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Author Topic: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?  (Read 920206 times)

TEKTRON

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #645 on: July 08, 2011, 06:51:16 AM »
use of ferroelectrics in condensers used by tesla is interesting possibility:

It is likely that Tesla was aware of the properties of ferroelectrics
in particular rochelle salt a likely canadate for condenser material.
 http://www.ieee-uffc.org/ferroelectrics/teaching/articles/e003/e0030291.pdf

a contemporary application given
http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20080246366


http://www.google.com/search?tbo=p&tbm=pts&hl=en&q=20080246366&num=10

JouleSeeker

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #646 on: July 08, 2011, 07:07:59 AM »
Thanks for the good discussion.

Steven

i wanted to thank you for raising our interest in your oscillator circuit and its associated investigations

i have to admit, when i saw your thread start i didn't follow it up at first because i thought the subject would have been exhausted in the various JT threads already in existence (not that i have anything against them!)

however, i'm hooked!

even in this seemingly simple circuit, all sorts of basic issues have been raised; it's certainly been a worthy test-vehicle so far - and we've only just got out onto the freeway  :)


what prompted me to write this now, is that i've been doing some of my own experiments since the end of last year, with DIY cells using thin sheet & foils of dissimilar metals & unusual hydrocarbon-rich 'electrolytes'
(as noted at my blog linked below)

i'm attempting to achieve a self-sustaining combination of cell & LED flasher circuit (ie. the system will need to obtain energy from the ambient environment)

i appear to have succeeded with one combination which has maintained an average 2 cell voltage of 1.2V since the beginning of March (all other attempts have discharged the cells within a couple of months) [snip, for brevity]

Congratulations are in order!  Let us know if this continues.  Lots of exciting developments around here.

@Nick -- thanks for pointing out the URL; three coils, a diode and a cap -- to light an LED.  Very interesting.  What is the source of the energy?  Does he know?
I had something similar a while back (well, maybe similar) -- no battery, but req'd a ground connection -- but when I measured the frequency it was 60 Hz, so I had grid pick-up I'm quite sure.  Lit up an LED though...

@Frankly, if you start another thread, you might find folks who are more interested in the theoretical side of things -- also, diagrams/drawings help a lot.

e2matrix

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #647 on: July 08, 2011, 07:15:43 AM »
Well, I am not sure what happened. I thought someone asked how energy could "come into" a circuit. In the describing of what "energy" is, I showed the thought process that led to (in a small way), understanding what forms energy, or amperage.

The amplification of this, is what I thought everyone was looking for. Small energy in, 10^13 times out, or something.

So, I spoke freely. To everyone here.

 It seems I have either been ignored or shut out. No feedback, no thoughts, no expressions of consideration whatsoever in days....what gives, people??

All sorts of terse words for my continued musings, when I was trying to encourage discussion and thought among what I thought were like minded people, yet, after the point was made, nothing.....

The "wheelwork of nature" revealed in words, and not even a blip.....

Would a video be better?

Or, some drawings???

Would that help convey the thoughts?

Been there, done that. It doesn't make a difference.

If you look up "Watt meter design" you will find that modern science is already well educated in the inertia of eddy currents.

Place this mechanism, (which is supported by the background energy of the universe, just as the domains in a permanent magnet are), into a transformer core, and you have energy amplification. Simple really. But, has anyone realised this? Or are willing to discuss the implications? It would seem not.

Either I am being ignored, or everyone is feeling a little abashed that they have missed something so simple for so long.

Let me know which it is please, so I may move on.

I spend hours composing messages every time I try to get the message across. My time would be better spent enjoying my children, not ensuring their future. After all, why shift the status quo?

I for one was very interested and trying to be interactive as I can with my current knowledge but this IS Dr. Jones thread and he did suggest we try to stay on topic a bit more (not the exact words but I'm sure it was the intent) and so I suggested with such an interesting and extensive discussion possible on this subject that you might start your own thread.  This thread after all is about a modified Joule thief and how to get verification and replications of the possible OU.  I'd be happy to start a thread for you if needed (I don't know if new posters here need a certain post count to start a thread).   I think you will find I and some others here are quite humble and eager to learn.  But some here have had their share of 'carrot danglers' who seem to never be able to fully open up about knowledge they claim to have.  This is the only reason I think some may seem less than cordial.   
    So how about a thread title like "The missing (5th) Element in OU" ?  Or we can leave out the 5th but sure like that Bruce Willis movie ;) 

TEKTRON

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #648 on: July 08, 2011, 08:22:26 AM »
Well, although I have not received any enlightenment from .99 regarding the questions I posed to HIS/HER statements, only the idea that I misunderstood HIS/HER statements somehow, (and if so, would like explanation please), I will answer this somewhat crossed message question.

Firstly, please be specific.....are we looking at a solenoid, or a torroid? Secondly, There is no Bloch wall formed on an electromagnet with present energisation, so a different set of phenomena are used to establish the rules of interaction than are used with magnets alone. Thirdly, with a torroid, or closed core transformer, as you rightly point out, all the magnetic energy for "induction" is within the core, therefore, how can this be "transferred" to the adjoining coil and provide useable energy via the collapsing or building magnetic lines of force.....and do it so well? The only answer is that the wire is being energised in some way that is not immediately apparent, and is occuring within the bounds of the primary coils' geometry, as it cannot be "sensed" untill the secondarie's winds are lower to the face of the torroid than the primary, so energy is lost. In the same manner, by placing wraps further out, there is loss. I wonder, has anyone used flat strap to wind a transformer? Probably not in nearly a hundred years. Interestingly, this is what was used for transformers with the AC electricity in it's early form...wire ribbon. Why? What did they know that seems to have been forgotten, or missed?

Previously I asked why amperage and magnetic strength of the B field were related. I wait for an answer.

As to "just conveying my thoughts" on what the form of the wheelwork of nature really is?? That thing that is the water in our pond? If I did that, what would you learn? No. How about you reflect on what I have said. The answer is there. Right before you. Only one person thus far has even attempted to think and imagine a solution, then, (hopefully) test that idea with apparatus. Oops, sorry. Did I just suggest that someone do science?

I wonder, did anyone measure the mass of the plates in the battery that is charging and measure the capacitance of the entire circuit and find the resonant frequency.....to see if there is a correlation with the running frequency?

What of these reported "sweet spots" with the present design?

Where are the joyous words extolling the solution has been found, for it is these that prove the thoughts. The basis of the harmonic scale of matter.

Have any mass measurements been done?

Why does the mass of the primary and secondary have to be so similar in transformers? What does "harmonic resonance" lock onto?

We hear the standing wave in our well tuned musical instruments all the time. Pianos are a prime example. Why is it that no-one has applied that thinking to energy amplification.

I recently learned that an "amplifier" in electrical engineering is not "amplifying" anything. To amplify means to increase in strength. So, the end result must be that energy is greater out than in via some sort of fulcrum or pulley. Like a gearbox, amplifying the mechanical energy to push the car faster with less engine speed. Utilising inertia to relieve torque. This was the reason for heavy flywheels in old engine designs. The storage of inertia so the energy from it could be amplified via pulleys and such.

However, nowadays it seems that to amplify a signal means to hold back on the original strength of the current, or working force, and control it. This means that the highest amplification of the signal possible is the same as having no amplifier present. The control of the signal DOWNWARDS in strength is referred to as amplification. It is this type of thinking that prevents discovery of the truth.

How, in what manner, can we amplify energy when we are not taught that energy spins and has inertia, just like a flywheel??

This motion is called reactance, reluctance and resistance and is the source of all of the original though forms and quaternion equations that once described, in perfect detail, the overall manner in which electricity operates based upon circles not lines.

How can vectors describe rotation of subatomic particles? It cannot. So, "science" invents quantum math to blur the edges of their straight lines, and gets further and further away from the truth.

Anyway, I am now ranting.

Back to the issue at hand.

What is affected by the energy from a source of electricity to form a magnetic field around the energised current carrying medium?

Ohh, and also, if you take out the core of a transformer and leave the coils adjacent, does it still work? Why? What must be done to prevent them interacting and transferring energy one to the other with the changing magnetic field?

This type of science is what must be done, all over again, to find the truth. I cannot just blurt it out, for I will not be believed. I tried that once before.

I have no credentials, only experimental experience. And, without the math skills to back me up, all I have is these words.

I can point the way, but you must walk.

I can show you pictures, and videos 'till the cows come home. These would only be the source of more conjecture.

I tried asking for expert assistance, none came. So, I now ask the questions of you that I asked myself, in order that you may also do the same thinking. This is what a teacher does, so the student may learn for themselves. Only in that manner will the result, once realised, be believed.

Do the investigations I suggested, think on the real reasons behind the simple processes, and the truth will be revealed.

Or, you can simply do nothing but continue along, blundering in the dark. Frankly, I don't give a damn.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_a_magnetic_domain

TEKTRON

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #649 on: July 08, 2011, 09:01:54 AM »
Very interesting results reported by Dr. Jones for the electronic circuit.

Does anyone have a suggestion on how to measure the input-output power ratio - without using a state of the art oscilloscope?  For example, a diode bridge with a capacitor - or perhaps a way to make the circuit self-running etc?

I am not a fan of testing alternative energy devices for light output with the human eye, or a battery that does not run down etc.  We want to do 'real science' with real repeatable measurements.

Comments anyone?

-Nils

Sorry, off topic...
Nice site Nils, I'll be back to check it out soon :)

ElectroGravityPhysics.com


nul-points

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #650 on: July 08, 2011, 09:21:08 AM »
 
[...]
... eddy currents.

Place this mechanism, (which is supported by the background energy of the universe, just as the domains in a permanent magnet are), into a transformer core, and you have energy amplification. Simple really. But, has anyone realised this? Or are willing to discuss the implications? It would seem not.
[...]

Aspden has not only discussed this at length in his reports and papers, he has patented a reversible heat-to-electricity device on the principle
 

[...]
Either I am being ignored, or everyone is feeling a little abashed that they have missed something so simple for so long.
[...]

you may find that people are more likely to engage in discussion with you if you stop patronising them - winding your ego in a few notches wouldn't go amiss, either
 

frankly

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #651 on: July 08, 2011, 10:09:16 AM »
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=11116.0

I think  I did it correctly. Sorry for the "Jacking". Seems my communication limitations have thwarted me again.

This is only the second time I have attempted to communicate in forums like this, and I don't understand much of the processes and social etiquette.

Hope to see some like minds join me.

Frankly.

DrStiffler

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #652 on: July 08, 2011, 02:01:12 PM »
Wow!  Dr. Stiffler has done it again.  That is really amazing to me.  It would be very interesting to see if this could be scaled up a bit.

Bill
@Bill
Did you see Ben's replications?
http://www.youtube.com/user/k4zep#p/u/8/kAXP-gnjATM

JouleSeeker

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #653 on: July 08, 2011, 03:53:24 PM »

Did you see Ben's replications?
http://www.youtube.com/user/k4zep#p/u/8/kAXP-gnjATM

Yes, but Ben suggests this is AC-grid pick-up, to light the LED, if I understood him.
Isn't that right?   Can you rule this out in your vid with the three coils?

@all -- note that I will be traveling north today, to give a talk at a university in Idaho.  I will be talking about novel energy research -- very favorably of all or nearly all of you at this forum!  NP, Chris -- hope you don't mind if I use photos of yours; also intriguing vid by Lasersaber.  Thanks -- back in two days.

nul-points

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #654 on: July 08, 2011, 04:27:58 PM »
[...]
@all -- note that I will be traveling north today, to give a talk at a university in Idaho.  I will be talking about novel energy research -- very favorably of all or nearly all of you at this forum!  NP, Chris -- hope you don't mind if I use photos of yours; also intriguing vid by Lasersaber
[...]

no problem - hope the proceedings go well, have a good trip!
 

dimbulb

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #655 on: July 08, 2011, 04:35:15 PM »
@ TEKTRON thankyou for the ferroelectric generator patent link, see above.
It is another good source on doping solid state materials for alternative energy.

@ Dr Stiffler, Ben's replication obvious issues, design changes, the smallest lab has variety of noise.
lt may be inconclusive at this point to conclude that your setup is only absorbing ambient emf.

If Ben would pull that video we would appreciate it until we know whats going on at Stiffler labs. 73's  :o

NickZ

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #656 on: July 08, 2011, 04:45:05 PM »
   @ Dr. Stiffler:
   Even if Ben or you are picking it from up grid, this is still a possibly useful circuit for those close to power lines.  I have lines crossing over my house both in front and on one side, so, it may be useful in my case.  In both the your video as well as Bens the led does not look fully lit.  Might just be the angle. Are the two white leds the most that can be lit. What is the voltage and current?  Just trying to understand what's going on.
 Dr. Stiffler: Thank you in advance for your answer.
I hope you don't mind me uploading your video link onto this thread without asking you first. It just happened to fit into our thread discussion at this time, and many of us probably had not seen it yet.
 Thanks for sharing.
                              NickZ

xee2

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #657 on: July 08, 2011, 04:51:33 PM »
@ DrStiffler

Even if your circuit is running off the ground line noise I think it is still very impressive. Is this the way you have the coils connected?






DrStiffler

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #658 on: July 08, 2011, 09:10:00 PM »
@ DrStiffler

Even if your circuit is running off the ground line noise I think it is still very impressive. Is this the way you have the coils connected?
@xee2
For you as I think most of what is here is...

If one were to take the time to explore what is out there, it would put an end to this 200 year continuous 'it was this, it was that, he did this, that guy did that". If one were to fully explore the channels that have been presented and see that some people have expended hundreds of dollars in faith to see if it is possible, maybe this on and on saga would produce something that everyone could enjoy. Yet we have the ego's, the manic depressives and the illusionists that just will not back off so something can come of this to benefit all.

For the 'BOOKS' as Ben found out after spending $700+ US for an SA, this is not 60Hz. I have shown for years the frequencies where the coherence is possible, yet with the COINTELPRO, Entombed Academics and just plain uninformed, for 20 years I have seen the same things over and over and over. Morey, Tesla... okay if all these have done it, we must all be really stupid that after 200 years all we have is talk and platitudes to our friends or idols.

I really just get a major enjoyment in watching it all unfold and repeat and repeat, great fun.

Okay Xee2, yes indeed if it were the 60Hz or 50Hz ambient it would be great, yet when properly done this is ruled out. Three years ago someone (?) took an Exciter and Light System to the far reaches of the 'OutbacK' and low and behold it still did its magic???

I only posted here again so Bill could see and explore Ben's Channel, I have no interest here unless the "slander" gets out of hand.

neptune

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #659 on: July 08, 2011, 09:25:44 PM »
@Dr Stiffler .I get no pleasure at all in watching it unfold and repeat .Every day that it goes on , more and more people die needlessly from starvation .You may remember we talked about the motivation of the Pyramid man . It is said that truth is the first casualty of war . Well ,it has been a while since World War 2 ended , but truth is still in a coma . We live in an age of Information Technology . Unfortunately much of it is false . How do we separate the signal from the noise ? You may wish to help by answering the question put by Xee " above ?