Cookies-law

Cookies help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
http://www.overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please leave this website now. Many thanks for your understanding.
Amazon Warehouse Deals ! Now even more Deep Discounts ! Check out these great prices on slightly used or just opened once only items.I always buy my gadgets via these great Warehouse deals ! Highly recommended ! Many thanks for supporting OverUnity.com this way.

FireMatch

FireMatch

CCKnife

CCKnife

Poplamp

poplamp

CCTool

CCTool

LEDTVforSale

Magpi Magazine

Magpi Magazine Free Rasberry Pi Magazine

Battery Recondition

Battery Recondition

OverUnity Book

overunity principles book

Arduino

Ultracaps

YT Subscribe

Gravity Machines

Tesla-Ebook

Magnet Secrets

Lindemann Video

Navigation

Products

Statistics

  • *Total Members: 81959
  • *Latest: Kapalek

  • *Total Posts: 491751
  • *Total Topics: 14473
  • *Online Today: 44
  • *Most Online: 103
(December 19, 2006, 11:27:19 PM)
  • *Users: 5
  • *Guests: 99
  • *Total: 104

Facebook

Author Topic: Infrared potential  (Read 11894 times)

Offline goofy

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 2
Infrared potential
« on: September 28, 2005, 07:35:21 AM »
I once did a crude experiment which showed promise. I made a small cone shaped funnel from a sheet of brass. It was about 5 inches long, 1.25 inches wide at the large end and about .3 inches wide at the small end. I turned off the corner lamp in the room, turned off the heat and held my breath when I adjusted it to try to avoid outside influnces. I set it on a shelf and pointed the large end at a dark colored piece of paper on the wall. I put a thermometer in front of the small end. I waited 10 minutes and moved the thermometer so that it wasn't in front of it. After another 10 minutes I put the thermometer back. When I moved the thermometer, which was a disassembled desktop design, I did so without touching the sensing element (a bi-metalic spring) and while holding my breath. I repeated this process three more times.

In all the tests, which were performed at room temperature, I found about .5 degree F. rise in temperature when the cone was aimed at the thermometer and if fell back down when it was moved away.

My reasoning behind the test was that long wavelength infrared is reflected by polished gold. Brass was the closest material I had at hand. The cone shaped funnel can reflect and concentrate light. So my theory is that the ambient infrared "light" was being concentrated to produce a higher than ambient temperature. A second law violation, no?

I believe that four changes together could greatly improve the results. First use a temperature sensor which matches the size of the small end of the funnel. The bi-metalic spring unit I used was about 2 1/2 times bigger in diameter than the small end of the funnel, causing excess radiating area for the collected heat. Second, use real polished gold instead of slightly polished brass. Third, place the unit in a vacuum for insulating purposes. Fourth, possibly cascade the effect by putting two or more cones in series with an appropiately sized and partially insulated black plate suspended between them. Of course the first three improvements are the most straight-forward and could prove the effect. If 5 to 15 degrees F temperature rise could be produced in a single stage then multiple stages could perhaps cascade the effect so that thermocouples or some other heat engine could be used to produce power. The arrangement may also work to make a passive heat pump, refridgerator or oven.

    Goofy

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Infrared potential
« on: September 28, 2005, 07:35:21 AM »

Offline newton2

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 64
Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2006, 01:05:40 PM »
HELLO GOOFY !

Your exp. was as close to real functioning as for some modifications to perform :

use Blackbody-to-Blackbody by curvatured mirrors having surden metallic fine polished surfaces !

and place in vacuum to avoid the "air" to "shortcircuit" the allready by 300 dgr K obtained app 5 dgr K temperature difference from a device app having 3 sgr-inches
BlackBody-plain-surfaces (fine carbon-powder-type)
the mirror-curv-topologics app of curved 15 sqr-inches , alltogether such a device
can be constructed into a 40-cubic-inches volume to place in vacuum !
use very thin Cu-wiring/very small-passive-thermo-resistor coupled to non-current in a outer balancing resistor-measuring bridge !
important to note : the temperature-measuring resistor must not be "heating" the active part of a BlackBody , but must have zero-current by the balancing measuring bridge !
not so tricky to obtain by successive balancing-acts !

have yourself succesfull experiments among of 2.nd-Thermodynamical-Proces--all-solid-state-structures/devices !

Have a nice day and thanks indeed for your weelwritten wordings about your exp , so easily to understand your construction plus measurements ! 

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline lanca II

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 12
Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2006, 06:06:13 PM »
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:PaulL:Thermodynamics
THZ-sphere,f.e.Dr.Helmut Reichelt
T-ray:a-/ether ?

S
  dL

Offline PaulLowrance

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2483
    • Global Free Energy
Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #3 on: August 17, 2006, 06:20:19 PM »
Hi,

Goofy's experiment was really great!  It's nice to see that it works.  For some time I too have been pondering upon the idea of extracting energy from room temperature environment.  Lanca II pointed out my peswiki project:

http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:PaulL:Thermodynamics

I think the purpose of Goofy's experiment was to see if it's possible, but it's really possible to extract even megawatts of power per cubic meter. According to Stefan-Boltzmann law 1 square meter radiates ~460 watts.  This is a very well tested and known law in the science community.  The radiation is in the far infrared range and often called T-rays.

I wrote a computer program that simulated T-rays radiated from a good FIR blackbody inside different shaped reflectors. Aluminum believe it or not is one of the best reflectors in the FIR range at nearly 99% if bare and polished.  The present design of this simulator is only 2D space and therefore the data cannot be taken too seriously until a 3D version is completed. Although it seems very hopeful and confirms Goofy's experiment. The simulation shows that the cone Goofy used would work if the thermometer were placed extending a slight distance away from the end of the cone, which is perhaps where Goofy placed his thermometer.

The present 2D T-ray simulator shows other shapes that are far better for heating up a surface.  The best so far is something close to an inwardly slanted cup, which achieved close to 20% above thermal radiation.  In other words, normally a one square meter of good material radiates nearly 460 watts, so this object would radiate 20% above 460 watts, which is 552 watts.  Since everything else in the room, except transparent objects, radiates roughly 460 watts per m^2 this equates to total of 120 watts of free energy per m^2.

To some people this may not sound like that much power given the size, which according to simulation was 1 meter wide at base, 0.8 meter wide at the top and 1 meter high. Every part of the cup is a made of aluminum except the base is made of a good FIR blackbody material. The simulation used Aluminum as the reflector. The bottom plate is the part that heats up, which may sound contradictory to Goofy's experiment, but the simulation shows exactly why Goofy's experiment also works. This of course is assuming the *2D* simulation version is correct.

So what's the potential of this technology.  By using micro technology it is possible to efficiently extract energy from thousands of thin plates. A plate that's 250 microns thick by 1 meter wide by 1 meter long would generate over 450 watts per side for a total of ~900 watts per sheet.  Stacking multiple plates to 1 meter high gives us 4000 sheets for a total of 3.6 Megawatts!  That's not bad for 1 cubic meter of space, but it's not realistic because we need to circulate air through each plate (which converts ambient temperature to electricity) to keep each plate near room temperature. Remember, if we are converting 900 watts of energy per plate into electricity then each plate will cool down. So we need to keep the plates near room temperature for maximum performance. Therefore, we should separate each plate by perhaps 250 microns, which gives us only 2000 plates per meter high for total of 1.8 megawatts. Even more realistic, given inefficiencies, we could expect as much as 1 megawatt per cubic meter.

I was planning on updating the present 2D T-ray simulator to 3D space, but something really big happened that looks extremely promising. The goal is to perfect a design by early 2007 that anyone can inexpensively build that would generate enough energy for his or her home 24 hours per day, 365 days per year, day and night. Right now it's too early to say just how successful this project will be by next year, but at least this technology is 100% backed by present proven physics; i.e., it is possible!

Paul Lowrance


Offline uberdeity

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2006, 04:13:07 AM »
Hey hey

I hate to be a spoilsport, but if his theory about reflective gold is right - which it appears to be and which I have to reason to disbelieve - then all he's doing is taking the energy available at the big end of the cone and concentrating it on the small end, so he's ending up with a rise as there is a higher concentration of photons at the small end, although the number of photons will be the same as or smaller than the number coming into the big end.

But yeah, it seems a sound enough piece of apparatus. And yes, it also has massive potential for power generation- harnessing the power of the ambient ~300kelvin and focussing it down to a smaller point where it can be used to perform work.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2006, 04:13:07 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline exnihiloest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 716
Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #5 on: August 27, 2006, 11:01:43 AM »
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:PaulL:Thermodynamics
THZ-sphere,f.e.Dr.Helmut Reichelt
T-ray:a-/ether ?

S
  dL

A black body radiates but also absorbs Thz radiations coming from its surrounding environment. Both balance, that's why a black body in a room is at same temperature as the room.
If we place a lense to focuse radiations onto the black body, inversely the black body will radiate more throught the lense.
To get a temperature difference between the black body and its environment or between two black bodies, in order to run a conventional thermal engine, we could produce an anisotropy in the way of the inward/outward radiations but no today's materials permit such things.











Offline PaulLowrance

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2483
    • Global Free Energy
Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #6 on: August 27, 2006, 03:53:23 PM »
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:PaulL:Thermodynamics
THZ-sphere,f.e.Dr.Helmut Reichelt
T-ray:a-/ether ?

S
  dL

A black body radiates but also absorbs Thz radiations coming from its surrounding environment. Both balance, that's why a black body in a room is at same temperature as the room.
If we place a lense to focuse radiations onto the black body, inversely the black body will radiate more throught the lense.
To get a temperature difference between the black body and its environment or between two black bodies, in order to run a conventional thermal engine, we could produce an anisotropy in the way of the inward/outward radiations but no today's materials permit such things.
Hi,

There are various methods that demonstrate this is already possible. Nature is the best example called the Dew Point effect. The clear night sky is 2.7 K, which is why horizontal surfaces cool down at night far faster than vertical surfaces. Also I wrote computer simulation software that showed me exactly how cones and parabolas would work. A lens will also work. If you focus T-rays coming from a square meter of surface onto 0.1 square meters then the 0.1 m^2 surface will become hot.

Although the simulation software is only in 2D space, it confirmed goofy experiment. I believe a 3D version would also confirm.

Presently I am working on technology that will allow T-rays to traverse through a special medium one direction, but reflect the other direction. This will allow up to 900 watts per m^2 of a very thin sheet.

Paul Lowrance

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #6 on: August 27, 2006, 03:53:23 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline goofy

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 2
Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2007, 06:56:24 AM »
>so he's ending up with a rise as there is a higher concentration
>of photons at the small end

Exactly. That's all there is to it. The great solutions are the simplest to understand and take advantage of.

The Dew point effect is what got me investigating this.

>A black body radiates but also absorbs Thz radiations coming
>from its surrounding environment. Both balance, that's why a
>black body in a room is at same temperature as the room.
>If we place a lense to focuse radiations onto the black body,
>inversely the black body will radiate more throught the lense.

>To get a temperature difference between the black body and
>its environment or between two black bodies, in order to run
>a conventional thermal engine, we could produce an anisotropy
>in the way of the inward/outward radiations but no today's
>materials permit such things.

Concentrating the radiation onto the black body will heat it up. As it heats up it will return more and more until what it is returning is equal to what it is receiving. It's in equilibrium. But it's staying hotter, in violation of the second law.

If we set up an arrangement so that it would heat up and reach equalibrium but instead the heat can return more easily to the source through a heat engine, then instead of the heat radiating back it's flowing through a heat engine.

The reason for the funnel is that it's non-directional. The photons are leaving the black body in all directions, not in a steady beam, so a non-directional concentrator is called for. A lense would not work well unless the photon source was an intense point source.

I don't believe that heat engines actually consume heat, the heat just flows through it, but that question is inmaterial to this device. Hotter than ambient is hotter than ambient. If the heat source works then it doesn't matter how the heat engine works.

It's possible that polished aluminum does reflect better that gold. Polished Aluminum is very common compared to gold and I read in the literature about an infared thermometer that it's inaccurate when pointed at polished metal. I presume that you would get a temperature reading from the surfaces reflected in the metal instead of the temperature of the metal.

In future tests I will test both. Maybe they both work well down to a certain temperature and below that you need gold. Maybe aluminum is almost as good but way cheaper. That would be fine. Aluminum can be cheaply bought, shaped and polished.

I feel another experiment coming on.

Offline profitis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3878
Re: Infrared potential
« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2014, 02:01:01 PM »
here is that thread

 

Share this topic to your favourite Social and Bookmark site

Please SHARE this topic at: