Hi Hoppy,

Could you please explain this further? In my understanding, in Circuit V7, all power being consumed in the input side of the circuit should pass through the Input Shunt Resistor R2 giving a total calculation of the Input Current to the rest of the Circuit? Is this not correct? Have I missed something?

Thanks in advance.

All the best

  Chris

Hi Tudi,

Yes, It is Inverted. It makes self Looping very difficult. Still working on it, no success yet.

Wont it be nice to build a small circuit that powers itself... Nice.

All the best

  Chris

@ hyiq

I think you should confirm the scope readings by replacing R4, D2, and VR2 in circuit V7 with a 1 K resistor and computing the output power by measuring the voltage across the 1 K resistor with a battery powered DVM. Watts = volts squared divided by resistance. Since the output is close to DC, this should give readings close to the scope readings. If not, the scope may not be giving accurate results.

EDIT:  using a 10 K resistor will produce higher voltage readings and may thus be more accurate.

Hi Bruce,

Thanks for the advise. I am always open to constructive suggestions, TinselKoala has not replied and I don't expect one now. Maybe he has looked at my data again and thought other wise?
(snip)

P.S. If anyone See's a mistake please let me know. Sometimes I work on this under tired wary conditions so like anyone I do make mistakes. I do try to always double check things however. A better way to do something is always a better way!

I'm trying, I really am.
If you want to see some of what I've been working on in the past, you can look at my YT channel, and put "Joule Thief" into the search window. I have posted a couple of videos concerning measurement of energy using oscilloscopes in the Joule Thief and in the Rosemary Ainslie circuit. Please note the dates, they are pretty old.
Also, you might look at the Rosemary Ainslie thread here, and look at what poynt99 is trying to illustrate.
The main problem that I see here is that some intelligent and creative people are wasting a lot of time making meaningless measurements, when they have the apparatus at hand to attack the problem properly. They might not get results they like, though, and THAT is really the problem.
I am willing to do "power analyses" the same way you are doing them. Let's start with my TinselKoil and see what kind of COP we get. I am also willing to do them properly and share the techniques for doing so.
Now... are you willing to do the measurements the way I suggest, just for comparison's sake? That is, use the amount of energy in a cap bank, applied over a period of time, for input energy, and use the integrated instantaneous power curve over the same time, for output energy, and compare the two, for a true COP efficiency value?

(ETA: Once we are taking proper energy measurements, we can start talking about probe placement, stray inductances and circuit layout. These are so critical that they can actually have large effects on measurements and the calculated values derived from them. Very very large.....)

@hyiq

I agree with TK. Setup a measurement protocol first.
Since you are in a milli and micro range, nothing is reliable. Even touching the probe or keeping a PC on besides it will alter everything.

Since the waveforms don't allow direct looping back, the only way is proper measurements. (For those who don't have expensive calorimeters)

I'd also advise you to go back to the original circuit of Prof. We all have a tendency to forget that we are doing a "Replication" and start twisting the original to suit our own convenience. I see that you are falling in the same trap.

All the best.

Hi All,

Yes I agree.  Thanks for your advise. I think I will wait for Dr Jones to come back and check this circuit, then work together. I have gone a bit off track and am starting to loose the focus of this replication effort.

To prove or dis prove an above unity circuit...

Hoppy, sorry for the questions, so does that mean, a "Sense Resistor" is not a good idea of measurements?

Thanks all for your help and advise!

All the best

  Chris

Hi All,

Yes I agree.  Thanks for your advise. I think I will wait for Dr Jones to come back and check this circuit, then work together. I have gone a bit off track and am starting to loose the focus of this replication effort.

To prove or dis prove an above unity circuit...

Hoppy, sorry for the questions, so does that mean, a "Sense Resistor" is not a good idea of measurements?

Thanks all for your help and advise!

All the best

  Chris

Chris,

A sense / shunt resistor will allow you to scope the current waveform whilst adding negligible load to the circuit. However, when dealing with complex waveforms and looking at efficiency, this is more involved and its necessary to have a good understanding of electrical principles. TK has the knowledge to guide you well on the right way to do this.

Hoppy

I don't know Russian but what i understood from the video was that, he first shunted the capacitor on the left then he charged the capacitor using the battery and left the circuit to run alone without battery. As he does this, he shows the waveform of the pulses on the scope so that we can see its amplitude. When the circuit starts running alone, the amplitude decreases (maybe because the capacitor on the right is charging) and then increases again and stabilizes.

If my understanding is correct and there is no trick, then this should mean the circuit is self running with at least n = 2 since capacitor charging dissipates 50% of the energy by joule effect.

This seems to be an interesting circuit to compare with. It uses a separated coil to collect the energy and with less turns than the primary coil so that the pulses have lower amplitude and greater current. This should make it easier to feedback. The 'collecting coil' also has a middle connection that allows full wave rectifying of the pulses with only 2 diodes instead of 4 which means less voltage drop (0.7V instead of 1.4V).

Regards,
Jaime

Dear yfree,

If you understand Russian, does it turn out how long his 'free energy circuit' runs? 
He charges up the input capacitor on the left side of his schematic first with the 12V battery, then the circuit runs from that (puffer) capacitor.  Because this circuit is basically a tipical blocking oscillator, with the usual spike waveforms and with very little current consumption, I believe the run time just depends on how long the initial charge lasts in the capacitor.
Of course the output of the oscillator is rectified and fed back to the puffer capacitor as an additional supply voltage, making the run time longer than without the feedback. 
So I wonder how long his circuit has run for him? 
I built blocking oscillators in the past and they run for about half an hour from a 4700uF puffer capacitor but once the charge was consumed from the capacitor the circuit stopped. I wonder why he calls this a free energy circuit? Maybe his circuit does not stop? 

Thanks,  Gyula