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Author Topic: MYT engine  (Read 11266 times)

Offline nightwynd

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MYT engine
« on: June 05, 2006, 04:45:20 PM »
Ever hear of the Massive yet Tiny engine? Apparantly this thing is going to revolutionize (pun intended) the Internal Combustion Engine... here's a link http://www.americanantigravity.com/articles/541/1/The-Massive-Yet-Tiny-Engine

Considering the massive efficiency of this engine, I'm wondering if it would be possable to run it from hydrogen... If so it just might have the capability for overunity... Engine producing electric current to create hydrogen which runs motor to produce electric current, etc...

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

MYT engine
« on: June 05, 2006, 04:45:20 PM »

jake

  • Guest
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2006, 04:50:06 PM »
I was looking at that last night.

It has very impressive spec's if it does what they say.  Really packs a punch for 150 Lbs.

Offline pese

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    • Freie Energie und mehr ... Free energy and more ...
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2006, 10:34:02 PM »
It give dozends of patents since 1930-1970
with change in carburators to need less engine than 3ltr/1000km .
some patents was buy from oil companies, others not produced.
as Pogue /Canada. you will find more under the following patent nos
------------
  Patents Part 1: Charles Pogue?s first high mpg carburettor patent 642,434. This is the first of three patents from Charles, each of which describes a high-efficiency carburettor and explains how it operates.

Patents Part 2: Charles Pogue?s second high mpg carburettor patent 1,997,497. This is the second patent from Charles, showing how his previous design can be improved.

Patents Part 3: Charles Pogue?s third high mpg carburettor patent 2,026,798. This is the third patent from Charles, showing further improvements to his design. This carburettor has been tested and the tests results claim a performance under normal driving conditions resulting in more than 200 miles per US gallon.






http://ch.to/FE   german language only

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: MYT engine
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2006, 10:34:02 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline pese

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Re: MYT engine
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2006, 10:42:09 PM »
Patents Part 4: Oliver Turner?s high mpg carburettor patent 3,653,643. This is another carburettor design from the 240 claiming 100+ mpg figures.

Patents Part 5: Thomas Ogle?s high mpg carburettor patent 4,177,779. This is another carburettor design from the 240 claiming 100+ mpg figures.

Patents Part 6: Allen Caggiano?s high mpg carburettor patent 5,782,225. This is another carburettor design from the 240 claiming 100+ mpg figures.
--------
if they search, they find more at more,  but it is unsalable.  it interests the industry. To sell products with current power requirement. 

ch.to/FE     type in - without "www"

Offline TheOne

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Re: MYT engine
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2006, 11:55:22 PM »
hopefully this MYT engine will be available soon :)

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: MYT engine
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2006, 11:55:22 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline pese

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Re: MYT engine
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2006, 03:09:06 PM »
if somebody , cant find the patentdecritions , i send the pdf of them.
pese

Offline nightwynd

  • Jr. Member
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  • Posts: 90
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2006, 03:44:38 PM »
Quote
if they search, they find more at more,  but it is unsalable.  it interests the industry. To sell products with current power requirement. 

Why do you consider this engine unsalable? If you could replace the engine in your car with something 1/10th of the weight and get MORE HP, MORE torque, and get MORE mpg...why wouldn't you?? I know I'd buy one...or two or three...

And I agree whole-heartedly, hopefully these things will be available soon. They should by all means change the way we build engines... I think they said it would be a couple of years before they begin releasing the lisencing agreements to automakers, but after then, let the engine building begin!

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: MYT engine
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2006, 03:44:38 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline TheOne

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    • Amanatsu Games
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2006, 04:49:35 PM »
the problem is that will take a lot of time just to have available motor to buy, i dont understand why they are not selling one for average joe now!


Offline pese

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Re: MYT engine
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2006, 04:51:53 PM »
that is unsalable, because the industry does not (more) earn anything to it.! Printers manufacturers earn only at the sales of the ink later .  Cigarettes manufacturers earn at the craze, which is produced. Automaker in co-operation with energy suppliers? etc. And at EACH PART the state earns also.  I read ?somewhere?, which gave BEFORE BENZ and DIESEL, it somewhere ? FIRST autocars running with pure water  (no steam engine!! ) But than , that the inventor also with businessmens then thinking to "swap" THIS invention on mineral oil "base" to design again, since one can sell OIL and such a durable business secures themselves.  ---------  I hold for possible convincing and plausibly .
 Greeting pese   

oil is NOT energy.
anything can be changed to energy.
it is no free enery to have
only new alternatives to change
light wind water stones metals enz TO
energy.
Solong the OIL ist business - no thing will
be changed.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: MYT engine
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2006, 04:51:53 PM »
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Offline nightwynd

  • Jr. Member
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  • Posts: 90
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2006, 08:17:49 PM »
I think I know what you're talking about pese, you're speakign of residual sales to get more money out of a system. It is true that many manufacturers have stooped to doing this...hopefully the company creating the MYT engine will not be doing this - it sounds like they are simply going to be releasing the lisencing to automakers. What I am hoping for is that someone will be able to convert an engine to run on water to create a true hydrogen engine, then release these plans to the rest of us to make our own.

Regardless of weather or not this engine will be convertible to hydrogen, I still want one to play with...do you realize how easy it would be to create personal aircraft with an engine that is this light? I'm personally thinking of a helicopter like arrangement >:)

Offline nightwynd

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 90
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2006, 08:19:13 PM »
Quote
oil is NOT energy.
anything can be changed to energy.
it is no free enery to have
only new alternatives to change
light wind water stones metals enz TO
energy.
Solong the OIL ist business - no thing will
be changed.

Oil won't be in business too much longer - read the link in my sig...read it to the end and then read it again... we don't have much time left.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: MYT engine
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2006, 08:19:13 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline Automan

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 11
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2006, 06:51:53 AM »
What I am hoping for is that someone will be able to convert an engine to run on water to create a true hydrogen engine, then release these plans to the rest of us to make our own.

Regardless of weather or not this engine will be convertible to hydrogen, I still want one to play with...do you realize how easy it would be to create personal aircraft with an engine that is this light? I'm personally thinking of a helicopter like arrangement >:)

Buy one. BMW makes one model in Europe that runs on either gas or hydrogen.  (it's a prototype)  If you wave enough money at them, I'm sure they will make one for you. It's just a regular piston engine for the most part, with a few modifications obviously.

They have a few of them running around which refuel at a windmill powered hydrogen generating (gas) stations  along their test route.

Don't ask me where exactly this is, but I'm sure if you search you can find more information about them. They were shown on a Car and Driver TV show not too long ago.


Offline Automan

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 11
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2006, 08:20:29 AM »
It give dozends of patents since 1930-1970
with change in carburators to need less engine than 3ltr/1000km .
some patents was buy from oil companies, others not produced.
as Pogue /Canada. you will find more under the following patent nos
------------
  Patents Part 1: Charles Pogue?s first high mpg carburettor patent 642,434. This is the first of three patents from Charles, each of which describes a high-efficiency carburettor and explains how it operates.

Patents Part 2: Charles Pogue?s second high mpg carburettor patent 1,997,497. This is the second patent from Charles, showing how his previous design can be improved.

Patents Part 3: Charles Pogue?s third high mpg carburettor patent 2,026,798. This is the third patent from Charles, showing further improvements to his design. This carburettor has been tested and the tests results claim a performance under normal driving conditions resulting in more than 200 miles per US gallon.






http://ch.to/FE   german language only




You just can't get 200 mpg because of a carburator.  A engine runs on a fuel/air mixture.   Gas is vaporized and blended with air  then compressed and burned.

Pogue carburetor violates the first law of thermodynamics, a commonly accepted scientific postulate that has been with us since 1830.

The law is written as follows:    U = q + w

In simple English, if you have chemical energy in a system (U) in its expenditure, it must equal q (heat) plus work (w). That is, if you have 100,000 BTUs in a gallon of fuel in which you then burn the end products?in a system operating at 30% efficiency?you will have 30,000 BTUs of work and 70,000 BTUs of heat.

Anything you put inside the combustion chamber can do only one of two things during the ignition stroke.

Produce energy (mechanical movement) during the reaction.

Absorb energy (leave out the exhaust port as heat) during the reaction.

There has been a lot written about the "unburned particulates" furnishing the extra fuel for the extra 50 mpg or so, but if you check the Fish dynatune emissions levels you?ll see there aren?t enough of them to get you another 300 yards down the road.

There are a few things wrong with this late 1930's concept of such a "200 MPG" system.

The first is that the gasolines in use during those days were far more volatile than the ones in use today. You could stand ten feet away from an open pan of gasoline, light a match, and watch the gasoline immediately catch fire. (And roast off your eyebrows and any exposed hair)

Gasolines were changed in the late 1930s with the advent of the catalytic cracker now used in petroleum refining. Carburetors like the Pogue, which depend on easily vaporized gasoline, simply will not work at all with today?s gasolines.

A second  missconception is  the methods of using exhaust heat or radiator water to heat the fuel to the "vapor" point in order to extend the mileage. Warming or preheating fuel does have some value, but it?s limited.

Let's consider using hot water from the radiator to vaporize the fuel first.

Today?s gasolines do not completely vaporize until they reach 450? F.  The maximum temperature of the water in today?s car's pressure radiators reaches only 250? Fahrenheit. You just can?t heat a substance to 450? Fahrenheit using a 250? Fahrenheit heat source. At least, not on this planet.

Exhaust heat.

It is the function of an internal combustion engine to change chemical energy (gasoline) into heat, and then the heat into mechanical movement. If the heat is not changed into mechanical movement it simply leaves ?as heat.

 Any time you feel heat coming off an engine you are feeling wasted energy. The exhaust ports of an engine that operated at 100% efficiency would be ice-cold to the touch since ALL the heat would have been changed into mechanical movement.

This means that the more efficient your engine is, the less exhaust heat you?re going to have.

 So, if you have 600? F exhaust heat produced by one gallon of gas over a 20-mile trip and you use "exhaust heat" to "vaporize" the fuel and go 60 miles, what produces the 600? Fahrenheit heat for those extra 40 miles?

If you answered "two more gallons of fuel," go to the head of the class!

There are ways to go more than 20 miles  on a gallon of fuel. None of them involve carburetors.

Charles Nelson Pogue was a machinist with no formal training in thermodynamics and may have actually believed that what he was attempting would work.

All a carburetor can do is meter and atomize fuel in correct proportion to air, which is then compressed and burned  producing heat and energy (mechanical movement. Somewhere in the vicinity of 14 parts air to I part gasoline. Higher ratios begin burning too hot, and begin doing other nasty things like detonating instantly, burning valves and valve seats, melting holes through pistons.

Of course, there is a limit to how "lean' you can mix fuel and air in a piston engine. It will simply quit igniting the fuel/air  mixture unless you can increase the engines compression ratio. It will stall.  Perhaps some of you have experienced a clogged fuel filter at one time.  As the filter plugs, the car looses power, then simply quits.
It's still getting a little bit of fuel, but it is too lean for the engines designed compression ratio to ignite.   Before it stalled, it began backfiring, "bucking"  when ever you pressed on the accelarator petal. (and running hotter too, maybe even causing internal damage!)

For someone to claim that a car which normally gets 20 miles per gallon, to suddenly get 200 miles per gallon because of a magical carburator, it would have to be burning fual/air ratios of around 75/1. Or, it wasn't running properly to begin with. 
Most people would notice if their car wasn't running properly. It would produce clouds of black smoke and smell  like someone was pouring raw fuel out the tailpipe. (If it started at all that is.) Flooded cars don't like to start because they can't get enough air to burn the fuel and make the heat needed to make energy/mechanical force.

Fuel systems today  are highly efficient in atomizing fuel. But they have to maintain that 14/1 ratio. High preasure fuel pumps, fuel injectors, and computer control systems do that much better than any carburator can.(and are twice as expensive too)  For the most part, complete voporization of gasoline has been achieved long ago. Any gains in fuel milage have to come from reduced friction, areo dynamics,
and converting heat into mechanical energy.





Offline nightwynd

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 90
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2006, 03:59:28 PM »
Nice reply Automan! And believe me, If I had the money to wave around at BMW, or Angellabs, I WOULD buy one....two actually. One to use on regular fuel (biodiesel in this case), and one to convert to hydrogen to play with. Now if the stupid lottery system here in Canada would just work in my favor....

Offline Liberty

  • Hero Member
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  • Posts: 524
    • DynamaticMotors
Re: MYT engine
« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2006, 04:57:25 PM »
It give dozends of patents since 1930-1970
with change in carburators to need less engine than 3ltr/1000km .
some patents was buy from oil companies, others not produced.
as Pogue /Canada. you will find more under the following patent nos
------------
  Patents Part 1: Charles Pogue?s first high mpg carburettor patent 642,434. This is the first of three patents from Charles, each of which describes a high-efficiency carburettor and explains how it operates.

Patents Part 2: Charles Pogue?s second high mpg carburettor patent 1,997,497. This is the second patent from Charles, showing how his previous design can be improved.

Patents Part 3: Charles Pogue?s third high mpg carburettor patent 2,026,798. This is the third patent from Charles, showing further improvements to his design. This carburettor has been tested and the tests results claim a performance under normal driving conditions resulting in more than 200 miles per US gallon.






http://ch.to/FE   german language only




You just can't get 200 mpg because of a carburator.  A engine runs on a fuel/air mixture.   Gas is vaporized and blended with air  then compressed and burned.

Pogue carburetor violates the first law of thermodynamics, a commonly accepted scientific postulate that has been with us since 1830.

The law is written as follows:    U = q + w

In simple English, if you have chemical energy in a system (U) in its expenditure, it must equal q (heat) plus work (w). That is, if you have 100,000 BTUs in a gallon of fuel in which you then burn the end products?in a system operating at 30% efficiency?you will have 30,000 BTUs of work and 70,000 BTUs of heat.

Anything you put inside the combustion chamber can do only one of two things during the ignition stroke.

Produce energy (mechanical movement) during the reaction.

Absorb energy (leave out the exhaust port as heat) during the reaction.

There has been a lot written about the "unburned particulates" furnishing the extra fuel for the extra 50 mpg or so, but if you check the Fish dynatune emissions levels you?ll see there aren?t enough of them to get you another 300 yards down the road.

There are a few things wrong with this late 1930's concept of such a "200 MPG" system.

The first is that the gasolines in use during those days were far more volatile than the ones in use today. You could stand ten feet away from an open pan of gasoline, light a match, and watch the gasoline immediately catch fire. (And roast off your eyebrows and any exposed hair)

Gasolines were changed in the late 1930s with the advent of the catalytic cracker now used in petroleum refining. Carburetors like the Pogue, which depend on easily vaporized gasoline, simply will not work at all with today?s gasolines.

A second  missconception is  the methods of using exhaust heat or radiator water to heat the fuel to the "vapor" point in order to extend the mileage. Warming or preheating fuel does have some value, but it?s limited.

Let's consider using hot water from the radiator to vaporize the fuel first.

Today?s gasolines do not completely vaporize until they reach 450? F.  The maximum temperature of the water in today?s car's pressure radiators reaches only 250? Fahrenheit. You just can?t heat a substance to 450? Fahrenheit using a 250? Fahrenheit heat source. At least, not on this planet.

Exhaust heat.

It is the function of an internal combustion engine to change chemical energy (gasoline) into heat, and then the heat into mechanical movement. If the heat is not changed into mechanical movement it simply leaves ?as heat.

 Any time you feel heat coming off an engine you are feeling wasted energy. The exhaust ports of an engine that operated at 100% efficiency would be ice-cold to the touch since ALL the heat would have been changed into mechanical movement.

This means that the more efficient your engine is, the less exhaust heat you?re going to have.

 So, if you have 600? F exhaust heat produced by one gallon of gas over a 20-mile trip and you use "exhaust heat" to "vaporize" the fuel and go 60 miles, what produces the 600? Fahrenheit heat for those extra 40 miles?

If you answered "two more gallons of fuel," go to the head of the class!

There are ways to go more than 20 miles  on a gallon of fuel. None of them involve carburetors.

Charles Nelson Pogue was a machinist with no formal training in thermodynamics and may have actually believed that what he was attempting would work.

All a carburetor can do is meter and atomize fuel in correct proportion to air, which is then compressed and burned  producing heat and energy (mechanical movement. Somewhere in the vicinity of 14 parts air to I part gasoline. Higher ratios begin burning too hot, and begin doing other nasty things like detonating instantly, burning valves and valve seats, melting holes through pistons.

Of course, there is a limit to how "lean' you can mix fuel and air in a piston engine. It will simply quit igniting the fuel/air  mixture unless you can increase the engines compression ratio. It will stall.  Perhaps some of you have experienced a clogged fuel filter at one time.  As the filter plugs, the car looses power, then simply quits.
It's still getting a little bit of fuel, but it is too lean for the engines designed compression ratio to ignite.   Before it stalled, it began backfiring, "bucking"  when ever you pressed on the accelarator petal. (and running hotter too, maybe even causing internal damage!)

For someone to claim that a car which normally gets 20 miles per gallon, to suddenly get 200 miles per gallon because of a magical carburator, it would have to be burning fual/air ratios of around 75/1. Or, it wasn't running properly to begin with. 
Most people would notice if their car wasn't running properly. It would produce clouds of black smoke and smell  like someone was pouring raw fuel out the tailpipe. (If it started at all that is.) Flooded cars don't like to start because they can't get enough air to burn the fuel and make the heat needed to make energy/mechanical force.

Fuel systems today  are highly efficient in atomizing fuel. But they have to maintain that 14/1 ratio. High preasure fuel pumps, fuel injectors, and computer control systems do that much better than any carburator can.(and are twice as expensive too)  For the most part, complete voporization of gasoline has been achieved long ago. Any gains in fuel milage have to come from reduced friction, areo dynamics,
and converting heat into mechanical energy.






I have some questions:  If the engine was running at top fuel vaporization, why do they use a catalytic converter? (After this so called 15:1 best mix ratio, which is only for carburetors, better ratios occur with fuel injection). Why is a converter needed to burn excess unburned fuel for air quality and it is converted into massive amounts of heat in the tail pipe?  Isn't this an indication of poor vaporization and mixing with air for complete burning of fuel before it goes into the engine? 

If the fuel is being completely or nearly completely burned from the engine, shouldn't the engine have a nearly clean output and not have any further need of an exhaust burning stage to more completely burn excess unburned fuel coming out of the tail pipe?

The exhaust should be similar to running on propane if the fuel is being fully vaporized.

 

OneLink