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Author Topic: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7  (Read 61254 times)

Offline broli

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #105 on: February 12, 2011, 12:40:43 AM »
Hi Vidar,

Interesting setups, I like them, although at the moment I cannot see how torque may develop between rotor and stator magnets, if you mean this is a motor setup?  Can you sometime test it with your magnets?

Thanks,
 Gyula

Put a magnet inside a ring magnet, if aligned like shown it will be pushed to the center, fairly standard.

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #105 on: February 12, 2011, 12:40:43 AM »

Offline lumen

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #106 on: February 12, 2011, 01:49:21 AM »
Vidar,
I like the second concept, maybe you could add to it by having the rotor repelling like you are on the first half, but then attracting on the way back in also. Just a mirror of the repelling area, but working in attraction. If you get what I'm thinking.

I thought I was going to be very busy this weekend but UPS will not be delivering until next week so I may find some time to run a few 3D models in Maxwell. I should quit work since it always interferes with my hobbies.



Offline Low-Q

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #107 on: February 12, 2011, 10:16:11 AM »
Put a magnet inside a ring magnet, if aligned like shown it will be pushed to the center, fairly standard.
True, but the magnet must rotate to approach the center - because the magnet are rotating eccentric to the ring magnet.

Vidar

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #107 on: February 12, 2011, 10:16:11 AM »
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Offline Low-Q

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #108 on: February 12, 2011, 10:23:31 AM »
Vidar,
I like the second concept, maybe you could add to it by having the rotor repelling like you are on the first half, but then attracting on the way back in also. Just a mirror of the repelling area, but working in attraction. If you get what I'm thinking.

I thought I was going to be very busy this weekend but UPS will not be delivering until next week so I may find some time to run a few 3D models in Maxwell. I should quit work since it always interferes with my hobbies.
Lucky for me I work with two of my hobbies: Loudspeakerdesign, and graphics (designing product catalogs, ads, flyers etc.) At home I spend my time at overunity.com, and flying RC planes and helicopters. My life is a hobby - except my wife. She tells me do do things all the time... ;D

Vidar

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #109 on: February 12, 2011, 02:04:27 PM »
Here is a new design which use the very same, and promising, principle as the initial design in this thread. However, I have now designed a dual rotor motor.

To separate the shields at correct places, a cam from the rotors can control this. There must be a 1:1 gear which connect and sync both rotors (not shown in the drawings).

I hope this looks interesting. The attached pictures have a explanations in them.

Vidar

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #109 on: February 12, 2011, 02:04:27 PM »
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Offline teslaalset

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #110 on: February 12, 2011, 02:24:29 PM »
Vidar, what 3D program are you using for your designs here?

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #111 on: February 12, 2011, 05:35:34 PM »
Vidar, what 3D program are you using for your designs here?
Google Scetchup.
http://sketchup.google.com/intl/en/download/index.html

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #111 on: February 12, 2011, 05:35:34 PM »
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Offline Low-Q

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #112 on: February 12, 2011, 05:58:17 PM »
Can some one please try my last design in Maxwell 3D? I't impossible to simulate this in FEMM - which is a 2D software.

My thoughts:
Opening and closing the shields do not require energy to do - the potential energy applied when fully opened, will be released when the shields are closing. Because there are in average the same magnetic force applied by the stator- and rotor magnets, regardless of their position in the horizontal plane. This is "confirmed" in the FEMM model in the very first post in this thread.
The shape of the shields in my design will give a uniform shielding, and does not provide any sticky spots.
However, whether the shields are open or closed, it will have a huge impact on the magnets and how they interact with eachother.

So I am very keen to know what a "magnetic 3D software" will tell. Can't wait :)

Vidar

Offline lumen

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #113 on: February 12, 2011, 11:03:38 PM »
Can some one please try my last design in Maxwell 3D? I't impossible to simulate this in FEMM - which is a 2D software.

My thoughts:
Opening and closing the shields do not require energy to do - the potential energy applied when fully opened, will be released when the shields are closing. Because there are in average the same magnetic force applied by the stator- and rotor magnets, regardless of their position in the horizontal plane. This is "confirmed" in the FEMM model in the very first post in this thread.
The shape of the shields in my design will give a uniform shielding, and does not provide any sticky spots.
However, whether the shields are open or closed, it will have a huge impact on the magnets and how they interact with eachother.

So I am very keen to know what a "magnetic 3D software" will tell. Can't wait :)

Vidar


It's an interesting design, but to simulate this would take a huge amount of computer time. It would be best to simulate only the working principal to first determine if a design is feasible.
If a design principal appears to have a suitable gain in the simulator, then it is usually faster to build a real device. At least for me because I have CNC machines in my shed. I only have problems with finding enough free time, since I also use my machines for extra income projects.
I am actually surprised that the original design concept of this thread does show gain, and that once the field enters into the iron, it virtually cannot attract or repel another magnet trapped in the same iron. The puzzling part of this is how to use this for an actual gain in energy if possible.


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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #113 on: February 12, 2011, 11:03:38 PM »
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Offline Omnibus

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #114 on: February 12, 2011, 11:12:00 PM »

It's an interesting design, but to simulate this would take a huge amount of computer time. It would be best to simulate only the working principal to first determine if a design is feasible.
If a design principal appears to have a suitable gain in the simulator, then it is usually faster to build a real device. At least for me because I have CNC machines in my shed. I only have problems with finding enough free time, since I also use my machines for extra income projects.
I am actually surprised that the original design concept of this thread does show gain, and that once the field enters into the iron, it virtually cannot attract or repel another magnet trapped in the same iron. The puzzling part of this is how to use this for an actual gain in energy if possible.

You can use this and many other, even more efficient designs, for an actual gain in energy but what is really difficult is to make a self-sustaining device. Otherwise, in many of the already known OU devices, this one including, you can put in a certain amount of energy and the device will produce more than you've put in. Portions of such excess energy you can produce easily and that's already a given. The problem, which is of purely psychological and political nature, is how to make the device self-sustaining, using the excess energy produced. The trouble is that said excess energy is produced in a way which doesn't allow to directly use it as input energy.

Offline Low-Q

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #115 on: February 13, 2011, 12:52:59 PM »
Can someone help me with a LUA-script for linear movement please?

Vidar

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #115 on: February 13, 2011, 12:52:59 PM »
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Offline broli

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #116 on: February 13, 2011, 05:59:24 PM »
Can someone help me with a LUA-script for linear movement please?

Vidar

You need to be way more specific than that.

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #117 on: February 13, 2011, 06:13:16 PM »
You need to be way more specific than that.
OK.

I already have LUA scripts for use in FEMM to calculate torque. This script, I can edit the resolution on the steps (degrees) and edit the final sample point - say 45 degrees where the simulation stops.

I have now a need to calculate a linear movement in X and Y, not circular. A LUA script which do not calculate torque pr. degree, but force pr. distance in X or Y plane. I also want to edit resolution of the steps, and edit where the simulation stops.

Vidar

Offline broli

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #118 on: February 13, 2011, 06:17:41 PM »
OK.

I already have LUA scripts for use in FEMM to calculate torque. This script, I can edit the resolution on the steps (degrees) and edit the final sample point - say 45 degrees where the simulation stops.

I have now a need to calculate a linear movement in X and Y, not circular. A LUA script which do not calculate torque pr. degree, but force pr. distance in X or Y plane. I also want to edit resolution of the steps, and edit where the simulation stops.

Vidar

What you are after requires a little vector math, if what you want indeed requires going from point A to B in a straight line. If you can share what you already have and perhaps annotate with comments what you want I can help.

Offline Low-Q

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Re: FEMM simulation showing COP 3 and 7
« Reply #119 on: February 13, 2011, 08:47:30 PM »
What you are after requires a little vector math, if what you want indeed requires going from point A to B in a straight line. If you can share what you already have and perhaps annotate with comments what you want I can help.
Here is the FEMM simulation. Group 1 ("T T" shape) are suppose to move vertically in steps I determine by possibly editing a script. The results for each step are added up and displayed in a console.

I will then calculate an average force over a given distance to determine the required energy to raise a magnetic shield.

If you need any more info, please let me know.

Vidar

 

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