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Author Topic: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect  (Read 28312 times)

Offline andreas_varesi

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #15 on: May 13, 2005, 11:50:47 PM »
Hi Kysmett,

the idea of the patent was to use very small piezzo elements with only some hundred nanometers. Than the local pressure variations should be strong enough to generate a constant current. If you try to rebuild this effect within a larger scale the classical laws of thermodynamics are valid and nothing will happen. Only if you go down to nanometers you can utilize the kinetic theory of gases. And this is exactly the problem for non industrial research - we don't have the possibilities to proof our own theories.

Best regards

Andreas

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #15 on: May 13, 2005, 11:50:47 PM »

Offline Kysmett

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #16 on: May 17, 2005, 10:18:04 PM »
I wonder how one would structure the material...I say material because I see the end product somewhat like velvet.  A flexible fabric sub-structure with tiny, piezo nano hairs on it.  If worn, or flown from a flagpole, you would get more than just ambiant prssure flux....hmmmm... will have to cook on this some more.  Textile manufacture seems to play a large part in my mental picture however.  The remaining question lies thus:  How dificult would it prove to actually make (or grow) some of this stuff on a fabric?

Offline swankpower

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #17 on: May 17, 2005, 11:37:44 PM »
The Michael Jennsen patent is available to view on the following link

http://v3.espacenet.com/textdoc?DB=EPODOC&IDX=DE19942739&F=0

If there is any trouble downloading it I could post the PDF version.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #17 on: May 17, 2005, 11:37:44 PM »
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Offline andreas_varesi

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2005, 09:02:18 AM »
Hi Kysmett,

the idea of a velvet like piezo structure sounds very reasonable. But even if you can produce such a material, the next problem is to rectify the alternating voltage. Maybe it is possible to combine piezo hairs with nanotubes that work like an diode. GE is leading in developing such devices http://www.azonano.com/details.asp?articleID=996. Maybe there are also other companies who see a chance in surpassing GEs success with this new idea of combining piezo hairs with nanotubes.

Reagards

Andreas

Offline swankpower

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2005, 07:50:22 PM »
The little cells descibed in the patent are evacuated, to make one dimensional pressure, and sealed with an ultrathin membrane. I would think they would only work for a limited spectrum of pressure and gases.


well we know pV=nRT at this 'classical' level. Pressure is dependent on the number of molecules and temperature and independent of the individual molecules size. The heavier the gas we use surrounding the piezo, the slower the gas molecules will travel, communing the same amount of kinetic energy to the walls per second. If we use heavy molecules which are gaseous at room temperature, z.B. Halon gas: Dibromotetrafluoroethane Atomic weight: 259.84, the average velocity of the gas particles is reduced by about three fourths. Lower velocity particles means more time for the piezo to relax back into its resting position, meaning you can use a little larger piezo. Furthermore, if giving the piezo time to relax is an issue, just put fewer molecules surrounding the cells, just enough pressure to push in the piezo.

There are other less reactive refrigerants which could be used, but if you want stability perhaps xenon tetrafluoride, but thats not a household ingredient like refrigerants.

In case you're wondering where I got that three-fourths figure, I used:
1/2*m1*v1^2=1/2*m2*v2^2 to get
v1=v2*(m2/m1)^(1/2)
try m2=16 (oxygen), m1=260(Dibromotetrafluoroethane), v1=.25*v2

Regards,
Andrew

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2005, 07:50:22 PM »
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Offline swankpower

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2005, 12:11:20 AM »
Using the piezo design guide from piezo-kinetics, http://www.piezo-kinetics.com/Catalog_pages_15-26.pdf, I calculated the patent's piezo with an outer diameter of .1mm and inner diameter of .033mm to produce on average 121mV in standard temperature and pressure, assuming that the foil diaphragm allows the strike area to be the full diameter of the piezo, .1mm. I didn't see how the foil extending outward from the outer diameter of the piezo to the flush ceramic base could help produce a force, since it would be bending in this area, negating pressure force. I can see why the inventor had trouble getting substantial voltages, when using a steel foil as the diaphragm. Mechanical stress could oppose some of the pressure force.

Offline lanca

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #21 on: May 27, 2005, 12:41:51 AM »
high guys, i found -years before-the patentschrift dd287597.
for global interests-i,for myself think it-could be the dd286012
similar to the solar-cycle(carl friedrich von Weizsaecker,club of rome)
but "fuer die friedliche Nutzung" of the surrounded ambient energy
without great costs and sustainable.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #21 on: May 27, 2005, 12:41:51 AM »
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Offline andreas_varesi

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #22 on: May 30, 2005, 05:17:17 PM »
Look also at "Piezoelectric energy" http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,121.0.html. There are also some interesting information listed.

Regards

Andreas Varesi

Offline lanca

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #23 on: May 31, 2005, 02:28:40 AM »
what is,without words,in a real tridimensional explanation "piezo-electric"?
The reverse mode of the liquid iron demonstration(Don Adsitt),material stress noise?
thermovoltaic=thermalnoise
thermic=motion,maxwell/boltzmann;


























Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #23 on: May 31, 2005, 02:28:40 AM »
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Offline Enoch

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #24 on: July 20, 2005, 02:28:53 PM »
Hello to all,
Look at the patent #413,353 of Tesla.
Simple method to rectify the AC to DC current using a modified transformer.

Offline kinggeorge

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    • CosmicSalamander
Wiegand wires
« Reply #25 on: September 04, 2007, 12:37:34 AM »
Wiegand wires or similar bistable magnetic elements and permeate magnets would be better, as it is easy to get 5 volt pulses.
George King
georgeking@cosmicsalamander.com

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Wiegand wires
« Reply #25 on: September 04, 2007, 12:37:34 AM »
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Offline Vortex1

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Re: Heat conversion by using piezzo effect
« Reply #26 on: November 18, 2007, 05:46:18 PM »
Perhaps you will find this article interesting(attached pdf) . It was published in Wireless World late 80's or early 90's. I called Pennwalt to see if John Scott Strachan still worked there when I was director of research and development at another company during that period. They said he no longer worked there and had no record of how he might be contacted. They were kind enough to send me some samples of the piezofilm. I have not performed any of Strachan's experiments although this method, if it works, would be ripe for development. The magazine chose to place the words "Hypothesis" at the top of each page, I suppose as a disclaimer. John Scott Strachan has several patents. For this google CA 2003318 patent application.

Best of Luck in your research.........V
« Last Edit: November 18, 2007, 06:59:42 PM by Vortex1 »

 

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