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Author Topic: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity  (Read 11146 times)

Offline studentofhistory

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Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« on: June 11, 2011, 11:41:43 PM »
Faraday's homopolar generator has fascinated overunity enthusiasts for decades. I think I've come up with a way to make it generate more power than it uses.

I got the idea while reading Dark Star by Henry Stevens. In it he discusses homopolar generator theory and revealed something that I didn't know before. The amount of power that a homopolar generator produces varies in direct proportion to each of three parameters. a) radius of the copper disk, b) how fast the disk is spinning and c) the strength of the magnet's magnetic field. This has always been the crux of the problem ie. if you spin the copper disk twice as fast you get twice as much power but you also end up using twice as much power to make it spin faster.

What I think is the solution to this challenge is the Force Square Law that is used in Flynn's Parallel Path technology. Simply stated, the FSL says that the strength of the combined magnetic field of two or more magnets connected in parallel, is greater than the sum of their individual magnetic field strengths. So for example, if you have two identical magnets and you connect them in parallel, the strength of the combined field is (1+1)^2= 4 times as great as each individual magnet. With three magnets, the combined strength is 9 times as great, etc.

So here is how I see this principle working. You start by adding a horseshoe-shaped magnet to the copper disk so the disk is in between the magnet's north and south poles. You then take a piece of soft iron that has a general horseshoe shape and wrap a coil around it's center. This coil will generate an electro-magnet when a current flows thru it. Then attach the electro-magnet to the permanent magnet in such a way that the electro-magnet's north pole will be in parallel to the permanent magnet's north pole and same for the south poles.

Now when you spin the copper disk, the permanent magnet will generate some current in the disk that can be siphoned off. Suppose some of this current is diverted into the coil that forms the electro-magnet? This will then generate additional magnetic flux and when that combines with the permanent magnet's flux, you get an exponential boost in flux strength when it passes thru the copper disk. This will generate more power. So if the permanent magnet were to generate enough current on it's own to create an electro-magnet with the same field strength as the permanent magnet, the combined field strength would 4 times as much. That means, all other things being equal, that the power generated would realize an incremental gain, which is 3 times as much as the original current, and which can be used for other things including running the motor that spins the copper disk. In theory it should be able to handle the disk motor and have extra power left over.

In order to boost the output even more, use more than one electro-magnet and iron bars that can handle a higher level of magnetic flux. The magic of the Force Square Law should be able to turn a homopolar generator into an overunity device that can be self powering. Suppose electric cars had one? Batteries could provide the initial power to get the device started and then the generator delivers enough power to run the car and recharge the batteries. The same thing could be used to power a home.

I have not built a unit to test this theory. I hope someone tries it and reports on their results. I'm throwing this idea into the Public Domain.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Paul-R

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Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2011, 04:23:35 PM »
If you are not familiar with them, you should check out Bruce De Palma
and Paramahamsa Tewari

Offline quantumtangles

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Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2011, 03:27:14 AM »
The amount of power that a homopolar generator produces varies in direct proportion to each of three parameters. a) radius of the copper disk, b) how fast the disk is spinning and c) the strength of the magnet's magnetic field. This has always been the crux of the problem ie. if you spin the copper disk twice as fast you get twice as much power but you also end up using twice as much power to make it spin faster.

If the circumference of the 'disc that spins' is itself surrounded by solenoids (tubes containing elliptical copper windings) such that each solenoid contains a magnet that can move up and down within the solenoid tube to generate electricity, then the following situation arises.

As the disc rotates, the magnets inside each of the peripheral solenoids would move up and down (like pistons).

In this way, 10 or 20 solenoids on the circumference of a single disc can generate more electricity than would be possible from a single copper disc.

I hypothesise that numerous peripheral solenoids can generate more electricity than is consumed by an electric motor capable of rotating a central supporting disc at optimal RPM.

In this case, optimal RPM has a lower limit defined by the requirement to generate meaningful electricity, and an upper limit defined by gravity.

Which is to say, the magnets inside the solenoids cannot be allowed to become pinned to the top of their solenoid by centrifugal force (should the central disc rotate too rapidly).

There is a formula for calculating the electrical output of each solenoid (based on the number of windings (copper turns) and the length of each solenoid etc).

In crude terms, multiply the output per solenoid by the number of solenoids on the circumference and you get total electrical output in watts.

The force required to rotate a central disc at the required speed can be calculated if you know the weight of the disc array (disc + solenoids + magnets in kg) and the acceleration of the circumference of the disc in m/s/s.

Once the force in Newtons is known (F = m*a), the power in watts needed to rotate the disc at the required RPM can be calculated using another formula.

Once you know the power in watts needed to rotate the disc, you can then compare power consumption with power output.

In all such mechanical systems, the strength of the magnet is a factor, but so too is the distance between the magnet and the copper.

The speed at which the magnet moves over the copper surface is important. The faster it moves, the more power is generated. But even if it were to move very quickly, it would not generate electricity unless there are 'changes' in direction.

Most neodymium magnets have enormous power (1.3 Teslas is not uncommon), but if the distance between the magnet and the copper exceeds a fraction of a millimetre, field strength falls exponentially.

On the flip side of the coin, even if you were to engineer a system in which a magnet close to the copper could change direction very quickly, the high field strength would itself require enormous torque (rotational force) to rotate the disc.

For these reasons, I have suggested having a central non-copper disc around the circumference of which solenoid magnet arrays provide rapid rates of change.

Magnets, moving like pistons in the cylinders of a combustion engine, would generate electricity whilst at the same time the torque requirements of the central disc would not be a significant limiting factor.

It might work particularly well in zero gravity if springs of differing specifications were attached to each end of the solenoids. One could simply ensure the spring at the 'outer circumference end' of the solenoid was much stronger than the spring closer to the hub of the supporting disc. This would prevent magnets getting stuck at one end of the solenoid due to centripetal force.

Dense neodymium magnets would move up and down inside the solenoids, bouncing off the springs at each end, providing rapid rates of change (and thus high electrical output).

Angular velocity in radians per second at the circumference of the disc would not be restricted by a speed limit preventing magnets travelling at more than 10 m/s/s (the rate of acceleration of gravity).

Large solenoid wheels in space might therefore provide electrical generating capacity that would otherwise require impractical arrays of solar panels. In addition, power would be available for propulsion beyond the influence of sunlight. This would allow us to send automated probes well beyond the confines of the solar system.

The size of a solenoid piston array in space could be enormous. High electrical output from such arrays could be used in manned spacecraft for propulsion systems requiring greater output than that available from solar panels.

Interesting thread. Thanks for putting it in the public domain. I particularly like the idea of using electromagnets in the way you suggested.

« Last Edit: June 14, 2011, 04:28:16 AM by quantumtangles »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2011, 03:27:14 AM »
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Offline SkyWatcher123

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Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2011, 08:20:01 AM »
removed
« Last Edit: June 14, 2011, 10:48:50 AM by SkyWatcher123 »

Offline SkyWatcher123

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Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2011, 08:44:15 AM »
removed
« Last Edit: June 14, 2011, 10:49:22 AM by SkyWatcher123 »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2011, 08:44:15 AM »
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Offline quantumtangles

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Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2011, 09:33:58 AM »
@ skywatcher123

Yes that is precisely what I was trying to describe. It is good to know it is open source.

I posted preliminary maths in 'Kinetic Hiker Backpack becomes solenoid array'.

I hope we are not too off topic in relation to this great thread about Michael Faraday's homopolar generator, which I really enjoyed reading.

Offline blueplanet

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Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2011, 06:58:44 AM »

Now when you spin the copper disk, the permanent magnet will generate some current in the disk that can be siphoned off. Suppose some of this current is diverted into the coil that forms the electro-magnet? This will then generate additional magnetic flux and when that combines with the permanent magnet's flux, you get an exponential boost in flux strength when it passes thru the copper disk. This will generate more power. So if the permanent magnet were to generate enough current on it's own to create an electro-magnet with the same field strength as the permanent magnet, the combined field strength would 4 times as much. That means, all other things being equal, that the power generated would realize an incremental gain, which is 3 times as much as the original current, and which can be used for other things including running the motor that spins the copper disk. In theory it should be able to handle the disk motor and have extra power left over.


Tesla did mention the use of spiral spokes to direct the eddy currents in a way to enhance the overall magnetic field. In my experiment, instead of using spiral spokes, I used a 3-turn coil surrounding the circumference of the cylindrical magnet. The magnet was glued to the copper disk.  For some unknown reasons, I ended up with some unexpected results: I got an AC output in addition to the DC output. The DC output is too small to be usable, but the AC voltage is much higher than the DC voltage.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2011, 06:58:44 AM »
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Offline quantumtangles

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Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2011, 07:35:14 PM »
@ blueplanet

Interesting

Offline leo48

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Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2011, 09:15:50 PM »
Quote
Tesla did mention the use of spiral spokes to direct the eddy currents in a way to enhance the overall magnetic field. In my experiment, instead of using spiral spokes, I used a 3-turn coil surrounding the circumference of the cylindrical magnet. The magnet was glued to the copper disk.  For some unknown reasons, I ended up with some unexpected results: I got an AC output in addition to the DC output. The DC output is too small to be usable, but the AC voltage is much higher than the DC voltage.

Surely you've connected the coil in the opposite direction ..
try switching the wires of the coil .. ;D
Leo48

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Making a Homopolar Generator Overunity
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2011, 09:15:50 PM »
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