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Conventional alternative energy systems => clean fossil fuel energy systems => Topic started by: hartiberlin on May 06, 2012, 06:05:28 AM

Title: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: hartiberlin on May 06, 2012, 06:05:28 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dW0moXn9y9U


This is a movie which shows Dennis Lee demonstrate a lawnmower engine modified with a Pantone Geet kit and running

CLOSED LOOP WITHOUT ANY EXHAUSTS !

(it is coming from a Video from his 2006 Better World Technologies tour)


So I ask myself:
Why is not every car manufacturer doing these kind of engines nowadays to completely get rid of any air pollution ?

This system just runs with the exhaust ball valve closed so there are no exhaust fumes coming out !
The CO2 exhaust fumes are probably decomposed and cracked again in the hot Geet tube and also water pyrolysis into hydrogen and oxygen takes place there so the hydrocarbons are burned much better than in a normal combustion engine.

Imagine how clean our cities could be, if every car manufacturer is forced to build your next car engine like this WITHOUT ANY POLLUTION OUTPUT !

But as these fuel cracker and vapouriser systems also have a too high Miles per Gallon
ratio, the oil industries dont like it and car manufacturers are forced to build cars with low MPG ratios and much more fuel consumption and the exhaust pollutes our breathing air and small kids gets lung deseases already in very early age !

Imagine how much better the world could be with these kind of engines WITHOUT ANY EXHAUST !

There are other guys who have got these GEET modifications also to run without any exhaust and also some even without any fresh air input.

Have a look also at these examples:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4P1saTDqDJw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4P1saTDqDJw)
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enOFP9z_0cU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enOFP9z_0cU)

This is the only way ICE engines will survive for a bit before electromotors will
kick them totally out of business !

Regards., Stefan.

P.S. The story with the EPA is a scandal ! Please share this and tell all your friends about it !
Many thanks !

German language article about it:

http://www.overunity.de/1420/motor-ohne-abgase-looped-pantome-geet-warum-hat-... (http://www.overunity.de/1420/motor-ohne-abgase-looped-pantome-geet-warum-hat-das-noch-nicht-jedes-auto/)
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: e2matrix on May 06, 2012, 06:17:05 PM
Having seen Pantone in the late 90's I was not very impressed.  He couldn't get the engine started.  However I think his involvement with some other questionable technologies did more to damage his credibility in my mind.  That being said I do believe his device works to both reduce pollution greatly and to possibly use water as well as other liquids for fuel.  However it seems the engines have little power.  Has anyone ever converted a car engine and gotten it to run down the road?  I see he is now giving away free plans not only for the lawnmower size engine but a full size car engine.  I heard he got put in jail a while back for fraud I believe.  Of course that may have simply been suppression forces at work. A number of Geet web sites seem to be missing.  This technology seems simpler than many HHO systems so if it has real world usefulness why isn't there more interest.  Having Dennis Lee promoting it is not the most confidence inspiring plan either.  With Lee's reputation and style it probably does more harm than good if people know about him.  I do realize Lee may be another casualty of suppression forces but his long ago promised magnet motor generator has never seen the light of day.   
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: norman6538 on May 07, 2012, 12:03:45 AM
This is real basic - an engine has to have oxygen - therefore ask yourself where the oxygen comes from. I've seen this myself and came to the conclusion that it comes from crankcase
leakage up past the piston. Remember a gas engine is a vacuum sucker when the piston goes down. I doubt that you can do any more than run a stationary engine this way. Driving down
the highway is probably not possible due to more oxygen is required than would be possible to leak past the piston.
  My real problem with GEET is that I know of no dealer driving a GEET vehicle and saving gas even though I have personally known 3 dealers who gave up on GEET.

I made a GEET mower and bought and paid for Pantone plans and the result was not better than a vapor carburetor at 30% longer runtime than stock gas and carb but Coleman camping fuel will get double the runtime on a vapor carburetor on a small lawn mower with a govenor.

Norman
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: NerzhDishual on May 07, 2012, 03:58:58 AM
Hi Harti-Berlin,

Thanks for these vids.

I do know that this Geet is very criticized, mocked and derided.
Was not Paul Pantone jailed?
Right.
For fraud?
Any proof?

Actually this Geet has been very successfully replicated and improved
by some witty French experimenters.

For my part, I'm not impressed at all with this 'know it all'
individual aka E2matrix.

Very best from Brest
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: e2matrix on May 07, 2012, 06:26:20 PM
Hi Harti-Berlin,

Thanks for these vids.

I do know that this Geet is very criticized, mocked and derided.
Was not Paul Pantone jailed?
Right.
For fraud?
Any proof?

Actually this Geet has been very successfully replicated and improved
by some witty French experimenters.

For my part, I'm not impressed at all with this 'know it all'
individual aka E2matrix.

Very best from Brest
That's funny.  Where did I claim or even act like a 'know it all'?  If you have read many of my posts you would see I am one of the first to admit I don't have nearly as much knowledge as many here have.  I was simply sharing my experience and was basically saying the same as you and others here on the viability of Geet technology.  I am sure there are some people here trying to impress others with their knowledge or skills but I am not one of them.  I'm sure any one who has been around this forum and other energy forums for a while would certainly agree with that.   

   If you are referring the the French experimenter I have seen in a youtube then I would agree that some have taken the basic concept and improved on it.  I had forgotten about that person.  See ?  I can't even remember it all let alone 'know it all'  LOL...
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: gauschor on May 07, 2012, 06:49:32 PM
I think that automobile industries would use this feature if it worked. Afaik there's also a limit for exhaust (at least in some european countries) for automobiles, and it seems the specific industries try to keep the exhaust fumes low if possible.
You must think that way: everyone wants his products to be the best and sold the most. Everyone wants to be praised and advertised. And a car with this feature would get a lot of public recognition and official notice. If you watch the common car advertisements all of them are "en par" with exhaust. Obviously they got nothing better. These industries also have an army for research and development, so they are not completely ignorant.
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: ruin41 on May 08, 2012, 12:05:43 AM
Looking at these video's one thing is clear the noise coming out of these motors is far greater than it should be. The noise is clearly exhaust so its coming out somewhere and if you look closely the amount of gas coming through the bubblers isnt anywhere near what is going in. The simplicity of this design is that the exhaust is cooled by the water thus reducing its volume until the water finally heats up. If you cant get enough power from your lawnmower to mow the lawn then what use is the whole system.
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: NerzhDishual on May 10, 2012, 12:35:40 AM
That's funny.  Where did I claim or even act like a 'know it all'?  If you have read many of my posts you would see I am one of the first to admit I don't have nearly as much knowledge as many here have.  I was simply sharing my experience and was basically saying the same as you and others here on the viability of Geet technology.  I am sure there are some people here trying to impress others with their knowledge or skills but I am not one of them.  I'm sure any one who has been around this forum and other energy forums for a while would certainly agree with that.   

   If you are referring the the French experimenter I have seen in a youtube then I would agree that some have taken the basic concept and improved on it.  I had forgotten about that person.  See ?  I can't even remember it all let alone 'know it all'  LOL...
-----------
OK "E2matrix"
Actually, I have not taken the time to read your previous posts. :-[

My apologies.
It should had been a 'language barrier effect' or a paranoiac inclination
of my own.

Sorry and Very Best
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: hartiberlin on July 22, 2013, 12:31:50 AM
Here is another engine running just on its exhaust gases.

The oxygene can also come from the used water via pyrolysis also.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHcm_nUZsOc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHcm_nUZsOc)

So a NO Exhaust engine can work, when it is designed right !

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: markdansie on July 22, 2013, 05:28:02 AM
Hi Stefan
the fuel is still required to power it and the fuel used is directly proportional to the energy stored in that fuel.
There is no magic here other than probably a higher burn efficiency.
Kind regards
Mark



Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: tinman on July 22, 2013, 07:44:25 AM
Hi Stefan
the fuel is still required to power it and the fuel used is directly proportional to the energy stored in that fuel.
There is no magic here other than probably a higher burn efficiency.
Kind regards
Mark
Hi Mark
Looking at Stefan's opening comment to this thread,i think he is concentraiting more on the fact that we can reduce or eliminate emmisions from the exaust. Any system,no matter what,will always have a fuel or energy source. This also means that there can be no OU machine's.It will only be OU until the fuel or energy source is found-much like the solar pannel.
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: markdansie on July 22, 2013, 08:13:13 AM
Hi Tinman
I am a fan of yours and love your work
Kind Regards



Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: TinselKoala on July 22, 2013, 11:28:59 AM
Ditto.
 :)
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: hartiberlin on July 23, 2013, 12:19:08 AM
Yes, Mark, fuel is needed, but no exhaust means no pollution ! .)
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: tinman on July 24, 2013, 11:57:06 PM
If you cant get enough power from your lawnmower to mow the lawn then what use is the whole system.
Done correctly,you can get as much power as you need.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4RMQg0Rj3I
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: GeekMan on April 24, 2015, 10:03:41 PM
This is real basic - an engine has to have oxygen - therefore ask yourself where the oxygen comes from. I've seen this myself and came to the conclusion that it comes from crankcase
leakage up past the piston. Remember a gas engine is a vacuum sucker when the piston goes down. I doubt that you can do any more than run a stationary engine this way. Driving down
the highway is probably not possible due to more oxygen is required than would be possible to leak past the piston.
  My real problem with GEET is that I know of no dealer driving a GEET vehicle and saving gas even though I have personally known 3 dealers who gave up on GEET.

I made a GEET mower and bought and paid for Pantone plans and the result was not better than a vapor carburetor at 30% longer runtime than stock gas and carb but Coleman camping fuel will get double the runtime on a vapor carburetor on a small lawn mower with a govenor.

Norman

I believe you are correct, Norman.

I developed the first closed-loop lawnmower for Paul Pantone. It was the first in the world at the time. All others I've seen online use my same basic design with small modifications such as to the bubbler. Paul's probably made a fortune selling my plans knowing him, lol.

I demonstrated that lawnmower at a some alternative energy conference in CA, at a gas engine fair in PA and later for three NASA scientists at my friend's house in MD. Two of the NASA scientists were amazed, one was rightly skeptical. All three should have been skeptical. The exhaust/air had to come and go from/to somewhere. The crankcase is most likely.

I also demonstrated it at a university (NJIT) for a professor. We fired it up inside his lab. After closing off the exhaust, there was no exhaust smell at all yet it ran for 5-10 minutes very quietly. However, I now attribute the lack of exhaust smell to it being run off a bubbler which is cleaner than running off the straight gasoline fuel. And yet it never would have had the power to mow a lawn. That's the problem with all bubblers so far as I'm aware... greatly reduced power. The power was reduced substantially, as it is with all the GEET engines I've ever seen and worked on -- especially so-called "closed-loop" motors. GEET, to me, is pure sleight of hand. It works because it's a bubbler, not because it's a "GEET reactor" or any such nonsense. I've never seen anyone prove the GEET itself does anything except maybe get really hot and vaporize the fuel some more, but that's nothing esoteric or new. Again, to me, it's trickery.

I was also commissioned to create a "closed-loop" generator as well (extremely finicky). While it worked, the power as with the lawnmower, was greatly reduced.

That was a long time ago, so I can't provide many more specifics from memory, but suffice to say, Dennis Lee is running a carnival sideshow act with this stuff (as usual). Let's see him mow a lawn and prove the crankcase isn't allowing air to come in an escape. He won't be able to without some form of deception or B.S.

Also, while I did not patent the design (there's no point, as the power loss was huge), I can certainly prove I was the first to develop the closed-loop lawnmower design, as I got my plans notarized long before anyone else was doing this stuff.

I appreciate when people interject common sense into discussions like these, as this stuff is hard enough without getting into fanciful thinking about it. One needs to be very skeptical and discerning, especially when working on it themselves. It's easy to believe something's happening when it's not. Real scientific thinking is important. One should be very skeptical of all claims and they should be backed up by an independent lab if possible, else you can end up wasting a lot of time, money and energy as you try to reproduce something that never worked in the first place.

All this said, there are some cool technologies that do use vacuum chambers that can effectively transmute elements at low temperatures (which Paul claimed, yet never proved). Walter Russell demonstrated this to Westinghouse around 1930 and it was repeated by Toby Grotz and Dr. Tim Binder in the 90s.
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: ramset on April 24, 2015, 10:58:51 PM
GeekMan
quote
and it was repeated by Toby Grotz and Dr. Tim Binder in the 90s.
end quote
Sir ,thank you for your input and contribution here, do you have any more info specific to the above reference ?


respectfully

Chet K
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: GeekMan on April 24, 2015, 11:21:03 PM
GeekMan
quote
and it was repeated by Toby Grotz and Dr. Tim Binder in the 90s.
end quote
Sir ,thank you for your input and contribution here, do you have any more info specific to the above reference ?


respectfully

Chet K

Here ya go, Chet. Let me know if you need anything further:

http://merlib.org/node/5070
6. A METHOD FOR TRANSMUTATION OF ELEMENTS
Changing atomic elements or making elements appear mysteriously? It sounds like impossible alchemy, but experimenters recently did this, without Big Science particle accelerators. These scientists learned from a metaphysician, Walter Russell (1871-1963). During vivid spiritual experiences, Russell had seen everything in the universe, from the atom to outer space, being formed by an invisible background geometry. Russell not only portrayed his visions in paintings, he also learned science. He was so far ahead that in 1926 he predicted tritium, deuterium, neptunium, plutonium and other elements.

Recently, professional engineers Ron Kovac and Toby Grotz of Colorado, with help from Dr. Tim Binder, repeated Russell's 1927 work, which was verified at the time by Westinghouse Laboratories. Russell found a novel way to change the ratio of hydrogen to oxygen in water vapor inside a sealed quartz tube, or to change the vapor to completely different elements. Their conclusion agrees with Russell: the geometry of motion in space is important in atomic transmutation. Kovac shorthands that idea to geometry of space-bending.

These modern shape-shifters speak of Russell's feats such as prolate or oblate the oxygen nucleus into nitrogen or hydrogen or vice versa. To change nuclei, they change the shape of a magnetic field. Although they used expensive analyzing equipment, it is basically tabletop science. No atom-smashing cyclotron needed; just a gentle nudge using the right frequencies. Focus and un-focus light-motion, create a vortex and control it.

Cold fusion researchers are also running across strange elements popping up in their own electrified brews. No one is proposing to make gold and upset world currencies, but some experimenters aim to clean up radioactive waste by their novel processes.

-----

Toby Grotz article:
VIDEO PRESENTATION

A complete explanation and visual presentation is available from the SPA video tape library. Order the presentation made by Toby Grotz at the Milwaukee conference titled, "Transmutation Of Elements Using Dual Polarity Control And Walter Russell's Experiments With An Over Unity Device" The video is available for $20.00 plus $3.00 shipping from: USPA Tapes, 993 West 1800 North, Pleasant Grove, UT 84062, Phone: (810) 785-5130.

Further information may be obtained by contacting the author, Toby Grotz (303) 824-6834, or by writing to 820 Bridger Circle, Craig, CO 81625

----

Grotz, Toby, Tim Binder, et Ron Kovac, (1992), "Novel Means of Hydrogen Production Using Dual Polarity Control and Walter Russell's Experiments with Zero Point Energy," 27th IECEC, pages 4.339-4.344.

Binder, Timothy, (1993), "Transmutation of the Elements, A Modern Alchemical Team's Experiments with the concepts of Walter Russell", Proceedings IANS pp.107-134.
Binder, Timothy - Russell's Nuclear-Magnetic Transmutation Experiments - ISNE 1993

Grotz, Toby - Russell's Power Multiplication Principle Experiments IECEC 1992, ISNE1993
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: norman6538 on April 25, 2015, 01:42:38 AM
Thank you Geekman for your excellent down to earth common sense comments.
Its hard to get that kind of report among all the hype that Pantone drummed up.

The French have done some enhancing on tractors and are having good results.

But I like Naudin's bingo fuel that is made by an elec arc welder that is powered
on that same bingo fuel by a gas engine generator.  But I can't figure out why
no one has done anything further with that idea.

Thanks again.

Norman
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: ramset on April 25, 2015, 05:28:55 PM
GeekMan
I echo Normans post and add many thanks for the links
do you still experiment?

some of us have a strong affection for the ICE and variants and are working on emulsifications, Papp and similar  type systems, all for open source .

respectfully

Chetkremens@gmail.com

 
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: GeekMan on April 26, 2015, 06:55:52 PM
GeekMan
I echo Normans post and add many thanks for the links
do you still experiment?

some of us have a strong affection for the ICE and variants and are working on emulsifications, Papp and similar  type systems, all for open source .

respectfully

Chetkremens@gmail.com

Hi Chet. I haven't experimented in quite a while. I'm focused on getting financially independent first so I can really focus on creating something truly worthwhile in terms of alt energy. I am partial towards hydrogen generation, personally. I think it's a great fuel, especially when it can be created on-demand in a safe, efficient way.

When I was more involved in this stuff, I worked with a friend who was a former Navy Seal. He built an electrolysis unit from which he ran his pickup truck for over 100,000 miles on tap water. The only problem (from my perspective, though not his apparently) is that he was storing the generated hydrogen in an inflatable air mattress in the bed of his pickup truck. All it would take would be one stray cigarette and boom. End of story. But, he died three times in battle anyway, so he wasn't exactly the wussy type. He used pure gold in his electrolysis device. A lot of it. It was very, very expensive and not economically feasible for any kind of mass production, but it worked for him. He was a neat guy, but I lost touch with him and can't even remember his name now, unfortunately. It's not every day a guy shows you his Uzi, tells you about the compartment in his teeth put there to hold a cyanide capsule or shows you a bunch of bullet and stab wounds. Definitely hard core.

I plan to get in touch with Francisco Pucheco's grandson, Edmundo, to see if I can access some of Francisco's electrolysis prototypes and notes. If I can replicate and scale that up, I plan to see if I can work with our town council to run parts of our town on sea water. I'd love to have it power something like this: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/videos/2014-11-21/cities-of-the-future-may-eat-plants-grown-in-air

Geek Man
Title: Re: NO EXHAUST Engine - Closed loop Pantone Geet engine
Post by: ramset on April 27, 2015, 12:58:47 AM

GeekMan

wild stuff...also very intriguing.. I do like your Plant growing link too.
I don't think you should wait for that Financial independence..

I'm sending you a PM

Thanks
Chet