Author Topic: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY (Read 11193090 times)

magpwr · « **Reply #4245 on:** May 20, 2014, 12:32:04 AM »

Quote from: gyulasun on May 19, 2014, 09:29:43 PM

Hi magpwr,

I think I understand your test circuit (I mean its schematic, I made a quick sketch for myself as per your description).
What I do not get is: why you say you have achieved OU in ANY sense? Would like to understand your thinking.

I think you would have to consider the input power your signal generator provides for your circuit. It is okay you use
very low duty cycle, it makes input power surely low but I believe it can be enough to maintain 3+Volts in the 4700uF
after disconnecting the 3.9V battery. And if you use the diode bridge instead of the single diode, the forward voltage
loss doubles (the charge current has to go through two diodes in the bridge) and the remaining lower current cannot
maintain the charge in the cap any more.
So this can also happen in this test circuit. You (we) do not know that in the single good diode's case how much excess
current would remain over the charge-maintaining current, which would be already enough to feed a tiny 2.5MHz pulse
oscillator with a few uA consumption from the 3+V cap voltage (provided of course that a low duty 2.5MHz oscillator
could be built with a 1-2uA current draw, this may be possible).
Would you tell the 2.5MHz input amplitude to the gate-source what the signal generator gives at its output? Just curious.

Thanks, Gyula

hi Gyula,

I have confirmed without feedback diode be it fast diode or simple 1n4148 as tested the capacitor voltage does keep dropping normally after providing short connection from the battery.

Another thing i noted i can't get capacitor to sustain voltage if i use schottky diode eg:1n5819 for the feedback.Even my "ultra lowest 25mV joule thief" as found in my youtube did not perform well with this diode which i just recall.BAT85 diode performed little better than 1n4148.Maybe we should not even use these 1n5819 for the 3v ou light as well.
I got to rush off to work it's 2.5khz not mhz.But without a low power oscillator to self sustain or to create a close loop it's hard to prove anything.

The signal generator is connected via 1k resistor to mosfet.Not forgetting the capacitor is powering the 10 turns switched via mosfet.
The "green" toroid used is a iron powdered toroid.

Recalled MC34063 or any other circuit used a normal step voltage booster only 1 diode is needed to recover bemf/spike to get higher voltage at the output.

gyulasun · « **Reply #4246 on:** May 20, 2014, 06:14:33 PM »

Hi magpwr,

I drew the schematic as per your description, please tell if it is correct or needs some modification.

Your tests with the different diode types show that we have to find the best performing type for a specific job, gotoluc, RomeroUK (and others) also wrote about this. One would think that Schottky types should be superior but this is not always the case.
If you happen to have a Germanium diode in junkbox, it may work also well. Or if you have a Germanium transistor (any type), you could try it too, connecting it as a diode.

Ok on the 2.5 kHz frequency instead of the 2.5 MHz you wrote earlier.

Can you tell the voltage amplitude that drives the gate-source via the 1 kOhm from the signal generator? What type of generator you have I wonder.

Thanks, Gyula

Farmhand · « **Reply #4247 on:** May 20, 2014, 10:06:42 PM »

Quote from: gyulasun on May 19, 2014, 09:29:43 PM

Hi magpwr,

I think I understand your test circuit (I mean its schematic, I made a quick sketch for myself as per your description).
What I do not get is: why you say you have achieved OU in ANY sense? Would like to understand your thinking.

I think you would have to consider the input power your signal generator provides for your circuit. It is okay you use
very low duty cycle, it makes input power surely low but I believe it can be enough to maintain 3+Volts in the 4700uF
after disconnecting the 3.9V battery. And if you use the diode bridge instead of the single diode, the forward voltage
loss doubles (the charge current has to go through two diodes in the bridge) and the remaining lower current cannot
maintain the charge in the cap any more.
So this can also happen in this test circuit. You (we) do not know that in the single good diode's case how much excess
current would remain over the charge-maintaining current, which would be already enough to feed a tiny 2.5MHz pulse
oscillator with a few uA consumption from the 3+V cap voltage (provided of course that a low duty 2.5MHz oscillator
could be built with a 1-2uA current draw, this may be possible).
Would you tell the 2.5MHz input amplitude to the gate-source what the signal generator gives at its output? Just curious.

Thanks, Gyula

I hope no one takes this as criticism but in my humble opinion if a function generator is used then it's entire input power should be considered as input as it is part of the device, without it there is no working circuit. When using IC's to produce signals I can see that the input power to the IC is very small with low frequency output to a mosfet gate, but as the frequency increases the input power can become significant if thinking in mA x volts. If a mosfet just for example has an input capacitance of 2000 pF and the operating frequency is 100 kHz then the 2000 pF is charged to gate drive voltage and discharged 100 000 times per second, that energy is supplied by the FG and just considering the power required to drive the mosfet means we must consider this power and the input power to the device that provides it as part of the input, not even considering any energy that might be transferred to the output via the mosfet capacitance.

If we use an IC to provide signals then we consider/measure all of it's input power draw not just the signal output power as it is part of the circuit/device. Just my opinion.

..

NickZ · « **Reply #4248 on:** May 21, 2014, 01:34:48 AM »

Gyula:
quote
"EDIT 2: There is a full wave rectifier circuit variation with two (independent) diodes but this would double the output DC voltage. The drawback in this circuit for your MBR20100 types is that the output coil ought to give only 50V peak AC to match the 100V max rating. Nevertheless, see the second figure in this link http://www.daenotes.com/electronics/devices-circuits/voltage-multipler Should you test it, maybe first reduce the number of turns of the output coils or use taps on it. Use one-one diode from the two MBRs"
end quote.
I am going try the MBR20100CT diodes first, to see what they can do.
The AC voltage of the output coil can be reduced, as needed, to suit the MBRs, which can also help to raise the current output level as well.
So, can you, or Sea Monkey, direct me as to how to connect two of those diodes together to form a full wave rectifier? Please... I will place that bridge on my circuit's second yoke, before placing another lesser voltage diode inline. also.
I'll also connect a 2200uf 16v cap across the input, as well as another higher uf cap on the DC output side, as you suggested.

SeaMonkey · « **Reply #4249 on:** May 21, 2014, 02:18:00 AM »

Nick,

The MBR20100CT Dual Diode Common Cathode is
designed to be used as a full wave rectifier in
conjunction with a center-tapped transformer winding.

When it is used in such a fashion it achieves full wave
rectification with less loss than a bridge rectifier. It
does mean though that the output winding of your
device would have to be wound as a center tapped
winding in order to feed the Common Cathode Diode
Pair properly.

In order to make a full wave bridge rectifier using the
MBR20100CT it would be necessary to obtain one of
its complements the MBR20100CTR. The final R in that
designation connotes "Reverse Polarity" or Common Anode
configuration.

With one each of a Common Cathode and a Common Anode
the two can be easily connected to make the full wave
bridge rectifier.

It may be easiest to just add some additional copper wire
to your device to make a center-tapped output winding in
order to utilize a single MBR20100CT as a full wave rectifier.

NickZ · « **Reply #4250 on:** May 21, 2014, 02:40:31 AM »

Ok, thanks for your reply.
Can you tell me HOW to connect a single BMR to form this full wave recitifier, or half wave, and I'll try that first. I can't do it, though, if I'll need the different BMR (R).
I've never worked with this type of rectifier previously, nor seen a diagram of how to go about it.
I can wind a center tap on the smaller yoke coil's secondary winding, as well.

I'll also dive deeper into my electronic junk pile, to see if I can come up with a rectifier that will work.

SeaMonkey · « **Reply #4251 on:** May 21, 2014, 04:18:51 AM »

The diagram shows how a full wave rectifier is
connected with two diodes and a center-tapped
transformer winding. With the Dual Diode
Common Cathode rectifier both diodes are
within the device and accessible by the three
terminals.

magpwr · « **Reply #4252 on:** May 21, 2014, 05:17:42 AM »

Quote from: gyulasun on May 20, 2014, 06:14:33 PM

Hi magpwr,

I drew the schematic as per your description, please tell if it is correct or needs some modification.

Your tests with the different diode types show that we have to find the best performing type for a specific job, gotoluc, RomeroUK (and others) also wrote about this. One would think that Schottky types should be superior but this is not always the case.
If you happen to have a Germanium diode in junkbox, it may work also well. Or if you have a Germanium transistor (any type), you could try it too, connecting it as a diode.

Ok on the 2.5 kHz frequency instead of the 2.5 MHz you wrote earlier.

Can you tell the voltage amplitude that drives the gate-source via the 1 kOhm from the signal generator? What type of generator you have I wonder.

Thanks, Gyula

hi gyulasun,

You have done a great job in interpreting my circuit layout in words.The existing turns at secondary 37 instead of 30.

Since i am on medical leave(flu bug) today.I will upload a video in youtube later today title-Finding Ferroresonance the easy way

(scope will be used to show what is happening)

Shortly i will do testing on the pot core 1st one which i had previously assembled using copper shield inside to observe if there is any charging occurring at the source capacitor.

-------------------
I do agree having low capacitance at the mosfet gate is also important in order to lower switching current consumption.By looking at datasheet of various mosfet in hand we can easily find out which one is more suited for the job.

-----------------
I do play with microprocessor.But i can't remember the estimated power consumption at 3volts although i know it's <10mA.

Taking 1/2500khz=0.0004 or "400us" .For 2% duty cycle (2/100%)x400=8us (period of switch on state).
For switch off 400-8=392us(period of switch off state).

-------------------------------
It's afternoon over here my findings revealed that the capacitor is getting charged without battery.But feedback diode is still required else the capacitor voltage would drop.
This means the signal generator is providing power via the 1k resistor to mosfet gate at the right frequency.

It's pointless for me to create video if it does not help or provide useful tips for others in any way.

---------------------------------------------------
In the meantime i am putting all my efforts in building a don smith device base on china replication after i have concluded the secondary coil is powered by strong RF field generated from primary coil which needs mere <30mA from above 1kv.To get 1KV supply the SG3525 is driving the E-Core transformer to around 300volts then boosted to 500...1600volts using MC34063 as voltage controller which is using external IGBT connected in series(I am waiting for 1700volts transistor to arrive to proceed testing the power supply stage.)

Pcb layout for 6 igbt driver in series is completed merely waiting for some unique component to arrive to get the pin width measurement right.

I just received those costly Cree IGBT cost $16 ea which got a total of 160ns delay compared to higher current $40 cree IGBT which which got 360ns delay.
These babies won't be used during testing stage which is replaced by other nearly fast 1200volt IGBT <200khz.

I will post next update on this device in around 2 months time.

gyulasun · « **Reply #4253 on:** May 21, 2014, 10:57:35 AM »

Quote from: NickZ on May 21, 2014, 01:34:48 AM

Gyula:

Quote
"EDIT 2: There is a full wave rectifier circuit variation with two (independent) diodes but
this would double the output DC voltage. The drawback in this circuit for your MBR20100
types is that the output coil ought to give only 50V peak AC to match the 100V max rating.
Nevertheless, see the second figure in this link
http://www.daenotes.com/electronics/devices-circuits/voltage-multipler
Should you test it, maybe first reduce the number of turns of the output coils or use taps on it.
Use one-one diode from the two MBRs"

I am going try the MBR20100CT diodes first, to see what they can do.
The AC voltage of the output coil can be reduced, as needed, to suit the MBRs, which can also help
to raise the current output level as well.
So, can you, or Sea Monkey, direct me as to how to connect two of those diodes together to form
a full wave rectifier? Please... I will place that bridge on my circuit's second yoke, before placing
another lesser voltage diode inline. also.
I'll also connect a 2200uf 16v cap across the input, as well as another higher uf cap on the
DC output side, as you suggested.

Hi NickZ,

I attached a drawing with the double diode pictures inserted and wired, (I know SeaMonkey
has also explained in the meantime).
I included both the full wave voltage doubler (here no center tap for your red coil shown earlier)
and the normal full wave rectifier with the center tapped red coil. Notice that for the latter circuit
I did not insert the MBR diode picture for D2 diode at the bottom right but of course you have to
connect it as I show for diode D1 on top right.

EDIT: I have attached a second possibility for using only one MBR double diode in the normal full
wave rectifier circuit, (see the 2nd drawing entitled as rectifier1.png) here you do not have to use
a short piece of connecting wire between the open anodes of one MBR double diode.
The center pin of the MBR will be the positive ouput, going to the puffer cap +.
You understand that when using the connecting wires between the anodes of an MBR, we use the
two diodes inside the MBR package in parallel and consider it as a single diode.

Gyula

gyulasun · « **Reply #4254 on:** May 21, 2014, 11:14:21 AM »

Quote from: magpwr on May 21, 2014, 05:17:42 AM

....
-----------------
I do play with microprocessor.But i can't remember the estimated power consumption at 3volts
although i know it's <10mA.

Taking 1/2500khz=0.0004 or "400us" .For 2% duty cycle (2/100%)x400=8us (period of switch on state).
For switch off 400-8=392us(period of switch off state).

-------------------------------
It's afternoon over here my findings revealed that the capacitor is getting charged
without battery.But feedback diode is still required else the capacitor voltage would drop.
This means the signal generator is providing power via the 1k resistor to mosfet gate at the right frequency.

It's pointless for me to create video if it does not help or provide useful tips for others in any way.

---------------------------------------------------
....

Hi magpwr,

Thanks for reporting the tests and unfortunately it seems that 'conventional science' is valid for this circuit,
the signal generator supplies and maintains the voltage level in the 4700uF capacitor.
This is what I strongly suspected (and probably also prompted Farmhand to chime in).
I wish you good health (quick recovery) and keep up your excellent 'tinkering'.

Gyula

NickZ · « **Reply #4255 on:** May 22, 2014, 01:30:05 AM »

Gyula, Sea Monkey, and All:
Thanks for all you've done. The diagrams were what I needed.
I tried the single diode rectifier connected to a center tap from my previous flyback core circuit, first. It burnt the right diode, with a small pop after a few seconds running with the bulbs on, also.
I had a higher voltage cap on that single rectifier diode. So, I placed a 25v 2200uf on it instead. I shifted the connections onto the other diode, (to the left hand one). Right one burnt out.
When running the circuit without a capacitor, the diode gets burning hot in seconds. With a 25v 2200uf cap in parallel with the DC output, there is little heating of the diode, but the cap gets very hot. I also placed a 25v 2200uf capacitor on the input, as well. Still the fets are getting hot, and so is the rectifier/cap which is connected to a second 12 7aH battery. I'm not looping the output back to the circuit input side until I resolve this overheating issue first, as I don't want to risk burning the Fets out, as well.
The flyback AC output voltage will dimly light a regular 100w bulb to about 20% bulb brightness.
The rectified DC output from the flyback/rectifier without a cap is 11.5 volts.
Here is a pic:

NickZ · « **Reply #4256 on:** May 22, 2014, 03:27:12 AM »

Although there are some of us that may think that these types of inverter systems are basically a waist of time, I would tend to disagree. Even if they don't have a working loop, to help them to self run.
Here below is a video made by Lidmotor showing how a regular 38 watt incandescent bulb is drawing 4 amps from his solar system's 12v inverter/battery set up. So, a single 110v, 100 watt bulb would probably draw at least twice that much current, like 8 amps +, perhaps.
How about a half dozen 100w bulbs, how many amps would that draw off of???
In comparison a Mazilli/yoke circuit draws much, much less, possibly only 50 to 75 watts, although only partially lighting the bulbs, for now. Further tuning would improve this for a higher light output.

Lidmotor video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkUJ019RA6Q

Hoppy · « **Reply #4257 on:** May 22, 2014, 09:53:09 AM »

Quote from: NickZ on May 22, 2014, 03:27:12 AM

Although there are some of us that may think that these types of inverter systems are basically a waist of time, I would tend to disagree. Even if they don't have a working loop, to help them to self run.
Here below is a video made by Lidmotor showing how a regular 38 watt incandescent bulb is drawing 4 amps from his solar system's 12v inverter/battery set up. So, a single 110v, 100 watt bulb would probably draw at least twice that much current, like 8 amps +, perhaps.
How about a half dozen 100w bulbs, how many amps would that draw off of???
In comparison a Mazilli/yoke circuit draws much, much less, possibly only 50 to 75 watts, although only partially lighting the bulbs, for now. Further tuning would improve this for a higher light output.

Lidmotor video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkUJ019RA6Q

Nick,

If you seriously want to light bulbs for domestic emergency purposes, then get yourself a decent inverter. The modified square wave type inverters should be avoided for running CFL's. The Mazilli setup will not match a decent inverter for efficiency. As Lidmotor demonstrates, incandescent bulbs are pants, unless you also need some heating to go with the lighting.

You say: "In comparison a Mazilli/yoke circuit draws much, much less, possibly only 50 to 75 watts, although only partially lighting the bulbs, for now." This is pure guess work given that you do not have the means to measure power v light level.

gyulasun · « **Reply #4258 on:** May 22, 2014, 03:14:06 PM »

Hi NickZ,

I think your AC output voltage from the coil is much higher than 100V peak (the max voltage rating
for the MBR diode), this can be the explanation for popping them. I do not think that it was the load
current which burnt the diodes, there must be some hundred Volt AC peaks amplitude at your output,
a scope would be the best to see it. OR you wish to consider buying fast or ultra fast, at least 600V
breakdown rated Si diodes. The UF4007 is cheap, has 1000V and 1 Amper capability and you could parallel
some to increase forward current capability, do not worry on paralleling them. Elsewhere on this forum
other diode types has been mentioned already for your question.
Now that your boxes may have no more suitable diodes, you have to buy...

The fact that your electrolytic cap 25V 2200uF got very hot when hooked up across the DC
output of the diodes means that the DC voltage level thus created must be much higher than 25V.
So you have to use capacitors with at least 100V DC ratings or even higher, BUT then this again depends on
the AC peak ouput level across the coil.

You would somehow need to know the unloaded and the loaded peak AC voltage levels across the coil,
the load could be a 40W or 60W regular bulb. I know you mentioned the 100W bulb test, this was a kind of
comparison for estimating the ruling power level, accepting this then as a rough measure you seem to have
20W power available... but this can also be deceiving.

You mention the rectified DC ouput to be 11.5V without any capacitor: I suspect your DC meter is fooled by
the rectified waveforms and does not / cannot measure reality.
Oscilloscope can show this correctly, unfortunately.

The capacitor when connected, charges up to the highest value DC component of the rectified waveform
and this level must be higher than 25V, if the cap gets hot fast. Did not you monitor this DC level across the cap
with a DC voltage meter? assuming a bulb load of a few watts is always connected because when a rectified and
capacitor puffered flyback voltage is unloaded, the DC level goes up near to the peak level of the AC output.

Gyula

NickZ · « **Reply #4259 on:** May 22, 2014, 05:50:14 PM »

Hoppy:
Thanks for your comments. However, after seeing what a regular inverter draws when connected to incandescent type of bulbs that I'm using, I'll stay with the Mazilli/yoke circuit, for now.
I absolutely hate florescent bulbs, and even worse the LED bulbs. Those are not an option for me. Their light spectrum is not what I'm looking for.
I only pay $20 per month on electricity bills, and even these unconvetional type of inverters can be also connected to the grid for further savings. I'm already doing this, and have also a few solar panels, connected to these inverters, as well. An emergency back up system is also not what I'm looking for, as I already have that.
In any case, I would like to obtain a proper inverter for these tests. Whichever type that may be. As several of the Akula or Kapanadze type of circuits seem to use them to obtain the results that are being shown.
I know that you don't think that any of the self running devices are for real and have repeated your views many many times concerning their falseness. But, I don't agree, with your speculations.

If this effort were easy to do, it would have been done long ago. Perhaps it was done long ago, and still being covered up to this date.

Cookie	Origin	Persistency	Information and Usage
ecl_auth	overunity.com	Expires after 30 days	This cookie contains the text "EU Cookie Law - LiPF cookies authorised". Without this cookie, the Forums' software is prevented from setting other cookies.
SMFCookie648	overunity.com	Expires according to user-chosen session duration	If you log-in as a member of this site, this cookie contains your user name, an encrypted hash of your password and the time you logged-in. It is used by the site software to ensure that features such as indicating new Forum and Private messages are indicated to you. This cookie is essential for the site software to work correctly.
PHPSESSID	overunity.com	Current session only	This cookie contains a unique Session Identification value. It is set for both members and non-members (guests) and it is essential for the site software to work correctly. This cookie is not persistent and should be automatically removed when you close the browser window.
pmx_upshr{NAME}	overunity.com	Current session only	These cookies are set to records your display preferences for the site's Portal page if a panel or individual block is collapsed or expanded
pmx_pgidx_blk{ID}	overunity.com	Current session only	These cookies are set to records the page number for the site's Portal page if the page for a individual block is changed.
pmx_cbtstat{ID}	overunity.com	Current session only	These cookies are set to records the expand/collapse state for a CBT Navigator block content.
pmx_poll{ID}	overunity.com	Current session only	These cookies are set to records the id for the current poll in a multiple Poll block.
pmx_{fadername}	overunity.com	Current session only	These cookies are set to records the state for a Opac-Fader block.
pmx_LSBsub{ID}	overunity.com	Current session only	These cookies are set to records the current category and the state for a static Category block.
pmx_shout{ID}	overunity.com	Current session only	These cookies are set to records the current state of a Shout box block.
pmx_php_ckeck	overunity.com	Page load time	This cookie will probably never see you. It is set, if a Syntax check on a PHP block is initiated and will be deleted if the function executed.
pmx_YOfs	overunity.com	Page load time	This cookie will probably never see you. It is set on portal actions like click on a page number. The cookie is evaluated on load the desired page and then deleted. It is used to restore the vertical screen position as before the click.

1	We are aware that Google uses additional cookies it stores on your PC and when you browse our site and all other sites. These are used to target advertising and Google currently does this without seeking your permission. Four of these cookies we know about are named "rememberme", "NID", "PREF" and "PP_TOS_ACK" and are stored in Google's cache on your computer.
2	If you are accessing this site using someone else's computer, please ask the owner's permission before accepting cookies.
3	Your browser provides you with the ability to inspect all cookies stored on your PC. In addition your browser is responsible for removing "current session only" cookies and those that have expired; if your browser is not doing this, you should report the matter to your browser's authors.
4	We regret and apologies for any inconvenience this causes to members and guests who are accessing our web site from outside the European Union. It is not currently possible for us to interrogate your browser and obtain geographic location information in order to decide whether or not to prompt you to accept cookies.

News:

User Menu

Author Topic: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY (Read 11193090 times)

magpwr

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

gyulasun

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

Farmhand

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

NickZ

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

SeaMonkey

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

NickZ

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

SeaMonkey

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

magpwr

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

gyulasun

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

gyulasun

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

NickZ

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

NickZ

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

Hoppy

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

gyulasun

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY

NickZ

Re: Kapanadze Cousin - DALLY FREE ENERGY