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Author Topic: Bessler , Karl I! The fat lady is gonna sing , haters bring it I'm not skeered .  (Read 88408 times)

johnny874

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yeah... ::) those who were wrapped up in astrology, ghosts, bloodletting and such? those guys who just a generation earlier laughed at galileo? and it would take another generation before those same 'critical minds' laughed at sadi carnot... ::)

now, where's that math from these "great mathematicians" you spoke of?

 

well then it should be easy to build shouldn't it... ::) why don't you have a working bessler wheel? look at what you do have: a perpetual motion machine 'powered by weights and gravity' whose secrets are now lost. you have no evidence how bessler’s wheel was powered, it could have been clockwork, or a heat engine, or a well fed koala in a wheel. bessler is an interesting piece of historical arcana, nothing more.

  Wilby,
 Liebniz was a contemporary of Newtons and co-invented calculus.
 read for yourself.
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gottfried_Leibniz

WilbyInebriated

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  Wilby,
 Liebniz was a contemporary of Newtons and co-invented calculus.
 read for yourself.
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gottfried_Leibniz
so what? as far as i am aware gottfried never inspected this wheel, he only got a letter from gravesande describing it... where is his math on how and why the 'invention' works?

johnny874

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so what? as far as i am aware gottfried never inspected this wheel, he only got a letter from gravesande describing it... where is his math on how and why the 'invention' works?

  Wilby,
 It's a matter of understanding the mechanics. If you consider Mt21, do you think it would work ?
Of course not, both sdes are equal. No over or under balance. but then, everyone has been missing something.
 If the levers are thought of as pendulums, then what is being over looked ? It's the torque they generate at their fulcrums. Apparently Bessler understood this.
 With torque, 1 ft.lb. can lift 1 lb., 1 ft. With solid weights, it requires equal motion or movement. With hydraulics,
the movement does not need to be equal. With a pump, as I have mentioned, if a lever drops a matter of inches, it can move fluids a greater distance.
 With Mt 21, the weights moving downward would be considered along the lines of mv^2 and the weights moving accross the top would not. This is because they would fall onto the hub and have a much slower velocity. Also, when a weight is hanging from it's fulcrum, it's movement sidewise would be the same as it's fulcrum, it would be ma/tangent.
 With Bessler's wheel, I think it's better understood if you consider that a falling weight can pump up water to a greater height and the faster the wheel rotates, the better it pumps.
 With the video I made, there is a bottle neck at the outlet. It's primitive but shows water can be pumped quite easily.
To build a wheel using such a concept requires almost having a wood shop. A band saw would be helpful believe it or not.
 It would make bulding it much easier because warping boards is not as easy as you think.
 
                                                                                       Johnny874
note the weight even lands on something
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h33LqXPCdV4
 
p.s. take a day or 2 to think about it
 
edited to add; if you consider the weighted lever drops 3 or 4 inches
and the water moves over 12 inches, I think that's a nice ratio

WilbyInebriated

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MY GAWD! you've invented the lever! good show old chap...

johnny874

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MY GAWD! you've invented the lever! good show old chap...

  I think this is why if I get in to see my doctor tomorrow, I'll probably be done with this.
 No time to consider somethng, just ignorant comments.
 Of course, on ships they use sequential pumping systems, but that's not in your text book, is it ?

WilbyInebriated

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  I think this is why if I get in to see my doctor tomorrow, I'll probably be done with this.
 No time to consider somethng, just ignorant comments.
Alas, to wear the mantle of Galileo it is not enough that you be persecuted by an unkind establishment, you must also be right. -Robert Park


 Of course, on ships they use sequential pumping systems, but that's not in your text book, is it ?
why don't they just use bessler wheels?

but seriously guys... his maid admitted to the fraud... and shortly thereafter he destroyed the wheel in a fit of rage. what was johann's middle name? mylow?

johnny874

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you sounc like ab hammer   you know everytning but mechanical engineering
you snould stick to what you know because this isnt it and I do have more important things to concern myself with

bye

ramset

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Johny,
It has often Amazed me just How much the Entity known as "Wilby" actually does know!
Fortunately his worship falls short in the "All seeing and Knowing" Department.
 
And of course as with all such Deities,
NO MANNERS WHATSOEVER!!
 
I appreciate your contribution as well as those of others here.
 
You make us think .
[Deities Don't think... They just Thought !;.[ [nothing new.......]
 
Very refreshing Johny.
Thanks
Chet
PS
I hope I made some gramar or Spelling mistakes in the above post
It makes him very itchy["The W"] ,and since he put me On "Ignore" like a decade ago.
{which I have grown to appreciate more with each passing day]
 
I get satisfaction out of the small things in life these days.
 
 
 
 
 

EMdevices

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Quote
but seriously guys... his maid admitted to the fraud... and shortly thereafter he destroyed the wheel in a fit of rage.


Willby,   is that true?  where does this piece of information come from?    Do you have a link? 




EM

WilbyInebriated

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Willby,   is that true?  where does this piece of information come from?    Do you have a link? 




EM
of course it is. i have no motivation to lie. her name was anne rosine mauersbergerin. she testified under oath. not only that, several devices were built by andreas gärtner that reproduced some of the 'successes' of bessler's public demonstrations... including the locked-room test. and they were acknowledged as trickery.

johnny874

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Willby,   is that true?  where does this piece of information come from?    Do you have a link? 




EM

  EM,
 What needs to be considered is if she was just saving her ass and leaving Bessler out in the cold. Wouldn't be the first time someone has turned on somebody and won't be the last.
 What it took for me to understand this concept was slowly working on the idea over a few months. It does take time to understand new idea's and Bessler's wheel is just that, a new idea. Will always be intoxicated can't accpet that doing something other than drinking and reading, but building, leads to new understandings.
 Myself, I've spent 5 years building and learning how Newton's Laws of Motion applies to mechanical motion. This is why I consider the math to be 4m-a/.5a + 4m+a/.5a = 8m/a.
 That is to say that the acceleration of gravity is cancelled out by the opposing weights being lifted which then any acceleration is a direct relationship between the masses being rotated (Newton's 2nd Law of Motion, see link) and the potential acceleration of the mass creating the over balance.
 And since mass with no velocity is considered to have no force 1kg*0=0, it's potential or kinetic energy is what is being transfered and is thusly refered to as free energy.
 Simply put, why the wheel rotates but the water is always in the same place.
 Sometin' for will b 2 con cidder  ;D
 
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newton's_laws_of_motion

WilbyInebriated

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  EM,
 What needs to be considered is if she was just saving her ass and leaving Bessler out in the cold. Wouldn't be the first time someone has turned on somebody and won't be the last.
 What it took for me to understand this concept was slowly working on the idea over a few months. It does take time to understand new idea's and Bessler's wheel is just that, a new idea.
more misdirection from johnnyboy... ::) WHERE IS THE MATH FROM LEIBNIZ?
there is nothing credible from bessler... his maid admitted to the fraud under oath... andreas gartner built replications of his 'wheel' that reproduced some of the 'successes' of bessler's public demonstrations including the locked room test...

not only that, but there has been nothing credible from any of you as to why this wheel should work... in point of fact, both you and EM have completely avoided answering my questions about these "great mathematicians" and "scientists" and instead have chosen to respond with logical fallacy... again, WHERE IS THE MATH FROM LEIBNIZ? where is the math from ANY of these "great mathematicians"? where is the data from these "inspections" by "scientists"?

Will always be intoxicated can't accpet that doing something other than drinking and reading, but building, leads to new understandings.
more logical fallacy from johnnyboy... ::)  again, WHERE IS THE MATH FROM LEIBNIZ? do you even know what a cogent reply is?

Myself, I've spent 5 years building and learning how Newton's Laws of Motion applies to mechanical motion. This is why I consider the math to be 4m-a/.5a + 4m+a/.5a = 8m/a.
 That is to say that the acceleration of gravity is cancelled out by the opposing weights being lifted which then any acceleration is a direct relationship between the masses being rotated (Newton's 2nd Law of Motion, see link) and the potential acceleration of the mass creating the over balance.
 And since mass with no velocity is considered to have no force 1kg*0=0, it's potential or kinetic energy is what is being transfered and is thusly refered to as free energy.
 Simply put, why the wheel rotates but the water is always in the same place.
 Sometin' for will b 2 con cidder  ;D
 
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newton's_laws_of_motion
why don't you have a working wheel then?
bessler's wheel won't work... i'll give you a hint as to why johnnyboy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xxn3WEGFaxE
unless of course, you plan on rewriting the laws of physics...  please make sure that your new laws jive with everybody elses new laws.  we wouldn’t want a conflict to arise between your physics and lifewave’s and angel light’s and q-ray’s and dna activation’s and thousands of other cranks out there.

johnny874

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  wilby,
 You are a troll.
 This forum is for discussing ideas, unfortunately you have nothing to discuss.

             Johnny

EMdevices

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WHERE IS THE MATH FROM LEIBNIZ?

try calculus 101,   :P
 
Seriously, why do you ask?  It should be obvious that Bessler did not share the secret, and I'm sure these guys were very anxious to put their skills to work and analyze why this thing worked as it did.
 
Why don't I have a wheel like Beeslers?   Because I do not know the secret, if I had it I would build a wheel to take advantage of it, and not only that I would share it, before the MIBs came knocking on my door.    ;)
 
EM   

WilbyInebriated

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try calculus 101,   :P
 
Seriously, why do you ask?  It should be obvious that Bessler did not share the secret, and I'm sure these guys were very anxious to put their skills to work and analyze why this thing worked as it did.
then where is the math?
 
Why don't I have a wheel like Beeslers?   Because I do not know the secret, if I had it I would build a wheel to take advantage of it, and not only that I would share it, before the MIBs came knocking on my door.    ;)
 
EM
the mib? LMFAO  come on... you can do better than that. :)