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Author Topic: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power  (Read 610958 times)

Offline ravzz

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #15 on: August 21, 2007, 09:32:38 AM »
Hi Wiz,

I've used 1.2mm dia SS 316L wirer to connect the pipes....so if you have seen video 6....im doing exactly what you suggested....connecting 4 sq mm copper wires upto the bottom of the WFC....the leads are resin bonded to the WFC casing to prevent leaks...so at present im trying to reduce the length of the leads up until the bottom of the WFC...some of the leads have started leaking now so this needs to be rectified first.

Any Ideas on why the efficiencies coming down when higher amps are given to the freq gen?


Ravi

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline ravzz

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #16 on: August 21, 2007, 10:19:56 AM »
Hi everyone,

Panacea-Bocaf is in the process of independently replicating what Dave and I have replicated with our inputs. Will keep you posted on this. The intention being to simplify and get a better understanding of the whole process for everyone to easily replicate the system.

Ravi




Offline rapttor

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #17 on: August 21, 2007, 04:52:18 PM »
Ravzz great to see someone is working at deciphering what Meyer did, his patent is so convoluted & shrouded in uneccessary jargon that once broken down and interpretted to current  electronics of the present day, It becomes apparent that it much more simple in design, the theory & how it really works I think is still something to be understood better.

Do You know of hydrocar's work? I've built the circuit that powers this cell, and blows me away with the little current it draws to produce this volume of gas.

Ravzz, keep up the hard work, it's paying off... thanks for sharing with us.

dyamios, care to elaborate on this one for us... I'm all ears and would love to understand it better sir, see link below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGk6KOImmkk

Regards,
-rapttor

Offline Unicron

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #18 on: August 21, 2007, 05:12:54 PM »
@rapttor

in this thread it gets explained! (from the creator himself)
http://waterfuelcell.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=454


Offline tinu

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2007, 07:11:33 PM »
Ravi,

What is the power you put in as pure dc?
(I mean before the oscillator and everything.)

Tx,
Tinu

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2007, 07:11:33 PM »
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Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2007, 08:07:58 PM »
He is using:


http://panaceauniversity.org/D14.pdf

The circuit given on page 7 with the inductors is what gives the highest efficiencies. The inductor on both positive and negative is a must. Why would you want to build one with the alternator? from what I can remember the page 7 circuit doesnt have an alternator and you can power the circuit with a DC 10A coverter like I did or use a plain heavy duty battery for getting the output. If you want to experiment with the other circuits in the document then its ok.... Good luck!!

There is another difference that needs to be noted compared to Dave's Replication. I didnt remember the exact gap between the pipes till patrick just asked me what were the differences between my setup....sat down and calculated....

The gap in between the pipes was:

Outer Pipe OD : 25.317 mm
Thickness : 14 SWG or 2.032 mm

Outer Pipe ID : 25.317 - (2.032 x2) = 21.253mm


Inner Pipe OD : 19.930 mm
Thickness : 14 SWG or 2.032 mm

Gap is 1.323mm ( 21.253 - 19.930 )

and this adjusted to both the sides as the inside pipe is centered is

1.323/2 = 0.6615 mm on either sides of the inner tube.

So effectively the gap between the pipes is less than 0.670 mm

I went for a lesser gap by increasing the thickness of the outer tube.
If you go through Stans Canadian Patent he mentions that the lesser
the gap between the pipes more the efficiency

I had a lot of difficulty in the alignment of pipe as they were
shorting. Had to get them straightened on pipe alignment machine.
Wouldnt advice people without engineering skills to go for this small
a gap.

The higher output of my setup could be due to the smaller gap aswell.
==========================

Posted by Kumaran :

Hi Ravi,

According to my calculation you got 644.62% OU.

Liter : 16.776
Seconds : 3600
LPM : 0.2796

Voltage : 12
Amp : 0.51
Watts : 6.12

Your cell efficiency : 0.36 Wh/L
Faraday efficiency : 2.3516 Wh/L (varies depending to atm pressure)

OU : 644.62%

No doubt on efficiency. Just need to push the system a little bit further to produce more gas while maintaining the efficiency. Great job.
_________________
Regards,
Kumaran



======================


So all in all this is a very nice cell !

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2007, 08:10:34 PM »
So any cell that is needing less than about 2.4 Watthours of energy
for 1 Liter of HHO production is overunity
as this is the Faraday law.

Ravi?s setup is thus way overunity.
I will post the formular to calculate this in another thread.

Regards, Stefan.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2007, 11:33:50 PM by hartiberlin »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2007, 08:10:34 PM »
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Offline TheCell

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2007, 10:09:06 PM »
@wizkycho2

A Series oscillatory circuit draws the maximum current when in resonance.
Believe me , I am an Engineer of electronics.
A paralell oscillatory circuit will draw the least current when in resonance.
You can prove it using Electronics Workbench Simulation Tool.

The higest current means NOT the highest power input.
Because alternating current and voltage is used , you must multiply in short time steps the volts

and amps (take care of the sign) . And for a whole loop you will get allmost 0 power input.
In resonance the energy is alternating between the capacitor and the coil.
The small amount of energy to put in , is only needed to compensate the power losses.
(The capacitor has a paralell resistor , the inductance isself has a series resistor)

@ravzz

I am missing a resistor paralell to the cell, what meyer called the 'current inhibitor resistor'.
Without that the cell won't discharge, the voltage will get to the 12 Volts input, and remain

there.(using the above metioned simulation tool)
You don't use such a resistor ?
Then I think the cell discharges itself; water is not a so good dielectricum , while the voltage
drops down to 0, the cell has the chance to discharge.

First Meyer was talking about a resonant step charging effekt.
Varios voltage levels that step by step will tare apart the water molecules.
With using inductivities in series you will get so high alternating voltage levels ,
that will surely overide this small step charging levels.

So I am nearly convinced , that periodic high voltage peaks will make a efficient electrolysis.

Please ravzz measure the voltage of your cell with an oszilloscope and a voltage devider. There will be 1000V - 3000V , so take care!
We would like to examine the main function of the circuit.

Offline ravzz

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #23 on: August 22, 2007, 07:57:49 AM »
Thecell:

I'm using Nichrome 80/20 Resistance Alloy wire in 1.6 mm diameter as the variable resistor. This has resistance of 0.52 Ohms/mt. I remember mentioning this on the oupower discussion board....but i dont think I mentioned the grade or size of the resistance wire used over there. The efficiency of the cell comes down initially if I dont use it for about three to four days but about ten to fifteen minutes after its switched on it gets back to the higher efficiencies. Is this what you meant by cell discharge.

If you go through Stan's patent 4,798,661 on page2 Figure 1 these variable resitors are designated by the numbers 60a to 60n which are individually connected to each of the inner tubes.

I have not tried the immersed excitor array in figure 1 this could probably increase the efficiency even more!

There should be very high voltage at the cell as I remeber Dave saying something about seeing a glow from between the tubes when WFC is run in the dark.....could be HV discharging.....I havent checked for this though...




Rapttor:

Check the following link of the same setup where you can see the input amps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ugd2HFmNL3k




Tinu:

Yes I used 12 Volt  10 Amp  AC to DC coverter as the input to the Freq generator and the reading you see in the videos are the current draw from this converter (the wires are the input leads of the freg gen).




Unicron:


Hydro seems to be doing some thing else altogether on the electronics side but using pipes to generate H2....looks like hydro's on to something new!!

Offline tinu

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #24 on: August 22, 2007, 08:36:31 AM »

Rapttor:

Check the following link of the same setup where you can see the input amps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ugd2HFmNL3k


Tinu:

Yes I used 12 Volt  10 Amp  AC to DC coverter as the input to the Freq generator and the reading you see in the videos are the current draw from this converter (the wires are the input leads of the freg gen).

Hi Ravi,

"This video has been removed by the user."
Another available link?

Tx,
Tinu

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #24 on: August 22, 2007, 08:36:31 AM »
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Offline ravzz

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #25 on: August 22, 2007, 11:57:15 AM »
Not just that even the link you posted has been removed by the user!! I saw it a little while ago1

Whats Happening???????



'Water Fuel Cell blast' was the name of the video on youtube.

Description of the video:
120v to 25v step down transformer, primary amp pull AC .80 amps. Secondary DC pull 3 amps. Heat issue if ran over 1 min.

The generation in both the videos looked the same except that he shows the amp meter showing around 0.82 Amps.


You could visit his forum postings on the link after yours.


Ravi

Offline ravzz

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #26 on: August 22, 2007, 12:01:07 PM »
The link to hydrocars postings forum is

http://waterfuelcell.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=454


Offline NerzhDishual

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #27 on: August 22, 2007, 02:05:33 PM »
@Harti_Berlin

Do you mean 2.4 Ampere/hour?

2 moles of electrons for one mole (22.4 liter) of H2.
2*96500= 193000 coulomb for 22.4 liters.
193000/3600/22.4 = 2.4 amp/hour for one liter.

You need more than one volt (theorically 1.23 volts but in practice almost 1.6 volts). This 'leads out' to about 2.4* 1.6 =/= 4 watts/hour for one liter (or 4 kWh per cubic meter) of h2.  Leads it out not?

According to Kanarev:
Quote
"The most modern Electrolyzers consume 4.0 kWh per cubic meter of this gas.
Electrolysis process takes place by voltage of 1.6-2.0 V and current strength of
dozens and hundreds of amperes. When one cubic meter of hydrogen is burnt, 3.55
kWh of energy is released."
http://www.guns.connect.fi/innoplaza/energy/story/Kanarev/electrolysis/index.html


BTW: This is not a skeptic remark. I'm convinced  that COP >1 ('overunity') electrolysis is possible.

Best




Offline ravzz

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #28 on: August 22, 2007, 03:12:03 PM »
Faraday's is 2.4 watts / hour / liter.


Volts x Amps = Watts

12 x 0.51 = 6.12 watts
the generation is around 7 cc/sec of H2 + O2

This converts to 4.66 CC of H2/sec

which converts to 16.776 Lits / hour

16.776 x 2.4 watts (Faraday/lit/hour generation) = 40.262 Watts


Well I seem to be generating the equivalent of 40.2 watts as per Faraday with just 6.12 Watts.........I hope this answers Kumaran's question aswell.

I dont know if im right but I seem to be generating 550% excess

as the above works out to 40.2/6.12 x 100 = 656.86%

656.86 - 100 (Faraday) = 556.86% OU !!

Correct me if im wrong with the calculations.



I remember watching on one of Stan Meyer Videos where they mention the Output to be over 1700% faradays....I guess there's more work needed to be done in this direction.

Dave's unit was 250% OU mine looks a little higher....one of the reasons I think is because my unit is comparitively bigger 9" length 9 tubes compared to Dave's 5" length 6 tubes. Stans was 18"length 9 tubes...double the size of my WFC.

Another reason for higher efficiency could be Dave's gap between the tubes was 1/16" or 1.5875 mm and mine was lesser at less than 0.670 mm....calculations posted by Stefan above.


{For pictures of the Pipe sizes check next page, the pics were posted on 25th Aug 2007.}



I'm using individual leads to each pipe in the WFC.

these I remember now. will post if I remember some more.

Ravi
« Last Edit: August 25, 2007, 09:55:21 AM by ravzz »


Offline rapttor

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Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #29 on: August 22, 2007, 10:01:16 PM »
@rapttor

in this thread it gets explained! (from the creator himself)
http://waterfuelcell.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=454



@ unicron, I know... I was specifying someone in particular who I see has remained silent, no big deal, thanks for the reply.

-rapttor

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Stanley Meyer replication with low input power
« Reply #29 on: August 22, 2007, 10:01:16 PM »

 

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