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Author Topic: aluminum can and copper wire batterys  (Read 54564 times)

Offline PeteIdl4

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #30 on: June 28, 2010, 05:40:33 PM »
Hello everyone,

I'm just wrapping up a few tests on two cells I made about about 3 days ago, today would be the fourth day. They have been running a joule thief continuously with a white Led. So far they do not show any signs of losing power. I have not added more electrolyte than what I initially started them with which is a small mixture of water, salt, and  sodium bicarbonate. I will be making a video tutorial on these today if anybody is interested in testing them out for themselves. I have a few pictures to leave you guys with showing the cells in action. Thanks to everyone for sharing and keep up the good work.

-Pete

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #30 on: June 28, 2010, 05:40:33 PM »

Offline Mk1

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #31 on: June 28, 2010, 11:43:10 PM »
@all

Have a look at those video
http://www.youtube.com/user/JackTSunn#p/a/u/2/hbS64LblwG8

http://www.youtube.com/user/JackTSunn#p/a/u/1/YwT-ONznU5I

http://www.youtube.com/user/JackTSunn#p/a/u/0/_Oy_iVscnJQ

I also have more on this , i just need to find it ...

Mark

But if i remember correctly it uses carbon and nickel also .

 


Offline the_big_m_in_ok

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #32 on: June 29, 2010, 12:45:25 AM »
lee
i hate to be dumn but what does What ohmic value of resistor  mine i dont no
The ohmic value is the resistance value of the resistor in ohms.

http://www.csgnetwork.com/resistcolcalc.html

This is probably for American industry standard resistors.  A typical carbon film high value resistor "resists" electricity and allows a battery or capacitor to drain more slowly.

http://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/resistor/res_1.html




So, the real reason I'm writing is to say I'm building water batteries differently because the electrodes rust or corrode way too quickly to be useful making them from wire for copper, for instance.

I "invented" this last night:

1) Take a commonly available American 15-16 oz. steel can and a small-diameter 8.4-12 oz. "red Bull energy drink can made of aluminum.
(The aluminum can has to fit inside the steel can.  This is the easiest way to manage this construction.)

2) With a pointed tip razor blade or very sharp knife, scratch a groove hard into the inside of the steel can and the outside of the aluminum can about 10 times; that's all.
(This will expose metal in the cans to the electrolyte through the outside paint or inside safety coating if the cans.  They're conductive now.)

3) Find a polyethylene "Wal-Mart" shopping bag from a past shopping trip.  Flatten the bag against the top of the steel can and then take the pointed razor or knife and stab the inside top of the can about 9-10 times all the way around the inside circumference of the can.

4) Now that you have a circle of 2-sheet polythene discs, tear them out of the hole you made with your fingers and then shove them flat to the bottom of the steel can.  You might need a pencil to arrange them neatly.  Repeat the operation at least 10-15 times or until the bag is too full of holes to continue.
(With 20-30 sheets of plastic discs in the bottom of the can, they will insulate both cans from each other after you pour in the electrolyte.)

5) Take a piece of standard 8 1/2 X 11" sheet of scrap of paper (computer printout scrap is perfect), and cut 10 strips about 1" wide out of it, using the whole thing.  Take 5 of these stacked on each other and roll up one end like you do to an empty tube of toothpaste.  With Scotch tape, tape the end down to keep the roll from unraveling.  You'll need at least 3 of these.

6) Shove the rolled up paper "shims", spaced 120 deg. apart, between the cans to force the aluminum can to remain centered inside the steel can.
(This will keep the electrodes apart and not ground out the cell.)

7) Fill the cans with your electrolyte of choice.  Whatever you favorite is.  I use water,  since it's free.  Lastly, connect the cells together with alligator clip jumper leads from Radio Shack.
(This should be your only cost and they're reusable.)
NOTE:
Steel rusts and aluminum corrodes, so this whole system should be as inexpensive as possible.  Narrow aluminum cans are available on the streets of all large American cities, or you can buy the drinks and consume the contents.  Steel cans are also on the streets or you can buy soup/fruit/etc. cans and reuse them.

I don't have a  camera or graphics software to better describe all this in pictures or on YouTube.  Sorry.

Be aware: 
This is legally the Internet, so my instructions are:  In.  The.  Public.  Domain.
(The date and time of entry is at the top of this post.  That may actually be why it's there--legal protection for the software engineering company who wrote this program.)

--Lee

Offline old man

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #33 on: June 29, 2010, 02:10:42 AM »
lee

that should work grate let us no how it work for you


mk1

that looks funney to me when you fine more let us no and thank for the info


PeteIdl4

that looka good cant wate for the vido


i am still reading the jf post all most done i have been reading now for 12 hours i got a lot idais for these cans  almost done with my teasting


thank agin for all the help


tom


Offline PeteIdl4

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #34 on: June 29, 2010, 01:28:41 PM »
Hello Everyone,
Sorry for the late post I got held up with a few other matters. None the less I have the promised video tutorial up on youtube, here are the links:

Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9YqFY-Z0dk

Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZeQof7ue9xA

These cells have held up very well running a joule thief with a white LED for 4 consecutive days with no added water/electrolyte, and no noticeable change in power. Better performance than what I expected.

P.S. sorry for the audio in the videos my cam is still giving me some problems.

-Pete

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #34 on: June 29, 2010, 01:28:41 PM »
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Offline jeanna

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #35 on: June 30, 2010, 05:01:27 AM »
Nice job on the video, Pete.

I was not able to see how you make the connection with the 2 al sides and the 1 copper.
I am assuming you connect the 2 al electrodes together as one then use them connected instead of a single electrode. I wanted to confirm this on the magnesium too. It is a good idea.

I couldn't see through the snarl of wires ( ;) ), but please verify this for me. I like the concept. It is like making a parallel element before adding the copper to give it more mA.

jeanna

Offline PeteIdl4

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #36 on: June 30, 2010, 07:02:27 AM »
Nice job on the video, Pete.

I was not able to see how you make the connection with the 2 al sides and the 1 copper.
I am assuming you connect the 2 al electrodes together as one then use them connected instead of a single electrode. I wanted to confirm this on the magnesium too. It is a good idea.

I couldn't see through the snarl of wires ( ;) ), but please verify this for me. I like the concept. It is like making a parallel element before adding the copper to give it more mA.

jeanna

Hi Jeanna,
Thank you and yes, you are correct. Each cell has both Al pieces wired together then used as a single electrode to run in series with the other cells. It is the same with my Magnesium one also, although I've only made one of those. Sorry for the mess of wires in the video ;D

-Pete

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #36 on: June 30, 2010, 07:02:27 AM »
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Offline The Observer

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #37 on: June 30, 2010, 09:18:31 AM »
Greetings,

The Penny Pill  Battery Experiment is going well.
4 days and Counting... the batteries run better on their side for some reason,
LED is running Bright.

Anyways... I do have an Invention.
It could be a World Changer.

I'm thinking a (2 different metal)/(tap water) Battery could run for years if not a decade.
       Could be wrong... but I am an optimist. ;o)

A large scale model of this that charges your 12Volt Battery system used in Solar/ Wind 24/7 might be the ticket.... Yea

« Last Edit: June 30, 2010, 07:41:19 PM by The Observer »

Offline jeanna

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #38 on: June 30, 2010, 07:04:16 PM »
I moved this over from the joule thief thread since it is about batteries.



Jeanna,

I have not tried charging a NiMh with the pill jars yet...
     At this point it is next to a forgone conclusion that will work.
           The Pill Jars give off Amps and Volts just like any other power supply.
                   The more Pennies the more Amps... (voltage stays the same)

I am curious how long they will last.
.....
I think you kinda figured that.

The Observer
Yes,
My question was about usefulness.
I understand that theoretically it will work.

So, because I was not very clear when I asked it before, (my apologies) I will ask it this way:

Will the recharging ability of these pre-1983 pennies with zinc (slugs? or a) bolt be a reasonable resource over time?
They corrode terribly and if they only last 3 hours before you must take them apart and sand them down, will it be worth it at all?

I am not asking a theoretical question.
It was my first electrical experiment to make a penny/zinc galvanic battery, and yes it worked. I forget how long it was in the electrolyte, but when I walked past it one time, (maybe after only 3 hours)  it had gone out and it was badly corroded. That is why I ask.

thank you,

jeanna

Offline The Observer

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #39 on: June 30, 2010, 07:40:24 PM »
Jeanna,

The Penny Pill Jar Joule Thief is on it's 5th day and going strong.
I did put in a tiny bit of water last night.
They also  run a lot better on their sides...(Bolt parallel with the ground).

Because it is running on water... I wonder if there will be much degradation or electroplating.
As long as the ingredients stay the same, I don't see why this wouldn't run for years.
Of course. this is the 5th day...
After a few months I would start talking pretty confidently. ;o)

The Observer

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #39 on: June 30, 2010, 07:40:24 PM »
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Offline old man

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #40 on: July 01, 2010, 12:48:17 AM »
 all

my test on alum can and copper wire i test everyday and 10 am

 vinegar                                   limon juice                                 
started with
dcv             ma                dcv                    ma                   
0635            .269              1.027              .273                                                     
day 1
1.132            .266            .885                .016
day2
1.110            .178            .738                  .010                       
day 3
1.105          .162              .725                .009
day 4
1.130           .245              .975               .000   
day 5
1.061            .175             .775               .000


and bleach

dcv                     ma
1.116               .141
1.235        .124
1.235            .087
1.199         .047
1.025             .15
.955            .000


so they dont hold up they all fall in voiles and amps next 3 will be
mild pepper juice @ salt and baking soda and electrolyte used for babies


Pete

good vid i am going to make some of them and see what happens

lee

hows your steel and alum can doing?


The Observer


good work but i have? how many do you have to have to light an led without a jf the reason why i am asking is if you dont have a way of makeing a jf just to of them wood not work  now if it takes 20 or 30 to get lets say 20 v all the time now that wood be nice  ;D  ???you have it all the time but if it run down  with a load on it  we wood have to add more water to which is good  ill thank i am going to see howmany Pill Jar it takes and how long it last with out an jf



Offline the_big_m_in_ok

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #41 on: July 01, 2010, 01:44:08 AM »
lee
hows your steel and alum can doing?
@old man
I've been rather busy with time-consuming personal issues.  But, my prototype steel-aluminum can water batteries leveled off at around .4 volts or so.

I have resistors, and a DMM, so I can check the operation of batteries I have now.  The first one, by-the-way, had no scratches on the outside of the aluminum can, and it gave about .01-.03 V right away.  Scratching the can is important.  Otherwise, performance is very poor.

My immediate goal is to build a (simple!) electrical relay inverter to run an emergency backup 6W fluorescent light from either AA/AAA Radio Shack batteries or otherwise can water batteries for free.  30-40 ea. cans should give 12VDC.  They'll be a lot of space on the floor, but they're sturdy, simple and free.  Components are found on the streets, except for reusable jumper wires.  Building one takes me about 25-35 minutes.

Here's some wiring diagrams:

http://www.eleccircuit.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/buzzer.gif
http://www.eleccircuit.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/ignition-coil-high-voltage-generators.gif
http://httP://img29.imageshack.us/i/schematic2.jpg/

You see what I mean?  The focus is "simple" and "reliable".
The 3rd circuit in the list just needs a battery connection.  The fan might also be done away with altogether.  The yellow leads can go to a resistor and separate power supply, although the LED's would be experiencing square-wave AC voltage.  The LED's can also be replaced by a step-up transformer or counter-wound toroid, for instance.  Lots of possibilities for experimentation.

I myself will be using Radio Shack components, since there is no surplus new/used retail electronic parts distributor in San Francisco.  And I don't trust the delivery reliability of the USPS or the cost of shipping.

Maybe later I'll try and build a useful, medium-to-high voltage Lakhovsky radiating coil and experiment with that.  In a while, though.

--Lee


Offline old man

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #42 on: July 01, 2010, 02:42:48 AM »
lee

them diagrams are good i am going to have to try them later
there is a lot there  i am trying to find the right electrolyte combo
found around the house thats good and last a long time and then ill go from there you no thank out side the box i hate boxs lol ;D ;D  i am going to test somemore thing in a day or two i find most of my stuff in the trash or pp give me stuff i go bye why bye it when you can find it lol

tom

Offline The Observer

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #43 on: July 01, 2010, 03:10:29 AM »
Old Man,

Well, it's true, a JT cheats the system by using the energy from the ferrite core that flips the dipoles back to random... that produces the spikes.

However, I would guess since they (the Pill Jars)  are putting out .5 - .6 Volts... it would take about 6 of them to light a regular 3 Volt Led.

So far... all I've added to the system was a small amount of water.

The Observer

P.S.  I am looking to build some bigger models using scrap metal of some sort.


Offline the_big_m_in_ok

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Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #44 on: July 01, 2010, 05:35:43 AM »
lee
them diagrams are good i am going to have to try them later ...
I have several more; I was concentrating on mechanical systems.  Electronics is quieter and lasts longer, but is fairly often more complicated as well.  Multivibrators are popular square wave inverters; reliable, too.
Quote
... there is a lot there  i am trying to find the right electrolyte combo found around the house thats good and last a long time and then ill go from there ...
Lemon juice was your best one so far, yes?  It might get a little expensive if you use a lot.  I'm still thinking of soda, which is acidic.  I drink it, anyway.
I wonder if galvanic action between the electrolyte and electrode(s) is something to be concerned about?
Quote
... you no thank out side the box i hate boxs lol ;D ;D  i am going to test somemore thing in a day or two i find most of my stuff in the trash or pp give me stuff i go bye why bye it when you can find it lol
tom
Right.  I look around the downtown area for cans and bottles, so things are free when I find them, too.

Will try and write in a few days.  I'll be back.

--Lee

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: aluminum can and copper wire batterys
« Reply #44 on: July 01, 2010, 05:35:43 AM »

 

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