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Author Topic: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect  (Read 756442 times)

Offline skycollection

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1245 on: April 27, 2013, 12:31:11 AM »
[color=rgb(255, 114, 0) !important]Skycollection[/color] and his behaviour are very consistent with capitalism. Everybody tries to outsmart everybody else (this is called competition) and tries to get as much money as he can (it is called good business). Well, if one believes in that mindset, one has to do exactly as [color=rgb(255, 114, 0) !important]Skycollection[/color] does. He thinks he is on to something, so he tries to make money from it in contrast to handing it out for free to everybody (who in turn would try to make money disregarding [color=rgb(255, 114, 0) !important]Skycollection[/color]). According to capitalistic doctrine he tries to protect his "invention" (in whatever stupid way).


I WILL ANWSER YOU ABOUT THIS....: DO NOT CONFUESE AND DON´T CONFUSE PEOPLE....! I NEVER RECEIVED ANY MONEY FROM USA BECAUSE PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE WAITING FOR THE "REPLICATION" YOU DON´T WORK, YOU AND MANY PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE WAINTING FOR THE "REPLICATION"


i have any obligation to share information because i never received DONATIONS, i have to buy magnets, wire, resin, cammera, time and effort to build a beautiful pancake coils, but i am not living in a donating program, this is not my profetion, i have my own business program and is not the electronics, electronics is only my fun...!


if you want to know how i am wonding my coils, i can share in a program or in a conference that offer me some economic support, and don´t wait that other people work and show you how replicate the work...!


saludos, from mexico, jorge

Offline conradelektro

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1246 on: April 27, 2013, 01:26:17 AM »
[color=rgb(255, 114, 0) !important]Skycollection[/color] and his behaviour are very consistent with capitalism. Everybody tries to outsmart everybody else (this is called competition) and tries to get as much money as he can (it is called good business). Well, if one believes in that mindset, one has to do exactly as [color=rgb(255, 114, 0) !important]Skycollection[/color] does. He thinks he is on to something, so he tries to make money from it in contrast to handing it out for free to everybody (who in turn would try to make money disregarding [color=rgb(255, 114, 0) !important]Skycollection[/color]). According to capitalistic doctrine he tries to protect his "invention" (in whatever stupid way).

I WILL ANWSER YOU ABOUT THIS....: DO NOT CONFUESE AND DON´T CONFUSE PEOPLE....! I NEVER RECEIVED ANY MONEY FROM USA BECAUSE PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE WAITING FOR THE "REPLICATION" YOU DON´T WORK, YOU AND MANY PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE WAINTING FOR THE "REPLICATION"

i have any obligation to share information because i never received DONATIONS, i have to buy magnets, wire, resin, cammera, time and effort to build a beautiful pancake coils, but i am not living in a donating program, this is not my profetion, i have my own business program and is not the electronics, electronics is only my fun...!

if you want to know how i am wonding my coils, i can share in a program or in a conference that offer me some economic support, and don´t wait that other people work and show you how replicate the work...!

saludos, from mexico, jorge

@Skycollection: May be it is the language barrier, but with the paragraph you cited, I in fact defended you. In our world only very few people give away something of value for free. So, I understand that you want some reward for your work. And you may do as you wish, I am not demanding anything from you.

Having this said, I also think that you probably have noting to sell. The functioning of your indeed beautiful pancake coils is most probably explicable by known science. But I am not skilled enough in electronics to explain it.

I am following "OU discussion forums" for some years and all the "beautiful inventions" and all the "claims of having found something special" have all turned out to be illusions. So, statistically you have nothing special. But I will be glad if we see in the future that you have indeed found something new.

I have a personal opinion about inventions:

Every invention is based on the knowledge of others. The inventor only makes a tiny little step, like all the people before him. All knowledge was gradually accumulated over the last 40.000 years. And one can never find out who really invented something. The patent law gives the invention to the person who files the patent first. But that does not mean that nobody else has already shown this idea or talked or written about it before. I know that most people like to see "inventions" as something special, I just do not follow this line of thinking. In an ideal world everybody should share all knowledge. And in a way it even happens like this in our complicated world. Since ever peolple have taken the ideas from others and have based their ideas on it. All the patent offices in the world can not change that substantially. All important "inventions" or "findings" were never successfully protected by patents. Patents cover only "details" which can always be circumvented in the end. And to make money from an "invention" you need access to funding, access to a market and access to the law in many countries. Think, how many people have that?

So, for me it is always extremely funny when someone in an OU forum claims an important finding and talks about keeping it secret in order to make money from it. It just does not work like this. You will see.

But by all means, I do not urge you to give away your secret. But please allow me to be sceptical; sceptical about the "invention" and sceptical about "the business angle".

Many will ask, why I am loitering in the OU forums? Well, its is extremely interesting. For me it is boring to build "known things". In the OU forums many strange ideas come up and many strange people make their appearance. I always say, that I build things which do not work, because all my life I had to build things which had to work. Now, in my pension, I am allowed to build non working and useless things. That is generally called freedom.

Greetings, Conrad

Offline hoptoad

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1247 on: April 27, 2013, 01:29:48 AM »
The Marinov Slab :
(Not a "free energy" candidate but one that exhibits some other controversial behavior: it's a N3L violator. In my dreams.)
Will you explain what controversial behaviour it exhibits?
Cheers

Offline skycollection

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1248 on: April 27, 2013, 01:47:56 AM »
Conrad, you mentioned capitalism in my work and i think is a mistake becuase i have a good work in my country, and i don´t need wire, resin, magnets because i can buy them, the important to share information not means that i have the "obligation" to share with other countries that are attacking me with bad commentaries. I AM NOT USSING PATENTED DEVICES, FOR EXAMPLE THE BIFILAR PANCAKE TESLA COIL, I AM USING MY OWN CONFIGURATION OF PANCKE COIL.


In other works, i would like to share information if the CONDITIONS ARE SAFE AND GOOD, not attacking with bad videos like ZEROFOSIL that delete HIS BAD VIDEO, this is the kind of people that want to share information "ATTAKING" WITH BAD INTENTION..?


SALUDOS
JORGE





Offline d3x0r

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1249 on: April 27, 2013, 10:38:07 AM »
Those who can, do. 


I am thankful you are able. 


Now you can enlighten your brother and share the light.


But no, you want to leave us in the dark, instead of sharing your blessings.


There's only a handful of people following that are also able to keep up and even give back what they learn with their various setups.  It's not like talking to a few will affect the available market for your devices.  there's billions to serve, and hundreds to provide.  That is assuming you're not fooling yourself into thinking you have what you seek.

Offline Farmhand

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1250 on: April 27, 2013, 11:45:10 AM »
Conrad, Have you tried using a charging circuit in your arrangements ?
Like the setup Tesla shows in the "Electrical Igniter for Gas Engines" patent http://www.google.com/patents?id=iAVhAAAAEBAJ&pg=PA1&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=1#v=onepage&q&f=false

They see use in Tesla coil primary circuits ect.

I put one on the input to my motor and got good results from it, the drawing shows my exact setup, and the scope shots show the results.

I was able to get up to almost 19 volts in the 200 uF supply cap to discharge through the motor coil.
It seems that cap gets fully discharged and recharged to 19 in fairly quick time.
Anyway I get better performance with less input power and the drive coil gets a capacitive discharge from 18 or so volts, more bang ! .
As the frequency gets higher the voltage also rises in the supply discharge cap.

The charging inductor can also restrict current because of it's inductance and it exerts a force with it's core as well but if that can be used while retaining the effect is another question.  ;)

Cheers

P.S. Maybe a wave form from the charging inductor itself might be interesting, i'll get one.  :)

Edit: Inductor current is taken across a 0.1 ohm resistor between the supply and the inductor, the inductor voltage was probed between the diode and the inductor.


Offline DeepCut

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1251 on: April 27, 2013, 12:37:06 PM »
@skycollection

You are being criticised because you act unfairly.

We all know that without the advice of GotoLuc you would never have made those coils.

We all know that Luc got his info from Thane Heins.

Credit where credit is due.

If you behave fairly toward others, they will behave fairly toward you.


Conrad, you mentioned capitalism in my work and i think is a mistake becuase i have a good work in my country, and i don´t need wire, resin, magnets because i can buy them, the important to share information not means that i have the "obligation" to share with other countries that are attacking me with bad commentaries. I AM NOT USSING PATENTED DEVICES, FOR EXAMPLE THE BIFILAR PANCAKE TESLA COIL, I AM USING MY OWN CONFIGURATION OF PANCKE COIL.


In other works, i would like to share information if the CONDITIONS ARE SAFE AND GOOD, not attacking with bad videos like ZEROFOSIL that delete HIS BAD VIDEO, this is the kind of people that want to share information "ATTAKING" WITH BAD INTENTION..?


SALUDOS
JORGE

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1252 on: April 27, 2013, 02:39:18 PM »
Will you explain what controversial behaviour it exhibits?
Cheers
This motor is a multi-turn analogue of the "Warlock's Wheel" aka Siberian Coilu of Stefan Marinov. If you are familiar with Jeffrey Kooistra's work at Mallove's Infinite Energy Magazine laboratory, with his version of the Warlock's Wheel, you'll begin to see the possibilities.

Offline gyulasun

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1253 on: April 27, 2013, 08:49:21 PM »
Hi Conrad,

Very good tests, they show the importance of AmperTurns by using drive coils with very high number of turns. Of course this increases AC impedance but it seems the tradeoff is still on the positive side when comparing rpm and power draw with lower impedance coils. 

Yes the drive circuit shown by DadHAv is interesting, I have not seen it, it is worth testing.

I will be away for some days and return about May 2.

Keep up the good work.

Greetings,
Gyula

I now have a comparison between the black and the white coils used in Version 2 of my ring magnet spinner. One sees from the measurements that the black coils have about double efficiency in comparison with the white coils (see attached picture).
....

Offline hoptoad

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1254 on: April 28, 2013, 01:21:00 AM »
This motor is a multi-turn analogue of the "Warlock's Wheel" aka Siberian Coilu of Stefan Marinov. If you are familiar with Jeffrey Kooistra's work at Mallove's Infinite Energy Magazine laboratory, with his version of the Warlock's Wheel, you'll begin to see the possibilities.

Thanks for the reply, although I'm not familiar with the work described or the people you've named above. I'll have to do some research.

Cheers

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1255 on: April 28, 2013, 02:14:54 AM »
Thanks for the reply, although I'm not familiar with the work described or the people you've named above. I'll have to do some research.

Cheers
There is some good information here, in Jeffery's article in Analog:
http://www.analogsf.com/0806/altview.shtml
In the Marinov Slab motor, the special "secret" winding of the coils simulates the current paths in the original "ring stator" of the Siberian Coilu/Warlock's Wheel. Since the moving ring stator and the magnet armature both accelerate in the _same direction_ in the Warlock's Wheel, and this same effect occurs with the fixed stator coils in the Slab (although masked by the "immobility" of the frame) ... one may be tempted to imagine a violation of Newton's Third Law of Motion (N3L). The armature accelerates in one direction .... but there isn't an opposite back reaction against the stator. Apparently.

Offline hoptoad

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1256 on: April 28, 2013, 04:50:36 AM »
There is some good information here, in Jeffery's article in Analog:
http://www.analogsf.com/0806/altview.shtml
In the Marinov Slab motor, the special "secret" winding of the coils simulates the current paths in the original "ring stator" of the Siberian Coilu/Warlock's Wheel. Since the moving ring stator and the magnet armature both accelerate in the _same direction_ in the Warlock's Wheel, and this same effect occurs with the fixed stator coils in the Slab (although masked by the "immobility" of the frame) ... one may be tempted to imagine a violation of Newton's Third Law of Motion (N3L). The armature accelerates in one direction .... but there isn't an opposite back reaction against the stator. Apparently.
Thanks again. Cheers

Offline Farmhand

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1257 on: April 28, 2013, 11:14:35 AM »
Hi Conrad,

Very good tests, they show the importance of AmperTurns by using drive coils with very high number of turns. Of course this increases AC impedance but it seems the tradeoff is still on the positive side when comparing rpm and power draw with lower impedance coils. 

Yes the drive circuit shown by DadHAv is interesting, I have not seen it, it is worth testing.

I will be away for some days and return about May 2.

Keep up the good work.

Greetings,
Gyula

Hi Gyula, I know ampere turns are important but we must respect the frequency current restriction of the coil.
For instance if the coil has too much inductance it can't pass much current in very short pulses, which means longer "on" times which ultimately restricts the frequency the coils can be switched at as well as the current. I think we need to be smart and work out how much inductance is too much by calculating the intended switching frequency of the coil.
As well in my humble opinion I believe as low a resistance coil as possible is best as long as it has as much inductance as possible (turns) this way we can use capacitor discharge methods as I showed in my last post to get as short as possible "on time" and the fastest rate of rise of current in the drive coil.
With the resonant charging circuit (with "de-q-ing" diode) the increased voltage cannot return to the supply and because of the added inductance of the charging inductor the drive coil mainly gets the energy in the supply discharge capacitor and not much current through from the supply, especially when on times are small. In order to get very high frequencies from a (pseudo synchronous motor) the drive coils must be able to pass enough current in short pulses.

I just tried going from using three strands in parallel of 0.5 mm wire about 7.3 mH each I think all three together had just over 1 Ohm resistance to using two in series that had just over 6 Ohms resistance and I guess about 14 mH inductance. The result was the two in series restricted the current so much the motor wouldn't run fast even with the increased voltage in the supply discharge capacitor. The way my coil and rotor magnets are arranged the magnets only just attract to the core. With the rotor I have it can spin the shaft rotor and a squirrel cage from a fan motor for flywheel weight up to 1300 rpm with just about 250 mA from the 12 volt battery and I only have two magnets on a 140 mm rotor it should have three or four magnets, which would increase the frequency more, even though the frequency is only quite low, even at 1800 rpm the frequency with two magnets is only 60 Hz. The inductance we want, but the resistance is debatable in my opinion. I'll be going the route of higher voltages to the drive coil and short "on" times, a variable voltage supply is the way to go, I'll use a boost converter to vary the input voltage and a resonant charging circuit to provide a capacitor discharge at a further increased voltage. I like the difference in sound the charging circuit has made now the setup purrs.

Last night I setup the adjustable timing mount for the optical sensor so I can advance and retard the timing now. I hope to wind a new drive coil tonight I think I might wind either a nice neat coil from 0.7 wire or just use some twisted stuff I have which is four strands of 0.5 mm wire and longer than the one I'm using now. My inclination is to wind the drive coil very neatly so as to get as many turns as possible as close to the core as possible. But with twisted wire the coil ends up much bigger than a neatly wound one because of the air gaps.

Cheers

Offline skycollection

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1258 on: April 28, 2013, 04:06:04 PM »
I AM NOT USING THE PATENTED CONFIGURATION OF NIKOLA TESLA  THEREFORE THERE IS NOTHING TO CLAIM...! I NEVER USED INFORMATION FROM ANYBODY, I DON´T UNDERSTAND IN ENGLISH.

Offline conradelektro

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Re: Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect
« Reply #1259 on: April 28, 2013, 07:54:56 PM »
Conrad, Have you tried using a charging circuit in your arrangements ?
Like the setup Tesla shows in the "Electrical Igniter for Gas Engines" patent http://www.google.com/patents?id=iAVhAAAAEBAJ&pg=PA1&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=1#v=onepage&q&f=false

They see use in Tesla coil primary circuits ect.

I put one on the input to my motor and got good results from it, the drawing shows my exact setup, and the scope shots show the results.

I was able to get up to almost 19 volts in the 200 uF supply cap to discharge through the motor coil.
It seems that cap gets fully discharged and recharged to 19 in fairly quick time.
Anyway I get better performance with less input power and the drive coil gets a capacitive discharge from 18 or so volts, more bang ! .
As the frequency gets higher the voltage also rises in the supply discharge cap.

The charging inductor can also restrict current because of it's inductance and it exerts a force with it's core as well but if that can be used while retaining the effect is another question.  ;)

Cheers

P.S. Maybe a wave form from the charging inductor itself might be interesting, i'll get one.  :)

Edit: Inductor current is taken across a 0.1 ohm resistor between the supply and the inductor, the inductor voltage was probed between the diode and the inductor.

I did use the back EMF from the drive coil to charge a cap/accumulator or to light some LEDs in some of my pulse motors, but the "charging inductor" is news for me and I will test it. Thank you for the scope shots.

At the moment I am redesigning my ring magnet spinners with a slab of Teflon (just having a hole for the axle) instead of a ball bearing.

Greetings, Conrad