Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding

User Menu

Custom Search

Author Topic: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?  (Read 914395 times)

e2matrix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1956
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #615 on: July 06, 2011, 07:35:37 PM »
The field surrounding an electrified form, which is magnetic in nature, and yes, swirling, is not what causes the field to form. The electric energy is the force creating it, yes. But what is it that the electric energy acts upon, to form the magnetic flux lines? Electrons???? How can a thing act upon itself to form another energy signature? That would be like wind glowing. The electron is the charge carrier apparently, acting upon....what....to form the magnetic field which is in proportion to the amperage content.....meaning the two are linked, magnetism and amperage. .......Now, there is a big hint!!
While it doesn't seem to quite fit with the last half of your reply above nor will it probably even sound sane to most people I keep coming back to photons as a possible answer to what energy acts upon to form magnetic flux lines.   A quote from an online source: " A Photon is the force carrier for electromagnetic force."  Just another wild shot in the dark  ... ;)

JouleSeeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #616 on: July 06, 2011, 08:12:52 PM »
 Again, the theoretical discussion is interesting, but to me, experimental studies are more likely to be productive of substantive results. 

Thanks again to Lasersaber for your build -- and if you're reading:   Just how did you connect your larger cylindrical coil into the circuit?  and what kind of coil was this? 
Thanks, all.

I decided to jump in and give this circuit a try.  I ended up modifying it.  I am excited by what I have seen so far.  I plan on trying a few more thing to improve the efficiency even more.

Thank you PhysicsProf for sharing.

Video:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PS2W_48_QKQ

e2matrix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1956
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #617 on: July 06, 2011, 08:22:19 PM »
Agree.  It would be good if frankly started his own thread. 

I think the coil is one of lasersabers coils from his JouleRinger circuit or similar to those he used in that fun little circuit.  I even gave that one a try and got about 4.5 minutes of light from a CFL off just the capacitor.  It's a bifilar wound coil.

NerzhDishual

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 588
    • FreeNRG.info
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #618 on: July 06, 2011, 11:08:17 PM »
@Frankly

Sincerely and honestly, you must be half a genius.

Actually, you managed to get Nul-Points (the misnamed) loosing his temper
but not his English Humour, (hence the halving). ;D

Yes, theoretical issues are very interesting  but Sadi Carnot did not invent
the Stream machine and serendipity exists.

Very Best

Ps: I'm aware that this post will not be of any help regarding your experiments. :P

ElectroGravityPhysics.com

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #619 on: July 07, 2011, 03:29:15 AM »
Very interesting results reported by Dr. Jones for the electronic circuit.

Does anyone have a suggestion on how to measure the input-output power ratio - without using a state of the art oscilloscope?  For example, a diode bridge with a capacitor - or perhaps a way to make the circuit self-running etc?

I am not a fan of testing alternative energy devices for light output with the human eye, or a battery that does not run down etc.  We want to do 'real science' with real repeatable measurements.

Comments anyone?

-Nils

e2matrix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1956
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #620 on: July 07, 2011, 03:59:26 AM »
Very interesting results reported by Dr. Jones for the electronic circuit.

Does anyone have a suggestion on how to measure the input-output power ratio - without using a state of the art oscilloscope?  For example, a diode bridge with a capacitor - or perhaps a way to make the circuit self-running etc?

I am not a fan of testing alternative energy devices for light output with the human eye, or a battery that does not run down etc.  We want to do 'real science' with real repeatable measurements.

Comments anyone?

-Nils

Welcome to OU.com.  I don't know of any way to measure OU accurately that does not involve high end equipment.  One member here has pushed the idea that probes for measuring such will cost even more than the oscilloscope.  I personally feel that if it's not at least a couple times OU than it's not worth getting into as it won't be able to self run or loop.  If it's over 2 or 3 COP than it should be able to loop and self run.  At that point I think you have irrefutable proof. 
    Having studied a lot about modern LED's and Lumen output vs. perception with the human eye I fully agree that LED's are not impressive in measuring OU.  After all they are just another circuit component - a diode that happens to have the side effect of some luminosity.  Also batteries as has been mentioned numerous times can by some means regain some of their voltage just sitting there not even in a circuit.  I've got LCD clocks still running on the same AA alkaline for 10 years and have flashlights that still put out light from AA Lithiums well after 10 years.
     

ElectroGravityPhysics.com

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #621 on: July 07, 2011, 06:07:40 AM »
Thanks e2matrix for the welcome and the common sense comments.

I agree with you about inconclusive battery testing methods for energy devices, and also taking measurement of light from a LED as any kind of proof.  I read somewhere that the LED output can be pulsed at a 10% duty-cycle and still look as bright as a steady state DC current - to the human eye...

I am guessing there may be a lot of difficult to measure phase relationships between high frequency currents and voltages in the Dr. Jones circuit, but I like to think there must be a simple way to add a high frequency bridge rectifier to his circuit that is feds into a small capacitor to measure the resulting rise in DC voltage?

Perhaps there a reason Dr. Jones has not already done this simple method of high frequency rectification to DC?  Any thoughts?

nul-points

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 995
    • Doc Ringwood's Free Energy blog
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #622 on: July 07, 2011, 09:32:02 AM »
 
[...]
We want to do 'real science' with real repeatable measurements.
[...]
-Nils

...awww, shucks, teacher - you're such a Bohr!



[...and now, folks - let's find out who is the next shiny new persona on tonight's show!  ;)  ]

JouleSeeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #623 on: July 07, 2011, 05:22:52 PM »
Very interesting results reported by Dr. Jones for the electronic circuit.

Does anyone have a suggestion on how to measure the input-output power ratio - without using a state of the art oscilloscope?  For example, a diode bridge with a capacitor - or perhaps a way to make the circuit self-running etc?

I am not a fan of testing alternative energy devices for light output with the human eye, or a battery that does not run down etc.  We want to do 'real science' with real repeatable measurements.

Comments anyone?

-Nils

Nils,     We have in the preceding pages discussed measurement methods at some length. 
Clearly, creating a self-running device (with load) is an optimum test.  Ideally, this would not have a battery anywhere in the circuit.

Measuring the total input energy available is quite straightforward using a known capacitor charged to a measured voltage:  E = 1/2 CV**2. 
Measuring the total energy released by the system while running can be measured by inserting the device into a sensitive calorimeter. This is the approach I am taking now, and I hope to have such a measurement on this device in the next few weeks (as my calorimeterist colleague returns from travel in Europe). 

JouleSeeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #624 on: July 07, 2011, 05:50:26 PM »
  Today, I came across a Declaration signed by physicist Harvey Fletcher, inventor of a stereo sound system and the hearing aid, and a key experimenter regarding the precision measurement of the electron's charge. 

  I personally spoke to Dr. Fletcher (September 11, 1884 – July 23, 1981)  while I was an undergraduate student at Brigham Young University in about 1972.  He was a bright and cheerful person, animated and full of life; he was about 88 years old when I met him.

  Dr. Fletcher's Declaration was signed and notarized in Provo, Utah, on May 25, 1979.  (Available here:  http://thmoray.org/, and attached.)  In it he states for the record that he personally observed Dr. T. Henry Moray's energy device; he writes:

Quote
I do know that it did function for the several hours of time that I observed it.  I could discern no batteries, and could observe no other known methods of inducing electric power into the box or its loads.

Having met Dr. Harvey Fletcher and admiring his clarity of mind and sincerity, I find the above statement to be quite compelling.
--Steven E. Jones (Spring City, Utah, July 7, 2011)




NickZ

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5225
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #625 on: July 07, 2011, 06:08:01 PM »
   Joule Seeker and All:
  I have gotten my BwJt to go from draining a new AA in a couple of days, to now ongoing 6 days, and still lit although very dimly.  So, at least I'm going in the right direction.  This is using the 3/4 inch iron powder Pc core (not ferrite), and a kn2222A  transistor, 5 k pot, and 104 cap. 
  I was wondering if Joule Seeker has finished with the test using an AA.  Last time I heard, in your first days test, the voltage reading had not dropped by hardly anything after a days run time. So, how many total amount of days did it run for on a new single AA???  Hopefully with some usable light intensity, not barely lighting.
  Although this kind of test is not very scientific, I give more credence to it, over any scope, meter, or heat analysis.  As they can be fooled by the recirculating, recycled energy.  But my eyes, are never fooled.
   Kooler has also found that the voltage goes from 0,6 to a 1.5 volts, up and down constantly.  How would any instrument be able to measure that type of result correctly?   As the battery in this case is part of the load.  The output from one of his devices secondary coil is only 4 giving volts, yet is lighting 70 leds.   
  I think that these backward Jtc have gotten my brain running backwards also. So, if I sound a bit off...  you'll know why.

NickZ

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5225
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #626 on: July 07, 2011, 06:30:30 PM »
  Funny how after so many years we still can't replicate the Moray device, that knowledge died with him. Thank you for bringing it up.
 
  Dr. Stiffler has made a self running device using three small coils, a tiny capacitor, and a ground connection, only.  No batteries, at all.   It does not seam to output much power to light an led,  but it's a start.
  There is no device that is really "self running", as they are all run on some type of energy conversion process.  Misnomers don't help to understand the cause of the effect generation.

nul-points

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 995
    • Doc Ringwood's Free Energy blog
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #627 on: July 07, 2011, 06:50:32 PM »
 
  Today, I came across a Declaration signed by physicist Harvey Fletcher, [...]
  Dr. Fletcher's Declaration was signed and notarized in Provo, Utah, on May 25, 1979.  (Available here:  http://thmoray.org/, and attached.)  In it he states for the record that he personally observed Dr. T. Henry Moray's energy device;
[...]
Having met Dr. Harvey Fletcher and admiring his clarity of mind and sincerity, I find the above statement to be quite compelling.
--Steven E. Jones (Spring City, Utah, July 7, 2011)


thank you for sharing that document - a fascinating glimpse behind the 'legend' of Moray - and a great connection for you, Steven!

i'm pleased to learn that people of Fletcher's calibre were able to be present at such a demonstration

the sketch which i've seen of a circuit diagram (if it truly represented the device demonstrated) appears to be little different from a valve radio in configuration - the unusual parts being Moray's special valves (as hidden in his hand during the inspection of the device at the demo), i believe they may have contained isotopes of some material(s)


my SJ1 variant is on its way, regular airmail post [no NDA required!  ;) ], hopefully arriving by early next week, in time for your access to a calorimeter

thanks
np


http://docsfreelunch.blogspot.com
 

xee2

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1610
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #628 on: July 07, 2011, 06:56:42 PM »

  Dr. Fletcher's Declaration was signed and notarized in Provo, Utah, on May 25, 1979.  (Available here:  http://thmoray.org/, and attached.)  In it he states for the record that he personally observed Dr. T. Henry Moray's energy device; he writes:


Thank you for posting this. I personally feel that Moray's device is the best documented free energy device. I fail to understand why the technology was allowed to be lost. His device seems to have been real and seems to have produce very significant amounts of free energy. I hope you will attempt to duplicated it.





JouleSeeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #629 on: July 07, 2011, 09:47:03 PM »


thank you for sharing that document - a fascinating glimpse behind the 'legend' of Moray - and a great connection for you, Steven!

i'm pleased to learn that people of Fletcher's calibre were able to be present at such a demonstration

the sketch which i've seen of a circuit diagram (if it truly represented the device demonstrated) appears to be little different from a valve radio in configuration - the unusual parts being Moray's special valves (as hidden in his hand during the inspection of the device at the demo), i believe they may have contained isotopes of some material(s)


my SJ1 variant is on its way, regular airmail post [no NDA required!  ;) ], hopefully arriving by early next week, in time for your access to a calorimeter

thanks
np


http://docsfreelunch.blogspot.com

Awesome, NP -- thanks so much for sending your DUT for testing and for comments!
@Xee -- I don't think anyone really knows how to duplicate Moray's device....  I certainly don't have enough information.
But I found this letter from Dr. Fletcher, which provides a little insight further:

Quote
"(Copy of the letter written by Dr. Harvey Fletcher of the Western Electric Company under the date of Oct. 6, 1928 to Mr. Robert L. Judd of Salt Lake City. The letter was written in New York City.).

 

"Dear Judd:

 

"We had a very pleasant return trip, arriving here in about six and a half days. The constant driving made me somewhat tired but after two days rest I feel fine. One can get a very good conception of what our country is like by driving across it in an automobile.

"Now regarding the experiments Mr. Moray showed us, I will say at the outset that I am just as puzzled as ever. I can give no satisfactory explanation of the result. If I saw all the parts that enter into the production of the light I would certainly agree with Mr. Moray that either the tubes or the rectifier or the coil had some very remarkable properties. As a scientist I should like to see them investigated in some physical laboratory which is equipped to do such work. If Mr. Moray's statement that the tubes have a capacity of a farad is even approximately true, the tubes alone have a great scientific value.

"The evidence as presented seems to favor Mr. Moray's explanation of where the energy came from. However, because it is so contrary to all previous notions about electrical sources and also because Mr. Moray was unable or unwilling to state how the various parts functioned, I am still of the opinion that all of us, including probably Mr. Moray, have overlooked something which will explain the lighting of the light in an orthodox way.

"There are certain facts which became evident to me as I saw the experiments:

"(1) There is considerable energy drawn from somewhere. Apparently you have satisfied yourself that it is not from other power stations in the city. Then it must be in the set itself. This looks improbable although not impossible. Some careful experiments in a laboratory would settle this points.

"(2) The energy is transferred from a high impedance circuit to a low impedance circuit by means of a high frequency current. The high frequency is probably produced by an oscillatory circuit in the system and I think tests would reveal that the frequency of oscillation was entirely controlled by the constants of the circuit and not by outside influences. Any attempt to obtain current or voltage readings on the high impedance side of the circuit by ordinary meters would probably result in failure. This is confirmed by Mr. Moray's experience.

"(3) If the source of energy is within the system, by redesigning the system the same performance can be obtained without the use of the antennae.

"(4) If the rectifier has only the function Mr. Moray claimed for it, then a substitute can easily be found which is much more stable and reliable. "Assuming Mr. Moray is correct in his explanation, in my opinion it would be many years before he would be able to perfect his device by working all alone by the cut-and-try methods that he must necessarily use. Progress is not made in these days by lone workers. There are so many phases to such a problem that it requires the coopers ion of specialists to answer satisfactorily the different phases of the problems. Unless Mr. Moray changes his attitude it seems to be hopeless to expect any progress whether he is right or wrong. He expects everybody to trust him and give him support but still he will trust nobody. When he will take into his confidence such fine men as Marshall and Eyring to such an extent that they can duplicate his apparatus I really think something good will come out of it, probably in quite a different way than he now expects."

"Sincerely yours,

Signed (Harvey Fletcher)* "

Clearly, the device had: "I would certainly agree with Mr. Moray that either the tubes or the rectifier or the coil had some very remarkable properties. "

The "rectifier" was evidently Moray's doped-germanium crystal (?) -- remember, this was before the days of the transistor even.  I wonder if that coil was bifilar? ;)

Does anyone understand this? or know how high the frequency was? :

Quote
The energy is transferred from a high impedance circuit to a low impedance circuit by means of a high frequency current. The high frequency is probably produced by an oscillatory circuit in the system -- Fletcher