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Author Topic: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter  (Read 32667 times)

Offline LarryC

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #30 on: February 24, 2010, 12:33:36 AM »
Hey Larry,

Have just downloaded and installed 3.18

Regards, Penno

Thanks, Penno.

Please use the proportional dimensions from reply #12 to help with the simulation dimensions. I don't know your level of technical knowledge, so others specs like Tesla, etc may require some research. Let us know if any assistance is needed. As I'm sure the combined knowledge and/or research ability here can be of help.

Regards, Larry

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Offline petersone

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #31 on: February 24, 2010, 12:35:20 AM »
Hi Darkspeed and All
Very interesting thread,could you tell me what you consider the max hz when using mild steel as a stator? as that is all I have at the moment.
peter


Offline darkspeed

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #32 on: February 24, 2010, 12:58:48 AM »
Hi Darkspeed and All
Very interesting thread,could you tell me what you consider the max hz when using mild steel as a stator? as that is all I have at the moment.
peter

Depends on your number of fire extinguishers?
It turns into induction heating around 10khz on up
Due to the eddy effect your going to have more losses the higher you go
You can get some rg60 welding rod and cut it into sticks and bundel that together for higher freq
or better yet get a ferrite bar from an old radio

Offline penno64

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #33 on: February 24, 2010, 01:06:53 AM »
Hey Larry,

Have you got a file you could email me - save recreating the setup ?

Regards, Pen

p.s. I'm off to work now - will be back in 6hrs. Pen
« Last Edit: February 24, 2010, 01:46:49 AM by penno64 »


Offline petersone

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #34 on: February 24, 2010, 01:07:29 AM »
Hi Darkspeed
Thanks for your prompt reply,I like your sense of humor,so around 1khz would be ok,the welding rods you mention are gas rods? copper coated? don't they need to be coated with insulation before they are bundled?
peter

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #34 on: February 24, 2010, 01:07:29 AM »
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Offline LarryC

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #35 on: February 24, 2010, 01:58:53 AM »
Hey Larry,

Have you got a file you could email me - save recreating the setup ?

Regards, Pen

Sorry, all files are deleted.

I can still see the menu, but I can't use. So my best guess is to:

First use the Add flux sources - Straight permanent magnet.

Second use the Add magnetic regions - Rectangular region.

Third use the Add flux sources - Straight solenoid.

I am attaching my analysis of the Magnacoaster design. The only difference should be the removal of the bottom magnet and the width and strength of the magnet, cores and solenoid coils.

Regards, Larry

PS: Play with the parameters, use the help, enjoy, take your time and get back to us when you can see the general working of Art's setup. We can perfect it later.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2010, 02:28:40 AM by LarryC »

Offline darkspeed

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #36 on: February 24, 2010, 02:21:57 AM »
Hi Darkspeed
Thanks for your prompt reply,I like your sense of humor,so around 1khz would be ok,the welding rods you mention are gas rods? copper coated? don't they need to be coated with insulation before they are bundled?
peter

Dont mean to intrude on Larrys thread but i wanted to answer..

Thanks,
you can lay them out flat and spray them with bbq grill paint then wrap them with Kapton tape if you want to be safe
1khz at a limited power.. The more flux and or frequency of flux change the hotter they will get.
You can also use thin wall pipe or tubing as well.

http://www.airgas.com/browse/product.aspx?Msg=RecID&recIds=18853&WT.svl=18853


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #36 on: February 24, 2010, 02:21:57 AM »
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Offline LarryC

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #37 on: February 24, 2010, 02:51:14 AM »
Quote from: darkspeed link=topic=8796.msg229838#msg229838 A=1266974517
Dont mean to intrude on Larrys thread but i wanted to answer..

Thanks,
you can lay them out flat and spray them with bbq grill paint then wrap them with Kapton tape if you want to be safe
1khz at a limited power.. The more flux and or frequency of flux change the hotter they will get.
You can also use thin wall pipe or tubing as well.

http://www.airgas.com/browse/product.aspx?Msg=RecID&recIds=18853&WT.svl=18853

@darkspeed,

Please don't worry about intruding on my thread, all who wish to help, please do so freely. Darkspeed, you have passed along some new knowledge (Kapton tape, bifilar relay solenoids) to me and others, as i"m sure we can all pass some knowledge that will help with this project.

@All,

Observations on the metal arc. Of course it has screws on top to secure it to the post, but it also has crossbolts along the side, which seem to indicate that it is composed of arc metal lamination's that are bolted together. Maybe sheet metal and coated or painted to prevent rust. Any other opinions?

Regards, Larry 
« Last Edit: February 24, 2010, 05:00:46 AM by LarryC »

Offline petersone

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #38 on: February 24, 2010, 02:53:57 AM »
Thanks Darkspeed
I done a few test today on the Art thing,nothing fancy,using mild steel,hence my questions,and it seems there is a gain to be had,if the distances,voltage,etc. are just right,as you said.My mags are crap,the steel is crap and the coil is crap,but in-spite of all that there seems to be something in it imho.I look forword to more of Larry's findings.I'll do some more tests and see if I can find something more definitive.
peter

Offline darkspeed

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #39 on: February 24, 2010, 03:57:22 AM »

Well if you get serious about it. the material you want to use is called Vimvar it has a sat. ind. of 21,500 gausses, it is made by Carpenter www.cartech.com it is a vacuum melt low carbon magnetic. You can get it in rod shape from Ed Fagan Inc. I have used it in pulse motors and it is great stuff..


Also if you wind your electromagnet with c-200 wire and use the tesla bifilar wind it will be much more efficient.



Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #39 on: February 24, 2010, 03:57:22 AM »
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Offline petersone

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #40 on: February 24, 2010, 01:54:55 PM »
Hi Darkspeed
Thanks for your reply,it looks like the people you mention are in the US,I'm in the UK,may be a prob.I'll see if I can get it here,what is c-200 wire?
peter

Offline darkspeed

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #41 on: February 24, 2010, 08:19:03 PM »
Hi Darkspeed
Thanks for your reply,it looks like the people you mention are in the US,I'm in the UK,may be a prob.I'll see if I can get it here,what is c-200 wire?
peter

it is a high build ( thick coating ) high temp magnet wire

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=magnet+wire+200c



Offline darkspeed

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #42 on: February 24, 2010, 08:22:40 PM »
Hi Darkspeed
Thanks for your reply,it looks like the people you mention are in the US,I'm in the UK,may be a prob.I'll see if I can get it here,what is c-200 wire?
peter

You can go to a metal supply in the UK and get iron stock and have it annealed ( in an oven ) to a "dead soft" condition and it will work as well.
Dont annealed it then machine it - machine it then anneal it!


Offline LarryC

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #43 on: February 25, 2010, 06:24:31 PM »
On the left in the attached picture is some additional info on Art's motor. The Metal Arc's are 60 degrees and the poles are 45 degrees apart, same as the cores(not shown).

On the right is a stator from a induction pancake type ceiling fan motor. It is make of laminated motor steel and could be cut into six 60 degree section. This could be used to make Art's prototype or the armature shown in video no. 2.

Notice the different color metal on the top and bottom, but only half way across the thickness. It is part of the shorting bar of an induction motor. It needs to be chisled off (soft material) and grind down any remaining metal to stop the magnetic field it would create, as it is would pull against the cores.

After doing the pull test, I'm sure this motor would work as stated. It seems easier to build then the other mag switch motors. I still have some questions on the coil parameter. But before deciding to build, I'm going to do some test on a large possible induction gain.

If the secondary was shorted before the start of the pulse to eliminate the induction and decrease the time it takes to align the core. Then if opened before the end of the pulse to get maximum induction, a large back emf would be created. The back emf also support the magnetic field polarity. It could shorten the pulse time required. This back emf can be seen in reply 20 scope shot with the open secondary. It is falling until the next pulse starts. 
 

Regards, Larry 


Offline Low-Q

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Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #44 on: February 25, 2010, 11:42:57 PM »
Good observations Larry. I think if the motor works because of the amplification, and the extra/free force you get from that, the shape of the arcs or the poles are not critical. I think the shape in the motor is made to minimize cogging. But cogging should not be a reason why this motor shouldn't work.

I think you can make this motor just as you like if you use coils and magnets, and use triggers correctly. The main thing here is the (claimed) difference between input energy and amplified force.

As in any conventional electrical motor, the construction is rather made optimized to get most possible efficiency. However, regardless on how you make an electric motor, it will work just fine if the timing of the polarity swapping is within a given period. Going beyond this period, the motor will reverse. If hitting the "dead" spot, the motor will just consume energy, get warm, and do not rotate. Hitting the "right" spot, and the motor will run very well.

Vidar

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnetic amplification and neutralization motor by Art Porter
« Reply #44 on: February 25, 2010, 11:42:57 PM »

 

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