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Author Topic: Shorting coil gives back more power  (Read 421780 times)

Offline penno64

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #75 on: February 24, 2011, 05:54:21 AM »
Hi Romero,

Great work.

I think you will be pleasantly suprised if you go to a half wave rectifier. You are using
only one diode, yeah.

I used two and what a massive jump in output.

Trying hard to get a self runner.

Penno

C ----------->--------C
O                             A
I                              P
L------------<--------S



Offline gyulasun

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #76 on: February 24, 2011, 10:55:31 AM »
Hi Penno,

Sorry to chime in, did not you want to say a full wave rectifier instead of the half wave?   Your 'schematic' below shows a half wave rectifier, even though you show a second diode?  So I cannot get how you mean.

Normally, using a full wave bridge across the coil, not only the spikes get captured and dumped into the capacitor but any induced voltage waveforms that are higher in amplitude than any two diodes forward voltages (out of the 4 diodes).  If your arrow symbols in your 'schematic' represent your two diodes, you still have a half wave rectifier and any voltage with reverse polarity to these two diodes gets blocked, cannot go into the capacitor.

Thanks,  Gyula

Hi Romero,

Great work.

I think you will be pleasantly suprised if you go to a half wave rectifier. You are using
only one diode, yeah.

I used two and what a massive jump in output.

Trying hard to get a self runner.

Penno

C ----------->--------C
O                             A
I                              P
L------------<--------S

Offline penno64

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #77 on: February 24, 2011, 11:07:09 AM »
Hi G,

Yes, you are correct.

But all I can tell you is what I see on my meter.

A single diode then into 3 x mot caps = 11vdc
Two diodes as per above = 100vdc

I shold stop beign lazy and put the scope on it.

Penno


Offline gyulasun

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #78 on: February 24, 2011, 11:21:46 AM »
Hi Penno,

Thanks and a scope shot would tell it sure. Maybe you would feel like using a full wave bridge too, just to compare the DC levels...   however it would be better using fast recovery diodes for the bridge or at least two more diodes of the same type you have used already when got the 100V DC.

Gyula

Offline romerouk

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #79 on: February 24, 2011, 12:31:19 PM »
@Magluvin
The core is the original one comming from the microwave fan.

Offline Lakes

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #80 on: February 24, 2011, 02:51:21 PM »
You should be able to measure the pulse freq from the hall effect to get an idea of speed/run down times with/without load.

Offline e2matrix

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #81 on: February 24, 2011, 07:39:55 PM »
Nice work Romerouk!  Looks like you could get a self runner there.  Considering the low power consumption on HD motors it seems doable.  Might need to try a smaller laptop HD like the 2.5" ones.  I see you went back to a reed switch on this one.  It appears to be lighting up some in the video.  Is that from sparking or getting hot?   I blew one out recently when I accidentally put a 12 volt nicad across it, lit up real nice for a couple seconds. 

Offline romerouk

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #82 on: February 24, 2011, 08:00:52 PM »
Nice work Romerouk!  Looks like you could get a self runner there.  Considering the low power consumption on HD motors it seems doable.  Might need to try a smaller laptop HD like the 2.5" ones.  I see you went back to a reed switch on this one.  It appears to be lighting up some in the video.  Is that from sparking or getting hot?   I blew one out recently when I accidentally put a 12 volt nicad across it, lit up real nice for a couple seconds.
I a not using the HDD motor to power the system, it is there just to have the disks with the magnets on it. I am powering the system with the small air core, hall sensor and a transistor.
I will post a diagram later.
Stefan suggested to use a 5w/240volts bulb but I don't have one yet.
The smallest bulb I have is a 15w/240volts and it does lit up but somwhere close to half brightness.

Offline gyulasun

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #83 on: February 24, 2011, 08:19:01 PM »
Hi Romero,

Would you mind using a current meter at the input so that any effect of the load (LED, bulb etc) could be seen on it, how much the input current changes?  I understand and can hear from the sound of the RPM in your video that the load quasi does not affect the RPM but still it would be nice to see it too.  You could use a 1 or 10 Ohm series resistor and indicate the voltage drop across it with even a digital DC meter, the tendency of change could be seen, no need for true RMS value measurements now.

Thanks and keep up your excellent ideas.

Gyula

Offline romerouk

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #84 on: February 24, 2011, 10:21:22 PM »
This is the circuit diagram used in my youtube video

Offline romerouk

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #85 on: February 24, 2011, 10:23:45 PM »
Hi Romero,

Would you mind using a current meter at the input so that any effect of the load (LED, bulb etc) could be seen on it, how much the input current changes?  I understand and can hear from the sound of the RPM in your video that the load quasi does not affect the RPM but still it would be nice to see it too.  You could use a 1 or 10 Ohm series resistor and indicate the voltage drop across it with even a digital DC meter, the tendency of change could be seen, no need for true RMS value measurements now.

Thanks and keep up your excellent ideas.

Gyula
I will do another video with measurements.

Offline woopy

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #86 on: February 24, 2011, 10:33:05 PM »
Hi Romero and all

Thanks very mich for your input and circuit

i just made a confirmation of your test

seems to be very promising

go on the good work

and good luck at all

laurent

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wB9wxySoBQE

Offline conradelektro

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #87 on: February 24, 2011, 11:35:37 PM »
Hello Laurent,

the experiment in your video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wB9wxySoBQE is just amazing (lightning the white 3 Volt LED with such low speed). I would like to replicate it (because I have a rotor with four magnets sitting in my work shop). But I do not understand your circuit. The most simple circuits are hardest to understand without a diagram (at least I am such a dummy). Specially I do not get what you mean by "shortening the coil"? Do you permanently connect a wire somewhere in the circuit?

I would like to ask you to make a very crude hand drawing of your circuit (used in the video) and to post it here (a photo or as a video). Your experiment is very important for understanding what is going on, because it looks so simple and easy to replicate. You seem to have come up with the most simple demonstration of this incredible effect.

I wounder what happens when you use an air coil? Because the rotor should loose much less speed (less cogging) than with the coil (having a core) you are showing in the video. But may be the induction is then too little?

Greetings, Conrad

Offline forest

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #88 on: February 24, 2011, 11:41:11 PM »
when exactly reed switch is closed and when opened ?

Offline e2matrix

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Re: Shorting coil gives back more power
« Reply #89 on: February 24, 2011, 11:47:25 PM »
I a not using the HDD motor to power the system, it is there just to have the disks with the magnets on it. I am powering the system with the small air core, hall sensor and a transistor.
I will post a diagram later.
Stefan suggested to use a 5w/240volts bulb but I don't have one yet.
The smallest bulb I have is a 15w/240volts and it does lit up but somwhere close to half brightness.

Yep I knew that from your previous mention of it.  What I was suggesting was with that much apparent output from your second coil (used for the LED's) that it might be possible to feed that back rectified and at a lower voltage to the battery which might turn it into a self runner that would not lose voltage at the battery.  I'm guessing you may have already considered this.  What do you think?