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Author Topic: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION  (Read 1853969 times)

Offline handrajaya@gmail.com

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8115 on: March 31, 2017, 09:12:14 AM »
Dear tim energy,

Sorry I don't get your clue :-(
Maybe need several years to get it like Tito's :-)

Regards

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8115 on: March 31, 2017, 09:12:14 AM »

Offline Grumage

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8116 on: April 12, 2017, 02:30:40 PM »
Dear Erfinder.

Whilst busy with other projects your reference to Tesla's " Ozone patent " has been coming and going through my mind.

I remembered the other day of a SS circuit I had tinkered with, rather badly.....

Would the attached circuit diagram be a close cousin ?

Kind regards, Graham.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Cadman

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8117 on: April 12, 2017, 07:11:31 PM »
Erfinder,

My attempt to describe the operational sequence of the ozone generator.

DC source, positive A, negative B. Switch H is closed.

At startup, positive A charges a high self-inductance, F+D, through switch H, also equalizing the charge on cap L through primary M at the same time. While switch H is closed the motor is receiving a current from AB and rotates.

Motor rotates x degrees and switch H opens.
The motor is disconnected from source at A, not B.
Inductance F+D sends a high voltage discharge through primary M into cap L.
At this instant is the discharge oscillatory between F+D and cap L?
A emf output is produced at secondary N.
Current also continues onward to source B from F+D during the discharge.

Motor rotates x degrees by momentum and switch H closes.
The motor reconnects to current source A and F+D recharge.
The cap L is shorted through switch H and primary M and a high frequency oscillatory discharge occurs between L & M.
For each oscillation a higher voltage emf is produced at secondary N. That emf is high frequency AC and is the beginning of the working circuit.

My thoughts:

The high frequency emf from N charges a larger cap in the working circuit that can be discharged into a step-down transformer to produce a lower frequency higher current emf for use.

The relationship of inductance, capacity, and resistance sets the frequency of L & M and also the frequency of the working circuit.

It looks as if the HV oscillating discharge between L & M would also charge the source through A.

It seems to be a very efficient set up. The pulse motor does work on it's own and the inductive discharge from the field coils that is normally wasted can be used to produce a high voltage with high current.

Sounds simple enough. What am I missing? Am I way off base here?

Regards

Offline Erfinder

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8118 on: April 13, 2017, 07:02:16 PM »
Dear Erfinder.

Whilst busy with other projects your reference to Tesla's " Ozone patent " has been coming and going through my mind.

I remembered the other day of a SS circuit I had tinkered with, rather badly.....

Would the attached circuit diagram be a close cousin ?

Kind regards, Graham.


I wouldn't  be playing by those unwritten rules if I said they weren't....  Here's the thing though, everyone keeps saying what's expected (parroting) of them with regards to this circuit.  Add to this, those whom you all deem as authorities say there's nothing more here, period...  At this point most (all) stop thinking for themselves because the authorities have spoken the final word on the subject they may know, however, cannot and will not expand on.  That being said, if you can't see more than the obvious, walk away from it.


Offline Erfinder

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8119 on: April 13, 2017, 07:05:22 PM »
Erfinder,

My attempt to describe the operational sequence of the ozone generator.

DC source, positive A, negative B. Switch H is closed.

At startup, positive A charges a high self-inductance, F+D, through switch H, also equalizing the charge on cap L through primary M at the same time. While switch H is closed the motor is receiving a current from AB and rotates.

Motor rotates x degrees and switch H opens.
The motor is disconnected from source at A, not B.
Inductance F+D sends a high voltage discharge through primary M into cap L.
At this instant is the discharge oscillatory between F+D and cap L?
A emf output is produced at secondary N.
Current also continues onward to source B from F+D during the discharge.

Motor rotates x degrees by momentum and switch H closes.
The motor reconnects to current source A and F+D recharge.
The cap L is shorted through switch H and primary M and a high frequency oscillatory discharge occurs between L & M.
For each oscillation a higher voltage emf is produced at secondary N. That emf is high frequency AC and is the beginning of the working circuit.

My thoughts:

The high frequency emf from N charges a larger cap in the working circuit that can be discharged into a step-down transformer to produce a lower frequency higher current emf for use.

The relationship of inductance, capacity, and resistance sets the frequency of L & M and also the frequency of the working circuit.

It looks as if the HV oscillating discharge between L & M would also charge the source through A.

It seems to be a very efficient set up. The pulse motor does work on it's own and the inductive discharge from the field coils that is normally wasted can be used to produce a high voltage with high current.

Sounds simple enough. What am I missing? Am I way off base here?

Regards


What if there is more to it than the obvious?  Imagine that.....what lessons are being taught aside from the ones which have received the approval of the resident competent authorities?  Go where they won't!


Regards

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8119 on: April 13, 2017, 07:05:22 PM »
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Offline Cadman

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8120 on: April 13, 2017, 08:15:17 PM »
Erfinder, thanks for responding. I do hope there is more to it than the obvious.

Well if I have the basic idea worked out then I think this would make a good first Tesla experiment.

The standard explanation of resonant rise, as I understand it, is 'incrementally storing more and more energy from the power supply' but that does not take into consideration contributions from other things like the inductive discharge or the secondary of the oscillation transformer and the cap connected to it for example. At least that is my thinking at the moment. If I build this properly I'll bet I see a few surprises and learn some things.

I think I can rig up a rotary switch, high inductance, and transformers fairly easily, caps will have to be ordered though. Probably use a 12VDC battery for the supply, maybe at a half amp.

Do you have a suggestion as to the oscillation frequency to shoot for in the L M circuit, or should I just try to follow Tesla's lead?

Regards

Offline Erfinder

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8121 on: May 19, 2017, 09:21:45 PM »
My Dogma...


The cap is the fulcrum of the system because:

    +    It is charged in series with the primary......


    +    It is discharged in parallel with the primary......



Fundamentally you are dealing with the same components, however, you must recognize that you are dealing with two distinct circuits, circuits operating at different instances, circuits which owing to their specific relations CANNOT oscillate at the same frequency, circuits which owing to the aforementioned are not operating in phase! 


Your eyes have been shut to the true nature of this and just about every other circuit Tesla has preserved.  You only see half of a whole.  You only see the parallel LC, you dont understand what the parallel LC is.  Most assume  when you have L and C you must tune.  Just because you can doesn't mean it's what you are supposed to do.


First, the cap is charged (by the supply) when the controller is open.  The current charging the capacitor moves through a circuit which includes the motor windings, and primary of the transformer......Doh!  The cap discharge (at switch closure) is NOT the only current exciting the transformer!!!!!


If the above didn't get your attention.....while "charging" the capacitor forms a series LC with the primary of the transformer....while "discharging" the capacitor forms a parallel LC with the primary of the transformer....holy shit...what does it mean....(certainly not what you're thinking.....) My original post was in Jan 2016... five months later.....folk still parroting the text, no real thought, just a bunch of copying and pasting.... pisses me off... I told you people, it's not about the obvious, or your goddamn measurements and or simulations!  What you want demands a fundamental change in perspective, begins with opening your damn eyes and seeing what's right fucking there!


The cap charging current causes the rotor to spin, excites the primary, and induces current in the secondary of the transformer!  Once the cap fills, current stops....pwm without the pwm..... This is a what the fuck moment.....why, you are being informed of that which "CAN", that which is taking place prior to switch closure, and this using what Tesla shows you.  Are there alternatives to what he's shown....yep...have I provided a demo....yep.....was anyone paying attention....probably not....can I blame you....wouldn't matter if I did.....


Regards

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8121 on: May 19, 2017, 09:21:45 PM »
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Offline penno64

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8122 on: May 19, 2017, 10:30:01 PM »
thank you

Penno

Offline Magluvin

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8123 on: May 19, 2017, 11:18:36 PM »

Offline Cadman

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8124 on: May 21, 2017, 08:00:58 PM »

First, the cap is charged (by the supply) when the controller is open.  The current charging the capacitor moves through a circuit which includes the motor windings, and primary of the transformer......Doh!  The cap discharge (at switch closure) is NOT the only current exciting the transformer!!!!!


If the above didn't get your attention.....while "charging" the capacitor forms a series LC with the primary of the transformer....while "discharging" the capacitor forms a parallel LC with the primary of the transformer....holy shit...what does it mean....(certainly not what you're thinking.....) My original post was in Jan 2016... five months later.....folk still parroting the text, no real thought, just a bunch of copying and pasting.... pisses me off... I told you people, it's not about the obvious, or your goddamn measurements and or simulations!  What you want demands a fundamental change in perspective, begins with opening your damn eyes and seeing what's right fucking there!


The cap charging current causes the rotor to spin, excites the primary, and induces current in the secondary of the transformer!  Once the cap fills, current stops....pwm without the pwm..... This is a what the fuck moment.....why, you are being informed of that which "CAN", that which is taking place prior to switch closure, and this using what Tesla shows you.  Are there alternatives to what he's shown....yep...have I provided a demo....yep.....was anyone paying attention....probably not....can I blame you....wouldn't matter if I did.....


Regards

With an 8 pole controller switch with 4 open and 4 closed segments of 45 degrees each, if the small cap is charged in, say 20 degrees of the motor rotation while the circuit controller is open, then during the remaining 25 degrees the motor is a generator.

As for the series charging and parallel discharging, the only thing I can relate to that at this moment is voltage is increased in a series LC and amperage is increased in a parallel LC, or so I have read.

There are several different frequencies traveling through the transformer primary. What was that Tesla said, something about constructing to the Law of Harmonics? You know, where two frequencies can produce a third frequency?

Is this relevant to what you are getting at? Probably not.

Regards

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8124 on: May 21, 2017, 08:00:58 PM »
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Offline Erfinder

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8125 on: May 23, 2017, 09:06:26 PM »
With an 8 pole controller switch with 4 open and 4 closed segments of 45 degrees each, if the small cap is charged in, say 20 degrees of the motor rotation while the circuit controller is open, then during the remaining 25 degrees the motor is a generator.


Try and understand that there is never a time when the motor is not functioning as a generator.....



As for the series charging and parallel discharging, the only thing I can relate to that at this moment is voltage is increased in a series LC and amperage is increased in a parallel LC, or so I have read.


I am not intersted in what you "can relate to"..... I am not intersted in what you think....  I informed you of what you should already be fully aware, what you can take directly from the diagram, specifically, the relation that the capacitor has to the supply, and the relation the same capacitor has to the primary, then, both and their respective relation to the circuit controller at the make and the break. 

There are several different frequencies traveling through the transformer primary. What was that Tesla said, something about constructing to the Law of Harmonics? You know, where two frequencies can produce a third frequency?


It's not enough to suggest that there are "several different frequencies travelling through the transformer primary..."  You need to be in the position to identify them!  What Tesla said in regards to the law of harmonic vibrations is usually always taken out of context, partially because folk have no idea what he was talking about, and partly because folk think they know what he was talking about.  The reference you sight is not about two frequencies in a wire generating a third (beat frequency), instead he was making a statement regarding several tuned resonators, represented by different parts of his circuits, operating in what he called electromagnetic synchronism, a condition many confuse with resonance, and this only because he used the word.....

Is this relevant to what you are getting at? Probably not.

Regards


It would be unfair for me to say no....but this is one of those times when I have to be unfair.....


no....

Offline Cadman

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8126 on: May 23, 2017, 10:23:50 PM »
Thanks Erfinder. That was actually helpful to me. Yeah I know, you don't care, but thanks just the same.
I'm just trying to understand the best I can before I attempt to build this.

By the way, when you joined in on this thread http://overunity.com/3972/the-tesla-project/ back in 2008 and tried to get people to build a layman's verification of the ozone patent did you already understand everything you have been trying to open our eyes to on this thread?

Just curious is all.

Regards


Offline Magluvin

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8127 on: May 24, 2017, 04:32:31 AM »

First, the cap is charged (by the supply) when the controller is open.  The current charging the capacitor moves through a circuit which includes the motor windings, and primary of the transformer......Doh!  The cap discharge (at switch closure) is NOT the only current exciting the transformer!!!!!


If the above didn't get your attention.....while "charging" the capacitor forms a series LC with the primary of the transformer....while "discharging" the capacitor forms a parallel LC with the primary of the transformer....holy shit...what does it mean....(certainly not what you're thinking.....) My original post was in Jan 2016... five months later.....folk still parroting the text, no real thought, just a bunch of copying and pasting.... pisses me off... I told you people, it's not about the obvious, or your goddamn measurements and or simulations!  What you want demands a fundamental change in perspective, begins with opening your damn eyes and seeing what's right fucking there!


The cap charging current causes the rotor to spin, excites the primary, and induces current in the secondary of the transformer!  Once the cap fills, current stops....pwm without the pwm..... This is a what the fuck moment.....why, you are being informed of that which "CAN", that which is taking place prior to switch closure, and this using what Tesla shows you.  Are there alternatives to what he's shown....yep...have I provided a demo....yep.....was anyone paying attention....probably not....can I blame you....wouldn't matter if I did.....


Regards

So are we looking at the motor mech output as a benefit here? Just wondering

Mags

Offline Erfinder

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8128 on: May 24, 2017, 02:36:33 PM »
Thanks Erfinder. That was actually helpful to me. Yeah I know, you don't care, but thanks just the same.
I'm just trying to understand the best I can before I attempt to build this.


It is not my intention to offend you.  I am simply saying that the opinions of others have no bearing on what I am sharing.

By the way, when you joined in on this thread http://overunity.com/3972/the-tesla-project/ back in 2008 and tried to get people to build a layman's verification of the ozone patent did you already understand everything you have been trying to open our eyes to on this thread?

Just curious is all.

Regards


The information I was exposed to then is the same info I study today....the difference  between now and then is the amount of time which has passed and the amount of space travelled since then, both have shaped my view, molded my perspective.  Now is important, now is where I am.  You want to comprehend what I am suggesting....stay in the now.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Erfinder

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Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8129 on: May 24, 2017, 02:43:37 PM »
So are we looking at the motor mech output as a benefit here? Just wondering

Mags


First it is a motor......it is a motor in the true sense of the term when the controller closes.....it is a motor in an unconventional sense when the switch opens allowing the cap to reestablish its connection with the supply, where it is filled through the motor.....  In essence, one is observing the actions of a rather curious two phase machine.... 


I am asking folk to familiarize themselves with the dynamic, so that you can intuit how it must be modified so that it can suit our purposes, assuming your purpose is the same as mine.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: ENERGY AMPLIFICATION
« Reply #8129 on: May 24, 2017, 02:43:37 PM »

 

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