

So it is an illusion that the MOSFET drain signals are disturbed when looking to the voltages alone.
They really follow their gate sequence like you would expect they do and measuring current is vital in getting the total picture

So knowing this all, we can say that this push-pull circuit is doing what it suppose to do.


Thanks for this ride, it was, at least for me, interesting again.

Itsu

Offline Hoppy

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12355 on: February 22, 2016, 01:54:49 PM »
Yes, an excellent ride. Thanks to all who contributed.

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12355 on: February 22, 2016, 01:54:49 PM »
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Offline T-1000

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12356 on: February 22, 2016, 02:58:54 PM »
Tariel is indeed different from Tesla because Tariel focus was on current movement to Earth and Tesla did ever light a bulb few feet/meter from tesla coil.
In Tariels case and Ruslan case, there was quite interesting tesmpeak conference on last Friday:
https://yadi.sk/d/f0qWJuBepCaqQ - Ruslan's new tuning approach
Ruslan generally told he is looking for natural resonance with maximum current sudden rise in grenade coil first with small resistance attached on low frequency range then builds push-pull for that frequency. Only then he adjusts Tesla coil frequency to be multiplier of close harmonics to the natural resonant frequency of grenade coil. Not way around, all what Tesla coil is needed for - just spikes, so no katchers.
In the end of conference he mentioned about overcomplicated setup of akula with 2 PLLs and how much trouble that was. So i came up with idea:

For example, the PLL on grenade locks on 15kHz, so the Tesla coil driver will need to be adjusted: 600kHz or 1,5MHz, or 3MHz but also there will be resonant harmonics between to choose for fine tuning which is close to natural frequenc of grenade coil. To do that we multiply frequency of PLL frequency  by 10 from 10 to 100 for crude adjustment then multiply by 1 from 1 to 10 for fine adjustment. The resonant harmonics never go out of division and multiplication ranges so we can use this in our advantage. Also the TT is not ment to be like katcher. We do not need much of self-resonance in TT (voltage). But we need self-resonance in grenade coil which will have maximum current and phase + frequency locks. So when 2 signals mix they add to each other. For multiplying it is like variable frequency but always on locked resonant harmonics so you pick up next harmonic instead of frequency not in harmonics. It is like tuning of piano octaves :) The wrong set of 2 frequencies cause bad sound there when playing music. There you have octaves for crude frequency shift and notes in each octave for fine frequency shift. It is same with resonant harmonics which we need here. Which means in Tesla driver we need frequency synthetizer for multipling PLL frequency -  http://m.teachastronomy.com/astropedia/article/Resonance-and-Harmonics
So lets say, our octave contains 10 notes: f,2f,3f,4f,5f,6f,7f,8f,9f,10f. We need 10 octaves. So the crude shift - 10f,20f,30f,40f,50f,60f,70f,80f,90f,100f. Then fine shift in each for selecting note. As that is in nature, it should work also in what we are trying to tune :) As an  example, 64f from 15kHz = 960kHz.

Offline NickZ

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12357 on: February 22, 2016, 03:31:30 PM »
  T1000:
  That all sounds very complicated.  Didn't Ruslan just turn some trim pots to adjust the frequency of the three turns coil to best match the 168t coil,  thus providing it's best output? 
   How does he find what is the best (natural?) running frequency for the grenade? Or is it just whatever that output coil, 37.5 - 40 meters long, is running at, without any adjustments there. Then the 3 turns coil is matched to that 168t coil frequency, by turning the pots.  Then after that the Kacher is matched to provide the most gain to the induction circuit's output?  Or not?

   Itsu: You mentioned:
   "So knowing this all, we can say that this push-pull circuit is doing what it suppose to do."
                                                                                                                      end quote.

   So, can you tell us what you're getting at the bulbs?  How many 100w bulbs can it light, how bright are they, etz... with and without the HV interaction.  Can you observe any gain from the HV onto the induction circuits, yet?

 

 
« Last Edit: February 22, 2016, 07:10:43 PM by NickZ »

Offline T-1000

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12358 on: February 22, 2016, 04:20:25 PM »
Nick,
There are always several approaches for it but the some things remain constant. The max current in grenade coil, the standing waves as well and the current pumping effect over ground wire. Also the high voltage spike from Tesla coil/nanosecond pulse generator which match resonance is there too. And that is locked on relationships of resonant harmonies.
I also got involved in replication of device in UK so will keep you posted if will manage to find simple way for getting at least unity.

Cheers!

Offline GeoFusion

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Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY
« Reply #12359 on: February 22, 2016, 04:48:21 PM »
Hi  guyz :)

 Nickz,
Yes, for what you just said  about adjusting the freq using the pot and to yoke with the 3 turn coil + cap series on grenade,
Here is one of my recordings doing the reading and figuring it all out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdYGq_jhmeg

This what needs to be done in the 1st place for what I have learned up till now :) with push pul, When done with that, only then Applying Tesla coil/Kacher
to the system for amplification and effect.
3turn coil and cap has to resonate and will see good output on grenade. the right freq needs to be found.
Easy way out it connecting a 7W bulb as indicator to grenade and the keep tuning the pot till you see the 7W light to a certain degree.
Then you know you reached resonance, this is without  scope. :) every capacitor you place will have a different
resonant point.


 T-1000,
I was recently on RealStrannik forum and wanted to ask you something they are talking about and heard Ruslan talking about it too.

What are OEDs??? EODs emissions.
I do know what EDS are   ....  EDS - transverse waves (when an alternating current and the alternating magnetic field
- is excited in the secondary housing proprtsionalny current)
EODs, to me they are talking about the system reaching or having Longitudinal waves and spin wave just like out solar
system does. Ions- Radiant energy is surely involved in this.
btw check PM inbox ;).

 
   Itsu,
Glad to see your on your bench back :),
give my setup a try and try to do readings, I still did not get my parts to continue the work.
But keep it up man, and the rest!

     
         Cheerz~

 

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