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Author Topic: Shorting coil gives back more power  (Read 420619 times)

Offline popolibero

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #240 on: March 10, 2011, 10:43:16 PM »
@Bolt or GK

I made this drawing according to Willis photos, is this the correct polarity of things or could it be repelling? Where does the bloch wall sit?

Mario

Offline bolt

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #241 on: March 10, 2011, 10:54:06 PM »
I thought Kunel device was a restricted highly classified class 3 patent. How did he get this info do you know?  Perhaps i have to look into this more as there was nothing on google in the past when i checked only speculation. Maybe it came out out via wikileaks LOL

Offline giantkiller

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #242 on: March 10, 2011, 10:58:13 PM »
Read this and absorb it.
http://www.intalek.com/Index/Projects/Patents/DE3024814.pdf

This guy jumped on the train a year after all my posts in 2009.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=9549.msg251718#msg251718

More detail
http://www.intalek.com/Papers/Handout3.pdf

I have other versions of this:

Offline bolt

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #243 on: March 10, 2011, 11:03:29 PM »
@Bolt or GK

I made this drawing according to Willis photos, is this the correct polarity of things or could it be repelling? Where does the bloch wall sit?

Mario

Bloch wall will be biased towards the right  side of the bar away from the highest count neos. It should lay just under the right hand side edge of the coil so you make the coil slid-able then adjust it during prototype. For production you will know exactly where to place everything.

Offline giantkiller

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #244 on: March 10, 2011, 11:07:23 PM »
The dual pulse protocol is another variation of this where you run a very fast thin pulse right up behind another very fast thin pulse. The signal on the scope shows greater than input.

At the Coral Castle Ed jacks the field that is the size of the park. Oh yeah! :o 8)

Here this is inside out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NB8fXByWj8

Offline popolibero

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #245 on: March 10, 2011, 11:44:14 PM »
GK, I have the Kunel patent and the Intalek docs, thanks. Good stuff.

Bolt, that's what I thought, the single magnet plus coil pull the BW to the right, but I thought the BW would sit on the left hand side of the coil (when not energized), closer to the stronger magnet pack?

Offline giantkiller

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #246 on: March 10, 2011, 11:50:56 PM »

This is why Sauron posted the little video coils.

Quote
Bottom photo oil pump assembly. If you look close at top centre is some coils he is using now for power generation. It looks no more then about 150 turns of about 24 awg hardly changed from devices shown years ago. This gives you a good heads up and how you should replicate.


Offline bolt

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #247 on: March 11, 2011, 12:02:15 AM »
GK, I have the Kunel patent and the Intalek docs, thanks. Good stuff.

Bolt, that's what I thought, the single magnet plus coil pull the BW to the right, but I thought the BW would sit on the left hand side of the coil (when not energized), closer to the stronger magnet pack?

Bloch wall wont move far perhaps 1/8th of inch when pulsed but the magnetic flux from those neos on collapse has a pull force of perhaps  >100 pound on the air gap. You can lose fingers in those neos they are not toys.

 Now pulse this at 50,000 times a second you got one hell of a powerful generator. To do this mechanically would need some first class machinery to get tight 1/16th air gap and handle impossible fast rotor speeds.

Offline giantkiller

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #248 on: March 11, 2011, 12:34:12 AM »
Coil excitation plus Dr. Stiffler setups.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5akYnh2fjM

Offline Feynman

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #249 on: March 11, 2011, 02:00:13 AM »
@bolt

Great post, thanks for the photos.

You write,
Quote
In its most simple form the low power version of about 150 watts has a 2 fet o/p stage is little more than a 50Khz inverter driving a small solenoid size coil with 3 neos one end and 1 the other.

Can someone post a schematic, photos, or any other sort of documentation on  this for a starting bench replication?   Or links to the place to look? etc

Thanks

Offline giantkiller

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #250 on: March 11, 2011, 04:03:08 AM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2qSe2YsEQM

Right out of the Kunel patent and Bolt's specifications.

Iron wire core.

In previous consults with other OUers the last year we discussed the magnet types. Magnacoaster, in one video, said the weak field was by cabinet magnets because NiDb magnet fields were too strong and the Bloch wall could not be swayed, jacked or broken. In one vid he used a chunk of steel and put a small NiDb BB on it at the back end away from the gap.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2011, 05:01:30 AM by giantkiller »

Offline bolt

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #251 on: March 11, 2011, 04:20:26 AM »
@bolt

Great post, thanks for the photos.

You write,
Can someone post a schematic, photos, or any other sort of documentation on  this for a starting bench replication?   Or links to the place to look? etc

Thanks

I am sure everything you need is already here. Start back in the old magnacoaster thread. The pulse driver is the same thing used all over this forum its basically just like a 555 driving a fet which bangs the coil. You should high side drive it though because the flux modulation likes positives pulses apparently. If you low side it then you end in essence pulling lows then it float up as a floppy high. I am pretty sure you can get results with very simple circuits. Magnacoaster got this going using a wheel and a car points as a switch then later went to fets. Until you get deep study on the bench and tried it, no one really knows the perfect frequency, shape, amplitude, etc  it does look around 20kHz- 50khz which seems about right. More then this will create a lot problems with heat and coil core materials. Advanced circuits may well use Hi Low drivers and an  H bridge to get symmetrical power drive.

Anyway sorry for taking this thread off track BUT if you have coils and magnets in front of you then you might as well combine all these technologies into something useful.

Offline Goat

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #252 on: March 11, 2011, 07:41:59 AM »
@ Bolt

I agree with your views particularly the "Magnacoaster got this going using a wheel and a car points as a switch then later went to fets."  I remember watching the early video and wondering how the circuit inside the box was related to the "wheel and car points" and the magnets and was feeding back to the battery to keep the 12V to 120V inverter going...Why was that method abandoned when it could have been implemented on a smaller scale and sold as a kit or a ready made product on a smaller scale to supplement bigger advancements... 

Is there a way to backwards engineer his first design?

Regards,
Paul

Offline forest

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #253 on: March 11, 2011, 08:49:25 AM »
Is there a way to backwards engineer his first design?

Regards,
Paul


From patent maybe ?

Offline popolibero

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #254 on: March 11, 2011, 09:59:53 AM »
Quote
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2qSe2YsEQM

Right out of the Kunel patent and Bolt's specifications.

Iron wire core.

GK, wow you put my drawing at work quickly, :D 

The Kunel stuff tends to use the control coil to neutralize (hide) a magnet from the pick up coil(s) and let go. In this case I think it's really just shifting the bloch wall, in a very powerful way.

Mario