@Xbox

Just an FYI:

When hitting a conductive mass with an HV charge consider that mass(the engine) a very large tank circuit. There will be inductive and capacitive reactance to charge. It is very likely the engine is simply absorbing the charge - especially if it is a stream of pulses.
If you get to the point where you are testing with an engine it should probably be a very small one and well insulated from everything including the Earth.

Just a thought. I haven't applied this type of work to and ICE but I do know my sparks 

I find the work here very interesting. If and when I jump in it'll be with a model airplane engine.

@springfield

@anyone
Can someone get me up to speed on the principle at work here? How does the spark extract the energy from the water?
1. When hydrogen combines with oxygen to make water (ie when it burns), energy is released which can be used to power a device, for example some kind of internal combustion engine.
2. To take water and separate its hydrogen from its oxygen, external energy must be supplied, most commonly electrical energy through electrolysis.
3. The amount of energy involved in #1 and #2 above is exactly the same for the same amount of material: in other words there's an exact give-and-take of energy when you go from hydrogen/oxygen to water and back again.
So here's what I don't get: if you start off with water as fuel I don't see how you can extract the energy from it - in fact, you have to put energy IN to separate the hydrogen from the oxygen. So if that's the case, what's the principle at work here that makes this special spark able to get energy from water? Thanks,
-Mike

Now there is a good question   A very wise person I know once said " you cannot build what you do not understand" and I believe this to be true --- so maybe we should explore the mechanism involved in-depth.
Here is what we know-----
- a high tension arc across a gap has little or no effect on water vapor
- a high current flow cannot jump the gap on it's own
- a high tension arc can act as a "conductor" and conduct large current flows across a spark gap
- an electric current can disassociate water into H2 and O2, if the gasses should recombine the same energy required to seperate them will be released.

Here is what has not been mentioned-----
-Water is a condition applied within the confines of a given space, water vapor is water that has it's surface tension released thus energy has been added to it.
-Water vapor is a condition applied within the confines of a given space, water vapor is not liquid water any more than an apple chopped up into a fine powder could be considered an apple. The qualities and properties change drastically, we enter the realm of nano-technology where many small things seperated act very differently than if they were joined together.
-Matter and space are "conditions" dictated by pressure and potential difference, conditions can be changed.

In this device the conditions have changed  A large current flow is forced to jump into an spark gap and apply it's energy to a water vapor already in a high energy state. What you have not considered is the one thing that makes this process work ----- Duration of the applied energy(Time). Matter will absorb energy until it exceeds its boundaries at which point it must "radiate" the energy to maintain its condition or change its condition. The capacitive discharge in the spark gap because it has a very short duration could amount to thousands of KW but only for a small period of time. As Nicola Tesla once said ---" I can charge a capacitor at 200Hp and discharge it at 10,000Hp or 1,000,000Hp"--- only the duration of energy flow has changed. I do not believe there is any "electrolysis" in the reaction in the spark gap,maybe this is an electrostatic event.
I had decided not to mention this but I think it will help you in more ways than you can imagine
Consider a single rock dropped in a pond of water, the rock entering the water is a singular event yet it produces waves in the water. We could say the properties of the waves are determined by the conditions present, that is the velocity of the rock and the density of the water.The water does not radiate outward from the disturbance, energy radiates outward using the water as the means for propogation. Following this line of though we could also say a singular impulsive discharge could produce waves in the "media" of any wavelength but in this case the duration(rate of change) and magnitude of the energy input can determine the properties of the energy and its effects in matter. Your plasma arc discharge produces UV radiation ie... energy radiating outward from a single point--radiant energy, but this is not the only thing it can do.
Best of luck

XBOX Hacker, I Believe your missing a rectifier right after your inverter in your diagram. can't see how else it would actually be a true dc circuit as you discribe. I am not an expert though.

Hi everyone,

Aaron has started a topic at the Energetic Forum of what we are doing here and he is doing a great job sharing our findings.

Here is the link to the topic: http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/2242-water-sparkplug.html

I encourage this to be shared to as many forums as possible, so if you know of other forums please share it there.

Sharing is the key to change.

I'm off to the garage to start building an engine test setup.

Luc

Hi,
I sent an request for this to capacitor 70, but in case I don't get a reply, can anyone confirm the circuit he is using or even better, the schematic?
Re. 2 stroke ICE's (Chainsaws) etc.
Should be OK if you Direct inject above the piston during compression stroke not easy to do. However, I am starting to think that Injection is the way forward for 4 stroke, but I appreciate the usual mechanical complexity of modification.

Here is a theoretical Fuel injection idea to help carb. users meter and vaporize water very easily. Remove the float from the float chamber, replace the cover. Run a pipe from the exhaust to a sealed vessel containing water then another pipe from that vessel to the float chamber's fuel inlet . the exhaust pressure pulse should force the water through the main jet to a vapor, into the venturi.
What is nice about this is. The water pressure increases /decreases relative to the exhaust pressure pulse on demand. a starter motor turning the crank could start the process.

Thanks for listening.

D.

First time I have posted here.
I have been following since this thread since it first started on this forum.
I have built a circuit based off of the picture diagram at the beginning. I'm currently not using my 400w Black and Decker inverter because I can't get more than about 2 or 3 sparks and something trips internally and it shuts itself off. This happens with everything from a 1 microfarad to 150 microfarad capacitor. I gave up on the inverter for now and went to something I know is sure to work. I'm using 110v AC from a wall socket going through 4 60w and 2 75w light bulbs in parallel to give me 390w AC. Wish I could attach a picture but my wife has the digital camera right now. I run this into an 8 amp full wave bridge rectifier. The negative from the bridge goes to ground on the MSD coil, spark plug(motor) ground, and one side of a 135 microfarad capacitor. The positive side of the bridge connects to the spark plug via 16 1N5407 diodes. The output of the coil is connected to the spark plug also. It looks very much like the picture diagram at the front of this post except  where the SPDT switch is I have fabricated a set of points that are operated by a cam lobe collar locked down by a set screw on the output shaft of a Briggs & Stratton 5HP Horizontal shaft engine. So far I've tried timing settings from 40 degrees before top dead center to 60 degrees after top dead center. I haven't been able to get it to run with only water. I can tell you this though- there is no way a normal ignition system would take the amount of water I've run through this engine. It seems to want to try to run on water at low rpm with the throttle valve completely closed.

I have run out of time for now and will be gone for 4 days. Will try again when I get back.

I'd like to mention that there is a big difference I think between the picture diagram and the circuit diagram at the beginning of this post from my point of view. The picture diagram is firing a capacitor THROUGH the coil and the circuit diagram is firing a capacitor ON TOP OF a coil discharge. I think this leaves more to be investigated.

I'd also like to mention that while using this setup the spark plug will fire without being grounded to the circuit. The engine is mounted to wood boards for insulation purposes. I accidentally forget to connect the ground from the circuit to the engine block and the plug still fired. As soon as I touched the motor I got shocked and then figured out I forgot the ground wire. Any explanations on this?

If someone is going to try this be very careful. I don't touch the engine while starting or running it. I turn it over with a 1/3 HP electric motor via a drive belt pulley from a water pump off an old chevy. If you take off the recoil starter and remove the ratchet clutch a water pump pulley will bolt right on with a  fine thread nut. Water pump pulleys are about 6" in diameter. I put a 2" pulley on the electric motor. It turns over great! When the engine starts firing, unplug the electric motor or it pulls down the engine. This way I can turn it over while watching the resistor light bulbs and get an indication of when the plug has cleared itself and starts firing again after being drowned out.

I originally tried turning it over with a 3/4" electric drill but for some reason it caused a full draw on the resistor light bulbs. I guess it was searching for a ground through the drill.

Happy testing everyone!!!!!
God loves you
MIke

I cannot get it to work on the lawnmower. I have the same problem with the test circuit. If I open the LV circuit anywhere then I can get my HV arc. If I don't open the LV circuit I cannot get a HV spark. With the test circuit I had to reverse polarity on the ignition coil to get this to work. I'm sure that's what my problem is on the lawnmower but there is no way to reverse the polarity with a magneto that I know of.

Another thing Ossie told me to check was the polarity of the coil. I did this test with ONLY the HV circuit hooked up. When the diodes are blocking flow from the coil to ground I get no fire, when they are blocking from ground to the coil I get fire. It is this way with the car coil and the lawnmower. Can somebody explain this to me because I thought electricty always flowed from neg to pos but according to that test it is flowing from the coil to ground which would be backwards.

Only thing I know to do is get a lawnmower with points ignition and bypass the magneto and use the points to trigger my car ignition coil so that way I can reverse the polarity on it so it will work. I've yet to have anybody really explain the flow of this circuit so until I understand it then I'm at the mercy of you people that know electricity.

I've tried the string of diodes in every place in the circuit I can think of backwards and forwards and nothing helps.

Hi bumfuzzled and all,

I did some bench tests with a new line trimmer motor yesterday using only water. The motor is a two stroke motor and has a fully enclosed electronic magneto coil. I also found that the pulse coming out of the magneto output was negative. So accordingly I connected the positive of my discharge circuit to the ground of the spark plug, but still I could not get the whole circuit to fire in the open as the ignition spark would not work. I found that I had to put a 12kV microwave oven diode in series with the ignition coil/magneto's output such that it was connected to and pointing to the magneto's output lead. This fixed the problem and now the circuit fires just fine in the open.

Because the HV pulse is essentialy the back emf from the ignition coil/magneto, there is a smaller pulse of the opposite polarity just preceding it which is the power pulse the coil needs to have to create a back emf, by not having the 12kV diode, it seems that the discharge circuit shorts out this preceding power pulse and that is why it needs a diode in series with the output of the ignition coil/magneto and still be able to create the required ignition spark.

The first thing I found was that the discharge circuit would not fire inside the cylinder. I could tell this by looking at my ammeter connected to the input of the inverter. capacitor70 used a household light bulb connected in series with the 240V section of his discharge circuit which also provides a very good indication if the discharge is occurring in the cylinder or not as there is no other way to know this, unless the motor runs. After a considerable amount of test and diagnostics, I found that for some reason, perhaps even because of the water vapour, that the ignition spark was too week to occur and allow the discharge circuit to fire inside the cylinder for the spark gap size I was using. Reducing the spark gap did resolve this problem to a point, as I found that it needed to be reduced so much as that now it is prone to getting clogged with water very easily. But also, a reduced gap does not appear to be benificial to the plasma water explosion as indicated by outside tests. Larger spark gaps appear to cause larger explosions.

All up after numerous trials I found that I was only able to get the motor to fire with water only once. By fire I mean one explosion pushing the piston down once in the correct direction and not running. I also found that a number of times I could feel the motor fire as a pressure in the reverse direction on the pull cord. This is indicative that the timing appears to be advanced from TDC so if this is the case, then there is no way for me to adjust the timing on this motor as it has a fixed magneto, without modification to the design and ignition system of the motor. To get the motor to fire just once on this motor it required me to use 310uf of capacitance in the discharge circuit. Firing this amount of charge out in the open with water sprayed on the spark plug sounds like a gunshot, I can tell you!

There is also quite alot of work to be done in regard to the air/waterfuel mixture required. But this can only be explored once the motor can be setup to fire regularly. So from my initial tests, I see more advantages in doing this on a larger 4 stroke motor with a stronger ignition system and variable control of the timing and air/waterfuel mixture.

Please see the following pictures of my setup.

Regards,

Ossie

That motor setup was NOT a failure, look what you learned!!!!!  Most impressive........I bet your next one WILL work....That 35 degrees AFTER TDC looks more and more like a viable setting.

Ben