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Author Topic: Simple to build isolation transformer that consumes less power than it gives out  (Read 258350 times)

Offline Magluvin

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Magluvin.

That's just a bullshit posting by you were you are strutting around puffing your chest out and stroking your ego because you saw me make a mistake.  If I corrected every single error you made and made a big stink about it and gave a speech you would not like it one bit.  The LED example is more bullshit because if someone else made the same mistake you would have politely corrected them and them left it at that.  With me you ran around like a crazy person screaming your lungs off.

Don't start this nonsense again where you are going to "go after me."  What you do know is that I know my stuff and I am not perfect.  Big farking deal.

In my previous posting I was trying to help Wattsup and I made a mistake.  Do NOT make the conscious decision that you are are going to try to make my life miserable every time I make a mistake. 

MileHigh

Oh yea, I forgot to mention the swearing. ;]

If you want me to dig it up in reference to the LED, it clearly shows that you were "adjusting" the led bias voltage(of a red led) to suit you argument. Considering the source was 1.2v. :o You were claiming that the led was being lit by the source alone, when it was really coil collapse that was lighting the led. I know you are good enough to see that, yet you went on to show your own version of what the circuit actually was, even though the maker of the motor had already shown his circuit. Again, you changed his circuit to fit your argument. There are numerous instances of this. But when I pointed out that the led would not light at 1v, your falsified circuit had to go down the drain too, being it counted on the led to pass 1v in order to get the motor to even work.

Let me ask you M. In your post, did you mean that P "can" be calculated by VxI?  Or even Prms= Vrms x Irms?  Is that what you meant to say? If so, then it doesnt suit your argument, does it.  What were you thinking at the time?  Hmm? What?

You are only here to dispute any and every positive finding, without ever even putting it on the bench yourself. If you truly know that it doesnt work, then show me an example proving so. Are you saying you have seen this quite odd circuit using 2 iso transformers, wired the way as shown, in order to have any valid argument against the findings here?

If so please give us reference to such a circuit.  :o   


Anyways, I think it is good that it is not just me catching you doing this.

I hand the stage to you.

MaGs


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Offline Magluvin

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CHET!! 

Wilby has been busy. ;) What you been up to? 

Mags

Offline Tito L. Oracion

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CHET!! 

Wilby has been busy. ;) What you been up to? 

Mags


chet is busy attacking me with his father.   :'(   ;D


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Offline ramset

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Tito
 
Thats "OUR FATHER"
You putz!! [sorry I didn't mean that.......]
 
 
Mags I'll give you a shout.
Thx
Chet

Offline Tito L. Oracion

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Tito
 
Thats "OUR FATHER"
You putz!! [sorry I didn't mean that.......]
 
 
Mags I'll give you a shout.
Thx
Chet


sorry your not my brother cause i'm your sister !  >:(
You patz!!! [ i mean that.....] , and i don't know patz  ;D


is your father the one who art in heaven or who art in hell?  ;D


now i believe that there is energy in friction. :o


Two isolated transformer makes some flowing a resistance between each of them then flux multiplied pulling lots of electron in that vicinity. then increase will happen.  >:( 

ps.
chet adding a makes cheat hahahahahaha  :D  joke

and that's actually the reason why i can't trust you !!!!!!!! :o

Chits  ;D   :P

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Offline baroutologos

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@all
Well here is my last trials using a secondary configuration as well. Mind again that these transformers are step down and hence not a true isolation transformer.
...
Enjoy.
wattsup


Hey wattup!

I see you made a nice setup there. Your findings are extraordinary so if i may suggest... verfication, verification and verification again! :)

One thing that bothers me, is the green lamp. If its rated as low as 11w at 110 VAC, how can be 11 watts ate 45 volts DC? From eye and experience playing with bulbs, its seems some 2-3 watts to me...
Pardon me, do not want to be a spoiler here. If this your initial findings is the case, i will be the first to open a champaign bottle to celebrate your success!

happy experimenting!

Offline MileHigh

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Mags:

Quote
If you want me to dig it up in reference to the LED, it clearly shows that you were "adjusting" the led bias voltage(of a red led) to suit you argument.

Two years ago in my mind the forward voltage drop from an ordinary vanilla red LED was 0.7 volts.  That's because it's a diode and a typical diode has a forward voltage drop of about 0.6-0.7 volts.  I mentioned this on a Joule Thief thread and got the crap beaten out of me and I was mocked.  It was about 30 years since the last time I calculated the proper value for a current programming resistor for an LED when you hook it up to a five-volt supply.  So remembering that incident in my mind I thought the forward voltage drop for an ordinary LED was about one volt, not 0.7 volts.  That's how I came up with one volt.

More importantly, it makes no sense to obsess about the specifications of a given part, what's really important is how the part works and is applied in a circuit.  You know that a diode or an ordinary vanilla LED or a modern high-power LED for lighting has a nominal current and a nominal voltage drop.  For diodes, depending on the technology of the diode and the power rating you have different IV curves for different devices.  Same for all the variations of LEDs, they have different IV curves.  So, I don't remember all of the different typical currents and voltage drops for all of the different commonly used diodes and LEDs.  But I know what a diode or LED is, and that's what's more important.  So all of the bashing for forgetting a typical forward voltage drop is uncalled for and gratuitous.

Incidentally, if you (generic 'you') work with diodes and you don't know what an "IV curve" is you should look it up.

Quote
Let me ask you M. In your post, did you mean that P "can" be calculated by VxI? Or even Prms= Vrms x Irms?  Is that what you meant to say? If so, then it doesnt suit your argument, does it.  What were you thinking at the time?  Hmm? What?

What I was thinking is that an RMS voltage already factors in the "square" in order to do power calculations.  That's why you can measure the RMS voltage of any arbitrary voltage waveform across a resistor and deduce the power dissipated in the resistor.  Since Vrms already factors in the "square" I thought that it would be an error to multiply it by Irms because that factors in the "square" also.  So you would be "doubling up on the squares" which would be a mistake.  TheCell corrected me and I did a quick double-check with a simple calculation and realized that I was wrong.  So shoot me!

I was just trying to help Wattsup with his discovery process.  If anyone wants to know what I think of the premise of this thread just post and ask me to tell you.  I will truthfully state what I think and if you don't like what you hear it's your choice to listen to me or ignore me.

MileHigh

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Offline Magluvin

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M

Ok, we will just have to accept those facts.

Mags



Offline T-1000

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MileHigh and Magluvin

Wouldn't it be much better just to find two 1:1 transformers and see results yourself instead?

Seriously, this time it is not complex circuit and you already know how to achieve resonance...

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Offline Magluvin

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MileHigh and Magluvin

Wouldn't it be much better just to find two 1:1 transformers and see results yourself instead?

Seriously, this time it is not complex circuit and you already know how to achieve resonance...

T
If you believe that it works, then you need only address MH here.
If you believe it doesnt work, then you need only address me. ;]

I have been doing experiments in this area for quite some time. Transformers with inductors added to the circuit. Just never thought of this configuration. This one is unusual, "and simple"  I like it.  Im happy that those that have taken on the task are seeing some good numbers.

I havnt ordered any transformers yet. I have 2 toroid cores that I am going to try some things, while these guys are doing good.

Mags


Offline wattsup

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@all

Come on guys. All we are doing is reporting our results and getting help from some so no need to attack each other for tidbits.

So from suggestions of @JouleSeeker to use a Kill-a-Watt counter, I got one today.

And also @MH's post;
Wattsup:
For your DC current measurement you are at nearly the rock-bottom output from the digital clamp meter.  Hence your accuracy is very poor.  I would suggest that you just use a regular digital multimeter or an analog ammeter with the proper maximum scale to get a better DC power calculation.
MileHigh

So I put the DC output through a multimeter as amps and to my greatest dismay, I saw only 45.5mA. I also took off the Variac and went direct to mains via the Watt Counter.

So while the system is running, with the regular clamp meter on the dc load, I am getting 0.2 amps but through the multimeter, I am getting 45.5mA. There is a great discrepancy between these two so @MH was more then right about that and good thing he caught it so quickly. Thanks man. I was wondering why the bulb was so dim with that voltage at .2 amps it should have been brighter then that, but when I saw .2 amps and did the math, hey, of course it looked good. We try to do our best efforts by the book, but sometimes things can get past us.

So here is a recap of the new numbers;
INPUT VIA WATT COUNTER: 121VAC @ 0.27 AMPS OR 32 WATTS
INPUT by meters A: 121.9 VAC @ 0.24A = 29.259 WATTS
OUTPUT B: 57.3 VAC @ O.47A = 26.93 WATTS
OUTPUT C: 43.1VDC @ 0.0443A = 1.90933 WATTS
TOTAL OUTPUT: 28.83933 WATTS

I put a small video here but it is still uploading (2hrs left);
http://youtu.be/F7MH7TgCxao

So back to the drawing board. I think my new transformers should be in by Monday so I will play around with this some more and see what gives. I think guys with clamp on ammeters that only provide one decimal point precision at low amp readings is not enough and can easily lead one to see OU where it is not, YET that is.

Soon.

wattsup

« Last Edit: July 15, 2012, 06:29:22 AM by wattsup »

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Offline JouleSeeker

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  It's refreshing to see someone take suggestions and quickly proceed with actual testing -- thanks, Wattsup.

  Your vid is still processing as I write, but I look forward to viewing it.  Glad you went ahead and got the Kill-A-Watt meter also; it may prove useful as we go forward.

 

Offline T-1000

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And also @MH's post;
So I put the DC output through a multimeter as amps and to my greatest dismay, I saw only 45.5mA. I also took off the Variac and went direct to mains via the Watt Counter.


This time you changed setup and variac seems is needed component for effect in your case. It acts as first tuned transformer...
Just leave power meter before variac and everyone will be happy :)

Offline guruji

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Deleted

Offline guruji

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Hi Microcontroller thanks for your PM comment that you send. The thing is that you disabled the reply cause I was going to send you my thanks. Another thing if I know something on anything I share it with others not try to bring them down with my comments. It's good that we behave like grown ups to each other not like id**ts.
 
 
 

 

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