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Author Topic: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.  (Read 848944 times)

Offline fuzzytomcat

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #945 on: March 13, 2012, 01:14:20 AM »
Hi guys,

Here are some other PDF's on batteries which are very good ....

New Dynamical Models of Lead–Acid Batteries ( 1.pdf )
Abstract—This paper documents the main results of studies that
have been carried out, during a period of more than a decade, at
University of Pisa in co-operation with other technical Italian institutions,
about models of electrochemical batteries suitable for the
use of the electrical engineer, in particular for the analysis of electrical
systems with batteries.
The problem of simulating electrochemical batteries by means
of equivalent electric circuits is defined in a general way; then particular
attention is then devoted to the problem of modeling of
Lead–Acid batteries.
For this kind of batteries general model structure is defined from
which specific models can be inferred, having different degrees of
complexity and simulation quality.
In particular, the implementation of the third-order model, that
shows a good compromise between complexity and precision, is developed
in detail.
The behavior of the proposed models is compared with results
obtained with extensive lab tests on different types of lead–acid
batteries.

Behavior of the Lead Acid Battery after the Rest Period   ( 25-509.pdf )
Abstract: - This paper presents the characteristics of a lead acid battery regarding the charge that it can release.
It is desired to determine the effect of the rest period on the charge released by the battery.
For this purpose a series of experiments that contain at least one rest period are presented.
In each of them the charge released is counted, depending on the time when the rest period is started.
It is pointed out that, every battery can release a charge close to its theoretical capacity if the discharge contains rest periods

Fuzzy
 8)

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #946 on: March 13, 2012, 01:35:45 AM »
A brief summary of my results so far:
I built the circuit using 2n7000 mosfets and some random inductances for the load, and a low-voltage battery pack instead of Rosemary's large one. I was interested only in waveforms, not heating of the load. I found that I could easily produce waveforms of oscillations that look identical to those shown in Rosemary's demonstration video, same magnitude and everything, but at lower _baseline_ voltages due to my smaller battery pack. These oscillations occurred only when FGs were used to switch or bias the mosfets, even using DC from the F-43 FG. No oscillations occurred when the mosfets were biased negatively or positively with DC from a battery or a regulated PS.
The oscillations followed the FG's output in phase but could be shifted 180 degrees by changing the DC offset of the FG's output. The oscillations were indeed "robust" and "continuous"... as long as the FG was used to switch the mosfets. Both mosfets heat up while the FG is used... regardless of whether the battery pack is used.
LEDs in the circuit could be made to light up at various offset settings, but only with both the FG and the 3v battery pack in the circuit-- the battery pack is needed to complete the circuit thru the LEDs, but the power to light them is coming from the FG.
A 100 pF capacitor in series with the positive FG lead completely eliminates the oscillation and the lighting of the LEDs while still allowing a nice square wave to appear on the output at my operating frequency of 1 kHz. The capacitor of course _Blocks the DC Current_ flowing through the FG while allowing the +/- square wave pulses to get through and drive the gates. This radically reduced the drawdown in the FG's output voltage--- I can use 40 V p-p if I like --- and eliminated the LED lighting while preserving the basic output waveform, minus the superposed oscillations. And the mosfets appear to run cooler.
My conclusion is that the oscillations shown in Rosemary's video are probably caused by the same effect as those I am seeing, and that the Function Generator itself is providing substantial power to Rosemary's load in her demonstration. Also, since she and her team have apparently grossly overstated the energy required to heat up her water..... the fact that the batteries don't run down detectably isn't surprising at all... nor is it indication of "infinite COP" or any other excess energy claim.


Oh... wait... I forgot. I used the wrong mosfets. The magic IRFPG50 must be used. Right?
Well, then why do my oscillations look identical to those in Rosie's video?

(The 2n7000 does have an internal body diode effect just like the bigger cousin, it just isn't normally shown on the diagram of the 2n7000.)

Offline poynt99

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #947 on: March 13, 2012, 02:03:13 AM »
GL.

Your circuit simulated.   :)

Shown running on 1.5V supply. Runs also on 12V supply. The scope is inverted, but otherwise same wave form.

.99

Offline Groundloop

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #948 on: March 13, 2012, 02:21:03 AM »
GL.

Your circuit simulated.   :)

Shown running on 1.5V supply. Runs also on 12V supply. The scope is inverted, but otherwise same wave form.

.99

.99

I did scope on my L3 coil so I got the sinus wave upside down. You simulation runs very much like my circuit.
What worries me with my circuit is that I can't use the output from the L3 coil to make a negative bias
voltage so that I can get rid of the bias battery. The power this mosfet switch did transfer through
my L1 coil is almost nothing so I can't get any real output to drive a load. I also did notice that I had a
range for the input voltage that the oscillator did run. In my setup this was from +1,2 volt up to +5,8 volt.
Above that voltage the oscillator did not run.

Thanks for doing the simulation.

GL.

Offline poynt99

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #949 on: March 13, 2012, 02:24:59 AM »
I'm going to continue this on your OUR thread. There's more I need to show you.

.99

Offline Rosemary Ainslie

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #950 on: March 13, 2012, 03:17:20 AM »
Guys - another LONG reply.  But it deserves no less.   I'll split the posts.  Maybe that'll help.  LOL

A brief summary of my results so far:
I built the circuit using 2n7000 mosfets and some random inductances for the load, and a low-voltage battery pack instead of Rosemary's large one. I was interested only in waveforms, not heating of the load. I found that I could easily produce waveforms of oscillations that look identical to those shown in Rosemary's demonstration video, same magnitude and everything, but at lower _baseline_ voltages due to my smaller battery pack.
Not sure what TK means.  Our oscillations are ONLY generated on the negative triggering - and their voltages, measured across the battery FAR exceed the battery voltages.  TK's barely managed one volt each at either peak and on either side of the battery base line.

These oscillations occurred only when FGs were used to switch or bias the mosfets, even using DC from the F-43 FG.
'bias'?... Is he referring to the MOSFETs?  And one would actually expect the MOSFETs to 'switch' with an applied signal.  No surprises there.  Surely?

No oscillations occurred when the mosfets were biased negatively or positively with DC from a battery or a regulated PS.
We DO see an oscillation with an applied DC from a battery operated 555.  And. We do NOT see an oscillation from the function generator when the battery supply is disconnected.  The signal probe and the scope probes appear to be in a coincident position on the circuit to TK's.  And, incidentally.  When the two probes are connected - but the battery is still disconnected - as shown on his video - then one wonders how signal voltage reduces?  I would have thought that can only happen when and if there's an applied load. 

Offline Rosemary Ainslie

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #951 on: March 13, 2012, 04:16:21 AM »
I couldn't get back here for the last half hour or so.  Something's seriously wrong with Harti's system.  Anyway.  Here's the next installment.
The oscillations followed the FG's output in phase but could be shifted 180 degrees by changing the DC offset of the FG's output. The oscillations were indeed "robust" and "continuous"... as long as the FG was used to switch the mosfets.
INDEED.  One would EXPECT an applied signal would be required.  I would have thought?

Both mosfets heat up while the FG is used... regardless of whether the battery pack is used.
Again.  We cannot get any kind of oscillation while the battery is disconnected.  I’m beginning to suspect that there’s some hidden connection there. Probably not intended.  LOL.

LEDs in the circuit could be made to light up at various offset settings, but only with both the FG and the 3v battery pack in the circuit
Again.  Surely one would hardly expect the LED's to light if there was no circuit path provided?  Isn't that self-evident? 

Offline Rosemary Ainslie

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #952 on: March 13, 2012, 04:19:20 AM »
and the next/...

-- the battery pack is needed to complete the circuit thru the LEDs, but the power to light them is coming from the FG.
That's assumed.  Not proved.  We have used a dual rail of LED's  in series with the battery supply.  In other words they could pick up the power in either direction.  Only one rail lights and it  stays lit continuously during the oscillation phase.

A 100 pF capacitor in series with the positive FG lead
Not sure what is meant by a 'postive FG lead'?  Hopefully he'll explain this.  In due course.  And. If one applies a cap in series with the signal output - if that's what he's referring to - wouldn't that completely obviate the applied signal? 

Which means that...
completely eliminates the oscillation and the lighting of the LEDs while still allowing a nice square wave to appear on the output at my operating frequency of 1 kHz.
…it would most certainly prevent the applied signal - that 'nice square wave' from reaching the circuit.  That's assuming that this is the 'nice square wave' that he's referring to.  This whole para is a bit vague.

The capacitor of course _Blocks the DC Current_ flowing through the FG while allowing the +/- square wave pulses to get through and drive the gates. This radically reduced the drawdown in the FG's output voltage--- I can use 40 V p-p if I like --- and eliminated the LED lighting while preserving the basic output waveform, minus the superposed oscillations. And the mosfets appear to run cooler.
I think what he's trying to say is that his signal at the function generators persists?  Golly.  Why should he expect otherwise?  He's measuring an applied signal.  LOL.  If the MOSFETs are cool - then it's because they're not being triggered.  I'd be surprised if he found anything else. 

Offline Rosemary Ainslie

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #953 on: March 13, 2012, 04:21:16 AM »
 
My conclusion is that the oscillations shown in Rosemary's video are probably caused by the same effect as those I am seeing, and that the Function Generator itself is providing substantial power to Rosemary's load in her demonstration.
Not an entirely scientific conclusion.  That use of the word 'PROBABLY'?  I would have thought that it's a bit vague.  It's easy to test the output.  Just put a small shunt there and check the current.  LOL.  More to the point - just measure the output voltage shown at the signal.  Not need to thumb suck.  Just measure it. I would have thought?
 
 
Also, since she and her team have apparently grossly overstated the energy required to heat up her water.....
We've never OVERSTATED this.  How can we?  Surely?  We all know EXACTLY how much energy it takes to heat water.  LOL I'm not at all sure what he's trying to imply?  Strangely full of innuendo and no substance.  Is this a propagandising trick?  I certainly hope not.  I think he needs to explain this.  Whatever next?  8) :o

Offline Rosemary Ainslie

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #954 on: March 13, 2012, 04:22:50 AM »
this is the last one.  I actually made them all too small.  But rather err in that direction.  Sorry guys.

the fact that the batteries don't run down detectably isn't surprising at all... nor is it indication of "infinite COP" or any other excess energy claim.
Again.  That's ASSUMPTION.  We'd prefer to test this under well defined experimental conditions.  Wouldn't that be more in keeping with science.  Or is TK rather hoping that his  'probability' assessments as sufficient compensation for experimental evidence or scientific fact?  Surely not?

Oh... wait... I forgot. I used the wrong mosfets. The magic IRFPG50 must be used. Right? Well, then why do my oscillations look identical to those in Rosie's video?
I'm delighted to see that TK has FINALLY realised this. I've been telling people this since FOREVER.  But with the caveat that they use a FET with a body diode - or that they apply one - in the absence of this.

(The 2n7000 does have an internal body diode effect just like the bigger cousin, it just isn't normally shown on the diagram of the 2n7000.
There you go.  It’s like I’ve been saying. REPEATEDLY. LOL.  On this point, AT LEAST it seems that TK's assessment and our own - COINCIDE.  That’s 1 more than nothing.  Which is a hundred percent better. What a pleasure. 

Kindest regards
Rosie

Offline poynt99

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #955 on: March 13, 2012, 04:50:04 AM »
We have used a dual rail of LED's  in series with the battery supply.  In other words they could pick up the power in either direction.  Only one rail lights and it  stays lit continuously during the oscillation phase.

Of course only one LED stays lit, the one pointing to the circuit.

Offline Rosemary Ainslie

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #956 on: March 13, 2012, 04:55:47 AM »
Rosemary,

You've cleverly dodged my question 5 times. Remember, the one about what your implied significance is of the oscillation in the simulations? Nicely done.  ;)

Let's review those dodgy responses:
Your technique is somewhat subtle (but abuntantly obvious), yet effective. How or where did you learn this technique?I asked nicely 5 times, and all 5 times my question was deflected. Clearly you are uncomfortable answering that question

Hi Poynty Point.  Always a pleasure to hear from you.  But ALL THOSE QUESTIONS?  And ALL THOSE SAMPLES? Golly.  You've been busy.  But you left out this one.
I've no idea.  Someone called Poynty Point?  Or is that Poynt.99 RECURRING?  But I've no idea who he is.  Just a talking head - somewhere in Canada - who hides behind an internet personality while he tries to kill off 12 years of hard work - my good name - and any potential advantages in some technology that I'm trying to progress.  And he uses tactics of calumny, traducement, misinformation, misdirection, denial, or anything to hand.  I also know that he's in the process of being sued by a certain John Bedini for similar indulgences of public defamation.  And - in the fullness of time - I hope to manage an action of my own.

LOL

added
Actually I also know that he's now DELETED HIS CALUMNY in the light of this action.  Would that I could be that effective.  But I'll bide my time.  I'm assured that all good things come to those that wait.  And God knows I've been waiting. :'(

Hopefully that explains it.   ;D

Rosie Pose.
 :-*

Offline Rosemary Ainslie

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #957 on: March 13, 2012, 05:21:14 AM »
LOL.  Guys,

It seems that ONLY I AM REQUIRED TO BE ACCURATE.  :o But it's a burden that I'll bear with PLEASURE.  Provided only that this topic is then taken seriously by our manifold TROLLS.  It seems that I must war with full force of their elite army.  LOL.  Would that the odds were better stacked AGAINST me.  That, at least, would present a challenge.  ::)

And as if any further nails would seal the coffin any tighter....

Putting a small capacitor in series with the "positive" FG connection kills all oscillations by blocking the DC current path through the FG.
regarding this last comment.  It's nice to see that TK now acknowledges the fact that the cap simply denies a path for the signal.   But I've covered that in my earlier post.  He seems to have some need to 'repeat' this?  Over and over?  For some reason?  Like the discharge of water from a water pistol.  Continuous but uncomfortably damp.  Anyway.  Moving on.

ETA: I notice that lately Rosie is denying that her oscillations occur when the battery is disconnected. But earlier, when asked about this point, she said something different.

Quoting Rosemary:
Am I allowed to ask which statement is true.... or would that be expressing rampant pseudoskepticism again?

I wonder if someone could explain to TK that there is a 'disconnect' from the battery supply when the switch at the MOSFET Q1 is open.  And by disconnect I only mean that the battery can't deliver a current.  I would have thought that was self-evident.  I think, in retrospect, he's sort of relied on the possibility that our claim ALSO covered the option of the supply being physically out of the system.  LOL.  Who would have thought?  And YET - he's managed to show us that.  I think we should all demand to see the full circuit schematic and some detail as to the parts used.  It's all rather vague.

Kindest regards,
Rosie

By the way (BTW) - it's nice to see the use of adventurous terminologies.  pseudoscepticism.  That's really good.  To the best of my knowledge - I've never even implied this.  If anything it means a 'pretended' disbelief.  And I realise that TK is now acknowledging this.  How refreshingly honest. 

Offline poynt99

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #958 on: March 13, 2012, 05:29:48 AM »
Hopefully that explains it.   ;D

Explains what?, my question? No it doesn't.

Just like water off a duck there Rosemary.  ;)

Anyway, by not answering, you've still provided an answer. ;)

Offline Rosemary Ainslie

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Re: another small breakthrough on our NERD technology.
« Reply #959 on: March 13, 2012, 05:30:30 AM »
Of course only one LED stays lit, the one pointing to the circuit.

Poynty Point.  You say OF COURSE?  That means that your accede that the the current is flowing in both directions through the that rail of LED's notwithstanding their polarity?  Because what I'm telling you is that NOT ONLY does only that one rail light up.  It also STAYS permanently lit.  Even TK's video sample showed evidence of this.  Not sure why you should all find this of so little interest?  But there you go.  One can take the horse to water - but that's about it.

Kindest regards as it's much needed
Rosie Pose.