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Author Topic: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?  (Read 706668 times)

Offline Tudi

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #105 on: June 01, 2011, 09:08:21 AM »
Quote
.. if you look at Gadgetmall's circuits...one of his JT designs will run over a year 24/7 on a single AA so that is a long time to test. ..
I know most people are here for science and progress. Some of us are here to change the world. That means if i can make my home lightning with 1 AA battery. Then to hell with measurement precision and errors. It simply works for a specific purpuse. Who cares if instead 10kHz your led will light up with 30Hz ? The point is that is working in a way that seems to be the same for you, but it consumes much less energy. It does not need to loop back forever, even if improved efficiency by a considerable amount it is a great achievement. No need to kill progress just because it is not exactly what you wanted to have.

Meantime, carry on with research :) Just don't get lost in the details like companies that get lost in the paper work before releasing a technology to "market".

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Pirate88179

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #106 on: June 01, 2011, 09:27:48 AM »
Tudi:

I agree.  I use JT lighting circuits to light most of my home most of the time.  I use dead batteries that others give to me instead of tossing out so, they cost me nothing for the light.  (Free light)  Efficiency is the main thing and if we get so efficient that it goes OU, so much the better.

Anyway, I have always been fascinated by the JT circuit as most on here know by now.

Bill

Offline jmmac

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #107 on: June 01, 2011, 11:03:38 AM »
Hi Chris,

I too am trying to replicate the circuit but with less success than you.

Regarding your measurements, i'm not sure i understood your method but, you can only calculate the output power multiplying current * voltage if these quantities are 100% constant over time (DC). Otherwise you'll get wrong results.

Regards,
Jaime

Hi Dr Jones.

I have replicated your Circuit. I have attached Pictures and the Calculator for others to use if they wish. I am getting COP = 2.5 at the moment. I think It may be a measurement error, but have checked three times and get the same result. Its early days for me and I will stay reserved at this point on my findings as there could be an error on my part. My goal is to make this self run like I mentioned but have not been able to make this happen yet.

I still think there is a 50/50 chance, but am convinced that some serious work will be needed to get a Bi-Polar Switch like Ron Cole/John Bedini's to make this run itsself.

All the best, and I will post more soon.

  Chris

P.S. My components are slightly modified compared to the schematic. Sense resistor = 1.5 Ohm. Load Resistor was changed also.I will post more information soon.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #107 on: June 01, 2011, 11:03:38 AM »
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Offline bolt

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #108 on: June 01, 2011, 11:05:42 AM »
Absolutely  correct. The road to OU starts with energy savings but they need to be applied to real life practical use to be of any benefit. Alike RV motors big heavy 3 phase motors can run on as little as 10 watts to spin a 5 HP motor.  So it means nothing to demonstrate 10mw IN and 80mW out UNLESS you put that to good use.  LED lighting is of course a useful application.  There are many things that are OU and its no surprise the JT is OU and i have been saying this for years more often than not when looking at scope shots. I personally not too impressed lighting an LED for a year on one AA battery. My smoke detector runs for 3 years on a pp3 battery and beeps and flashes an LED for another 6 months LOL. This is 25 year old technology.  So use the JT principle and scale it up bigger.

 Is it real? well yes of course see Ismael electric Car MEG DOT and DOE engineers tested to a COP of 2.7 running a 1000 watt load! But OU is not Looping too many people do not understand the difference. Call it energy savings first. For the same load your battery will last say 4 to 8 times longer. If EVERYONE used this technology that is around 1/2 Trillion dollars a years not going into the battery market. That is sure to upset a few people.

 You can get the same use full size transformers and a lot more power. Looping is a different matter requires a COP > 2 plus system losses. In practice unlikely to loop under  COP 3 and tuning and critical RF application of load matching is essential to prevent OU being lost. 

So don't spend too much time arguing about scope shots you never convince anyone that way and the arguing has been going on for many many years of how to measure IN and OUT see Ainsley Heater for that 1000 page thread saga. What changes things is when everyone just starts to use this technology then its just accepted as the norm like using microwave ovens was one of the biggest changes for  technophobics  in the home of the last century.

Focus your energies into getting a bit more power out and applying it to real life  applications then you will see the market sit up and take notice.

Offline Hoppy

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #109 on: June 01, 2011, 11:38:16 AM »
Hi Dr Jones,

I think at this stage my replication has too much room for error, so for this reason, may be best if I work a bit more on this first. Certianly after i get more results, that would be no problem.

All the best

  Chris

Chris,

Using your test setup with my Rigol DS1052E scope taking average voltage readings across 1R resistors, I get 3.5mA I/P and just under 1.0mA O/P. In power terms this gives an efficiency of around 30%. My Rb is 56K and running frequency is 2.63MHz. Load is 1K. Battery supply voltage 3.0V.

Hoppy

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #109 on: June 01, 2011, 11:38:16 AM »
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Offline bolt

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #110 on: June 01, 2011, 12:50:39 PM »
Chris,

Using your test setup with my Rigol DS1052E scope taking average voltage readings across 1R resistors, I get 3.5mA I/P and just under 1.0mA O/P. In power terms this gives an efficiency of around 30%. My Rb is 56K and running frequency is 2.63MHz. Load is 1K. Battery supply voltage 3.0V.

Hoppy

But did you measure the o/p voltage? You must measure volts and amps. In OU phase shift creates reactive power increases voltage drastically! ZPE enters equation where current node is Zero not nothing while voltage is max.  High impedance load will appreciate this extra voltage @ 1mA could easy be 25v RMS from 3v supply. Larger unmatched loads creates phase shifts losses back below Over-unity.  This explains why high impedance florescent lights easy lit full brightness as OU JT far brighter than normal DC i/p.

Offline Tudi

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #111 on: June 01, 2011, 01:00:57 PM »
it's amazing how many people talk about RC components of a circuit while L is just characterized by number of turns most of the time. I think that L can have at least as much details as a C. How about wire resistance ? Inductance, Ferite type, size of the cavity, wire length, wire diameter, distance between wires, the way the coil was made ( wire direction ), how compact is your coil, the speed and amount of characteristic changes of the wire when gets heated.....
To get a perfect resonance you need to match quite a few details. No wonder most people are unable to reproduce devices if description is like : you need a 2 wire coil

I think it would be very wise if next step would be to create additional 2 circuits like the first one by Joulseeker and try to use the output of circuit 1 to feed circuit 2 and 3.

This would help regarding scaling details ( sum of output power...) + might reveal small details regarding the build that might have got missed in the description.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #111 on: June 01, 2011, 01:00:57 PM »
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Offline Hoppy

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #112 on: June 01, 2011, 01:06:20 PM »
Post deleted

Hoppy

Offline Hoppy

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #113 on: June 01, 2011, 02:07:17 PM »
But did you measure the o/p voltage? You must measure volts and amps. In OU phase shift creates reactive power increases voltage drastically! ZPE enters equation where current node is Zero not nothing while voltage is max.  High impedance load will appreciate this extra voltage @ 1mA could easy be 25v RMS from 3v supply. Larger unmatched loads creates phase shifts losses back below Over-unity.  This explains why high impedance florescent lights easy lit full brightness as OU JT far brighter than normal DC i/p.

I've re-taken measurements and now have 1.80mV across the output shunt and 2V across the 1K load resistor, so the two match up reasonably well with the difference being down to the accuracy of my 1R shunt which has 5% tolerance.

Yes, 25V RMS at a particular load but not at 1K with my setup.
 
Hoppy
« Last Edit: June 01, 2011, 02:50:43 PM by Hoppy »

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #113 on: June 01, 2011, 02:07:17 PM »
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Offline jmmac

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #114 on: June 01, 2011, 02:20:58 PM »
Hoppy,

If you eliminate the 1 Ohm resistor and keep the 1K load, then you can just measure the voltage drop in the load and calculate the current and power. You should have more accurate values this way.

Jaime

I've re-taken measurements and now have 1.80mV across the output shunt and 200mV across the 1K load resistor, so the two match up reasonably well with the difference being down to the accuracy of my 1R shunt which has 5% tolerance.

Yes, 25V RMS at a particular load but not at 1K with my setup.
 
Hoppy

Offline yssuraxu_697

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #115 on: June 01, 2011, 02:36:42 PM »
BTW it may just be an electromagnetic flywheel. In this case it is no problem to record "OU" in the flywheeling part but attempts to extract from there at greater rate than input will fail. At least when attempting to extract exact same form of energy.
Unless there is "unconventional" input from material itself in transistor, core or cap.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #115 on: June 01, 2011, 02:36:42 PM »
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Offline Hoppy

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #116 on: June 01, 2011, 02:55:25 PM »
Hoppy,

If you eliminate the 1 Ohm resistor and keep the 1K load, then you can just measure the voltage drop in the load and calculate the current and power. You should have more accurate values this way.

Jaime

Yes, that's the way I would normally measure but I'm just comparing the two.  ;)

Hoppy

Offline JouleSeeker

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #117 on: June 01, 2011, 07:02:26 PM »
Glad people are doing replications and tests. 
I just wrote an email to someone beginning a replication that may be of use to others as well:
 
Quote
....very glad you're looking at this little circuit.

I would ask that on your scope you look at the Power waveforms, Pin and Pout, and then tune the circuit as well as you can to minimize Pin.  Pin waveform should appear with a strong AC component, fluctuating around zero.  "Tuning" means adjusting the variable resistors in the circuit -- and the resistor to the transistor base -- so as to try to get the MEAN value of Pin to be close to zero.

The Pout waveform should show spikes of power, which remain on "one side of the zero line" when the Pin waveform is adjusted to average to near-zero.

That's what I've observed, and that's how I have evidence for (not "proof" of) super-efficiency, Pout/Pin > 1.

Thanks for taking a look at this!
Steven

Offline Montec

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #118 on: June 01, 2011, 08:14:35 PM »
Hello JouleSeeker
Measuring output power using current is one way to measure power. It does not matter whether the current is DC, pulsed DC or AC. The same equation I2*R=P holds true. The trick is to split a current into two equal currents. Taking an output across a load resister and passing it through a FWBR and charging a capacitor will give a maximum voltage across the capacitor. Using a variable resistor across the capacitor you can drain the energy (current) in the capacitor to a steady state voltage reading (across the variable resistor) that equals 0.707 times the max voltage you first measured. This is a half power measurement. The power dissipated by the variable resistor is equal to the power dissipated by the load resistor. The load resistor dissipates power from a non-sinusoidal current and the variable resistor dissipates power from a (nearly) DC current. A larger capacitor will make the DC smother at the expense of a longer measuring time. (Charge and discharge times increase.)

:)
 

Offline jmmac

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #119 on: June 01, 2011, 08:39:29 PM »
Prof. Jones,

I'm trying to replicate your circuit without success. Can you please give some informations in order to help me?

- What's the voltage drop in your LED (in a dc circuit)?
- Did you use a normal ferrite toroid?
- I don't have 2N2222 transistors. Can you tell me if your circuit works as well with a BC547, BC547A or 2N3904 ?

Thank you. Hope you're having a nice time.
Regards,
Jaime

Quote from: JouleSeeker
link=topic=10773.msg289174#msg289174 date=1306947746
Glad people are doing replications and tests. 
I just wrote an email to someone beginning a replication that may be of use to others as well:
 Steven

 

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