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Author Topic: Shorting coil gives back more power  (Read 351865 times)

Offline popolibero

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #285 on: March 12, 2011, 07:53:24 PM »
Quote
Haha okay , I thought this had moving parts since the magnet is shown in different positions in the lower set of diagrams  (thought it was a magnet on a rotor).  My mistake...

Feynman, I think you still have some things mixed up. If you're referring to the link yes it shows how to short coils on a rotored version. But you can apply the same shorting circuit to a non rotored version like I just explained.

I'm not sure magnacoaster is shorting the coil, I think he's doing something different.


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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #285 on: March 12, 2011, 07:53:24 PM »

Offline Feynman

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #286 on: March 12, 2011, 08:38:03 PM »
@popolibero

I'm sure I still have things mixed up!  Just learned about this in the past day or so.  Thank you for your explanations though, they have been very helpful.  I appreciate that you have taken time to write them, so I can refer back to them as I research.

I just got back from radio shack -- picked up parts for JT COP>1 anomalous phase replication.  I also picked up a some neo magnets and ceramic magnets.  Unfortunately the only magneticly activated solid state sensors they had were a reed relay -- not hall sensors.  I will at least get to experiment with the reed relay and the coils.

I'm placing a larger parts order next week so then maybe I'll snag some hall sensors and reed switches.

By the way , your idea for using the 555 to produce the AC as well as coil shorting pulses is really clever.   Luckily I have a ton of 555 timers.   In any case, I picked up 100' 22 gauge solid core insulated wire to wind the induction coil on some sort of air core. Magnet wire might have been better but that's all they had.

Anyway thanks everyone , let's figure out how to get an open-source inexpensive ($<200) self-runner somehow!

Offline bolt

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #287 on: March 14, 2011, 02:59:25 AM »
Just a note on Bob Boyce.  Its my understanding after dissecting all the info i can find on it that the toroidal thing he uses is wired as a  3 phase transformer in essence driven by processor for control of very narrow PWM pulses, amplitude  and frequency control. The HF ferrite transformer is driven out of phase to create very high VARS and the cell sits in series with another inductor with a cap across it to make alike RF tuned circuit. This is basic RV technology.

Bob says the overall system from DC to gas has a COP around 3-5 typical. The only reason i mention this is because i seen reference to Bob's stuff having a COP > 1000 and this it not true.  So his devices puts on par with a good MEG but falls way short of Kapanadze COP 100 and the real TPU and VTA has a COP > 1000. Anything with a COP 5 or over should be capable of looping very easy.

Although many people have produced COP 1.2 or 1.8 etc within well tuned Joule Thief's, Bedini wheels and chargers etc you cant loop till you get a COP 2 plus losses to loop it usually means in practice at least COP 2.5  and even then its twitchy as hell to get a motor/gen looped at low COP and will have no power to drive anything else other than barely keep itself going.

 These lower COP levels although very real and purposeful  as Energy Savers open a big bag of worms for testing as a million man hours wasted arguing about the correct measurement methods. My suggestion is don't even bother to arguing about it if it works for you then put it to practical use for lighting, pumping, heating whatever.

I will clarify this as a motor generator. Its a COP 3 system.  Lets say my motor drives a generator. My motor needs 100 watts. The generator makes 300 watts as some special coil shorting thing (example only)  Out of that 300 watt i must loop back 200 watts because 100 watts will be lost through the motor, inverter, friction, lead acid battery etc till i get 100 watts i need to power the motor. This means the system is only 50% efficient in terms of losses. But the COP of 3 means i can pass back 200 watts lose 50% to keep the motor going on 100 watts. So im left with left 100 watts OU out of the generator.  This is typical of real life loopers:)

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #287 on: March 14, 2011, 02:59:25 AM »
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Offline forest

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #288 on: March 14, 2011, 09:35:19 AM »
the real tricky seems to have device running with gain, aka infinite COP and to stop at the required level of energy before it destroy device

Offline giantkiller

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #289 on: March 14, 2011, 04:50:29 PM »
From what I have seen is John Hutchison is the only one that uses multiple Tesla coils in a given test. There are no sparks and no spark gaps in the vicinity. Has anybody ever run a Tesla coil with the spark gap at some distance outside the field and/or in a shielding box to seperate the spark gap from inside the harmonic field? Probaly wouldn't create sparks. My thinking is the harmonic resonant field greatly magnifies the spark itself or reproduces it not by step up but by magnetic magnification akin to a magnetic amplifier of a resonant magnetic field in air at great potentials rather than ferrous based core.

Think about that...
« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 07:25:58 PM by giantkiller »

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #289 on: March 14, 2011, 04:50:29 PM »
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Offline ramset

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #290 on: March 14, 2011, 05:27:43 PM »
Chef,
What the heck is Richard Willis doing ? Do you have any info to prove that the Million man  hour device that bolt showed pics of being dissasembled on the bench,is a fraud?

Chet

Offline bolt

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #291 on: March 14, 2011, 06:30:47 PM »
This is typical real life bullshitting  :P

Show me please only one system with hard cold proof and measurement, where output energy exceed input energy by any amount! The truth is you can't! You can talk about imagined devices, with imagined overunity performance, and I am sure lot of people will eat your words,and wetting their pussys, but in real life somehow all of these devices fail to produce the claimed results!

Funny, isn't it?  :-\

Oh yes i can! Ismael MEG has a COP of 2.7 and measured and tested on Dyno by Philippine government DOE giving OU at 134% on the wheels. Its not his MEG is anything special far from it but its the first time a device in recent history has been properly tested by a Government agency.

I also have seen looped RV's over skype about 3 years ago and watched it for over an hour. For every 1 public disclosure there are about 100 more that rather stay out of the limelight. If you prefer to believe there is no such thing as an OU device then that's fine im not out to convince you or anyone else of anything.  I just inform and you do your own homework.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #291 on: March 14, 2011, 06:30:47 PM »
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Offline giantkiller

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #292 on: March 14, 2011, 07:28:37 PM »
Shorting on the peaks makes it look like hash on DC.  ;)

Quote from Masterplaster
Quote
I have a feeling that on collapse of the holding force, the earths magnetic field over compensates and that is the bounty.
Yep... She hates a vacuum.

Here is my version from the previous Falstad sim that I wrote.
The input sine freq is arbitrary at 44hz. The 555s are timed for this.

« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 08:23:15 PM by giantkiller »

Offline bolt

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #293 on: March 14, 2011, 08:28:31 PM »
.

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #293 on: March 14, 2011, 08:28:31 PM »
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Offline bolt

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #294 on: March 14, 2011, 08:30:57 PM »
GK correct as coil shorting attenuates BEMF as the signal is modulated where it can be extracted using high pass filters. TO gain OU within electrical systems method to be applied must provide source to load isolation from the effects of BEMF. Typically this happens in symmetrical systems where the i/p is directly affected by the o/p.

The greater the isolation the greater the COP as effect of Asymmetric Modulation or Asymmetric Generation can be applied to break the symmetry so we operate outside of book rules and lead into OU devices.  Special Coil construction need to be applied in most cases to drive offset flux on the bloch wall or use flat Tesla Bifilar coils driving perpendicular coil to provide 90 degree offset to prevent BEMF. Use of embedded Cap-inductor alike Don Smith Dipole. Coincidently the math and theory support either a dipole passing a cap layer OR inductors within a capacitor to break the BEMF symmetry.

Toroidal  cores can be wound and interfaced 90 degrees to each other to allow only magnetic coupling without BEMF as JLN solid state orbo has merit.

Normal transformers can NOT be used will always be symmetrical and lead to a loss. However new 90 degree windings can be made to reduce symmetry. Generators require end fired Inductors as ferrites  perpendicular to magnetic field but operated in Scaler operation create anti-lugging.

RV creates high VARS very easy. OU manifest as VARS increases kinetic energy while current and voltage operate in high VSWR or PF 0 as standing waves = Scalar Operation.  Result is massive increase in magnetic flux converts to torque while performing work on very low watts as per Joe Newman motor runs on a few PP3 batteries.

To convert VARS to Watts use asymmetrical device as above to keep symmetry broken and maintain the Dipole.

Those that have done this and proves it works you can step up to the plate. Open minded people needs to retune their thinking. Debunkers can fck off as no time left to play games.


Offline ramset

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #295 on: March 14, 2011, 09:35:43 PM »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #295 on: March 14, 2011, 09:35:43 PM »
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Offline popolibero

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #296 on: March 14, 2011, 09:36:42 PM »
Yesterday I've run some tests with the Willis type setup, in solid state. From his patent the bigger magnet has its N facing the core it is attached to. The coil on the core when energized has the same orientation. Basically the big magnet plus coil make one magnet. The other (single)magnet with the gap opposes the core plus big magnet as it has its N oriented towards it. I've still tried all the possible orientations and could also slide the coil across the core but I never got more out than in. the output was a big cap with light bulb across it.

The orientation suggested by the patent seems to be the best, when sliding the coil towards the gap side there is a point where current draw is minimum, like a balance point, also dependent on the gap space. But with magnets on I never got close to the efficiency of the setup without magnets, which basically becomes a buck converter, or solid state bedini charger which can be up to about 85%. I tried low and higher frequencies. Also the coil got very hot with the magnets on.
Has anyone else played with this besides Romerouk?

Btw, Bolt I've dropped you a PM a while ago about the VARs, don't know if you got that.

Mario

Offline i_ron

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #297 on: March 14, 2011, 09:47:33 PM »


Here is my version from the previous Falstad sim that I wrote.


 In reality it is the circuit I posted, only with 555's

 When you rework a posted circuit you give credit, as I did.

Ron
« Last Edit: March 15, 2011, 12:25:08 AM by i_ron »

Offline giantkiller

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #298 on: March 14, 2011, 10:51:06 PM »
@Popolibero,
Tried many different magnet types. Natural and tuned resonance. Many frequencies. Square and sine. Different levels of core insertion. But I am not finished as of yet.
Otto posted this and I have a coil based on this sent to me by Moab.

You get the gauge, length, and frequency just right and it is the flux manipulation technique.

Offline bolt

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #299 on: March 15, 2011, 12:22:17 AM »
btw, Bolt I've dropped you a PM a while ago about the VARs, don't know if you got that.


Yes i did thanks and i read all your tests its looks very interesting. I still haven't had time to watch your YT vids yet as the internet for me this last weekend was very slow and take forever to load so i was going to reply after i seen them. I have been getting a LOT of PM's lately so sorry if i cant answer them all but i do read them. I prefer them in public on relevant forum so i don't have to keep answering the same questions over and over unless of course its a really private matter.

 

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