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Author Topic: rotoverter for power generation  (Read 180342 times)

Offline mbell

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #15 on: December 29, 2006, 01:16:04 AM »
Hi Esaruoho,
Are you the person on the youtube video demonstrating the RV motors?
I was thinking that this would be a great idea to use in conjunction with the water hammer device.
The water hammer needs very little torque, just lots of RPMs.
Because of the size of the rotor in the water hammer, you need a fairly chunky motor, like the ones you have been showing. 
Now what if you couple the efficiency of a free wheeling 3 PH motor with a water hammer that is claimed to be 160% efficient?

Hot water, steam and lots of it, use it for heating, cooking, washing, tumble dryer etc.

Regards

Rob



Kingrs
     I have been thinking this same exact thing. I have been suscribed to the evgray group for some time now and what they have been doing is fantastic. I have a 10 HP motor here at work that I will be turning into RV. I plan on using the water hammer like what Griggs has to make steam. Then with the steam you could run a steam engine like the one from this link http://www.greensteamengine.com/  to make electricty. My only problem is I don't have the equipment to make the water hammer so I am working with a friend to see what I can come up with. If you couple the efficiency of the RV and the water hammer IMHO you could have a very cheap way to power your home.

Best wishes
Mike

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #15 on: December 29, 2006, 01:16:04 AM »

Offline ashtweth_nihilisti

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #16 on: December 29, 2006, 02:51:44 AM »
This type of thought has enabled many independent replicators to find further applicaitons and imporive their R and D. The RV is the RV, its what you can do with it by your own applicaiton that counts.

And this is thinking in the right directrion, apply it and imporive it will give you the options to do it, main thing also is to support it and sign the petitions on this page please (to support the RV's energy savings)

http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm

Guys please report your success and description so we can help and improve. After the New year im testing Norm set up, we have more efficient double coiled RV motos then Norm to try, if you dont have Double coiled mortors, we still can HALF the input down by using a circuit in the compilations on the NPO page

Here-

http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RV%20energy%20saving%20applications%20and%20R%20and%20D.doc

And here
http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/Advanced%20RV%20Research%20and%20development.doc
« Last Edit: December 29, 2006, 03:48:12 AM by ashtweth_nihilisti »

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Offline idnick

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #17 on: December 29, 2006, 03:44:01 AM »
"The water hammer needs very little torque, just lots of RPMs."

Both of the statments above by kingrs are wrong about the torque and RPM. It's info like that,  that makes it harder to build a machine because it's not going to work if it's underpowered or over over rev'ed. Then in the next sentence kingrs states that "Because of the size of the rotor in the water hammer, you need a fairly chunky motor, like the ones you have been showing."                                                       It's got to be one way or the other. Which is it?  ???

Dave

Offline esaruoho

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #18 on: December 29, 2006, 07:02:37 AM »
kingrs. im not  bellerian. link me to waterhammerdevice.
http://rootof.info/distro/RVTestingBasedOnDeliveranceOptions1and2.doc
RV Testing Based on Deliverance Options 1 and 2 by bellerian.

this should explain the deliverance rotoverter further.

heres some further comments from bellerian:
"The deliverance testing reported in this doc was not setup using pulsed timed discharging via SCR's timed from an inverter, but was direct output, constant feed, with nothing other than the phase adjustment due the passive components in the setup.  (well and the rheostat used to trim voltage on the FWBR setup, that could have been removed from the diode plug setup.)
 
A comment on the diode plug setup, it seems like it may work better if the cumulative C1 was replaced with ONLY C2/C3 as the parallel tank caps and then add the extra two diodes on the opposing caps fed over to the Top A and B output drops that are DC effectively due the charge blocking diode arrangement.  Adding the extra two diodes in addition to those shown in the Option 1 of the Deliverance schematic added between 20-30volts more on output from the diode plug setup.
 
The FWBR setup seems to show the best output to input ratio, easily powering the 2 x 60watt 120vac bulbs in parallel with 152VDC in the tank circulating 3.4-3.6amps while the input from the mains was at 120VAC 1.9-2.1amps.  I think I could have added two more bulbs in parallel to be close to drawing the voltage down to a reasonable level where the rheostat could be removed.
 
This all can likely be improved by building and using the zero time pulse discharge phase coupled to the AC being supplied by an inverter."


Offline MeggerMan

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #19 on: December 29, 2006, 09:59:53 AM »
Hi Dave,
Quote
"The water hammer needs very little torque, just lots of RPMs."

Both of the statments above by kingrs are wrong about the torque and RPM. It's info like that,  that makes it harder to build a machine because it's not going to work if it's underpowered or over over rev'ed. Then in the next sentence kingrs states that "Because of the size of the rotor in the water hammer, you need a fairly chunky motor, like the ones you have been showing."

Sorry, I wrote that without checking the facts first. It was just an idea thats all.
After visiting some of the sites mentioned above:
http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm
states the RV motor can run a generator (RV) at over unity.
So it looks very promising.

Regards
Rob

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #19 on: December 29, 2006, 09:59:53 AM »
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Offline idnick

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #20 on: December 29, 2006, 01:51:56 PM »
Hi Rob
I'd never heard of the RV motor before yesterday. But I have built the Griggs hydrosonic pump.(water hammer). And I liked your idea of combining the both. I believe it will work. Think I'll keep a closer eye on this thread.
Have a good day!!
Dave

Offline MeggerMan

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #21 on: December 29, 2006, 07:45:31 PM »
Hi Dave,
Quote
But I have built the Griggs hydrosonic pump.(water hammer).
Ahh, I sort of knew you had when I saw your reply.

Couple of questions:
When I emailed Hydro Dynamics about their shock wave pump in January this year, I assume this is the same as the Griggs Hydrosonic pump, I asked if the pump was capable of operating at over-unity.
Their reply was:
Quote
Dear Rob,

Our ShockWave Power Reactor is very efficient, but still is less than 100%.

Please, go to our website for more information. www.hydrodynamics.com

Regards,

Bijan Kazem

Have you found it to generate more heat than the energy used to turn the rotor?

Regards
Rob

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #21 on: December 29, 2006, 07:45:31 PM »
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Offline idnick

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #22 on: December 30, 2006, 12:08:20 AM »
Hi Rob

Hydro Dynamics and  Griggs Hydrosonic pump are basicaly all the same thing. I read somewhere on the net that Griggs argued with a couple of testers of his pump that it was not over unity even tho they said it was. I give Griggs alot of credit for that. I don't think he would tell anyone it was OU even if he knew it was way OU. That way he can stay in business with no questions asked.  ;)
And No I have not got my setup finished yet so  don't know what kind of heat to energy ratio I have yet.

Later
Dave

PS  We've almost turned this thread into hydrosonic  ;D

Offline esaruoho

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #23 on: December 30, 2006, 09:28:45 AM »
so, what did anyone think of that bellerian replication video?
or the norman wootan OU  RV results?
do let me know.

Offline MeggerMan

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #24 on: December 30, 2006, 01:04:43 PM »
Hi esaruoho,

Quote
so, what did anyone think of that bellerian replication video?
or the norman wootan OU  RV results?

Yes, fascinating, I could not find a video of the closed loop RV though.

I would be keen to give the OU setup a try but for the fact I am on the brink of testing the MEG device for the first test run.

I looked at the cost of a 3 phase motor (1HP) and they can be bought off ebay for about 80 GBP, also I looked at the price of a 3kW 110/240v generator suitable for connecting to a petrol engine for about the same price.
So its fairly cheap and I am fine with the electronics side of things.
I have a 1400W inverter (old APC UPS).

If the MEG does not work out then I am keen to give this a go.
Who knows, maybe the MEG may benefit from some of the ideas used in a single phase RV set-up.

Regards
Rob

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #24 on: December 30, 2006, 01:04:43 PM »
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Offline esaruoho

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #25 on: December 31, 2006, 10:53:28 PM »
What's a rotoverter?

from http://peswiki.com/index.php/OS:Rotoverter
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Image:D2_rotoverter01.JPG
The output device is an alternator which is driven by a three-phase mains-powered, 3 HP to 7.5 HP motor (both of these devices can be standard 'asynchronous squirrel-cage' motors). The drive motor is operated in a highly non-standard manner. It is a 240V motor with six windings as shown below. These windings are connected in series to make an arrangement which should require 480 volts to drive it, but instead, it is fed with 120 volts of single-phase AC. The input voltage for the motor, should always be a quarter of its rated operational voltage. A virtual third phase is created by using a capacitor which creates a 90-degree phase-shift between the applied voltage and the current.
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Image:D2_rotoverter02.JPG
The objective is to tune the motor windings to give resonant operation. A start-up capacitor is connected into the circuit using the press-button switch shown, to get the motor up to speed, at which point the switch is released, allowing the motor to run with a much smaller capacitor in place. Although the running capacitor is shown as a fixed value, in practice, that capacitor needs to be adjusted while the motor is running, to give resonant operation. For this, a bank of capacitors is usually constructed, each capacitor having its own ON/OFF switch, so that different combinations of switch closures give a wide range of different overall values of capacitance. With the six capacitors shown above, any value from 0.5 microfarad to 31.5 microfarad can be rapidly switched to find the correct resonant value. These values allow combined values of 0.5, 1.0, 1.5, 2.0, 2.5, 3.0, 3.5, ... by selecting the appropriate switched to be ON or OFF. Should you need a value greater than this, then wire a 32 microfarad capacitor in place and connect the substitution box across it to test higher values step-by-step to find the optimum value of capacitor to use. The capacitors need to be powerful, oil-filled units with a high voltage rating - in other words, large, heavy and expensive. The power being handled in one of these systems is large and setting one up is not without a certain degree of physical danger. These systems have been set to be self-powered but this is not recommended, presumably because of the possibility of runaway with the output power building up rapidly and boosting the input power until the motor burns out.


-------------------------------
i came across that piece of data from an older pdf. hope this helps.
i showed that pdf, to a friend of mine, who jsut said this:
"this is one of the coolest hacks i've ever seen"
"modifying a system to work in a manner different than what was originally intended so like modifying a motor to be a generator"
me: thats what the rotoverter is?
"the key to the RV is turning the stator around
the rest is just to get the electrical current in a usable form
the thing with the capacitors is to tune for power output
and the alternator is a generic way to produce AC, it's basically the same thing as in a car, in a car you have a belt spin the wheel of the alternator and the alternator makes AC
in RV the PM spins the shaft of the alternator and the alternator makes AC
AC then powers your appliances
if you wanted mechanical work, like powering a car you don't need the alternator
you can hook up the shaft to the wheels for example"

hopethis helps.

Offline wattsup

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #26 on: January 08, 2007, 02:52:02 AM »
Hello to all the RV guys.

I did a lot of reading on the RV on Dr. Adams's web site and his pdf file but for a non-electronic person, although good with complicated mechanical and logic systems, unfortunately reading his information was like getting a Vulcan mind meld. So many ideas being thrown around that I just got totally lost. So my question is simple. Can RV be applied to strictly DC Prime Movers and Generators and if yes, how? I am currently working on an RV system but with DC motors. If my Prime Mover can consume less current, and, if RV can enable the generator to develop less drag, this would be very useful to my system. It is currently loosing about 0.1 volts DC every 4-5 minutes and I am sure it is because of the drag on the generator side, and probably over consumption on the Prime Mover side.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.


Offline ashtweth_nihilisti

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #27 on: January 09, 2007, 01:31:17 AM »
Yes there are many mutations you can build with the RV and DC.

ill direct you to both these compilations
on this page scroll down and look for

) RV energy saving research and development (5MB)-----<<<<<(DC design in there)

3) Advanced RV research and development (5MB)-------<<<(vulcen logic there  ;D)


http://www.panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm

Offline esaruoho

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #28 on: January 09, 2007, 10:12:17 PM »
Hello to all the RV guys.

I did a lot of reading on the RV on Dr. Adams's web site and his pdf file

which url is this dr.adams website on? does it have lots of rotoverter info?

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Offline ashtweth_nihilisti

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2007, 01:40:55 AM »
No RV info on Dr adams site,  ;) We have a document in the RVreplication yahoo file section that has an Adam idea, under fisher and paykel.

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Re: rotoverter for power generation
« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2007, 01:40:55 AM »

 

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