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Author Topic: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?  (Read 709382 times)

Offline Tudi

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #255 on: June 10, 2011, 10:14:29 AM »
As long as it can make 1 lightbulb shine "forever" for everyone in the city. I would be happy to accept almost any source of energy that does not cause some harm ( like eat up radio signals ).

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline nul-points

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #256 on: June 10, 2011, 12:01:11 PM »
Now the question remains why?

Does the charging capability seems to decrease at night .. This could be because of less electric noise pollution from radiostations, mobilephones and so on at night

Best regards

beno


hi all

apologies for a marathon post here - i hope you will consider it all to be on-topic wrt recent posts


firstly, from observing my 'slower' variation of Steven's circuit (approx 25uS pulses with a very low 'mark-to-space' ratio, more like the Russian circuit) i see a decreasing amplitude 'sine'-like oscillation, approx 55kHz, immediately after the pulse

this sine wave is occurring when the system enters a high-impedance state when the 'driven' pulses stop - ie. no load, little dissipation

the wave usually decreases as a small amount of energy remaining in the self-resonant winding setup dissipates during each cycle

i've found that this waveform is significantly reduced or 'killed' by applying any load - the energy left in the system just dissipates more quickly

when i was experimenting with different forms of feedback in the last few days, i added a 'tuning' cap across the o/p winding (as per the Russian cct) and i could easily get the sine waveform to sustain for several seconds after the intended pulses had stopped (at the same amplitude, approx 1V) until the sine suddenly 'snapped' to off

interestingly, when i replaced the transistor base bias variable resistor (250K ohms) with a schottky diode (1N5187), using the reverse leakage of the diode as a very high impedance bias 'resistor', the circuit spontaneously started to produce this 55kHz sine wave of approx 250mV pk-pk (from cap charge alone) without ever getting into pulse generation mode


i watched it for several minutes to see if it started to decrease in amplitude and, if anything, it appeared to continuously fluctuate up & down slightly, without any obvious pattern

i suspect that these oscillators can operate in a very high-impedance mode (as if the whole circuit has a high 'Q' factor) and they can use remnant voltage in the system very efficiently

however, my requirement was to generate short bursts of pulsed energy which i could feedback into a NiMH cell, and since this 'continuous' wave couldn't provide sufficient amplitude or power to achieve this, i noted that this behaviour was interesting, but not useful to me at this time

i suspect that the Russian circuit is showing similar behaviour


my second comment, relating to all this, picks up on a couple of other investigations i've done - one a couple of years ago, monitoring the self-charge of capacitors, and the other an ongoing experiment with simple D-I-Y cells

in both these experiments i've recorded a daily fluctuation of self-charge of isolated (and enclosed in metal case) systems

the major correlation of the self-charge appears to be temperature, but other factors have appeared to contribute also, and sometimes these seem to link to astronomical conditions

in one test, i used a capacitor which previously had been shunted by a 1M ohm resistor for at least 6 months continuously

under these conditions the voltage on the cap had shown a continual cyclic positive charge of a few mV pk-pk

i removed the shunt resistor, replaced the cap in the metal case, and took 'spot' voltage measurements over the next few months

in the first couple of weeks, the voltage on the cap rose exponentially to somewhere in the region of 50-100mV, and then it settled into a linear increase with time

when i stopped monitoring the capacitor after about 6 months it had reached 300+mV

this was NOT because the capacitor was 'relaxing' back to a previous state of charge - it's maximum voltage for the previous 6 months was only a few mV!

details of all my test findings can be downloaded in PDF format from:
     link-->http://ringcomps.co.uk/doc/pages/secret_life_of_capacitors.pdf 


the D-I-Y cell experiment is interesting, not only because one cell appears to be self-sustaining (with a very small load) - several months achieved so far - but the cell voltages rise & fall with temperature

most of the cells i've made have had a positive temperature co-efficient (cell voltage increased with temperature rise) - and i expected that energy was being supplied to the cell with ambient heat enabling the voltage to rise on-load

however, the cell which is now self-sustaining shows an INVERSE temperature co-efficient!
(details via the Blog link below)

i can't explain that one - the load circuit is the same - the cell parts are the same materials (possibly very slight constructional method)


so - in both these cases the charge effect is different at night - but this is mainly because the temperature changes by a few degrees, compared to daytime

i don't rule out the possibility that these low-powered experiments are also being affected by cosmic particles - but i can certainly discount electromagnetic influence when the systems are operating inside e/m shielding


hope this has been helpful
np


http://docsfreelunch.blogspot.com
 

Offline beno

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #257 on: June 10, 2011, 04:20:54 PM »
nul-points, Your post was not long at all ;)

I think that you in your secret_life_of_capacitors are a lot closer to the real reason for this effect, than the story about neutrinoes, which I find a bit hard to belive (but this may be a problem with my imagination).

Because the way I read it,it can be boiled down to:

* Temperature

And interaction with the earth capacitor (the schumann cavity):

* Height
* Time of day

Actually it was also this cavity which Nikola Tesla "worked" with in some of his experiments.


Best regards

beno


P.s. I happen to test this with a simple capacitor setup which loads two 1000uF capacitors up with about two volts per day, but this is without any real load. So the energy involved is not that great, and therefore not of any real value other than having some fun.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #257 on: June 10, 2011, 04:20:54 PM »
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Offline Pirate88179

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #258 on: June 10, 2011, 05:59:54 PM »
As long as it can make 1 lightbulb shine "forever" for everyone in the city. I would be happy to accept almost any source of energy that does not cause some harm ( like eat up radio signals ).

I agree with this post totally!  I have argued this for years.  Many of my devices have been accused of tapping into man made energy transmissions...but...the radio transmitter has no idea how many radios are tuned in right?  1 or 10,000 still the same output.  So, since I am no scientist I can't really argue where the energy is coming from  BUT, I still call it free energy (Of which I have and use many devices)  I never call it OU.  My earth battery that lights my Christmas lights every year for free (400 leds) is free.  I can run a Bedini motor from it also that charges my batteries for free.  I think of it like solar, not OU but stick a panel outside and you can do useful things with it for free.

I will never forget a post to one of my Youtube videos where a "Scientist" claimed that it took over $10,000 of energy to produce the transistor I was using. (2N3904)  Since I only paid like $.59 for it I guess someone is getting ripped off.  I am sure this fellow makes more money than I do,....go figure.

This is a great topic and I really respect Dr. Jone's attitude toward all of this.  The more folks that replicate this, the better.

Bill

Offline beno

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #259 on: June 10, 2011, 06:34:46 PM »
I also agree on this too. But if we can find where the power comes from, we can more easily improve on our "harvesting" process.
And thereby build more simple devices, which people perhaps even can make at home. Or buy them cheap.

Maybe it is me but I miss a list of which "devices" that have a proven record for harvesting this "free energy" or whatever we call it.
The more simple the devices are to build, the better.

Because I think that we are more people trying to build the same "device" and make the same mistakes.

Therefore we need to see if we can replicate this devices and the results, and then this can make it to this list too.

Best regards

beno

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #259 on: June 10, 2011, 06:34:46 PM »
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Offline gauschor

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #260 on: June 10, 2011, 06:49:53 PM »
Maybe it is me but I miss a list of which "devices" that have a proven record for harvesting this "free energy" or whatever we call it.
The more simple the devices are to build, the better.

I'm also very interested in them :)

Offline Tudi

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #261 on: June 10, 2011, 08:13:01 PM »
..I will never forget a post to one of my Youtube videos where a "Scientist" claimed that it took over $10,000 of energy to produce the transistor I was using. (2N3904)  Since I only paid like $.59 for it I guess someone is getting ripped off.  I am sure this fellow makes more money than I do,....go figure.
well there is a design phase, there is a HW simulation in software, there is a "matrix" / factory adjustments in order to produce it ( just think at it as a new software to control robots ). Once all this is done, the mass production costs litle. ( finished CPU design university... )

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #261 on: June 10, 2011, 08:13:01 PM »
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Offline xee2

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #262 on: June 10, 2011, 09:18:27 PM »
@ hyiq

The following circuit may not be measuring input power correctly. R1 should be in series with the battery. The way it is may work, but having the ground between the resistor and the battery can cause problems. With R1 in series with the battery there is no possibility for problems.


EDIT: You can just reverse the scope probes so that the ground is where the current sense point is and the current sense point moves to where the ground is. You will probably get the same readings, but it is a better way to do it.


« Last Edit: June 10, 2011, 09:57:30 PM by xee2 »

Offline LarryC

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #263 on: June 12, 2011, 12:49:59 AM »
FYI, for those that don't know, the mean of instantaneous V * I as used by Dr Steven with the Tek scope can be obtained with much lower cost home scopes.

My RIGOL DS1025E has a math function, whereby instantaneous V * I can be displayed, but it does not give a mean or average value for the math trace like the Tek. However, it does have the capability to download Ch1 and Ch2 instantaneous values to a PC. Load these values into a spreadsheet and the mean of instantaneous V * I is easy to calculate.

Regards, Larry 

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #263 on: June 12, 2011, 12:49:59 AM »
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Offline Tudi

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #264 on: June 12, 2011, 09:19:41 AM »
FYI, for those that don't know, the mean of instantaneous V * I as used by Dr Steven with the Tek scope can be obtained with much lower cost home scopes.

My RIGOL DS1025E has a math function, whereby instantaneous V * I can be displayed, but it does not give a mean or average value for the math trace like the Tek. However, it does have the capability to download Ch1 and Ch2 instantaneous values to a PC. Load these values into a spreadsheet and the mean of instantaneous V * I is easy to calculate.

Regards, Larry
the question is the sampling rate for v * i. For example, a hardware arduino board has an internal clock of 16kHz. In case this circuit has a frequency of a couple of MHz then you are only sampling aprox every 1000th value. Far from precise enough(imagine the luck you are skipping 60% of the negative values). You might get lucky to tune in to some function like pattern for positive values for the osciloscope value smoothing ( avarage) function to aproximate a better value then it is actually.
This is why a simple collect and measure the amount principle works better even if the result is not so pleasing then a bad measurement.

Offline LarryC

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #265 on: June 12, 2011, 04:52:08 PM »
the question is the sampling rate for v * i. For example, a hardware arduino board has an internal clock of 16kHz. In case this circuit has a frequency of a couple of MHz then you are only sampling aprox every 1000th value. Far from precise enough(imagine the luck you are skipping 60% of the negative values). You might get lucky to tune in to some function like pattern for positive values for the osciloscope value smoothing ( avarage) function to aproximate a better value then it is actually.
This is why a simple collect and measure the amount principle works better even if the result is not so pleasing then a bad measurement.


No luck needed. The scope is 50Mhz. Note the time column change of .000000001 seconds per observation. All so note the scope graph and the spreadsheet graph is the same.

An associate has a EE Masters and downloads data the same way on his home scope.

Regards, Larry

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #265 on: June 12, 2011, 04:52:08 PM »
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Offline Tudi

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #266 on: June 12, 2011, 10:06:05 PM »
@LarryC: i don't want to argue about your skills to measure something. I'm a software enginier, and from time to time i strugle with heisenbug ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unusual_software_bug ). Simply saying that measuring something so small, sensitive in a world that is not prepared enough for it, might make it look different then it is in reality.
Just make 2 circuits and try to see if the thing scales=simple math rules apply to the presumed values.

Offline NickZ

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #267 on: June 13, 2011, 03:17:20 AM »
   @ All:
   I built a few of these Hartley oscillators circuits to use with my cement battery cells.  I don't have a scope so I've been trying to see which circuit outputs the most light, and can work with the 50 mAs that the cement cells can produce.  Most Jtc will not work, they simply consume all the available energy and the leds get dim almost immediately. So, I've been working with the backwards Jt to see if there is any benefit, as they are more efficient when using low amp circuits.  But I still find that even the Hartley circuits are hogs, also, when connected to the cells as a source. The big advantage that I can see is that they do self run, to a degree, and do feed back to the battery, or otherwise the leds would go out after a day or two.  The real trick is to balance the led's load consumption with the amount of feed back going to the battery,  thus keeping the led(s) lit,  24/7. 
  I have replicated Koolers tiny Backwards Jtc (first picture), and is still the best and the smallest of all the ones that I have working so far.
  I use a kn2222A trans, a 103 cap, 2 to 5 k trim pots, and no resistors, at all. 
                         NickZ
 

Offline xee2

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #268 on: June 13, 2011, 03:39:40 AM »

 and can work with the 50 mAs that the cement cells can produce. 
 

Do you mean 50 uA instead of 50 mA?


Offline NickZ

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Re: PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?
« Reply #269 on: June 13, 2011, 03:57:37 AM »
   @ Xee:
  All my latest cement beach sand cells produce 55 to 65 mA each cell, not micro amps.
  The last picture in my previous post is of a capacitor can cement cell, it outputs 55 mA, 1.2 volts).  Most of the larger aluminum beer cans output 65 to 70 mA, 1.4 volts.
  These cells will not connect in parallel, only series.  I've gotten over 10 volts from them so far, by using 8 cells. 

 

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