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Author Topic: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel  (Read 84513 times)

Offline Bubba1

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2008, 03:22:37 AM »
Yes I ran the same numbers but:
1000 peltiers in series would read 1000 x .019 volts= 19 volts
The same 1000 peltiers in series would read 1000 x .2 amps = 200 amps

200 amps x 19 volts = 3800 watts.

I agree the voltages would add up in series.  1000 peltiers in series would give 19 volts.  However, the amps do not add up in a series circuit.  The same current goes through all of the peltiers.  Do you really think that there would be 200 amps going through those skinny wires?

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2008, 03:22:37 AM »

Offline billmehess

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #16 on: September 12, 2008, 03:43:43 AM »
Each peltier is acting as a individual charging station. If there was not a culmulative effect happening then I would not be seeing a step increase in both voltage and amperage as measured on the individual meters. The digital meter measuring the voltage and the 600ma meter measuring the amperage.
I took another capacitor and "charged it up" to 100 mv and 200 ma from the four peltiers. I removed the cap from the system and discharged it into the voltmeter and it read around 95mv.
I then reccharged the cap to 100 mv and discharged it into the amp meter and it spiked at 200ma.
I understand your math but the fact of the matter is that it is charging both amperage and voltage in series.

Of course 3800 watts would fry the system.

Again each peltier, acting independent of each other until is acting as its own charging station. In a panel configuration the entire system would read the culmulative levels. It might be possible to pulse charge a battery pack as is used in a standard solar system. Even though
the pulse would momentarily "drain" the panel it in effect recharges itself within seconds.

Also when I used a simple magnifing glass on the surface of one of the peltiers not even focused at its smalled point the amp meter pegged (600ma+) and the voltmmeter read 300 mv.


Offline TheOne

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #17 on: September 12, 2008, 03:59:07 AM »
You seam to not understand that your calculation is wrong, its 4w not 4000w, you cannot multiply 2 times 1000, only one time, the best way to calculate is to get the w from one peltier and then multiply it by 1000 not by 1000000

Anyway, i was looking at this too, maybe with a concentrator (mirror dish) could be used to focus the hot ray sun in a piece of metal that lye on few peltiers devices and maybe you can really get something useful from it.

GM is about to release a generator working on this principe, not sure if they use peltier device but they seam to generate enough power to be used as generator.


Offline hydrocontrol

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #18 on: September 12, 2008, 04:07:22 AM »
The best way to increase the power level is to increase the temperature differential between each side of the Peltier Junction. So the best way to do this is cool one side of the junction using a large heat sink. The other peltier side attach a piece of aluminum painted black and focus the sun on the aluminum. Make sure to use heat sink compound.  ;)

So you need four of these.
http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/peltier/ck500.htm

Remove the wimpy peltier junction and replace with one of these better junctions
on each assembly. Total four needed.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Gigantic-62mm-545-Watt-Thermoelectric-Peltier-Cooler_W0QQitemZ310081827783QQihZ021QQcategoryZ4660QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Hookup the 12vdc fans to be run off the peltiers.

get one of these surplus parabolic dishes discussed here at overunity and retrofit it with the above assembly.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=5453.msg125595;topicseen

Ebay source for small dish
http://cgi.ebay.com/DIRECT-TV-TRIPLE-MULTI-SATELLITE-DISH-SATALITE-SATELITE_W0QQitemZ150293343590QQihZ005QQcategoryZ29783QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I think you should be able to get 1500 watts with fan losses and losses from running four 545 watt peltier devices. Maximum possible would be 2180 watts but that is not going to happen.

Fan assemble $35.00 x 4 = $ 140.00
545 watt Peltiers @ $30.00 x 4 = $ 120.00
Parbolic dish = $ 45.00
A bit of engineering and for less than $400.00 you should have about 1500 watts plus on a sunny day.

Now compare with the cost of $ 400.00 for some creative backyard engineering against this  ebay listing for 6 solar panels that put out 180 watts each (6x180=1080 watts) for $3,780.00 and take up a lot of room.  ;D  ;D

http://cgi.ebay.com/Pallet-of-6-180-Watt-solar-panels-3-50-watt_W0QQitemZ220280243462QQihZ012QQcategoryZ41981QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Looks like it might pay to be creative.  :o  :o


Offline hydrocontrol

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #19 on: September 12, 2008, 04:19:42 AM »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #19 on: September 12, 2008, 04:19:42 AM »
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Offline TheOne

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #20 on: September 12, 2008, 04:29:24 AM »
Great tutorial to make your own dish

PARABOLIC DISH MIRROR PARABOLOID HOMEMADE SOLAR CONCENTRATOR
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZh-CRneIII



Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2008, 04:36:10 AM »
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Offline pese

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #22 on: September 12, 2008, 10:58:26 AM »
 
MOR SIMPLY the "metering warong" is to unse car lamps as load.

Your "light" is directly comimg to brain and to understand, what power comes out
to load CAR-lamps (bulbs) tha are to find at 5 10 21 50 watt. (12 volts)

after this you can try to understand your "volt/Ampere Meters)
Pese

Offline exnihiloest

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Re: Peltier Generating less Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2008, 11:42:56 AM »
...
If the same number of peltier squares were connected in series (960) of them the output would be:
960 x 200ma=  192 amps
960 x 20mv  =  19.2 volts
or
w=va     192 amp x  19.2 volts=  3686 watts

Wrong calculation.
As the elements are in series, the voltages add but the current remains the same.
960 peltier squares give 19.2v, 0.2 A, thus P = 3,84 W which is far less than a solar panel of same area.



Offline spinner

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Re: Peltier Generating less Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2008, 12:02:57 PM »
Wrong calculation.
As the elements are in series, the voltages add but the current remains the same.
960 peltier squares give 19.2v, 0.2 A, thus P = 3,84 W which is far less than a solar panel of same area.

Absolutely.
Peltier effect is indeed an interesting thing... But..

Like most of the people already said, the electricity produced is relative to a HEAT difference between the Peltier element sides, and it's perfectly CoE obedient. In fact, it's one of the worst energy converters (in a thermodynamical sense).

Without going into details, I'd say it has at least a few times lower efficiency than a 'same area' solar cell (which depends on different, photoelectric effect).

Check your measurements, use a known resistor for a load and measure voltage across it's terminals.
Ohm's law will tell you the rest.
 Cheers!

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Peltier Generating less Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2008, 12:02:57 PM »
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Offline hydrocontrol

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #25 on: September 12, 2008, 03:56:38 PM »
Nice video that shows using a peltier.
http://www.metacafe.com/watch/1167872/alternative_electricity_energy_power_from_peltier/

You need a setup like this to check out what happens when you add multiple peltier junctions. I am surprised that he did not have two or three peltiers junctions hooked up with the size of the heat sinks he was using. Now take his setup and add a parabolic reflect dish to the mix.

Offline FreqShift

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #26 on: August 12, 2009, 05:28:39 AM »
The Peltier, or the "Solid State Thermal Electric Generator", as I like to call it, is now capable of much higher efficiencies:

See Here:

http://www.powerchips.gi/technology/pcalc.shtml

Using a small parabolic dish, it is now possible to generate several thousand watts of electricity.

Please see the posts here for more info:

 http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=5453.msg196837;topicseen#msg196837



Offline sm0ky2

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #27 on: August 12, 2009, 06:18:44 AM »
where are you getting peltiers that only produce 20mv??

mine produce between 8 - 13VOLTS with a temp. diff of 200 degrees

this guy here has done some pretty kewl stuff with an archimedes-style solar collector.
http://solardeathray.com/

there are designs that work much better than this, using far less space. it's all about the angle of reflection, directing many suns into one spot, a lense can also be utilized to focus the beam even futher.

a basic 14-inch solar oven can reach over 350 degrees F.

a solar panel of a given area is going to waste almost all of the heat energy it collects from the sun.

theres no doubt that the sun puts out far more heat energy than 'visible' light.
the peltier vs solar panel argument, depends mostly on how each are configured. you can collect light and polarize it to make the solar panel more efficient,
or you can collect light and focus it to ake the heat collector more efficient..

overall the most efficient device i have seen for converting sunlight into usable energy is a solar collector to a sterling engine.

nothing else even comes close.

a 6-inch reflector dish can power a household hair dryer, even with the rediculous conversion losses of connecting the sterling to a magnetic motor/generator.

neither a solar array nor a peltier array can do that, or even a combination of both....


Offline triffid

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #28 on: August 12, 2009, 08:16:34 PM »
test,just wanted a link back to this thread.triffid


Offline kmarinas86

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Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #29 on: October 07, 2009, 09:27:09 PM »
This is interesting so I thought I might share it to see what the group thinks. I took a 1.5 sq. in. peltier and connected to a amp meter and a volt meter to see its output under heat conditions.
The peltier is under a glass bowl so I can get the maximum output using a greenhouse effect. At an outside temperature of 83 F. I am getting a reading of 200ma and 20mv output. This is really quite high.
A standard solar panel is around 24"x60" or 1440 in. sq. and will normally put out around 12v-17volts at ideally 100watts.
If the same number of peltier squares were connected in series (960) of them the output would be:
960 x 200ma=  192 amps
960 x 20mv  =  19.2 volts
or
w=va     192 amp x  19.2 volts=  3686 watts

That is an absolutely terrible calculation.

First of all, you claim that 960 of your peltier squares equals 1440 sq inches. That is 1.5 square inches per peltier square. Also, each of your squares produces 200ma at 20mv, which is equal to 0.004 watts. 0.004W * 960 equals 3.84W.

In other words, the correct calculation is:

IN PARALLEL
960 x 200ma = 192 amps
192 amps x .02 volts = 3.84 watts

IN SERIES
960 x 20mv = 19.2 volts
19.2 volts x .2 amps = 3.84 watts

Am I missing something here?

Yes.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Peltier Generating More Watts Than A Solar Panel
« Reply #29 on: October 07, 2009, 09:27:09 PM »

 

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