3rd example
Settings same as previous

This one to show that on a range of samples limited to the 'oscillation' only - then there is INVARIABLY the mean average voltage across the shunt in the negative.  But I'll redo some of these at the weekend and post them here as Harti requires.  The cycle mean result here is meaningless as the sample range does not include a full cycle.  But the principle holds.  It's always negative.  Hopefully I'll find another example.

So guys.  I hope that now clarifies things.  We are well able to fine tune the circuit to get a negative mean average over the shunt.  Even at runaway wattage levels evident from the resistor element.  That wasn't what we were pointing to.  We were showing that the hidden benefit is always in the 180 degree antiphase relationship between the battery and the shunt.  Or that was the intention.  It seems to have eluded you all - and no doubt - I should have made this clearer. 

The point is this.  When that burst oscillation mode is evident - then also, there is invariably a gain - based on instantaneous wattage analysis.  So.  I hope that's clearer.

Kindest regards,
Rosemary

And Guys, in this repeated effort to cast aspersions - as freely as confetti at a wedding - is the new claim that the VV math trace is, confused by us all, as a reflection of wattage.  I challenge ANY ONE OF THOSE MISINFORMANTS ON POYNTY'S FORUM to show any SINGLE reference by any one of us - either in the demonstration or on any posts here - or on my blog that  we have referred to that math trace representing a WATTAGE VALUE.

I assume your challenge here is open to anyone.  So...please observe the presentation video starting at 8:25 in (very near the end).  The mystery presenter clearly points to the VxV math trace and says clearly that it shows 5 Watts.  So your challenge is rather easy, Rosemary.

On a different subject, but related, is another observation that I think is worth considering.  Seems we have all in the past (self included) assumed that the current in the shunt represents the current in the battery.  To and from, as it were.  This would certainly be the case under a DC analysis, where the MOSFET gate is correctly considered an open circuit without current flow.

At a frequency of 1.5MHz and each MOSFET having (from the data sheet) 2800pF of capacitance from Gate to Source, with five in parallel that is 14nF or 0.014 microfarads  which is substantial.  We see the 1.5MHz oscillations appear on the gate voltage traces in Rosemary's scope shots. 

That means substantial RF current is circulating in the resonant LCR tank consisting of the MOSFET input capacitance, the Shunt resistance and inductance, the wiring inductances and the complex impedance of the gate drive cable, which, by the close-up photos, is not a 50 ohm coaxial cable matched to the generator and is of unknown characteristic impedance and length.  This RF current loop includes the shunt but does not include the battery.  Thus the shunt current is not the same as the battery current.

The energy circulating in this resonant circuit is what is responsible for wiggling the gate and causing the 1.5MHz oscillations and the currents involved are fairly significant.  The energy to sustain the current circulation in the gate loop is injected from the drain node of the MOSFET via the drain-gate capacitance as the drain voltage swings up and down by hundreds of volts.

Lastly, for anyone trying to figure out what the difference is between the high power and low power modes, it's quite simple:

In the low power mode, the gate drive high voltage is always kept below the 3-4V gate turn-on threshold.  When the gate drive gets close to or briefly hits the turn-on threshold, it stops the oscillations but does not result in actual turn-on of the MOSFETs.  This is why no current flows during the non-oscillating portions of the drive duty cycle.  And why the load heat drops to a few watts as supplied by just the oscillating portion of the burst envelope.

In the high power mode, the drive offset is adjusted so that during the non-oscillating half of the period the MOSFETs are actually turned on and DC current flows out of the battery through the load.  This normal DC current adds a great deal more heat to the load, so we get 44W now.  50W flows out of the battery.

These numbers are not made up.  They are there for all to see.  The scope traces show that when the MOSFET gates are driven above 3-4V there is always positive current flow.  Please don't take my word for this...check out the facts yourself.  There are no real mysteries involved.

cHeeseburger

I received a private email today from someone that suggested that you are looking for ways to measure the outcomes to suit your thesis.  I and many others have also reached that conclusion some time ago. This reminded me to a visit I had in the USA to a large research institute. I was talking about analysing data with the head of one of the research programmes and two PHD graduates. We all agreed it is common problem even amongst academics of sometimes looking at measuring methodologies or selective data to suit ones bias towards a hypothesis rather than a rational look at all methodologies. This is why Peer Review is so important.
Several people have made excellent suggestions, and offers.  Sadly you only talk to those who concur with you and ignore the others.
So please take a fresh approach of analysing what you have done to date and how you could better do it. Until you do come up with methodologies that satisfy the industry professionals, you will never be taken seriously by mainstream.
I am writing this as helpfull advice, not to shoot you down. Go back again , read what has been said and device a new methodology. People want to help.
Kind Regards
Mark

Hi Rosemary .The scope shots look convincing to me but I would like to see comments from Harti . I know that you get overwhelmed with info , but bear this in mind .Harti suggested replacing the Function generator with a DC power supply , and you said it might be hard to obtain one . You can get the same effect using just TWO CHEAP COMPONENTS . The gate will draw no current , so get a 9 volt transistor radio battery , and a 1K potentiometer . The pot will have 3 terminals . Connect the center one to the Fet Gate . Connect the other 2 to the 9 volt battery terminals . Now run a wire from the battery positive terminal to the ground of your device .Job done . You now have a neg potential on the gate which can be varied from zero to 9 volts by the 1K pot . Try it when you get time .

Hello Neptune.  You make this sound so easy.  I'll ask if Marco can set this up - but I must admit I'm reluctant to change that artefact.  Anyway.  I'll CERTAINLY try the Power supply number as that's within my competence.  But that test needs to wait until the guys are back from a conference.  Sometime next week.  That's the soonest.  I'll do more waveforms at the weekend and - hopefully - show you some more of those really complex numbers where the battery average itself falls to something weird.

added - sorry Neptune.  Yes.  If the guys can set this up for me - I'll test it.  It seems such an elegant solution.

And Feynman, I'd be glad if you get on board here eventually.  I"m still battling to find some way of showing those spreadsheets.

Kindest regards,
Rosemary

Rosemary, I've just been going through your blog-Report - you really should do something about the images there, though 'click-able', they don't expand much if at all, and are almost unreadable!  But I made a discovery - despite all your talk of negative voltages on the gate from the get-go, I always took this to mean zero-volts! Rank-amateur and sad but true, it also kinda explains why I had a negative result the first time round - I was using a pulse-generator, 0->5v range, not the the 555 circuit.

Do you have a link to where someone could buy the heater element you used?  The company "Specific Heat" you list in the report doesn't google anything relevant.

Sprocket - this is beginning to sound promising.  Yes. I can definitely pm you on this.  But PLEASE.  There is absolutely NO requirement for a precise component EVER.  I need to make this very clear.  I'm not sure of the cost but those are standard immersion heaters.  What it shows is that it works very well.  Plus/minus 10 Ohms.  Guys - for anyone wanting to experiment on this or aspects of this test - it is absolutely NOT frequency dependent and nor is it component dependent. I KNOW that this can be shown on just about any variation and variety.  Look even at the configuration that Mags has shown.  All that is needed - as I see it - is that there is the generation of BEMF - or - maybe - FEMF as Mags calls it.  BUT.  To generate that amazing burst oscillation - then I THINK you all that is needed are those mosfets in parallel and some kind of negative triggering.  That's it.  I would be really sorry to find that anyone gets ensnarled again in attempting a precise replication.  It's not needed.  Look at all the varieties that I've shown.  And I've only given a fraction of what our data shows.  And you guys are skilled.  You could very easily take this to some kind of application.  That would be so nice.  Just to tempt you.  I think you could unplug your hot water cylinders with between 6 and 8 of those batteries.  I'm reasonably certain that we were dissipating in excess of 200 watts and that with just 4 batteries.  If you do this and if you manage it - then let us all know.  It would be most enouraging.

Kindest regards,
Rosemary

Hi  Hartiberlin

in response to your inquiry on youtube

hope i have undesrtood your mind

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQFD1cDlEUU

good luck at all

Laurent

Woops, one more thing

Ive been told that those caps have a built in resistor, that looks like why your charge voltage is declining as it sits. Some of these caps have the resistor welded to the outside terminals and can be removed.  these caps can hold very high voltages. Ive picked up a few charged caps in my time that I was shocked, literally and not ;], at what 200 or 300v in a tiny cap can feel like, but up to 2000v     Thats why they have the resistor so the voltage doesnt stay in the cap when not in use.
;]
Magz