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Mechanical free energy devices => mechanic => Topic started by: dan on May 02, 2005, 09:57:50 PM
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has anyone built a rotoverter? what are the better ways to do so? does it work as advertised? who has ways that failed? (no use in anyone repeating ways that failed.)? and who has better ideas to make this work easier/better?
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What's a rotoverter?
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Think that is the thing Hecktor :o is trying to sell. Hear it doesn't work either
least not OU style.
sugra
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the plans are for a 7hp motor and a 3hp motor to be connected and it is to run an alternator.
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hi.. there's a rotoverter video, a rotoverter manual, and a rotoverter wiki-page posted with replications by various people (including norman wootan).
googlevideo, 40minutes:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6905677911913482159 (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6905677911913482159)
rotoverter /zpe manual:
http://rootof.info/distro/RE-OU-v6_1.pdf (http://rootof.info/distro/RE-OU-v6_1.pdf)
rotoverter page on peswiki
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Rotoverter (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Rotoverter)
rotoverter page on panacea:
http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm (http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm)
from the previous overunity messages it seems that there is a misunderstanding going on, with people thinking that hector "sells" instructions. i havent paid for any of this information, and there are replications of it. please do check this stuff out. he just stuck his head out and posted about it on the "inconvenient truth"-forum.. if you know what that is :)
hope you guys are fine.. i would be more than glad to find out if any of you build this thing and therefore make your own replication.. would be great.
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replications by various people
The only replication where someone claims overunity is from 2002 - and that person is still alive (as far as I know), and hasn't built a bigger unit to power his house, so...
I'm waiting for someone to replicate this device, who gets overunity with it, and whose results are double-checked by someone else skilled at power measurement, that has the proper equipment for power measurement. Some digital meters are very inaccurate when used to measure weird waveforms.
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Greetings Esa, Dan, Charlie and Fred.
First of all Thanks to Esa! ;D
Now there is alot of newbees starting to learn the RV's practical power managment and can apply it in real life, you have to start with an understanding of avoiding energy wastage (as stated by Hector) before you can get a system of OU. The RV is your best chance to learn and apply this, try it in the Lab and you will see.
This is real life open sourced, Fred it is not as easy to power your home with a OU device and go public.
Im sure Norm who also has the MRA (256-1 OU) could power his own home, but what would happen to him?. Dont worry about reading signs like this try the lab work your selfs.
Visit the panacea site and sign the petitions, also we wil have an RV drill on TV next year, all open sourced.
There is no money going on, just replicaitons.
And the NWO becoming more uinerable to the collective efforts...
Any questions ill be happy to answer. Thanks man (Esa)
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Hi epi / ashtweth nihilistic
Whats going down Bro?? You said a while ago on "Besslerwheel.com" that you'll have a slot on channel nine (60 minutes??) Sydney Australia regarding some free energy device's.........are you still with us bro??? .....I have another few years to wait, no probs mate! .......lol.....can't hardly wait
As George Knunstler would say,
"The future has begun" ......(I'd throttle his little neck if I could) !!!!!
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hahar, hey mate!! yep as soon as we get the proto types up to scratch we are on 60 minutes, its time to take OU and energy suppression to the mainstream.
we will be on brisy extra in FEB, befire then with an energy saving RV drill.
check out this site and drop me an email one day mate,
hey every one sevich does gravity wheel R and D, sign up on our site so we can provide help in grants when and where we can.
check out this page mate,
http://www.panacea-bocaf.org
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Fred it is not as easy to power your home with a OU device and go public.
If you have an OU device capable of powering a home then mount a couple of cheap solar panels on your roof, put a small windmill in your backyard, and use them as camouflage for the OU device, and go off-grid.
You could go 'public' by anonymously publishing the plans, with photos, in any number of places on the Internet.
Im sure Norm who also has the MRA (256-1 OU)
Has anyone other than Norm, that has the proper power measurement tools and expertise, measured the output of his OU devices? From what I've read, these devices produce out-of-phase non-sinusoidal waveforms, and a lot of digital amp/volt meters produce inaccurate readings with out-of-phase non-sinusoidal waveforms.
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new rotoverter video posted. this time its some shots of the bellerian rv replication.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=6z2pfnswn40 (http://youtube.com/watch?v=6z2pfnswn40)
"Bellerians RV replica output to 2x 60watt 120V bulbs in serial"
"Still have yet to get shots of the paralleled bulbs being driven at full output versus the serial rig that was only pushing 160 or so volts thru both in series. Hopefully over the next week or so... I also have the 17.5uF caps to work the diode plug adaptation... so will try and get on that this week as well."
hope this helps.
enjoy!
btw, i always thought norman wootan was trustworthy - and wouldnt make a mess out of measuring.
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Im sure Norm who also has the MRA (256-1 OU)
Has anyone other than Norm, that has the proper power measurement tools and expertise, measured the output of his OU devices? From what I've read, these devices produce out-of-phase non-sinusoidal waveforms, and a lot of digital amp/volt meters produce inaccurate readings with out-of-phase non-sinusoidal waveforms.
this is the response i got:
"RV is Out of phase sine wave "RF" and is metered easy ...
people just need to know a fact ...
A meter acts on energy input as any other device ...
The same thing that can make a meter pop its glass off scale can also
make your home toaster burn the bread .
You only need to tune your toaster to it !"
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The only replication where someone claims overunity is from 2002 - and that person is still alive (as far as I know), and hasn't built a bigger unit to power his house, so...
another response from the list:
First thing to say is for him is to do the tests himself to find out.
It only takes a few hours to convert an AC motor to RV mode and dozens of people just on this board (evgray) have done it.
Running any good AC ammeter in line from house power will give you the right amps reading without argument from any engineer once they do the tests themselves...and if the engineer wants to compare and verify the AC readings, then run a 12V battery into any DC-AC invertor, and run the RV off the invertor, then measure the DC into the invertor and you will get the same watts input less loss of particular invertor...
Cant get much simpler than that...dont have to worry about powerfactor or any 3ph equations with battery-invertor powered RV.
Lots of people on the net like to convince others they know lots about something, but in the case of RV you have to do the tests yourself to understand how it really is....laziness and ego-
based "cant ever be wrong" attitudes are only thing to stop you since AC 3ph motors are dime a dozen.
I have a 1/3hp AC motor working as a lawnmower right now, but if you take off the blade and let it run off the "perfect" UF size run cap (17uf in this case) the motor accelerates and accelerates way past its normal "idle" AC sine wave rpm and as it accelerates, the draw in amps goes DOWN lower and lower....you have to pull the plug at the house power socket of the motor, or eventually it will explode...(deliverance) got one to blow - he tried to stop the accelerating
by jamming in some more run caps, and boom. This is more evidence of OU operation in "resonance" mode in RV... just needs to be controlled.
Whether anyone else has or hasnt repeated NormsW way-succesful PMI servo motor as generator tests is not impoertant - those tests are real, and overunity too by good margin...and have been on the net for years and he just doesnt want to believe it.
Best thing to say to critics who insist OU is not possible, because it hasnt been proven to them, is YOU prove it to me that it is not possible and throw ball in their court. They cant prove it, so
everything they say comes back "three times the pain" (Jimi Hendrix - machinegun - 1970)
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Hi Esaruoho,
Are you the person on the youtube video demonstrating the RV motors?
I was thinking that this would be a great idea to use in conjunction with the water hammer device.
The water hammer needs very little torque, just lots of RPMs.
Because of the size of the rotor in the water hammer, you need a fairly chunky motor, like the ones you have been showing.
Now what if you couple the efficiency of a free wheeling 3 PH motor with a water hammer that is claimed to be 160% efficient?
Hot water, steam and lots of it, use it for heating, cooking, washing, tumble dryer etc.
Regards
Rob
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kingrs. im not bellerian. link me to waterhammerdevice.
http://rootof.info/distro/RVTestingBasedOnDeliveranceOptions1and2.doc (http://rootof.info/distro/RVTestingBasedOnDeliveranceOptions1and2.doc)
RV Testing Based on Deliverance Options 1 and 2 by bellerian.
this should explain the deliverance rotoverter further.
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Hi Esaruoho,
Are you the person on the youtube video demonstrating the RV motors?
I was thinking that this would be a great idea to use in conjunction with the water hammer device.
The water hammer needs very little torque, just lots of RPMs.
Because of the size of the rotor in the water hammer, you need a fairly chunky motor, like the ones you have been showing.
Now what if you couple the efficiency of a free wheeling 3 PH motor with a water hammer that is claimed to be 160% efficient?
Hot water, steam and lots of it, use it for heating, cooking, washing, tumble dryer etc.
Regards
Rob
Kingrs
I have been thinking this same exact thing. I have been suscribed to the evgray group for some time now and what they have been doing is fantastic. I have a 10 HP motor here at work that I will be turning into RV. I plan on using the water hammer like what Griggs has to make steam. Then with the steam you could run a steam engine like the one from this link http://www.greensteamengine.com/ to make electricty. My only problem is I don't have the equipment to make the water hammer so I am working with a friend to see what I can come up with. If you couple the efficiency of the RV and the water hammer IMHO you could have a very cheap way to power your home.
Best wishes
Mike
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This type of thought has enabled many independent replicators to find further applicaitons and imporive their R and D. The RV is the RV, its what you can do with it by your own applicaiton that counts.
And this is thinking in the right directrion, apply it and imporive it will give you the options to do it, main thing also is to support it and sign the petitions on this page please (to support the RV's energy savings)
http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm
Guys please report your success and description so we can help and improve. After the New year im testing Norm set up, we have more efficient double coiled RV motos then Norm to try, if you dont have Double coiled mortors, we still can HALF the input down by using a circuit in the compilations on the NPO page
Here-
http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RV%20energy%20saving%20applications%20and%20R%20and%20D.doc
And here
http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/Advanced%20RV%20Research%20and%20development.doc
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"The water hammer needs very little torque, just lots of RPMs."
Both of the statments above by kingrs are wrong about the torque and RPM. It's info like that, that makes it harder to build a machine because it's not going to work if it's underpowered or over over rev'ed. Then in the next sentence kingrs states that "Because of the size of the rotor in the water hammer, you need a fairly chunky motor, like the ones you have been showing." It's got to be one way or the other. Which is it? ???
Dave
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kingrs. im not bellerian. link me to waterhammerdevice.
http://rootof.info/distro/RVTestingBasedOnDeliveranceOptions1and2.doc (http://rootof.info/distro/RVTestingBasedOnDeliveranceOptions1and2.doc)
RV Testing Based on Deliverance Options 1 and 2 by bellerian.
this should explain the deliverance rotoverter further.
heres some further comments from bellerian:
"The deliverance testing reported in this doc was not setup using pulsed timed discharging via SCR's timed from an inverter, but was direct output, constant feed, with nothing other than the phase adjustment due the passive components in the setup. (well and the rheostat used to trim voltage on the FWBR setup, that could have been removed from the diode plug setup.)
A comment on the diode plug setup, it seems like it may work better if the cumulative C1 was replaced with ONLY C2/C3 as the parallel tank caps and then add the extra two diodes on the opposing caps fed over to the Top A and B output drops that are DC effectively due the charge blocking diode arrangement. Adding the extra two diodes in addition to those shown in the Option 1 of the Deliverance schematic added between 20-30volts more on output from the diode plug setup.
The FWBR setup seems to show the best output to input ratio, easily powering the 2 x 60watt 120vac bulbs in parallel with 152VDC in the tank circulating 3.4-3.6amps while the input from the mains was at 120VAC 1.9-2.1amps. I think I could have added two more bulbs in parallel to be close to drawing the voltage down to a reasonable level where the rheostat could be removed.
This all can likely be improved by building and using the zero time pulse discharge phase coupled to the AC being supplied by an inverter."
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Hi Dave,
"The water hammer needs very little torque, just lots of RPMs."
Both of the statments above by kingrs are wrong about the torque and RPM. It's info like that, that makes it harder to build a machine because it's not going to work if it's underpowered or over over rev'ed. Then in the next sentence kingrs states that "Because of the size of the rotor in the water hammer, you need a fairly chunky motor, like the ones you have been showing."
Sorry, I wrote that without checking the facts first. It was just an idea thats all.
After visiting some of the sites mentioned above:
http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm
states the RV motor can run a generator (RV) at over unity.
So it looks very promising.
Regards
Rob
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Hi Rob
I'd never heard of the RV motor before yesterday. But I have built the Griggs hydrosonic pump.(water hammer). And I liked your idea of combining the both. I believe it will work. Think I'll keep a closer eye on this thread.
Have a good day!!
Dave
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Hi Dave,
But I have built the Griggs hydrosonic pump.(water hammer).
Ahh, I sort of knew you had when I saw your reply.
Couple of questions:
When I emailed Hydro Dynamics about their shock wave pump in January this year, I assume this is the same as the Griggs Hydrosonic pump, I asked if the pump was capable of operating at over-unity.
Their reply was:
Dear Rob,
Our ShockWave Power Reactor is very efficient, but still is less than 100%.
Please, go to our website for more information. www.hydrodynamics.com
Regards,
Bijan Kazem
Have you found it to generate more heat than the energy used to turn the rotor?
Regards
Rob
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Hi Rob
Hydro Dynamics and Griggs Hydrosonic pump are basicaly all the same thing. I read somewhere on the net that Griggs argued with a couple of testers of his pump that it was not over unity even tho they said it was. I give Griggs alot of credit for that. I don't think he would tell anyone it was OU even if he knew it was way OU. That way he can stay in business with no questions asked. ;)
And No I have not got my setup finished yet so don't know what kind of heat to energy ratio I have yet.
Later
Dave
PS We've almost turned this thread into hydrosonic ;D
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so, what did anyone think of that bellerian replication video?
or the norman wootan OU RV results?
do let me know.
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Hi esaruoho,
so, what did anyone think of that bellerian replication video?
or the norman wootan OU RV results?
Yes, fascinating, I could not find a video of the closed loop RV though.
I would be keen to give the OU setup a try but for the fact I am on the brink of testing the MEG device for the first test run.
I looked at the cost of a 3 phase motor (1HP) and they can be bought off ebay for about 80 GBP, also I looked at the price of a 3kW 110/240v generator suitable for connecting to a petrol engine for about the same price.
So its fairly cheap and I am fine with the electronics side of things.
I have a 1400W inverter (old APC UPS).
If the MEG does not work out then I am keen to give this a go.
Who knows, maybe the MEG may benefit from some of the ideas used in a single phase RV set-up.
Regards
Rob
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What's a rotoverter?
from http://peswiki.com/index.php/OS:Rotoverter (http://peswiki.com/index.php/OS:Rotoverter)
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Image:D2_rotoverter01.JPG (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Image:D2_rotoverter01.JPG)
The output device is an alternator which is driven by a three-phase mains-powered, 3 HP to 7.5 HP motor (both of these devices can be standard 'asynchronous squirrel-cage' motors). The drive motor is operated in a highly non-standard manner. It is a 240V motor with six windings as shown below. These windings are connected in series to make an arrangement which should require 480 volts to drive it, but instead, it is fed with 120 volts of single-phase AC. The input voltage for the motor, should always be a quarter of its rated operational voltage. A virtual third phase is created by using a capacitor which creates a 90-degree phase-shift between the applied voltage and the current.
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Image:D2_rotoverter02.JPG (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Image:D2_rotoverter02.JPG)
The objective is to tune the motor windings to give resonant operation. A start-up capacitor is connected into the circuit using the press-button switch shown, to get the motor up to speed, at which point the switch is released, allowing the motor to run with a much smaller capacitor in place. Although the running capacitor is shown as a fixed value, in practice, that capacitor needs to be adjusted while the motor is running, to give resonant operation. For this, a bank of capacitors is usually constructed, each capacitor having its own ON/OFF switch, so that different combinations of switch closures give a wide range of different overall values of capacitance. With the six capacitors shown above, any value from 0.5 microfarad to 31.5 microfarad can be rapidly switched to find the correct resonant value. These values allow combined values of 0.5, 1.0, 1.5, 2.0, 2.5, 3.0, 3.5, ... by selecting the appropriate switched to be ON or OFF. Should you need a value greater than this, then wire a 32 microfarad capacitor in place and connect the substitution box across it to test higher values step-by-step to find the optimum value of capacitor to use. The capacitors need to be powerful, oil-filled units with a high voltage rating - in other words, large, heavy and expensive. The power being handled in one of these systems is large and setting one up is not without a certain degree of physical danger. These systems have been set to be self-powered but this is not recommended, presumably because of the possibility of runaway with the output power building up rapidly and boosting the input power until the motor burns out.
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i came across that piece of data from an older pdf. hope this helps.
i showed that pdf, to a friend of mine, who jsut said this:
"this is one of the coolest hacks i've ever seen"
"modifying a system to work in a manner different than what was originally intended so like modifying a motor to be a generator"
me: thats what the rotoverter is?
"the key to the RV is turning the stator around
the rest is just to get the electrical current in a usable form
the thing with the capacitors is to tune for power output
and the alternator is a generic way to produce AC, it's basically the same thing as in a car, in a car you have a belt spin the wheel of the alternator and the alternator makes AC
in RV the PM spins the shaft of the alternator and the alternator makes AC
AC then powers your appliances
if you wanted mechanical work, like powering a car you don't need the alternator
you can hook up the shaft to the wheels for example"
hopethis helps.
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Hello to all the RV guys.
I did a lot of reading on the RV on Dr. Adams's web site and his pdf file but for a non-electronic person, although good with complicated mechanical and logic systems, unfortunately reading his information was like getting a Vulcan mind meld. So many ideas being thrown around that I just got totally lost. So my question is simple. Can RV be applied to strictly DC Prime Movers and Generators and if yes, how? I am currently working on an RV system but with DC motors. If my Prime Mover can consume less current, and, if RV can enable the generator to develop less drag, this would be very useful to my system. It is currently loosing about 0.1 volts DC every 4-5 minutes and I am sure it is because of the drag on the generator side, and probably over consumption on the Prime Mover side.
Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
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Yes there are many mutations you can build with the RV and DC.
ill direct you to both these compilations
on this page scroll down and look for
) RV energy saving research and development (5MB)-----<<<<<(DC design in there)
3) Advanced RV research and development (5MB)-------<<<(vulcen logic there ;D)
http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm
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Hello to all the RV guys.
I did a lot of reading on the RV on Dr. Adams's web site and his pdf file
which url is this dr.adams website on? does it have lots of rotoverter info?
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No RV info on Dr adams site, ;) We have a document in the RVreplication yahoo file section that has an Adam idea, under fisher and paykel.
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two new videos posted (well, they're old). by hector..
http://youtube.com/watch?v=FjiQ-sAdmEI (http://youtube.com/watch?v=FjiQ-sAdmEI)
1000 watt light load test with RotoVerter by Hector
http://youtube.com/watch?v=XC2k2um--xM (http://youtube.com/watch?v=XC2k2um--xM)
virtual circulating current with RotoVerter by Hector
also i've done some snooping around on jlnlabs, and found the norman wootan posts about rotoverter. here are some excerpts:
Mon Feb 25, 2002 1:10 am
Here is the verification that you have been waiting for. Per our off line dialog here is the set up for my rotaryverter so others may duplicate what we have seen.
Motor is 3HP, 3 Phase, 60HZ, 1725 RPM, wired for operation on 480V.
Motor free running, tuned to minimum current draw from 120V line input required 20mfd 370V oil filled cap resulting with a current draw of .66 amps @ 120VAC input.
Motor loaded with belt drive stepup 6:1 ratio to drive a PMI disk PM, DC motor acting as a generator. (generator unloaded) required 30 mfd, 370V oil filled cap with a resulting current draw of .50 amps @ 120VAC input.
Now I loaded the DC generator with 160 watt incandescent lamp load.
Now things get more interesting. Since I have two independent systems here, one being driven with 120VAC line input and the other system a belt driven DC generator being loaded with pure resistive load. Well here are the numbers: Motor was retuned for minimum current draw which required 45 mfd, 370V oil filled cap with a resulting current draw of .15 amps @ 120VAC input. The independent generator put out .75 amps @ 74 VDC into a resistive load.
The only thing that needs to be looked at on the input side of the equation is the power factor of the AC input. I need to find my tectronics current probe for my scope to look at the current/ voltage phase relationship. I'm satisfied with the figures that I calculate which shows roughly 18 watts AC input with a DC output of 55.5 watts. What I find most interesting is the fact that the more load you put on the 3 phase motor the lower the input current draw and the motor gets colder. The belt driven DC generator gets quite hot after about 30 minutes of running time. Go figure it out.
I believe there is a lot to be learned about revolving magnetic fields in 3 phase motors and tunning the output via capacitors. This experiment is so easy to do everyone should seriously look at this phenomenon. My next step is to document PF on input and improve the DC side of the circuit to provide more loading.
By the way, all measurements were made with four each Fluke 87E meters which I believe to be fairly reliable on 60HZ and DC measurements. Nothing exotic here. Only PF to be determined.
Norm
Thu Feb 28, 2002 2:51 am
Q:* What was the make and model # of your 3 phase motor? Any photo's? How did you tune to determine the capacitors needed? Looking forward to the results of your PF measurements.
A:o The motor is a General Electric, Mod. 5K49ZG1759, 3 HP, 3 phase, 230/460 V, 1725 RPM, 9.2/4.6 amp, SF 1.0, 56 frame.
A:o An 80 mfd cap is used to start the motor (aprox. 2 sec.). Tuning is via changing the value of the run capacitor. Attach neutral line to L1, attach line hot (120V.) to L2 and attach your run cap between L2 and L3. For starting, momentairly parallel the run cap with the 40mfd start cap. Any 3 phase motor will work if it has the high voltage winding(460/480V). Norm
Mon Mar 4, 2002 4:20 pm
Hi! Uli: When you are working with a resonant circuit you have X-L component and an X-C component. Tuning means that we are changing the value of the capacitance (X-C) to cancel reactance (X-L) so that the motor windings represent a pure resistive load. You have to tune a resonant circuit by changing the value of either reactance or capacitance. <g> Norm
all these, and more, are linked from
http://peswiki.com/index.php/OS:Rotoverter (http://peswiki.com/index.php/OS:Rotoverter)
hope this helps.
.. surely SOMEONE has a 3-phase AC motor (or two) sitting around in their homes??
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www.byronwine.com/files/plans.pdf
something about rotoverter,
but also the MRA and the right measurement !
S
dL
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Hi Lanca and all,
The file you include in the link is version 2.5 from 2004.
Since then the recent advancements have been included in another PDF file, version 6.1 from 2006, see this link (2MByte filesize): http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RE-OU-v6_1.pdf
rgds
Gyula
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has anyone on overunity started to replicate the rotoverter?
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RotoVerter replications
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications)
have fun
more will be added
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I have had a private email conversation with Brian D. Prater
and he is saying, that he has a closed loop selfrunning
lawn mower built on the rotoverter principle.
Here is the email exchange with him and a ZIP folder
with a few drawings.
He will try to upload soon a video for us all to see it:
--- overunity2001 <harti@harti.com> wrote:
> > Hi Brain,
> > doI understand it correctly,
> > that you have a selfrunning lawn mower
> > based on the Hector Rotoverter principle ?
> >
> > Please let me know more.
> >
> > Many thanks.
> >
> > Regards, Stefan.
Well yes i do have a self running(Cap discharge
recover) push lawn mower but im in the middle of
putting it on my rider mower but im looking for a
bigger motor for it, for it takes alot of energy to
power its self pulling the duel blades and all .. so
im working to put two motors on my rider then im
thinking of riding it around and mowing a few peoples
yards with it so im sure ill have to use a battery on
it , and yes this is biased with the RV transforming
Hector princples as many has been put together as one
unit that way its most effecent.
then im thinking of shooting some video of it eating
up grass and cordless... the rider will ride for all
the people in this kind group...Hector Kone and so so
many more the names could go on and on .... dont get
me wrong here its not easy keeping banging away at
things untill ya get it working like you like it... im
sure you know this ... like many 1000s of others do..
anyway i guess i need to go look for more parts .
i will upload a video on this mower if any one would
like to see to , if not no biggy later on ill upload a
easy way "how to" for the Pan. site for every one.
Thanks
Brian D. Prater
Cavetronics R&D Labs
Hello Stefan
yes i been working many years on the best ways to
convert energy to a pass energy in to a load and
recover and so on , i have made a magnon bosnova
machine and so on. i work with many people to help
them come to understand just how easy it is.
i have aspergers "high end" so i really think i was
born to do just this. invent ... i have about 15000
things i have invented . i use as many of them coupled
to one system thus = most effecent.. when you combin
them in to unity it becomes over-unity.
how may i be able to help you ?
Feel free to ask away
i tacked on one of many of my EQs on energy , this one
a good pal of mine done for me as i sent the data to
him.. and he done the paper work for me , we trade off
. so now you know what file is your looking at is .
if the paper is confusing just let me know
Thanks
Brian D. Prater
Cavetronics R&D Labs
--- "hartiberlin@gmx.de" <hartiberlin@gmx.de> wrote:
> > Thanks for the equation,
> > but what is the COP or efficiency
> > of your lawn mower?
> >
> > Regards, Stefan.
Hello , Stefan
The C.O.P. is flexing amount mostly around 5.88 to
7.31
so the motor does about 1/3 hp , its a 3ph motor so
thats not so good but it idles on 34 watts while
doing,, its kinda like more you load it the less you
get out..
--- "hartiberlin@gmx.de" <hartiberlin@gmx.de> wrote:
> > Hi Brian,
> > do you have a picture or a video of this mower
> > running just on capacitors ?
> >
> > How long does it run just on charged capacitors ?
> >
> > Do the caps discharge after a while ?
> > How long does it take ?
> >
> > What is the total capacitance ?
> >
> > How much energy is used from the motor mechanically
> > about?
> >
> >
> > I guess the idleling of a RV motor is minimal,but
> > when you draw
> > mechanical power from it, you have to put this power
> > into
> > the electrical input there too, right ?
> >
> > So how can it be overunity and selfrunning ?
> >
> > Regards, Stefan.
I am going to make some video on this..it runs about
4.5 secs on just the caps , but i use a invertor to
charge the caps and run the motor and the motor runs
charges the caps, under heavy load it will start
draining down on the caps voltage in about 23 to 45
mins ,, so i wait a few mins and keep on mowing after
the caps build up to 14 volts i take off mowing
again..
the motor mech. uses about 2.4 watts to 17 watts under
load , the output watts of the motor is about 1/3 hp
or 248 watts. 1/2 of this watts charge the caps to
fire the invertor. i use what i store and reuse what i
store that way im just paying to keep it in osc and
the tank wattage stays up by me having a open closed
looped system . kinda lenzless do to the return of
energy im cycling in the tank circut of the coils and
cap and motor and invertor. the invertor has a 90%
effcenty .. but it cost me about 5.8 watts to run it
but the motor supplys the energy do to supply this
energy the input goes down while the load output goes
up but if i break it over in energy use it falls off
and i have to jump start the whole system..if i load
it to hard ,
Brain
Hello,
Yes i will upload the video to you ...and you can put
it on your site.. i stop mowing just for a few mins
for the energy to build back up .. kinda like the
window motor does.
--- "hartiberlin@gmx.de" <hartiberlin@gmx.de> wrote:
> > How do you get this high COP ?
> > Where is the additional energy coming from ?
> > Is the environment cooled down and
> > thus the second law of thermodynamics is violated ?
> > So is the resonance in the motor coils somehow
> > tap the heat energy and converts them to mechanical
> > and
> > then electrical energy ?
> > Did you measure the temperature ?
> > Does it run cold ?
> >
> > Regards.Stefan.
its just more efficient power management...
i added a zipped folder of things i used to get it to
go on its own...when one compounds theses systems in
to one whole looping force of forces it becomes lagged
by time , that = differental charge movment.
there is no heat , when you have it effecent..
the hard part is keeping differental charge in osc
>from being moved in to different states.. read the OU
EQ it states all losses become gain... so use the
losses to run the motor , while the motor acts like a
generator supplying the losses this way we just move
the losses around and loss becomes gain...im sure i
still have some loss but i have some gain still do to
the losses.. make any sence to you ?
Brian
think over 5.8 watts per hour we are only lossing
0.0967 watts per min. at 120 volts = .0967 watts / 120
volts = how many amps per sec ? x 60 = one hour
becomes 0.04835 amps x 120 volts = 5.802 watts a loss
of .002 watts per hour.
1.44 watts per 30 days of running...in losses so to
stop running maybe it will take 5.8 / 1.44 = 4.0278
times before its dead thats about 116.8062 days at arg
of 29 days = a month ...
Brian
--- "hartiberlin@gmx.de" <hartiberlin@gmx.de> wrote:
> > Hi,
> > Many thanks.
> > I am looking forward to see some real pics or videos
> > of it !
> > Can I already post the infos you send me via email ?
> > Or should we wait, until you have a few videos
> > uploaded ?
> >
> > Many thanks.
> >
> > Regards, Stefan.
Hello, Yes that would be fine Stefan, ill work on
getting some video coming your way...
Thanks
Brian
-
wow this is very exciting! thanks for keeping it Open Source! :)
cant wait!
peace
-
Yes, it seems Brian is just charging up once its
capacitors before starting the lawn mower and then can mowe about
25 to 45 minutes on this one cap charge.
Normally, when he would not have this rotoverter feedback, the caps would just
only last for 4.5 seconds on the mower !
That is amazing !
-
how is this possible?!?! :D
-
how is this possible?!?! :D
could resonance have something to do with it?
btw, what might be the correlation of Walter Russell's Cosmogeny and Nikola Tesla's Impulse Current (IC) which Eric Dollard always talks about?
It would seem that with the pulsing you can achieve a specific point which you can then resonate and tap the harmonics generated by the original wave being resonated, and tap that without the motor or device stopping working.
seems like signal generators are going to become a lot more interesting (Rotoverter, Norman Wootan's Magnetic Resonance Amplifier (MRA)) and so on.
Keely did it acoustically, we can do it with signal generators.
-
RotoVerter replications
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications)
have fun
more will be added
http://video.google.com.au/videoplay?docid=8060034688864982719&hl=en-AU (http://video.google.com.au/videoplay?docid=8060034688864982719&hl=en-AU)
RotoVerter Energy Saving Method
-
NeonPeakTrigger circuitschematic + pictures + explanation by Patrick J. Kelly, with collaboration with David Kousolidas.
more info at
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:Deliverance (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:Deliverance)
-
Neon Peak Trigger circuit schematic
http://peswiki.com/images/4/4c/NeonPeakDetectorSwitchingV1.3.JPG (http://peswiki.com/images/4/4c/NeonPeakDetectorSwitchingV1.3.JPG)
-
NeonPeakTrigger writeup by Patrick J. Kelly.
D2 by Patrick J. Kelly (heaps of RotoVerter info on page 16 onwards)
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:NeonPeak (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:NeonPeak)
-
"I got a 7.5 HP 3phase motor from the dump and started running that with the mains in RV mode, via a variac to get it to run off around 100V ac. Then, I was able to switch from the mains over to the inverter power, and then to increase the frequency, speed and reduce the duty cycle."
"in summer 2006, many in the EVGRAY group were discussing different methods of resonant collection, in particular the "Diode Plug" method, given by Hector. So I uploaded another add-on circuit to the inverter which synchronized the switching of the Diode Plug with the Deliverance Inverter. this was called the Deliverance, because the resonance recovery circuit used the triangular wave in the original Deliverance Inverter."
"In April 2007, after Hector suggested the idea of using a Neon to detect the peak voltages in the Diode Plug, I uploaded a revised resonance recovery circuit, which doesn't need to be synchronized to the Deliverance Inverter because it detects and synchronizes to the actual voltage waveform across the resonant capacitor in circuit. I called this circuit "Neon Peak Detector and Switching V1.3", because it can operate with mains or any inverter. It is quite a bit simpler than the previous version (Deliverance RV resonance Recovery 1.1) which it supersedes, and yet is more universal.
"Patrick- Why would your average individual want to build and use this circuit? Looking at the circuit from a beginner's point of view, it appears to be a variation of John Bedini's solid-state circuit where one capacitor is charged (from back EMF?) for dumping into the battery and the second capacitor is charged up until the neon fires and operates the opto-isolator to trigger the SCR to feed the capacitor energy into the battery."
"David- Yes, that's it in a nutshell. The crucial part is the timing of the dumping into the battery in relation to the voltage waveform across the Run Cap (and Diode Plug Caps).At the peak voltage on one diode plug cap, is the moment when the alternate diode plug cap(previously charged up) is dumped into the battery. The Bedini circuit you describe sounds similar, but I'd like to see it before comparing. "
-
Energy saving basic introduction
We would like OPEN SOURCED ENEGINEERS TO REPLICATE THE neon SWITCHING, ONLY COST 19$.
Overuntiy! this may be the ckloses5t we have gotten to a real self runner which is open sourced. Please Help us help you wiht this research and replicate and give us feedback thanks
http://video.google.com.au/videoplay?docid=8060034688864982719&hl=en-%20AU
-
Here is news from Brian:
heres some pictires of the 3HP 3phase motor .
the readings are the motor at idle without power
factor correction.
none tuned just hooked up running.
take the motor and tune it to lowest watts, do all
this before you start making the mower so as you will
get to know the motors watts per HP and such, all
motors are different ,
then step to RV energy managment ... many files and
ways to do it but over all , we get what we think to
"use" back because we really dont destroy the
energy ,we just let it get by us from not using the
most effecent ways..= force , thus force = uneffecenty
do to load , so if we use the load to load more energy
back then we are just moving the energy in a loop ,
the energy speeds up at the RV and slows down at the
force so we build up energy at the force level , and
use this force level to yield charge.
when you make 1/2 system input easyer to move then the
output is 1/2 higher in energy , drive this higher
output into a lower input and it got by us again , so
we do it again and again ect... = bad effecenty back
feeded to good effecenty = a little more energy do to
more time of holding it .. tank energy is held in the
motors coils in magnetic fields ,, the extra energy is
there already loaded thats what makes a less input..
brian Prater
Ps. i dropped my cam on the floor and its toast...
might be a few more days before i get more pictures do
to needing a cam to take pictures and video
Hello ,
Stefan
heres some of how it works ... using inverse
hyperbolic sine and hyperbolic... see smoke and
mirrors below
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Pseudosphere.html
Sphere Power = "elastic forces"(everlasting forces)
Half the surface of revolution generated by a tractrix
about its asymptote to form a tractroid. The surfaces
is sometimes also called the antisphere or tractrisoid
The pseudosphere therefore has constant negative
Gaussian curvature, justifying the name
"pseudo-sphere" (i.e., an analog of the sphere, which
has constant positive curvature). Its constant
negative curvature also makes it a a local partial
model of hyperbolic geometry, just as a cone or
cylinder is a local partial model of Euclidean
geometry of the plane.
now lets talk about the coils and how they overlap in
the 3 phase motor ... and how this supplys what i was
talking about ,,,
its everwhere if we learn how to use it
http://home.earthlink.net/~jimlux/hv/cw1.htm
The CW multiplier has the disadvantage of having very
poor voltage regulation, that is, the voltage drops
rapidly as a function the output current. In some
applications, this is an advantage. The output V/I
characteristic is roughly hyperbolic, so it serves
well for charging capacitor banks to high voltages at
roughly constant charging power. Furthermore, the
ripple on the output, particularly at high loads, is
quite high.
The inversion of three-dimensional Cartesian
coordinates is called 6-sphere coordinates.
The scale factors of Cartesian coordinates are all
unity Hi=1
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/CartesianCoordinates.html
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/HelmholtzDifferentialEquationCartesianCoordinates.html
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/6-SphereCoordinates.html
is it start to look like RF waves di-polor antennas?
Laplace's equation ?
it all ties to ECE theory ... did i send you a OU EQ
file ?
the O in the unity is do to a charge that we have when
we give it a jump start , so to say...
thanks brian
-
Neon Peak Trigger circuit schematic
http://peswiki.com/images/4/4c/NeonPeakDetectorSwitchingV1.3.JPG (http://peswiki.com/images/4/4c/NeonPeakDetectorSwitchingV1.3.JPG)
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:NeonPeak (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:NeonPeak)
the whole NeonPeak article written by David Kousoulides and Patrick J. Kelly. enjoy!
-
how is this possible?!?! :D
i posted your"how is this possible" to EVGray list, and Hector Torres responded with this: (note, once and for all, before i start pasting material that hector torres wrote, I AM NOT HECTOR TORRES. I AM ESA RUOHO. :( )
hartiberlin>That is amazing !
responder#2>how is this possible?!?!
hector>Energy saving power management technology ..
hector>EV Gray group is in Aplications phase of ZPE-OU technology .... we generated overunity long ago and began aplications in energy savings,as all group got in UNITY "overunity" became a matter of time to be demostrated ,the theory additions are found in the magnificient compilations and work done by thoose replicating this methods and adding theirs and the gained expertize.
hector>Overunity is just transformation and is a variant of thermodynamicaly justified reasoning (book justified).
hector>If hurricanes are energy transformation engines why we cant copy naturea and create energetic copy? The answer is evident .
hector>Work with nature (resonance ) and tune to its energy ...
---
and here are some of the data provided: (its me, esa, again)
go to page 17 of Patrick J. Kelly's file and sstart there for quite a load of info on RotoVerter :)
http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/patrickkelly/D2.pdf (http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/patrickkelly/D2.pdf)
download these three files:
http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RV%20energy%20saving%20applications%20and%20R%20and%20D.pdf (http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RV%20energy%20saving%20applications%20and%20R%20and%20D.pdf)
http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RE-OU-v6_1.pdf (http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RE-OU-v6_1.pdf)
http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/Advanced%20RV%20Research%20and%20development.pdf (http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/Advanced%20RV%20Research%20and%20development.pdf)
-
http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RV%20energy%20saving%20applications%20and%20R%20and%20D.pdf (http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RV%20energy%20saving%20applications%20and%20R%20and%20D.pdf)
this is the one, in which there are instructions on how to RV a DC motor :) enjoy
(just look for DC to AC by phil)
-
The best part seems to be the mechanical Overunity operation,
when the mechanical output power is measured via a prony break torque measurement versus th.
electrical input power.
From the last PDF file I quote here Doug Konzen?s test:
Doug Konzen?s prony Break testing
For the third time I tested the 7.5hp Baldor motor with the series adding wiring which
gives 5.9 ohms resistance to each phase. This time I tore the motor all the way down
first, photographed the internal wiring and labels, and also oiled the bearings just a bit
with some "Kroil" brand hi-tech lubricant.
The phases are wired in Y fashion - and the motor is run in Hector's roto vertor-mode
with a 7UF run cap across lines 2 and 3. At 1650rpm no-load idle, the motor draws
.3Aac @ 120Vac with the 7UF cap.
Any amount of force from the prony brake that exceeds approx 80 ounces on the scale
with the corresponding amps input of approx 2.3Aac will bring the motor to a stop.
In this testing, and the previous too, it has been found that this particular RV'd 3ph
7.5hp Baldor AC motor only likes just a couple narrow "notches" of speed and torque
being squeezed from the shaft by the foot-long Teflon-collar prony brake.
And as before in the two earlier test-runs done this week, it was possible to keep a
consistent force of 54 ounces (3.375LBFT) on the scale, which corresponds to a
simultaneous reading of 1 Aac @ 120Vac input to the motor showing on the meters.
And also a force of 43 ounces (2.687LBFT) and the simultaneous .8 Aac @ 120Vac
input to motor on the meters was another narrow notch-of-power from the shaft to
extract.
So again, it is almost a full HP (746watts) of shaft-power from under 120 watts
electrical input, and still haven?t tried out more UF values to the run-cap in order to
fine-tune it to the load.
RESULTS:
1/20/2007
120VAc grid-power input
7.5HP Baldor motor
.81 power-factor rated showing on label (stock rating)
88% efficiency rating on label (stock rating)
7UF run-cap used in both tests
Test #1:
.8Aac X 120Vac = 96watts input
2.687 LBFT X 1550rpm / 5250 = .793HP X 746 = 591 watts output
Test #2:
1Aac X 120Vac = 120watts input
3.375 LBFT X 1500rpm /5250 = .96HP X 746 = 716watts output
-
news about lawnmower.. you might be interested in this post from cavetronics, the creator of the lawnmower.
//
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EVGRAY/message/15140 (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EVGRAY/message/15140)
do to , some people keep missing with me about the looped mower... it is no longer looped ... your wishes have come true...please leave my people alone now!!!...
Tue May 29, 2007 12:32 am
//
-
Cap discharge "timming" works better then "chips" , because of the cap discharge(the cap moves its "stored energy) in the system , the cap can store and move the store about , where as the chips can just act as switchs... unless the chip acts as a cap then its not so "waste-full" ....
The same thing applys to coils ,, as coils act like caps to... so what part is going to blow 1st ? the "chips" most likly..
timming is key here " we have X amount of time when the node is at (zero and Max energy) do to the coupling of the gate at a zero node.... so think large switchs = more wider of a gap to colect the energy in the same amount of time...
i made a post about shorting out the sec in a transformer ,,, now lets think about this short as being a charge also...add this with the mower & TPU you have a RV-TPU grass cutting capdischaring rotate motor-generator RotoVerter " like hector said (bang them coils ) i have 300 amp SCRs doing the bangin" i have about 2ms of BANG(zero node currents) to get and give energy in a BI-WAY of NODES
the rest is All DOWN HILL like the Back part of the Standing Wave ... USE VSWR and Grid Dip meters and make a DSP unit to compress your 2ms in to 60ms of energy
The key to the Mower...Pulesing magnetic fields travling DOWNhill /\/\/\/\ ( we want this part took off ( \\\\\ ) and we put on this part ( ///// ) to gether they are (\/\/\/\/)+(/\/\/\/)=////\\\\////\\\\
Cavetronics
-
three new videos from panacea
-------------
RotoVerter overunity preview
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhB9rdpnyBI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhB9rdpnyBI)
description: This is a demonstration of Panacea's Roto Verter device (motor / generator coupling version) in an apartment in Brisbane, Australia. By clipping the peaks of the wave form using neon switching or diode plug techniques, it may be possible to extract the resonant / excess power shown on the alternator such as replicated by an open source engineer in France. The neon switch circuits are near completion for this setup. More information including the circuit diagrams are available at http://www.panacea-bocaf.org (http://www.panacea-bocaf.org)
-------------------------
energy suppression and rotoverter script
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5757587323690598971 (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5757587323690598971)
description: This is panacea-bocaf.org's media script on energy suppression and the solutions to addressing the political and economic conditions present.
----
rotoverter running a drill
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3089731393806776576 (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3089731393806776576)
description: This is the RV energy saving modification, here you can see a drill turning at 2900 RPM on 240 volts at .5 amps equaling about 120 watts!! the draw also went down to 4.8 amps! http://www.panacea-bocaf.org (http://www.panacea-bocaf.org)
-
http://video.google.com.au/videoplay?docid=3223602109300684830
latest OU circulating current and showing the neon extraction circuit
We are building 4 of them ATM
-
a frequency driven rotoverter..
http://video.google.com.au/videoplay?docid=9089608413203959523 (http://video.google.com.au/videoplay?docid=9089608413203959523)
Rotoverter Frequency drive Demonstration] 3min42sec (6th July 2007)
-
some of you might find this ev-gray message interesting:
"Hello all,
Tonight I achieved over unity with an RV conversion variation.
For PM I used a junkyard 10hp 3 phase 1725RPM motor. Wired for RVPM.
No load other then turning an un loaded alternator with 37uf of
capacitance, .6 amps at 120.5v ac (from inverter). 72.3 watts.
For an alternator I used an old (I mean old) single phase, 120v
1/3hp 1725 motor. I used a belt to connect the two, the pulleys were
almost the same, alternators a little smaller so it was being over
driven a bit.
No load and 62uf I was at 159v and 6.6 amps with PM at 40uf and 1.8
amps at 120.5v.
I then loaded the alternator with (4) 100watt 120v light bulbs, (2)
in series (2 pairs in parallel). It seams you have to let the
alternator load up with capacitance then hook up the light bulbs. It
would not generate when I started with the bulbs connected.
Alternator loaded with (4) 100 watt light bulbs (at full brightness)
I had 4.7 amps at 125v (587 watts). The numbers were the same at the
bulbs, caps or right off the alternator.
With alternator loaded PM was at 62uf and 2.6 amps at 120.5v. 313.3
watts.
Gota run,
Jason"
-
esaruoho,
I am new to RV. Seems you are much more experienced. So my question to you is, where is the RV OU from? Drive motor?
thks
Hank
-
The more I read the post the less it makes sense and does not look like o/u to me. He states he has two bulbs in series and two series sets in parallel. Well, that means he only has 62.5VAC at each bulb, not the necessary 120VAC to run them full brightness. He would need to measure 240VAC at the caps in order to have his estimated o/u at the series bulbs.
I believe he is measuring the output voltage of the alternator with the full amp output of the alternator which includes the power necessary to charge the rotor (load plus capacitor bank). IMO, he is only getting about 200 watts of usable power from 313 watts input.
Rich
-
Rich,
Which reort you are looking at?
-
This one.
Rich
some of you might find this ev-gray message interesting:
"Hello all,
Tonight I achieved over unity with an RV conversion variation.
For PM I used a junkyard 10hp 3 phase 1725RPM motor. Wired for RVPM.
No load other then turning an un loaded alternator with 37uf of
capacitance, .6 amps at 120.5v ac (from inverter). 72.3 watts.
For an alternator I used an old (I mean old) single phase, 120v
1/3hp 1725 motor. I used a belt to connect the two, the pulleys were
almost the same, alternators a little smaller so it was being over
driven a bit.
No load and 62uf I was at 159v and 6.6 amps with PM at 40uf and 1.8
amps at 120.5v.
I then loaded the alternator with (4) 100watt 120v light bulbs, (2)
in series (2 pairs in parallel). It seams you have to let the
alternator load up with capacitance then hook up the light bulbs. It
would not generate when I started with the bulbs connected.
Alternator loaded with (4) 100 watt light bulbs (at full brightness)
I had 4.7 amps at 125v (587 watts). The numbers were the same at the
bulbs, caps or right off the alternator.
With alternator loaded PM was at 62uf and 2.6 amps at 120.5v. 313.3
watts.
Gota run,
Jason"
-
esaruoho,
I am new to RV. Seems you are much more experienced. So my question to you is, where is the RV OU from? Drive motor?
thks
Hank
Hi Hank,
I'm in the process of learning and will give you what I know, or at least what I think I know.
The drive motor (prime mover) when tuned properly will give you a highly efficient motor and some highly technical types getting 500%+ overunity. But I'm not that technically minded and use the basics of the RV concept without going into the coils and rewiring them. So with a basic RV drive motor in good tune you can break over unity by about 25% from my understanding. I have not torque testing my set-up but this is what I have so far on my high speed 7.5hp prime mover and low speed 5hp alternator coupled 1:1.....
input is 121VAC @ 5.4amps=653.4 watts
output (actually power tuned INSIDE the alternator) is 420VAC @ 8.7 amps=3,654 watts
The problem is the load has to be tuned to the power output using capaciters for maximum efficiency, not the power tuned to the load. Inside the alternator it looks like over unity but I have not managed to get it out of the alternator yet but it does look promising. I thought I had it last night but apparently need much more capaciter capacity than I do now.
Did I just stir-up mud in the pond?
Rich
-
Guys don't forget you cannot load series resonance like you do a resistive load, elt driving a stepping up GENs , also Freq driving needs more testing.
With the RV alt i would apply David Kous' Neon switcher.
Ill have our tests done tomorrow and will post some results.
The Alt is complicated, i would start with the neon on the prime mover first.
dont forget to READ THE ADVANCED RV RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT COMPILATION FOR IDEAS ON THE ALT
http://panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm
-
Rich,
Thanks for explanation. I am totally new to this and hope to learn more from you guys. I still have to adjust to the ideal of tuning the load for max result. My imagination is that when motor is working, there must be magnetic fields rotaing around the motor itself. Wonder if we can somehow modify the motor and use additional windings to extract the energy? Or is that what RV does?
Hank
-
hanker the RV can be a great learning tool, essentially its best to apply it into energy savings first, for a beginner i suggest you read
the comps on the RV page i posted.,
Regards
Ashtweth
-
Thanks Ash,
I did notice you are also on yahoo. I'll look in to the places you suggested. I have been spending a great deal of time on TPU threads. It is exciting to see TPU threads thrive and grow. I think it's a matter of time before we, guys on OU, crack the codes.
-
I didn't get as much power as I'd hoped but..............................
;D ;D ;D WE HAVE OVERUNITY OUTSIDE OF THE GENERATOR ;D ;D ;D
I used an old cooktop with all four burners on maximum for the load (7.6kw @ 240VAC on the label). Here are the particulars:
PM: 5.5 amps @ 120VAC = 660 watts in
Alternator: 5.22 amps @ 274VAC = 1430 watts out
It's only taken 20 years!
Rich
-
Hi Rich,
Congratulations!
Would you share some more details? I don't get how and where you used the cooktop burner as a load? You loaded the alternator with it?
Thanks,
Gyula
-
Yes, the stovetop is the load. I placed the load in series with the cap bank and wired a switch to short-out the load while building power (charging the cap bank). Once the cap bank is charged then you open the switch and this forces the charge through the load. The power is very stable with no problems of maintaining it for long periods.
Rich
-
Hi Rich,
Thanks, now I understand, very good idea to connect the load INSIDE the parallel resonant circuit created by the alternator's windings and the cap bank. The reactive current inside the parallel resonant circuit is what flows through the load. Now if you had an alternator with very low winding/copper resistance, your ou results would be even better, right? (part of the output power suffers copper loss, unavoidable)
If you switch on or off or control some of the burners out of the four, does the output voltage change a lot or a little? And do you have to retune a little bit the RVed motor (the prime mover) when you change the load?
Thanks
Gyula
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Can you use , an part of the output Power , to drive the INPUT from them ?
This way , tat this device can work as an SELFRUNNER , after that was "startws" !?
Gustav Pese
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@oouthere
Now that the burners are on, I'll have two eggs, sunny side up. LOL
Good work. So when do you get off the grid.
I also did something. Could not figure out why this 108 amp alternator is not producing more than 10 amps. Took it apart and found the rotor slip rings are shorted out. Will bring them into my alternator guy on Monday to get it fixed. I think mine will be working by Tuesday. I just couldn't figure out why, all the elements were in their right place but the alternator had a short. Go figure.
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@oouthere can you make a short video of your set up?
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If I wanted to fool people I could easily do that but the truth is my meters did not give the true output due to the frequency change. There is no over unity.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,2813.10.html
Rich
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<<Hi all,
Here I came up with new type of RV power generator that may requare minimal torque. I have done no actual testing on this design.
I have combined the shaft and armature as one unit to cut down a torque requirement for power production.
Here it is folks.
For this desined generator to work shaft has to be specially magnetized to even numbers. Such as N, S, and 2,4 or 6 poles etc. I am in touch with 2 magnet companies to get for their multiple pole shaft magnet price quotes.
Stay tune.
Mehmet.>>
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@Mem
Good idea but here are a few things to consider.
The 1" shaft simply becomes a 1" rotor with much smaller stator windings. The windngs and rotor would have to be 3 feet long or more to get the same wattage as the original generator.
Look at this alternator on ebay.
http://cgi.ebay.ca/HighAmp-PMA-Permanent-Magnet-Alternator-Generator-SC12F_W0QQitemZ290146347291QQihZ019QQcategoryZ121837QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Now imagine that rotor being only 1". How fast would it have to rotate to produce the same power as this alternator?
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<<Very good point, the shaft then has be longer, sure and go a lot faster to achive the same results! I sure like to built and test this generator around 24" long shaft. I would mount the maximum posible coils around the shaft to pick the power.
This new design "may?" support metal core electromagnets for larger amp. output.
Since will need min. torque RV motor maybe able to turn it.
(I am using too many "maybes" I wish I could do the math on this.
Mehmet.>>
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Hi guys,
I remember Raivo tried that PM ALT on his RV the Exact one in fact, from memory the DRAG/ Eddy currents were not good, the next generation RV is the permanent magnet ROTOR RV.
Except you have to know the math with the magnetic DRAG from the design, we have many suggestions in the RE-OU v6 compilation on PM RV.
But no one has built it yet, apparently according to hector the design can be 100% efficient , as has no slip.
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@ashtweth_nihilisti
Thanks for your input on that PM alt. Actually I just removed my alternator from my system to start working on my VAR project, but I must say, I was tempted by that PM Alt as a last ditch effort with an ALT. Ideas abound.
@Mem
What I was trying to say is this. Even if you put a thin rotor and long windings, or stubby rotor and fat windings, to produce an equal amount of wattage, you will still be exposed to significant drag. Although I must say the advent of having a thin long rotor seems to dictate that since the drag would be closer to the center of the shaft, it will have less overall drag on the PM, versus a wide rotor being stopped by drag that would be putting more of an anti-leverage effect on the rotation. There might be something there indeed. But you are right, this would have to be considered and workable on paper before you go through a build. Maybe search patents for long thin generators. Drag is a real drag.
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is this what weve all been waiting for ?....or maybe i dont understand( im pretty good at not understand ing).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhB9rdpnyBI
what i think im seeing in its most basic description is that it takes 3x 100wbulbs of power to out-put 11x 100wbulbs of power so getting about 8x 100wbulbs of power for free?...or have i missed the point completely ?...i know some of you will prolly say go back and read all the crap and pdf's but all i get from that is a sore head...is there a way to explain this or whats going on here for simple everyday ppl who are generally kinda cluless ?( like my self).
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::) ;D
>have i missed the point completely ?.
Never mind the lights or loading the Alt reactive power ;), We are basically saying to try the attached circuit (Neon its a few posts back), as it is the reported OU self runner. our will be ready for testing this weekend.
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is there any one in New Zealand that would like to get togeather and try to replicate this ?. id like to go off the power grid, our power bills here are insaine...the way i see it one of these could sit in the boot of an electric car as well ..we pay almost $2 a liter here for fuel...once again insaine prices.
( i still have no clue how this is done tho, i cant seem to find simple instructions that anyone can follow).
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http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm
for beginners
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Rotoverter
Look for the panacea replication for step by step
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Great! i found the step by step on how to , But i cant seem to open it no matter what i try..is any one able to copy and paste out the txt into a new file and pics as well and zip it or someting into a txt file or something ?..
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b0rg13.. please consult http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:Panacea (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:Panacea)
which is the newest version of that rv step by step thing.
but please also visit the panacea website and consult the other PDFs where you will find further information.
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b0rg13.. please consult http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:Panacea (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Rotoverter:Replications:Panacea)
which is the newest version of that rv step by step thing.
but please also visit the panacea website and consult the other PDFs where you will find further information.
thank you very much , i appreciate.
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<<Hi All out there,
What you guys think of getting this generator here http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=45416 (http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=45416)
and using 20 HP, 3600 RPM, 3P Baldor motor in RV mode, couple them with a (say 20 lbs of) flywheel together,
With this priciple there no battery or inverter;
After system put together, then turn the primemover on with AC then once the motor gains the full speed n torque with a 3 way switch instatly turn the primemover to run with our AC generator.
What do you think will happen, will it sustain itself? Or will it slowly slow down and stop?
If will sustain itself? Do you think will it give access power out is well or not?
Mem>>
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Hi Mem, we dont have allot of test data on that process sorry, and or any Schematic, i thought its best to put it there but Im afraid its a 'half baked idea' :)
Gene tried to get a Sch out of Hector but no luck, so we would have to rely on the lb tests to tell.
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<<Hey guys
Yesterday while I did lots of testing on power consumption
on these motors. I had a hard time believing what I was seeing
on the watt/Amp miter.
Little fan motor coil that uses more energy than other 2 lot bigger motors!
Folks, (RV) resonance electric motor conversion method, can give us all the free power
we need if we could find the way to couple these motors with the right generators.
Mem>>
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how did u put them into RV mode ? , is ther a step by step way to do it ?.
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how did u put them into RV mode ? , is ther a step by step way to do it ?.
<<Here is a simple RV conversion methode. http://www.geocities.com/koneheadx/RVMuller.html (http://www.geocities.com/koneheadx/RVMuller.html)
The run capacitor: 2 MF 370 VAC (good for 3 phase motors up to 3 HP) If you need more power output ?
Use bigger value run capacitor like 5, 7, 10, MF etc. Always use AC capacitors 200 VAC minimum.
Have fan
Mem.>>
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::) ;D
>have i missed the point completely ?.
Never mind the lights or loading the Alt reactive power ;), We are basically saying to try the attached circuit (Neon its a few posts back), as it is the reported OU self runner. our will be ready for testing this weekend.
Please see my recently-edited post at
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,3332.msg52830.html#msg52830
I think someone has been grossly misrepresenting other people's work and owes the forum and the inventor an apology.
Linda
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Note- Ill clear up for the board if hummbugger us not removed then you can find your result ts else where Ill clear for others in case you are getting suckered into this dick head again (For the last time)
The circuit is reported to have no reflection on the primary battery, David has not loaded the Shaft of his RV, but has stated the bearings are a load, and have allot of friction, it is logical to assume that if the circuit can be run on one battery and charge a secondary with no reflection that it can be self run. (thats what is being stated) obviously.
I have others off list who report to me and don't post here so you are missing out on a allot of informaiton again you can thank this banned user for his distraction and time wasting
He is stupid and does not understand any thing., and or build any thing and is a pest.
he was banned over at EVGRAY and is hiding there now
unless this user is removed then you can count me out of this mess
Ashtweth
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>:(
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>:(
I'm a newbie to
I don?t sell anything nor do I buy.
I just replicate ROTOVERTER AND IS RUNNING ON MY GARAGE
Stop talking just to appear cleaver.
Energy is not a joke RV is a very promising way
Replication of this very simple experiment is a way to thank for a great gift.
Unless you have other interest on your agenda and cheap energy will reduce
Your ignominious gains!
Regards
Isoprobe
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Isoprobe,
Yes the stage that you are in with your RV experiments are good.
A months or two later: You'll change a little bit, you'll wonder what
you can do with the RV motor?
I went through these steps myself.
About 6 months a go, I talked to local industrial electric motor repair shop
and I told them about my 3 Phase RV motor how it runs with only
20 Watts of power.
I kid you not! They laugh at me. They said we know all about that.
He said. They are even able to convert (rewind the stator)
3 phase motor's to single phase or viseversa 1single phase to 3 phase.
The guy said: You run the motor with so little energy but you can't do anything
with it, they don't have torque power.
My leaps were sealed, I coun't say any more to him. He knew he's business
only too well.
So we come back to realty check: RV motor conversion idea is okay.
For some small amount of energy saving.
(The way I see this, you basicly reduce the input power and therefore you save wasted enery during
the proces, is not an overunity or anything like that. It's sort of like using 4 Cylinder car
instead of 8 Cylinder. Yes, you save energy, or else will be wasted!
thats all there is to it.
During idling of the motor, bearly any energy is need it, when it comes to do the work thou,
motor will need emps to get the job done.
Understanding of electrical or electric circuits, machines so on, it's something that
evolves in life. 400 years a go, man couldn't even dream the way of life we have now!
Past centuries, spiritual man and woman, that had vision or a special ability
was burned on a stick. Just like we cook game meat today! Man, killed those
that were little ahead of their time. Let us not do the same to day!
Perhaps we're little more civilized to day. (Not everywhere, thou: If you live in
Iraq, Afghanistan or Palestine and try to defend your country from aggressive
foreign army?s invasion! You can get killed, like so many others dies everyday.
Man has created separation on earth and therefore they can justify
of their actions any way they want. Sort of like, big tree middle of the city square
is more important then giant tree's in Brazil's Amazon. That they get turn into chips...
Well, here is a test for you, too. And this test will tell you where you're in
your own spiritual evolment and self mastery. (not every one is ready for this)
Yes, at below video this pank, looking guy has developed powers
undreamed by most mortal man. This trully applys here; The truth will set you free!
But first will piss you off! That's the reason why people think, he uses trick's.
There is no trick, that, this guy uses! The best thing I can tell you, study this guys
life and you'll know more about he's abilitys and he's powers. If you do so
prepare to be further shocked! Thats why he calls himself "Mind Frick"
He defys: To days science, gravity, time, space, death, life and more... Check him out...
The point is: We are trapped in false reality, and we don't even know it.
Sort of like a dream, that we don't know that we are dreaming...
We think this life is the ultimate. Fasle!
Sort of like a: Baby would think that kindergarten is the ultimate place to be.
Without further due
Check this out guy here, then you'll see what I mean:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ne2DtbB608E (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ne2DtbB608E)
Mem.
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is this what weve all been waiting for ?....or maybe i dont understand( im pretty good at not understand ing).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhB9rdpnyBI
what i think im seeing in its most basic description is that it takes 3x 100wbulbs of power to out-put 11x 100wbulbs of power so getting about 8x 100wbulbs of power for free?...or have i missed the point completely ?...i know some of you will prolly say go back and read all the crap and pdf's but all i get from that is a sore head...is there a way to explain this or whats going on here for simple everyday ppl who are generally kinda cluless ?( like my self).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhB9rdpnyBI
check out this vid, im curious why no one is jumping on this and trying it out , it seems that this has just been forgottin about, does it work or not ?. its hard to tell from just one or two ppl replicating it, has any one else tryed this ? the questions ive asked in this thread seem to have not been answerd, there just talked around with no real info, its been a few months so here i am asking again.
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is this what weve all been waiting for ?....or maybe i dont understand( im pretty good at not understand ing).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhB9rdpnyBI
what i think im seeing in its most basic description is that it takes 3x 100wbulbs of power to out-put 11x 100wbulbs of power so getting about 8x 100wbulbs of power for free?...or have i missed the point completely ?...i know some of you will prolly say go back and read all the crap and pdf's but all i get from that is a sore head...is there a way to explain this or whats going on here for simple everyday ppl who are generally kinda cluless ?( like my self).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhB9rdpnyBI
check out this vid, im curious why no one is jumping on this and trying it out , it seems that this has just been forgottin about, does it work or not ?. its hard to tell from just one or two ppl replicating it, has any one else tryed this ? the questions ive asked in this thread seem to have not been answerd, there just talked around with no real info, its been a few months so here i am asking again.
hello b0rg13. i'm posting the same "compilation" i posted on the thrapp thread, to add to this thread too.
i too am very surpirsed that the resonance revoery methods are not being taken and run with. peter lindemann already notified us all that the power factor correction tuning of capacitors to create energy savings is in use on some technologies, and is just a nice start to start getting into the reactive power generation. theres some people who have verified, even on overunity.com that reactive power does get generated, however, for some reason they havent sat down and extracted it (oouthere is one, hence why i replied on thrapp and in this thread). peter lindemann also said that it cant be extracted, but look what happened.
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
To comment on the rotoverter...yes it appears to be o/u but the power cannot be extracted. My unit was at best about 1,100 watts in and 3,600 watts out. But, if you tried to run light bulbs with it, it consumed the 1,100 watts plus the additional load as well. That's why it disappeared, everyone came to realize this or else everyone of us that tried would be running our house on these units.
Rich
hello rich. i refer to these posts from peterlindemann:
1)
"I applaud Hector for encouraging people to run these experiments, but the RotoVerter is an EFFICIENCY technique, not an OU technique. The Reactive Power circulating in the LC tank circuits can be converted to Real Power, usig methods discovered by Tesla, but that is another matter entirely." (http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/1507-roto-verter-2.html#post16707 (http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/1507-roto-verter-2.html#post16707))
2) then peter refers to tesla's 6 method of conversions for getting the reactive power out, ( http://www.energeticforum.com/16933-post53.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/16933-post53.html))
3) then peter refers to hector's virtual current circulation video:
"The video of Hector is a perfect example of why I believe what I do. He is showing that the RV motor side is running on 175 WATTS of Real Power, and the generator side is producing 208 volts and 7.6 amps, or 1508 VARS of Reactive Power, measured to and from the Capacitor load on the generator. He refers to this as "circulating current" which is exactly what it is. This film shows ZERO WATTS of Real Power coming out of the generator. Reactive Power does NOT produce any Back EMF in the generator, so the motor is still operating at, essentially, no load. There is no way (shown here) to use the power from the generator to run the motor. I am not trying to be a "pain in the ass", I am trying to help you form a clear picture in your mind of what is possible and what is not." http://www.energeticforum.com/17173-post87.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/17173-post87.html)
4) http://www.energeticforum.com/17204-post89.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/17204-post89.html) i try and write about stuff about the recovery circuits to peter to see how he reacts (he did mention tesla's recovery methods)
5) peter: "Thank you for this post and the link to the "neon peak recovery circuit". THIS APPROACH HAS MERIT!!!!! Going back to what I posted about Tesla's "Method of Conversion", clipping the VOLTAGE PEAK of a resonant tank created by an AC generator feeding a Capacitive load, IS the first method he discusses. The trick is to clip the top of the voltage rise JUST AS THE CURRENT DROPS TO THE ZERO POINT. In a 60 cycle system, that gives you about a millisecond to clip. Under these circumstances, this system WOULD tap Radiant Energy (voltage without current) just as Hector apparently claims." "The discussion about "false triggering" of the SCR's is interesting. My guess would be that the "false triggering" is coming from the neon bulb more than the SCR. 50% failure rate on a commercially available semi-conductor device seems excessive."
and here's the clincher
"I now see that there is more to the RV project than just Power Factor Correcting a 3-phase motor. This recovery process will work in ANY situation where an AC generator is supplying Reactive Power to a capacitive load." http://www.energeticforum.com/17211-post90.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/17211-post90.html)
this was the most remarkable about-turn i've ever seen. this is when it started getting interesting. oouthere, i really recommend you start looking into extracting the reactive power. if you got far enough to create it, why not just extract it?
6) "My goal will be to understand what this technology is and what it's historic roots are. At this point, my understanding is that it all relates back to Tesla's brushless induction motors, and his "Method of Conversion" processes for cracking Radiant Energy out of Resonant AC tank circuits. If you have found practical ways to accomplish this with off-the-shelf technology, then it is AWESOME." http://www.energeticforum.com/17250-post99.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/17250-post99.html)
7) a huge post from ashtweth in response to the thread http://www.energeticforum.com/17269-post106.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/17269-post106.html)
8) peter lindemann reacts: http://www.energeticforum.com/17278-post108.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/17278-post108.html)
anyone + oouthere pretty please, look into it.
btw, has anyone else noticed that john bedini also speaks of reactive power extraction, etc? ir efer to these 3 merlib posts (they're small archives, i spent a bit of time looking at what lindemann+bedini say about reactive power, cos if bedini talks about reactive power extraction, lindemann refers to tesla's reactive power extraction, and the Rotoverter technology's virtual current/reactive power can be extracted with the circuits - as has been shown, then these 3 things need to be put together, analyzed and applied. i am glad things are moving forwards now.
http://merlib.org/node/5544 (http://merlib.org/node/5544) - Peter Lindemann: Reactive Power and Radiant Energy and John Bedini's materials
http://merlib.org/node/5508 (http://merlib.org/node/5508) - John Bedini: Reactive Power is the clue to Monopole, Hendershot, Moray..
get the RV going, extract the VAR, and post about it. here is a good PDF which contains quite a lot of
various extraction circuits. http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Chapter2.pdf (http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Chapter2.pdf) (go towards pages 35-40 etc, you'll see when the resonance recovery circuits start bumping in.
all i can say is, godspeed!
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Mem wrote: "Check this out guy here, then you'll see what I mean"
Hi mem, don't mix up the magician's abilities with the search for Free Energy. First is occultism. They pay whith their soul for it. Second is real nature!
-
get the RV going, extract the VAR, and post about it. here is a good PDF which contains quite a lot of
various extraction circuits. http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Chapter2.pdf (http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Chapter2.pdf) (go towards pages 35-40 etc, you'll see when the resonance recovery circuits start bumping in.
all i can say is, godspeed!
Hi Esa,
Just a small correction on your otherwise excellent contribution: the pages on extracting circuits are between pages 24-35, so some ten pages earlier than you wrote above.
Thanks, Gyula
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thank you! i never meant to mislead people on posting the "kinda thereabouts" page, and will correct it for future posts :)
i hope someone is having a feast reading the recovery circuits..
Hi Esa,
Just a small correction on your otherwise excellent contribution: the pages on extracting circuits are between pages 24-35, so some ten pages earlier than you wrote above.
Thanks, Gyula
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Mem wrote: "Check this out guy here, then you'll see what I mean"
Hi mem, don't mix up the magician's abilities with the search for Free Energy. First is occultism. They pay whith their soul for it. Second is real nature!
Joh70,
Do you believe what you say is true?
For a man to gain higher mastery to manipulate mater and time and space with his new gained abilitys.
That maybe called with bunch of names, such as occultism, yogic powers, magician etc? what ever the name used matters not.
One thing for sure: True adept have no desire to demonstrate his ability, never! Perhaps young adepts are like a ?kid? needs lots of attention.
As far as the price of the gift goes?
Well, if you got the powers from the dark side of the spirit realm? You are right on Jon70!
But if you earn the rights and forces of Light (Holy Spirit) bless with many gifts I feel you are safe!
This doesn?t mean that even a rightly earned gift can?t be misused, surely it can!
Perhaps one has to have the wisdom and the discernments of the spirits before anything.
As as a free energy researcher I admit my weakness sometimes I drift into other realms
Mem>>
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i was recently re-watching "Energy From The Vacuum Part 2" with John Bedini - and in it, at the start, is the EnergenX promotional video from 2000, where Bearden describes one of the Bedini devices as being made to produce reactive power - and that then transformed into actual energy.
this seems to be exactly the conversion rpocess that needs to happen in the RotoVerter Reactive Power Recovery Circuits that are being spoken about quite a bit.
your thoughts on recovering Reactive Power?
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The RV conversion is interesting because it converts to resonance. Tesla said something like "if it wasn't for resonance then electricity would be rather boring".
In practical RV terms the savings are really only on the light to medium load running. As the load increases the run cap has to be increased to make up for the power required. It can save money though where you have a legitimate need for a motor. People with a pool for example run a 1hp pump motor for 8 to 12 hours a day taking like 800 watts and the motor runs so hot you cant touch it. In RV mode the speed comes up and the power drops to about 100 watts and then it runs cold saving the bearings from overheating and drying out.
When you see whats happening the coil inductance is increased by taking on more windings which allows for a smaller run cap and the supply in is shared between the phase in virtual mode.
However the loss of any type of OU is lost in the generator configuration. Thats why Thrapp appears not to use an RV run motor but all the cap coil tweaks are done in the gene not the run motor. This is 100% opposite to what the RV crowd is doing where their gen motor is then wired to a really small inductance by parallel up the phases and set the lowest voltage setting. This must be wrong as Thrapp can prove its wrong by his clearly OU self running setup.
Thrapp clearly shows a massive cap bank on his gene but in addition the inductance looks huge too due to the size of the windings. There are similarities though. He is using an inverter which is modified to frequency and voltage and the bulb bank has another box on it too for what seems like more power factor correction. I think Thrapp describes the gene as a variable frequency generator. The trick always seems to be resonance. Get the inductance to appear small even though in reality its large by thousands of turns and exchange it for extremely large caps to get the C I in resonance.
The best thing about this in my mind from an experimenters point of view is that one can take ordinary motors and show excellent power savings that can do something useful. This is much better then a Bedini bicycle wheel going round thats does very little and where build standards are often really shabby and still wont do OU.
The same happens with the Newman motor. Make the inductance of the coil massive so the current is tiny and large voltages will start flowing. The efficiency looks great but it is never recoverable to drive another motor.
If Thrapp is something to bear witness too then the OU loop trick is not in the run motor but in the gen motor. If the gen motor cant produce more electricity out then mechanical going in the OU loop is dead.
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I know this is a stupid question - but I am having an impossible time finding the wiring for the rotoverter/3 phase motors. I have acquired some unused older GE 3 phase motors, but I cannot find anyplace showing which wire color off the motor is for what, so I am at a standstill.
Can anyone help me by just showing/telling which color wires are which on the 3 phase motors? I have got the capacitors for my variable bank and start up, but can't go farther without this simple (and probably stupid) problem being solved.
Thanks
-
->panaceauniversity.org->RV document
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I know this is a stupid question - but I am having an impossible time finding the wiring for the rotoverter/3 phase motors. I have acquired some unused older GE 3 phase motors, but I cannot find anyplace showing which wire color off the motor is for what, so I am at a standstill.
Can anyone help me by just showing/telling which color wires are which on the 3 phase motors? I have got the capacitors for my variable bank and start up, but can't go farther without this simple (and probably stupid) problem being solved.
Thanks
Victorfolk, nevermind about the colors or the numbers of the wires. All you need is 3 wires that are already coming out of the windings.
Number those wires as 1,2,3 and start testing the motor, then one by one switch the wires around. You'll find that experementing like this you'll master the art of fine tuning your 3 phase AC motor. It helps to have a clamp on amp meter or new watt meters that can be purchased for $20 . It will be fun to see that you can run 3 HP motor under 20 watts... Have fun man
Mem.
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Hi Mem ok you told Victor nevermind about wire colors but what Capacitors should one use then to 2nd and 3rd wires?
And for Europe running a motor 240v in normal mode what voltage should one give after modifiying this motor?.
Thanks.
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Hi Mem ok you told Victor nevermind about wire colors but what Capacitors should one use then to 2nd and 3rd wires?
And for Europe running a motor 240v in normal mode what voltage should one give after modifiying this motor?.
Thanks.
<<guruji,
Take a look at this circuit here http://peswiki.com/index.php/Image:D2_rotoverter02.JPG (http://peswiki.com/index.php/Image:D2_rotoverter02.JPG) the circuit was made to run with 120v to use this circuit with 240v probably you need to lower the capacitor values to half what says there. Like 17.5 uF is used for run cap. for your project use 5 or 8 uF ( my rugh guess here)
I bough a 20 HP, 3600 RPM motor that took me for a while to get this motor going, the problem I had my run capacitor value was too low!
But once I used the right value of capacior (can't remeber what it was now) this motor runs beatufly. Runs with 240v probably uses around 2 amp. just to idle, The motor is weigh aroun 250 lbs. Factory lable on the motor says this motor at 230v needs 44amp (just to run without doing any work).
Yes it's true that motor runs with full speed but as soon as you put a load on the shaft slows and stops.
Be great if we can find the way to build a generator that with have no back emf or drag! Sort of using DePalmas generator.
Then you can produce all the energy you ever need!
Mem.>>
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Sometimes naivity is funny, sometimes not,
Look at http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-794876184702452555
Who measures "1000W light bulb" what it gives out in reality?
Nobody!
Very dark room, nothing more.
khabe
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congrats for 2nd place in applied mechanics california state 2008 science fair
hi.. just found this, some of you might find it interesting:
CALIFORNIA STATE SCIENCE FAIR - 2008 PROJECT SUMMARY
Name(s) Austin Adee; Alex Thomas
Project Number S0801
Project Title: Rotoverter
Abstract
Objectives/Goals
The objective of our project is to see if electricity can be generated more efficiently than onventional methods. We hypothesize that using two three-phase motors, in a setup a "Rotoverter" electric energy can be generated more efficiently than conventional methods.
Methods/Materials
Materials: A steel U beams, copper wire, capacitors, switches, power meters, two AC three phase squirrel cage motors, Plexiglas, transformers, full wave bridge rectifiers, an inverter, and epoxy are used in our experiment.
Methods: To build our setup; weld the steel U beam in a rectangular configuration; open the electric
motors, and clean the bearings of grease; reverse the casing of one of the two electric motors, and
assemble them back together; wire the motors so that one is an alternator and the other a motor; wire the switches in series to the capacitors, which are parallel to each other; and wire the capacitor banks to motor and alternator.
Results
We successfully found an alternative way to generate electric energy more efficiently than conventional means. In the process of doing this, we generated more reactive power than is consumed. Reactive power can be described as energy that does net value of no work. Achieving a greater amount of reactive power than true power is not a new concept and is accomplished very easily. What's different about the Rotoverter is that we can extract some of this power which is considered imposable by definition. We are not sure how the Rotoverter works, but only that it does produce large amounts of reactive energy that can be extracted on a small scale. There are two probable solutions around this; either get a resistive load to match our resonating output, which in our case would be a 4.5kw light bulb; or get an inductive load such as a transformer, that does not break the resonance of the alternator.
Conclusions/Discussion
As of this moment, we have only produced reactive power, but at a much greater amount than real power
consumed. We have not yet experimented with the two possible solutions mentioned before because of the
lack of materials. Further experimentation may reveal that the reactive power can be extracted.
from http://www.usc.edu/CSSF/Current/Projects/S0801.pdf (http://www.usc.edu/CSSF/Current/Projects/S0801.pdf)
---
so here's another "yep, we got some reactive power running in our rotoverter circuit - and it should eventually be extracted" type thing.
what are your thoughts on this, please?
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Guys, Who says rotoverter does'nt work? I did it tried myself. I used 2 Australian made 7.5 hp motors as prime mover and generator respectively and I got output 7 times the input of 200 watts. Better try it yourself to disprove Hector's discovery. Don't be an asshole arguing without doing it yourself. I am a mechanical engineer and I did it ran infront of some engineers here in the Philippines. People here are the "see it to believe it" type like you. I'm betting my balls on it!
VAL
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Guys, Who says rotoverter does'nt work? I did it tried myself. I used 2 Australian made 7.5 hp motors as prime mover and generator respectively and I got output 7 times the input of 200 watts. Better try it yourself to disprove Hector's discovery. Don't be an asshole arguing without doing it yourself. I am a mechanical engineer and I did it ran infront of some engineers here in the Philippines. People here are the "see it to believe it" type like you. I'm betting my balls on it!
was that 7 times output the "out of phase" virtual current (was it VAR that they called it?) that some have managed to get circulating inside the setup, or did you extract it - and with which extraction circuit, please?
i think theres certain people who doubt anything related to the rotoverter, who would really appreciate some details on this whole thing. its nice to see at least someone on overunity.com actually doing something related to the rotoverter. btw,there was a more active discussion going in the rotoverter thread over at http://energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/
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hi, this is something that koneheadx created: and the video descriptions:
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=RzO_lzgfoKM (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=RzO_lzgfoKM)
"
This a step by step "hands-on" AC motor rotovertor conversion demonstration.
I eventually got this motor to run at 180 milliamps at 120Vac with no load on shaft with a 9uf run cap.
IN NUTSHELL:
1) Hook 3ph AC motor up to its HV 460V circuit shown on its label. (they usually use the 460V circuit with these 3ph type of AC motors in heavy industry and factories)
2) Connect AC power feed to only 2 of the 3phases, so that the AC power feed lines connect to line 1 and line 2 coming from the motor.
3) Connect run caps and start caps between line 2 and line 3 coming from the motor..
Note: Line 2 coming from motor shares a connection with one of the power-feed lines, and also one side of the AC run and start caps.
4) Adjsut run cap UF value to get lowest draw first at idle, and also when the shaft turns a load too.
For beginners, run the rotovertor simply on single phase 120VAC grid power (or 240V if that is what you have in your country)
Later on, run these on a DC to AC INVERTOR! Now you will then be running this motor on batteries - golf cart batteries are the norm, as they are a type of battery that can be discharged and charged everyday for 5years before they go bad - while regular car batteries can only do a few dozen discharge-charge cycles before they are no good.
For very advanced work with a rotovertor motor, use pulse width, voltage and freqeuncy adjsutment so you can really nail a super effecient rpm, voltage and power level for the particular load the motor is turning.
With these three modificationss to the motor (actually inside the invertor running it), you will most probably be able to acheive a self-running unit if you also have a very effecient no-lug type of generator on the shaft too.
go to my site:
http://www.geocities.com/koneheadx/ (http://www.geocities.com/koneheadx/)
look at link #16 for a rotovertor spinning a Bill Muller design of dynamo/generator
Also look at "circuit diagrams" link on my site too for the basic rotovertor circuit and some more advanced ones, which can make it so you can charge battery stacks at same time you run motor. "
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=nGGL7Hs0p5Y (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=nGGL7Hs0p5Y)
this is the 2nd half of the rotovertor demo.
This particular 3450rpm marathon-brand 3ph 2hp AC motor shown in the video I eventually got to run on .18amps (180milliamps) at 120Vac with no load on shaft, using a 9uf run cap.
The rotovertor is a discovery of Hector Torres and has been replicated and tested by hundreds of people since it was introduced publically around 8 years ago by Hector.
This sort of motor has the ability to actually "run itself" if you spin a super effecient generator, and also pull out power not only from the generator, but also what the AC motor itself in rotovertor mode makes in additional power from its third "virtual" phase - this phase works more or less like a "rotary transformer"
Study the rotovertor circuit and you will see that the third phase does not draw electricity, but in fact makes AC power itself that can be extracted.
Look on my geocities site for the rotovertor circuit in "circuit diagrams" link - also look at the circuit there in that link that uses a 2nd trigger-transformer to pulse-out power from that 3rd virtual phase at the motor's sinewave peaks to charge 2nd battery stacks so there is "no reflection" to the input power to the motor itself. This can also be done using a strobe-light light sensor trigger circuit too.
my site: http://www.geocities.com/koneheadx/ (http://www.geocities.com/koneheadx/)
Also look at link #16 which shows a 5hp 1850rpm rotovertor AC motor spinning a Bill Muller design type of dynamo/generator.
This generator should have its power-out pulsed out at the peaks of the sinewave that the coils prodduce to eliminate "lug" to the motor as it spins the generator.
Also look up lots of good rotovertor information at this site: http://www.panaceauniversity.org (http://www.panaceauniversity.org)
-----
also look through some of hsi circuit schematics either on the page he linked (geocities.com/koneheadx) or access them at
http://merlib.org/taxonomy/term/3806 (http://merlib.org/taxonomy/term/3806). enjoy.
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Esa
As usual an amazing amount of wonderful info Thanks, much to look at and learn
Oh BTW WITTS up? http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=6192.0;topicseen
Thanks again
Chet
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Hmm so anymore news about this? It seems like it's the most obvious case of free energy yet you don't hear a lot about it.
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Hmm so anymore news about this? It seems like it's the most obvious case of free energy yet you don't hear a lot about it.
well, it appears that someone made a RV Water Pump. (from http://energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/1507-roto-verter-7.html (http://energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/1507-roto-verter-7.html))
--
"I just completed a test on my 3 PH old water pump motor to run in RV modes. Here is my video link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3lfQSkaz4M (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3lfQSkaz4M)" YouTube - RV water pump-1
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"One more. This below is my test on RV modes water pump. I got better result now (only 100 mA draw current)."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E46HOfENYEA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E46HOfENYEA) YouTube - RV water pump-2
"built it based on Roto Verter documentation at panacea bocaf site."
"it is a 3 PH motor. This motor actually used as water pump motor with only have 0.17 HP at 220 VAC, 1.2 A, 50 Hz, 2850 RPM (specs) with 8 uF 450 VAC start capacitor. I hope later I will able to built a 4 or 5 HP motor which could runs a 1-2 HP dinamo or alternator. It will be very usefull for our energy saving and alternative."
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this system also works with sinlge phase motors as well so give it a try am mostly interested in feedback circuit neon .
if you read the sum of this post you have tesla's car figured out but type of motor may be inportant as not all induction motors are equal so keep this in mind as you discover what is happening be sure to list motor specs as it will be most helpful to everyone involved i have tried two motors and am on my third a three phase universal ge 5 hp with j winding class will have to change some configuration.
the single phase motors used varing start windings and were both ge motors with one being a continous duty and one intermittent coils of each were found to not be alike or giving rotoverter results on the continous duty motor so needed some reconfiguring run now at .5 amp and can still go lower to the voltage.
good luck to all in there attempts at conversion.
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All,
I have next setup on induction motor in RV mode. Here below is the video link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_p3y1g83MI
But why it's a humming sound appear when start cap connected to motor, and the sound gone since it disconnected/switch off from the setup ? Is there something wrong on my setup ?
Rev.
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Hi All,
After a couple of days to do some business I made a test on RV mode to have resonance effect on 2nd motor as alternator. I have 3 PH 3 HP motor that I used as a prime mover driving the 2 HP 3 PH motor (act as alternator) via a belt.
I found the main thing on the system is speed/RPM. If I could get speed with lowest power input, I will get higher voltage on the alternator. And I'm sure we could control the output frequency thru this speed too. We tune the capacitor to have lowest power input on PM with the fastest we can get to get power output.
Yes, I got it. My first target is to sure the resonance work on the alternator and I got that. Next target is to tune the system with my capacitor available. We'll se..
Here is the video link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZacyuiwekI
Rev.
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Hi All,
I bought a new 2HP 3 PH 2840 RPM motor to work in my RV Project. This motor drive my last 2HP 3PH 1400 RPM motor which will act as a generator. I coupled it by belt to get higher power output result. I got virtual circulating power output 2440 watt from 1300 watt input. May be it will give better result if I could tune the cap on the fly.
Here is the vid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOJcZSnS74o
Rev.
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Hi All,
Here is my last result. The best so far.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeSOzsUDk3g
Rev.
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Hi All,
Here is the test load of my last RV-Setup.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHmhBKPkgRM
Rev.
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Hi
I am planning replicate RV for my pool water pump.
please check this webside -http://www.wnysupply.com/index.cfm/fa/categories.main/parentcat/25431
also they are selling unit call Rotary Phase Converter, can I use this phase converter with running capacitor bank for RV replication, .
using only 115 volts instead of 230 Volts ?
regards
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Hi
I am planning replicate RV for my pool water pump.
please check this webside -http://www.wnysupply.com/index.cfm/fa/categories.main/parentcat/25431
also they are selling unit call Rotary Phase Converter, can I use this phase converter with running capacitor bank for RV replication, .
using only 115 volts instead of 230 Volts ?
regards
Hi Steve,
If I'm not wrong.. please correct it if I make a wrong understanding.
In a phase converter we need a 3 phase motor act as phase converter (called idler motor) which provide 3 phase power supply to other motor. The idler motor works in idle (without load). The run voltage is the same as the rating on plate motor.
Beside this, in RV-setup you work on 3 phase motor from 1 phase power supply on 1/4 of it's rating voltage. It's not always in idle, but could run in certain load up to 1/4 of the original power rating.
This is important to know the power (in watt or HP) you need in pool water pump application. You have to provide a motor with the power about 4 or 5 times larger than the original power requirement to get efficient system.
So I think you do not need above phase converter kit to make a RV-setup. The main requirement after the 3 phase motor are AC capacitors and switches.
Just my two cent.
Rev.
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Hi revizal
Please check this schematic http://www.wnysupply.com/index.cfm/fa/categories.main/parentcat/25431
same as RV setup except running cap are fixed and they are using 230 volts insted of 115 Volts
which they call static converter.Only reasonn I want to buy this kit because it has everything what I need for RV electrical set up.
Please advice.
I need 2hp for my pool pump.
I bought following
1)Baldor EM3770T 7.5 HP( if I need I can get 15 and 20HP . please advice)
2)Wagan 1000 Watt Slim Power Inverter , part # 2294(Which I will convert to VF inverter)
3) alternator- Pancake style 10 hp 48 volts permanent magnet DC motor , no cogging
4) alternator -output 300 amps at 14 volts -I disconnected the field and install neo magnet and I am getting same output.
Do you know where I can buy flyweels ?
regards
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Hi
I am trying to replicate the Rv,
Battery charge start resonance collector circuit , 12volt DC motor coupled with baldor 7.5 hp motor.
But having problem to locate Center Y.
Does any one know how to find Center Y in 7.5hp Baldor motor(EM3770T) ?
Please help..
regards
Chow
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@steve_chow
The pdf for your motor can be found here.
http://www.baldor.com/products/perfdata.asp?1=1&catalog=EM3770T&product=AC+Motors&family=General+Purpose|vw_ACMotors_GeneralPurpose&winding=07WGW721&rating=40CMB-CONT
What do you mean by Center Y.
Under RV, you need to connect the motor at the 460volts (high voltage) method and use one of the phases through a capacitor bank. Look at any of the photos here:
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Wattsups%27%20stuff/rotoverter/
But the most important spec of this motor is the rpm being at 1750. Usually RV drive motors are better at 3600 rpm because the generator side needs to turns at or near that rpm, so the specs of your generator will be important to understand.
You mention "no cogging" regarding your alternator. I really don't think that is possible. All alternators will give you drag as they produce output and this will ultimately reduce the rpm of the drive motor and increase amperage draw and that is one of the reasons a 3600 rpm motor is more suitable. But this will depend on the specs of the alternator.
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Hi
thanks for response..
My baldor motor RPM is 1760, and with std RV setup it takes about 40 watts to run without load with same RPM.
Alternator I am using needs about 1200 rpm to produce 14 volts, but when I coupled PM with alternator , PM try to start but stop...
am I doing something wrong ? or Alternator needs more HP ?
Alternator I am using is permanent magnet alternator/motor and it has no cogging when I rotate by hand...
Also i have a car alternator which I modified with permanent magnet...
Now I am trying to make RV setup using attached circuit diagram, but I am having problem to finding center Y in PM(baldor motor)
please advice...
regards
Chow
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@steve_chow
That diagram you are using is wrong. The line with the cap "L" should be removed and the line going left above the number 12 should be removed.
See the diagram shown below.
You need at least two caps in parallel but the start cap is on a switch. You switch the start cap on to start the motor and when it is running well you remove the start cap.
But the 4uf may be too small. Usually the caps I used are in the 10-15uf range 370 volts but with my capacitor bank, switching in and out the caps is easy to find the really best running situation. You may consider using the other 4uf as "L" and use it with the other in parallel.
As for the alternator, they are the worst things to use. No cogging is normal when the alternator is not loaded but them suckers are really stubborn to turn when they are fully loaded. Just short the positive and negative together and try to turn it.
For a load off the DC battery, you may consider using several 12vdc light bulbs and add them in parallel, one by one and as you add another bulb, see how the drive motor holds up. Use the bulbs with and without the battery connected since the battery could be causing the alternator to put out too much power and hence, it will stall the drive motor.
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Hi
I am using the same setup as you mention but having problem running alternator as load.
using capacitor bank for tuning, with no load it takes about 17 MF 370 Volts for run cap and using 270 MF 370 volts for start cap.
Power input from 12 volt battery is about 40 watts.
are you saying we can not use alternator as load in RV mode ?
I though As per RV 7.5 hp convert to 1.8 hp which should give at least 1k watts of power from alternator ..????
regards
Chow
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@steve_chow
We can never say for sure, like in your case you are using a magnet rotor and not the standard rotating coil like I have tried. Also my trials were with a 5 hp drive motor, you are using a 7.5hp.
For my standard alternator, I had even taken out and modified the regulator which gave me direct access to supply a variable voltage to the rotor coil, but even then the alternator just did not want to make juice unless you had real horsepower behind it. Alternators are serious shit and I would not use them again for anything but to use only the stator and work towards making a non-turning alternator.
Most RV set-ups use two identical motors, one as a drive, the other as a generator and the reason this works is because the generator is not really a generator but a motor that is being used as an inefficient generator, hence it will produce just enough juice and create not as much drag as an alternator.
Ever wonder why manufacturers don't use alternators in their gas run portable home generators. I would suspect that a generator coming from a home type gas generator would be the most suitable for RV simply because they were designed to be efficient.
It's a learning process and I surely do not have all the answers.
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@wattsup
I did test with RV setup..
PM - Baldor- 7.5 hp, 3 phase
Alternator -7.5 hp , 3 phase
Test data-
PM run with alternator without cap in alternator side.
input voltage =120 Volts
input current = 0.2 amps
run cap-=17.5 mic 370 volts
RPM~1765
PM run with alternator and cap 22.5 mic in alternator side
PM:
input voltage -120 volts
input current~2.2 amps
RPM ~same
Alternator:
Alternator output with 22.5 mic capacitor
output voltage = 208 volts
output current =13.6 amps
RPM~same
I am thinking to charge battery from alternator output but I need transformer 10:1 ratio
then I can get 20 volts AC with high amps to charge 12 volts battery bank.
But problem is I can not find the transformer which can stepdown 200 volts to 20 volts AC
Do you think I will get the same output from Alternator if I use load as battery bank....
If I do then I can get almost 2K watts of extra power !!!!! is it possible ?
please advice..
regards
Chow
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Hi Chow,
So you say you have an input of 264watt and are getting 2828.8watt from the alternator?
May I ask you how you measured the alternator output. I mean are the volts and amps in phase?
Lots of people measured a big circulating amperage in the Rv alternator. Problem only is that it is totally out of phase with the voltage.
Kind regards,
Steven
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Hi Steven
Alternator wired in Y , I used 142.5 mic cap between wire 1 and 3.
Current measurement from 1 and 3 about ~13.6 amps
Voltage measurement between wire 3 and 2 about 206 volts...
I was using 16 gage wire to connect Capacitor with alternator and 16 gage wire was almost melting then I had to change
to 12 gage , now running cool ...
Please advice...
regards
Chow
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@steve_chow
Good work. There are some things you have to know about but I am not the best guy to give you the most recent RV techniques. There is a member here named @ashtweth_nihilisti and in my book, he is the best one to comment on present RV. I have put a post in a new thread he just opened to refer him here.
His threads starts here;
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=7055.msg164581#msg164581
Before doing any talking about power measurements, etc., 3-phase to single phase, his first question will most likely be, did you read a good part of the RV information that is already out there?
I will still be here but would hope that Ash can give you better information at this stage.
Regarding AC to DC, here is a photo of a big bridge rectifier I used to transfer the single phase AC output of a generator to the DC input of a DC drive motor via 24 x 12 volts batteries. You might need one but for three phase.
Here is a link that goes over phasing basics and 3-phase rectifiers if any help.
http://www.windstuffnow.com/main/3_phase_basics.htm
Geez, this is the first time I am doing a two-way thread referral. Well there is always a first time. lol
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@wattsup
Thanks ..I will send mail @ashtweth_nihilisti .
I do have three phase bridge rectifier unit (150 amp) which I designed for my other project....
but now I need 10:1 transformer to reduce the voltage 206 Volts AC to ~ 20volts AC then
I can run through bridge rectifier to get ~15 volts DC.
Do you know where I can buy 10:1 transformer .....
regards
Chow
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@wattsup
Hi
I think you busy with Mylow HJ replication...
I did following test with RV setup-
Input - 120 volts 1.2 amps
Test 1-
Used three transformer with alternator output-
transformer output (converted to AC to DC)- 16.5 volts DC 1.3 Amp/phase which means I connected three battery with three(L1,L2,L3) diff phase and all batteries are charging without any problem , running cool..
Test-2
Connect L1,L2,L3 direct to AC to DC converter..
output - 242 volts DC 1.3 amp without load...
alternator temperature- warm......
So far no sign of OU...
regards
Chow
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Dam i forgot about this post please remind me in an EMAIL in future guys. Steve, please bring the description over to EVGRAY, we can cut and paste the solutions back here after that, but most of them are over at EVGRAY who will advise on your set up.
Please post and join here
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EVGRAY/
thx wattsup.
Just a note for beginners, note that the principle of the RV is to create VARS (reactive power) and transform them into usable watts BY THE RV'S METHOD IN THE COMPILATIONS.
If you loading it down in another way you will need to try other things, like step up up ratio's (belt 6-1 etc) frequency driving it (flywheel) etc. But its not intended to be OU this way.
Its very hard to tune BTW, but its been done twice, in fact ask these two guys what happened when they did it.
http://panacea-bocaf.org/rvtechnology.htm
Ash
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Hmmmm, just seeing something on a cam means nothing. I can easily fool people doing that with my current set-up and show a 3:1 o/u....but it's not usable. It's like the guy with the highly expensive d/c motor saying he did....not. If one of these guys will talk to me on the phone that states they have accomplished a loop, it'll fire my POS back up and try their way.
Just for the record as well. I built the self powered water pump that I'd read on this site in February. About $90 and 8 hours later another failed project. The science looked good to me but I was not thinking in the terms of hydraulics as is needed, at least I now understand how to evaluate these types of machines.
Also, the guy shooting a stream of water onto a paddle will never work. Yes, it will work shortly but the energy is simply stored in the water.....nothing else.
I know I sound negative, but it's disheartening to watch replication after replication of failed ideas only to find the so called inventor either lied or was simply wrong.
Rich
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Just a passing thought, but if they really have a running looped rotoverter then why don't they place it on ebay? That thing would easily sell in the thousands if not 10's of thousands of dollars. It does not take two days and $500 to build one of these systems so he'd be making probably over $1k per day...sounds like good enough pay to me.
Rich
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How long do you think it would take before the "boys" came around and shut down his little operation on ebay?
BTW looping an RV is dead easy anyone can do it. Just needs a bit of tuning thats all. OU has always been here but most are too lazy to look and try it.
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There is a whole lot of circuit sims going on over at EVGRAY now showing a loop, we are testing them also.
Ash
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You can call this „saving energy†when running a motor idle in rotoverter configuration.
A motor 5.5 kW at 50 Hz or 6.6 kW at 60 Hz (7.5 hp) runs on real power less than 4 W on one phase, so theoretically it can be run from a small battery.
To achieve such result the motor bearings have to be well cleaned and slightly lubricated, the fan and the gaskets have to be removed. This motor shaft stops turning ~ 2.5 minutes after the power is switched off.
This film shows the data: ~3 W on the watt meter (the active range is 100 W), 0,21A on the amp meter (left) and 20.14 V on the volt meter):
http://filmoj.info/laboratorio/esploroj/rv/RV_04/P1040484.MOV
more pictures in:
http://filmoj.info/laboratorio/esploroj/rv/RV_04/
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And here is the update, actually only the short film on youtube:
You may remember, this is an old experiment I did, trying to run 5.5 kW 3 phase, 400 V 1430 rpm motor on as little power as possible.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOAvE9_BObA
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i looked at this years and years ago but was unable to try it out,and i still cant, from what i understood is once you hook up a load to this system........it stops,.......
.....has anyone tried this or know whats really going on once you hook up a load ?.
thanks in advance.
Peace.
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all about rotovertor
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=NBPLR7LC
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=C59DKQDD
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=O7N40GBC
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=PQP7JQVU
clave ROTOVERTOR
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I tested shorting capacitors using the Hector's diode plug.
After that I switched off the thyristors and wanted to for curiosity, how little my 5,5 kW / 400 V, 50 Hz motor can draw and still turn the shaft at its nominal speed.
And the bearings were still with it's factory grease, not cleaned yet.
Watch the film, that I just uploaded:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3994T_0FBt0
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Hello,
I am new to rotoverter and I am sadly not (practitioner engineer). I had a look at a lot of links (pdf-files, videos, the peswiki etc.) and a few questions about rotoverter.
1.) Which is "now" the most advanced rotoverter project? The last posting is one year old, what is the actual situation?
Would be very nice, if you can help me/us.
2.) Is it necessary to have to study over weeks or months, to get an idea, if it is working? Is there a consensus in the community about rotoverter? Or do/work the most of you, on other topics as on rotoverter? If, yes, why?
Thank you.
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Welcome to OverUnity Twinkie. I have studied into the Rotoverter. It seems like the payback from having
to buy some HUGE 3 phase motors just to get some promised free energy doesn't seem worthwhile to most folks.
Most peple here would rather have something that generates electricity directly without
mechanical motors, bearings, pulleys, flywheels, pumps, chemicals, turbines, hydrogen, etc.
To see the ideal free electricity device (NO MOVING PARTS) click on the Link below. But so
far, nobody has been able to duplicate it. Nobody even knows where we can get a schematic.
http://video.google.es/videoplay?docid=167210479374903373 (http://video.google.es/videoplay?docid=167210479374903373)#
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Just to inform you that running rotoverter on even lower voltages, even if it is
shaft coupled with another motor, can require very little power.
Here, one of experiments I was doing yesterday:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7AJspQm1e8
Industrial motor 5,5 kW (at 50 Hz) is powered from one phase, runs (1452 rpm)
faster than standard rotation (1430 rpm) and consumes only 0,45 A at 14,5 V
which is 6,5 VA (probably less than 6 W).
The prime mover runs another motor of same type which is not loaded. The
friction of both machines is the only load.
It was running for half an hour and then stopped, probably the voltage went too
low, maybe 14 V only, that was too low.
Imagine how low power it would require if the bearings were ceramic.
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Hi, i want somebody help me to replicate the portable rotoverter to use for 3 refrigerators 110 volts or make 3 portable rotoverter for each refrigeratos. I think the portable rotoverter is the best for me being that i want to use something small, simple and powerfull and cheaper. and clean,the other samples of rotoverter are too much for me and for my needs. i have 3 phase with 9 amp each one. I am in Mexico so here is 60 hz.
I have 6 months translating and studing documents and i am makin a new resumen to find what is missing me to determine how to choose the motor, how to choose the rotoverter model to use appropriate for my needs.
I'v read the RE-OU v6-1, document in word how to convert electric motor in rv, The Energy saving aplications principles also the laymens_RV_STEP_BY_STEP3, I have saw the video ROTOVERTER koneheadx and also all the video from Prosperforall, and many more and i cant determine how to replicate portable rotoverter to use for saving money in energy. I am determined to do that.
I am not an engineer why is a little dificult for me.
Thanks very much.
Help me any way.
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cipriano
I found myself looking at the same topic this morning but was leaning towards capacitors instead for power factor correction. I have 5 soda coolers tons of flouo lights and with the way they go on off at different times and combinations Im guestimating about 60 % wasted energy. Soon as I can get my head wrapped around the cap thoery Im gonna try to transfer that to a Tesla pancake coil and hope that will do the power correction. Im not all that confident in caps. Im still trying to figure why charges would want to seperate in a cap.
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Another scientific toy run as rotoverter, 99% power saving.
An example of big power saving when (idle) running three phase motor of nominal power 5.5 kW (7 hp). This motor needs only 4 W of active power and 5.2 VA of virtual power. It is run from one phase, at 18 V, 0.29 A, capacitor used 55 µF.
The same motor when connected to 400 V three phase grid consumes 400 W. Power saving is 99%.
The motor cannot be loaded more. Almost all the power is used for overcoming the friction.
Based on rotoverter published by Hector Torrez.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUNrG9Btp_Y
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Rotoverter at first glance appears to be overunity but vars are not real power. voltage and amps must be in phase or they are not present at the same time. They need power factor correction added to all output measurements. All that is left for this to work is convert imaginary power to real power lol. lots of voltage with no current one millisecond and lots of current with low no voltage the next millisecond is not real power it is an illusion of power. Efficient resonance idling with no extra power is useless. Except to avoid the inrush current of the next startup. If your idle time is short it may be worth implementing into a working motor but not overuntiny and most likely better to just shut the motor off during idle times. Run capacitors are implemented to keep motors efficiently running under load and have been for a long time. Then motors can be shut off during idle no reason to leave a motor running rotoverter mode at idle if no work is being done just shut it off. Only a very small advantage to this RV mode and cost of switching in and out the rotoverter mode for a short idle is foolishness with the quantity of motors that could be in a single plant.
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Only a very small advantage to this RV mode and cost of switching in and out the rotoverter mode for a short idle is foolishness with the quantity of motors that could be in a single plant.
I'll give you an example where a motor, converted to RV, blows (literally) everything away.
Take a 120 VAC industrial fan, the portable ones used on warehouses, etc., which have a diameter of around 4 feet.
Those fans usually consume around 350 to 400 watts.
Now, take a three phase motor, a small 2HP, and convert it to RV. Idle watts at full spin, 1750 RPM, is about 40 watts (tested) after modded,
Now throw away that big fan motor and change it for the modified RV and tune the run cap.
You'll be running now at around 60 watts (with blades installed) at full speed. (tested)
There you have it. An RV fan, way more efficient that any other fan of it's size.
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this is a standard 3ph motor or samting else