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Author Topic: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells  (Read 762674 times)

jbignes5

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #675 on: March 02, 2012, 03:18:47 AM »
I depends on the meteorite..


 Check the structure of this piece:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Widmanstatten_hand.jpg

PhiChaser

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #676 on: March 02, 2012, 06:49:46 AM »
@ IB: If hematite is the material, what about trying hematite rings? (Or are those some kind of ground up-recombined hematite?) Break those rings in half maybe? How well does aluminum work with hematite? Gotta go watch your videos, I haven't had time!!
Bismuth huh? Awesome job! (EDIT: Niiiiice!!! Nevermind the aluminum question...)

Got a bunch of stuff in the mail I ordered today. So far the microamp (0-500uA) meter (vintage triplet) is the only one my cells will move. Lucky I got one of those although I have a sweet vintage Honeywell (0-2.0mA) that I haven't tried out yet but will probably see a lot of use (I hope). Busy RL!! Maybe tomorrow or the weekend will allow more measurements etc.
Happy experimenting everyone,
PC

Sunglasses

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« Reply #677 on: March 02, 2012, 07:07:25 AM »
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jbignes5

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #678 on: March 02, 2012, 03:12:48 PM »


 After looking at several batteries I know think I know whats going on and it agrees with my previous assumptions.


"The action which takes place in an Edison cell, both in charging and discharging, is a transfer of oxygen from one electrode to the other, or from one group of plates to the other, hence this type of cell is sometimes called and oxygenlift cell. In a charged cell the active material of the positive plates is superoxidized, and that of the negative plates is in a spongy or deoxidized state."[/size]

[/size]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potassium-ion_battery
http://www.dataweek.co.za/news.aspx?pklNewsID=597&pklCategoryID=31&pklIssueID=40
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_iron_battery

 It seems to me that oxygen is the charge carrier and water has oxygen in it. The crystalline water has Highly organized oxygen in it. This organization facilitates a better transfer of the standing potentials present from the electrodes. The oxide layer we were using was making a locked layer of oxygen that did not move completely to the electrode when charged. This allowed the charges to bind to the oxygen and rotate around a center point of the lattice. When the charge on the oxygen comes nearer to the electrode it inductively charges the electrode causing more charge to appear on the electrode via electrostatic charging laws. Charges will shift in the electrode imparting planar voltage levels on the electrodes. One side will be -2 volts and the other side or plane will be +2 volts. I would suggest that we use objects that have an inside and outside, with two planes in parallel.

 These batteries are very simple electrostatic devices. Through the electrostatic device it creates a dynamic diode like effect. It indeed works like the video's I showed you earlier with moving oxygen as the vehicle and not the water. The water it seems is the ball bearing and anchor for which the oxygen revolves around and changes the diodes direction. If a third plane was added to the cell it should react much like a transistor does. Hmmm....

NickZ

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #679 on: March 02, 2012, 05:03:24 PM »
 Although water contain oxygen which is resposible for "OXIDATION" it is also be present in the air, so unless a cell is hermetic it will also absorb oxygen from the air, and that will also create a negative effect in the metals.  The oxide layer may help to protect the metals from the open air, as in an air battery, but I have my doubts about its long lasting effects when salts are used in wet electrolytes in sealed, open, or exposed cells.
I feel that the salts will win in the end, and the metals will be dissolved.  This is what I have seen in my salty environment. Of course, this is only my opinion, which will take some time to prove. But I have not seen any layers or protective galvanizing or anything similar that will work long term when combined with salts and water, or even just air.
  What do you think would happen if you put metals that have the protective oxide layers and are then placed in a concentrated salt solution, and then further exposed to the open air? Mush!  Or not? At least if the cells are sealed they will act more like sealed LAB, that can function for many years.  What are we gaining by it all, when you compared to what you can already buy ready-made?
 
  Ib2:  What is needed is to show that by using only voltage in your cells, something useful can be obtained from it. Not just to dimly blink an led on an oscillator, as that has no useful purpose.  Yes, even trees, and rocks, have some energy to them, but it is all due to what is external to them, and how they all interact with the surrounding field energies.
 
                              NickZ

jbignes5

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #680 on: March 02, 2012, 06:12:52 PM »
The Super-iron battery is a new class of rechargeable battery.
"Super-iron" is a moniker for a special kind of iron salt (iron(VI)).Potassium ferrate (K2FeO4) or barium ferrate(BaFeO4), used in this new class of batteries. As of 2004 chemist Stuart Licht of the University of Massachusetts was leading research into a Super-iron battery.Use of ferrate cathodes was tested and patented by Amendola as well as other patents."...the new employs salts of an unusual ionic form of iron — hexavalent or superoxidized iron—that readily accept three electrons per ion, Licht explains. The more electrons the cathodean accept, the more electricity the battery can supply." —Peter Weiss. It uses the same zinc anode and electrolyte as an alkaline battery, but its capacity is around 50% higher.


 Here is it's application:  http://www.ou.edu/class/che-design/a-design/projects-2003/SUPER%20BATTERY-SUMMARY.pdf

ibpointless2

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #681 on: March 03, 2012, 02:13:24 AM »

  Ib2:  What is needed is to show that by using only voltage in your cells, something useful can be obtained from it. Not just to dimly blink an led on an oscillator, as that has no useful purpose.  Yes, even trees, and rocks, have some energy to them, but it is all due to what is external to them, and how they all interact with the surrounding field energies.
 
                              NickZ




I've been thinking very hard on how to make a low amp cell useful and I think I may have a idea. We keep seeing these cells as batteries but they don't give much amps at all so we must stop looking at them as batteries but instead look at them as components. I'll include a picture below of a rough draft of a idea I have to use low power crystal cells as components. 


You have C2 fully charged (1.5V) and powering the circuit. The circuit powers a LED and then it dumps it into C3. The crystal cell is in parallel with C3 and it helps to charge C3 too, the crystal cell puts back in the energy that was lost do to heat from the circuit. The Crystal cell "picks up the slack" and thus puts a higher charge into C3. C3 can now be swapped with C2 so that you can repeat the process. The LED will run for a long time if you swap the capacitors over, the Crystal cell will put the energy in that is loss do to the natural loss of circuits.



This is just a rough idea.

triffid

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #682 on: March 03, 2012, 02:28:32 AM »
My concern is that we do not have the heat that comes with summer right now.I started my experiments in the winter.About the second week of january.So I have not had a chance to see how the heat of a hot car will affect my batteries.I think I will make six more cells using buttermilk in place of vineagar.I realized today too that eyedrop bottles could be used to measure out drops of vineagar or whatever once they are cleaned out.Maybe a couple of bucks for the cheapest eyedrops?Iron could be the key here.Iron rust(iron oxide) should be easy enough to come by.triffid

triffid

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #683 on: March 03, 2012, 02:31:56 AM »
I do see these cells as self charging capacitors if that helps anyone. Someone else here thought of them as diodes once upon a time.triffid

jbignes5

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #684 on: March 03, 2012, 03:05:36 AM »
I do see these cells as self charging capacitors if that helps anyone. Someone else here thought of them as diodes once upon a time.triffid


 I still do lol... But it seems we are retracing discoveries that are previously been discovered. Edison, Stubblefield and even newer discoverers. The earth battery is about the closest thing to the super iron battery. This super iron seems to be a super oxygenated iron that converts between iron(3) and Iron(6). Just like the Edison battery it relies on irons ability to transition between the two very easily.


 These are diodes in all effects. The electrodes hold the potentials that bias the diodes on or allow current flow through the diodes and naturally the diodes leak in a reverse manner. Think of a pipe with holes drilled in it. Create a vacuum and it sucks in the environmental energy via the pipe holes. Except this is a diode. It only allows environment in and not out causing a pulsating flow out of the diode.

NickZ

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #685 on: March 03, 2012, 03:10:45 AM »
  Ib2:
    I have not found much advantage in using capacitors in line with the cells. As they only charge up to the same voltage as is being put out by the cells, and don't really hold that charge more than a few seconds. So, I have not found them to be of help much, in conjunction with these cells.
In any case please do try it out, as there is not much to lose, and everything to gain. the circuit mentioned is not so complicated, and would not take long to build.
  I'm waiting for John B to show us his BwJt circuit, using the transformer idea. 
 
   triffid:  Although some cells are working somewhat similar to capacitors, or diodes, as they are all "one way" directional components, but I have not heard or seen any caps or diodes that can do what some of these cells can do. 
   As you will not get much Current from your series connected multi-cell design,  maybe there is something that can be done, using  mostly voltage, as that you can obtain and is what all of us need to learn how to work with, instead of using current.  Have you built an oscillator circuit to use with your cells? If not, that is what you'll need to do, or you'll find that the cell voltage will drop, and since you have very little current, the leds will go out, even after a short while.

jbignes5

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #686 on: March 03, 2012, 03:12:56 AM »



I've been thinking very hard on how to make a low amp cell useful and I think I may have a idea. We keep seeing these cells as batteries but they don't give much amps at all so we must stop looking at them as batteries but instead look at them as components. I'll include a picture below of a rough draft of a idea I have to use low power crystal cells as components. 


You have C2 fully charged (1.5V) and powering the circuit. The circuit powers a LED and then it dumps it into C3. The crystal cell is in parallel with C3 and it helps to charge C3 too, the crystal cell puts back in the energy that was lost do to heat from the circuit. The Crystal cell "picks up the slack" and thus puts a higher charge into C3. C3 can now be swapped with C2 so that you can repeat the process. The LED will run for a long time if you swap the capacitors over, the Crystal cell will put the energy in that is loss do to the natural loss of circuits.



This is just a rough idea.


 Why not make the cell like a capacitor? That way it can self charge and maybe become stronger in the process.

ibpointless2

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #687 on: March 03, 2012, 03:38:02 AM »
  Ib2:
    I have not found much advantage in using capacitors in line with the cells. As they only charge up to the same voltage as is being put out by the cells, and don't really hold that charge more than a few seconds. So, I have not found them to be of help much, in conjunction with these cells.
In any case please do try it out, as there is not much to lose, and everything to gain. the circuit mentioned is not so complicated, and would not take long to build.
  I'm waiting for John B to show us his BwJt circuit, using the transformer idea. 
 
   triffid:  Although some cells are working somewhat similar to capacitors, or diodes, as they are all "one way" directional components, but I have not heard or seen any caps or diodes that can do what some of these cells can do. 
   As you will not get much Current from your series connected multi-cell design,  maybe there is something that can be done, using  mostly voltage, as that you can obtain and is what all of us need to learn how to work with, instead of using current.  Have you built an oscillator circuit to use with your cells? If not, that is what you'll need to do, or you'll find that the cell voltage will drop, and since you have very little current, the leds will go out, even after a short while.


In the diagram the cell is not in series with the capacitor but instead is in parallel. Putting a cell in series with something is not a good idea. Having the cells in parallel and with a higher voltage will give the results i'm after.

ibpointless2

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #688 on: March 03, 2012, 03:40:34 AM »

 Why not make the cell like a capacitor? That way it can self charge and maybe become stronger in the process.


The cell do act like capacitors. But they hold little charge and putting the cell in series with something like a LED will make the LED go dim as the cell fills up. The cells don't do good in series but they do great in parallel.

PhiChaser

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Re: Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells
« Reply #689 on: March 03, 2012, 05:32:15 AM »
Hey all!
Good things are afoot!! I have tested a bunch of cells today and started taking measurements. That is to say I've taken measurements on more than half of the cells I have made (which is quite a few!). (EDIT:Writing in a journal that is heh heh...)

I have something of a discovery to post here which I think is pretty significant:
While building some cells I decided to make a cell with one anode (1/4" aluminum rod) in the center and TWO cathodes (carbon tubes) in the same electrolyte mix.
The mix at this point is mostly irrelevant. What I think is worth notice is that when I hook up the anode to the black test lead, and then hook the red test lead to one of the cathodes, I get about 0.64v which drops steadily, over the course of a couple minutes, to about 0.41v.
Not exciting until I unhook that red test lead and hook it IMMEDIATELY to the other cathode and see 0.64v, the same reading I saw on the FIRST cathode when I first hooked it up!!! No waiting for recharge... So I hook the two cathodes together just now and it tests like just one cathode!!! The same 0.64v and sinking... Those readings are from a mix that wasn't very successful as far as voltage goes but the point of the test needs to be re-proven.

Help me out guys!!!!

Does this mean we can keep adding cathodes (or anodes???) until we run out of room in the electrolyte? Are you kidding me!?!
If this is the case we can use an anode 'case' full of cathodes!!
I have to go build some test cells to see what is up...
Easy thing to test right? Let me know what you find please!

Happy experimenting,
PC