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Author Topic: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws  (Read 15891 times)

Offline vikram_gupta11

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #75 on: January 21, 2018, 06:17:02 PM »
Dear Sm0ky2 sir,
As per my calculations it must work.if there is something wrong then please clarify it.
The scale length is 2 meter.
There is a 2 or 4 meter long tube.
Let's take tube length 2 meter.
This 2 meter long tube is mounted on left arm of seesaw in middle so it's 1 meter part is above fulcrum and 1 meter is below fulcrum.
A 10 kg.ball is resting at the bottom of the tube.
Now counterweight.
After calculating distance from fulcrum the counterweight will be 14.4 kg.to balance the seesaw as the distance of ball is 1.44 meter from fulcrum as the ball is in rest position in the tube.
Now the seesaw is in balanced position.
But I will take counterweight 20 kg.due to this excess counterweight the seesaw will be in tilting position at 90 degree angle.
Now when I lift up the seesaw then I will not have to calculate the input energy of  the 1 meter distance of tube which is mounted below fulcrum as I have added mass in counterweight.
Now calculate input using mgh formula
Mgh=10*10*1=100 Joule
But calculate output as ball will fall down from 2 meter height
Mgh= 10*10*2=200 Joule
Ball will again fall down from 2 meter height at the time of reversing
Mgh=10*10*2=200 Joule
So total output is 400 Joule but input is 100 Joule.
The very interesting point is that it is not important that the device must complete one cycle as ball has completed one cycle.
See the link.you can see momentum in the video.
https://youtu.be/TQr-MR2yj_U

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline sm0ky2

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #76 on: January 22, 2018, 06:38:15 AM »
The latch-pin is a nice addition, as it release the ball when you need it to

Offline vikram_gupta11

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #77 on: January 22, 2018, 03:07:48 PM »
Dear Sm0ky2 Sir,
See the sketch.as per sketch the tube length is 2 meter.
It is mounted in middle with left arm.
A10 kg.ball is in rest position in this long tube  below 1 meter from fulcrum.
The counterweight is 20 kg.
I have taken a ball as a counterweight in a 1 meter long tube.
The long tube rest 1 meter part is above fulcrum.
Now as per my calculations input and output.
If seesaw is in horizontal position and ball is in rest position below 1 meter from fulcrum then counterweight will be 14.4 kg.
But I have taken 20 kg counterweight.so seesaw will be in Vertical position.
Now input will be 100 Joule
As ball will be lifted up only 1 meter.
But output.
At first ball will fall down from 2 meter height
So output=200 Joule
Ball will again fall down from 2 meter height
So output=200 Joule.
So total output is=400 Joule
But there is more output from counterweight.
When ball will hit the top of tube at the time of tilting then the counterweight ball will also jump in the tube and it will again fall down.
If 20 kg.ball jump 75 cm in the ball then the output will be 150 Joule.
So total output will be 550 Joule.
There will be a great advantage if counterweight ball jump in the tube as device will get great momentum.


Offline vikram_gupta11

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #78 on: January 22, 2018, 07:18:35 PM »
The device get great momentum if counterweight ball jump in the air in the tube as the counterweight will become massless up to that time when ball is in air in the tube.
In this way the counterweight will also work as a output.

Offline vikram_gupta11

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #79 on: January 26, 2018, 12:14:03 PM »
I did an experiment to know the feasibility of device .when I drop the ball then the counterweight ball is bouncing in the tube to provide leverage.
This experiment is proving difference between input and output.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #79 on: January 26, 2018, 12:14:03 PM »
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Offline sm0ky2

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #80 on: January 27, 2018, 02:34:38 AM »
Only as an oscillatory device.
When turned in a complete circle,
The energy gained in the top half is lost at the bottom.


also the balancing seems important, it needs to be heavier on the
counterweight side, so at rest, the ball is above the axis.
otherwise, the effect is mostly lost.
But when it’s too heavy, the down-motion of the ball is fighting the
counterweight.


Still working on a demo model, it looks like the arm with the weight
should be angled, opposite to the angle formed by the end of tube to axis.
this way the machine can balance with both weights at the axis.




Offline vikram_gupta11

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #81 on: January 28, 2018, 08:35:56 AM »
Dear Sir,
As per sketch if the long tube is mounted very near to fulcrum with 10 kg weight and counterweight(13kg) is mounted 1 meter from fulcrum then I think input energy will be less.
There is a spring based brake system to store the energy of counterweight as well as to provide it momentum.
So input energy will be only 30 Joule if counterweight is 13 kg.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #81 on: January 28, 2018, 08:35:56 AM »
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Offline sm0ky2

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #82 on: January 31, 2018, 11:20:39 PM »
I am having some issues with my test rigs


First: when the ball falls to the right, most of the weight is balanced
         by the counterweight.
So the force it creates is very small.


Next:
When the ball falls to the left, it has more force but
We spend that by either compressing a spring or lifting the weight.
To get it back the other way.


Because the weight has moved, it becomes no longer balanced.


If we make the ball heavy on the right side,
and balanced on the left, so it resets itself
We spend energy to lift it from right to left.






Offline sm0ky2

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #83 on: January 31, 2018, 11:24:23 PM »
Perhaps the standard “wheel analysis” is not valid here,
because it does not make a complete circle.


we might need to look at this from a perspective of ‘absolute height’


i.e.: ball initial height and ball final height
This would give a more accurate energy diagram




Offline vikram_gupta11

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #84 on: February 01, 2018, 09:36:31 AM »
I am having some issues with my test rigs


First: when the ball falls to the right, most of the weight is balanced
         by the counterweight.
So the force it creates is very small.


Next:
When the ball falls to the left, it has more force but
We spend that by either compressing a spring or lifting the weight.
To get it back the other way.


Because the weight has moved, it becomes no longer balanced.


If we make the ball heavy on the right side,
and balanced on the left, so it resets itself
We spend energy to lift it from right to left.
Dear Sm0ky2 Sir,
See the sketch.if we use a lock mechanism under counterweight to prevent the falling of counterweight then the force will be increased very much but there will be no need of extra energy in the lock mechanism.
Second if we setup the device as per the sketch then there will be need of very less input .for example,if the entire mass of device is 25 kg then we will have to tilt it just 10 degree more so that the ball could fall down.
Please consider these two points.
First lock mechanism and second rest position of device in this particular angle as per sketch.
If counterweight is also a ball in a tube then it will work to provide momentum due to impact of weight.
A spring will work to bounce back the device after hitting with counterweight side so that the device could get back it's initial position.
Thank you Sir.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #84 on: February 01, 2018, 09:36:31 AM »
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Offline vikram_gupta11

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #85 on: February 01, 2018, 10:01:03 AM »
Dear Sir,
If the device is set at this angle in initial position then the input will be very minimal even if we calculate it's entire mass as there will be need of just 10 degree more to tilt it.
If the entire mass is 25 kg then input is  only 25 joule to tilt it 10 degree more.

Offline sm0ky2

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #86 on: February 01, 2018, 11:09:40 AM »
I get what you are saying, and can see/feel the momentum
But won’t this be absorbed by compressing the spring?


falling ball compresses spring, spring pushes the ball back up


our 25 J is (partially) returned to us when it resets
But we have to put 25 J more do go another cycle.
So we lose part of the 25 J each time.


Like in your video, when you use your hand to lift it up.

Offline sm0ky2

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #87 on: February 01, 2018, 11:12:26 AM »
It is a very strange way to transfer gravitational potential into momentum


But in experiments I am not able to achieve excess power, greater than the input.

I’m really curious now how a Chaos-Pendulum would perform,
if the weights were in tubes......

Offline vikram_gupta11

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #88 on: February 01, 2018, 05:11:41 PM »
Dear Sir,
We will have to use the absorbed energy in the spring to tilt the device.if we could use this absorbed energy then there will be no need of extra energy to tilt it  and device will sustain it's momentum.

Offline sm0ky2

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Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #89 on: February 01, 2018, 06:38:26 PM »
Dear Sir,
We will have to use the absorbed energy in the spring to tilt the device.if we could use this absorbed energy then there will be no need of extra energy to tilt it  and device will sustain it's momentum.


Even if we perfectly balance momentum and springs
There is still friction and wind resistance.
even though the total change in (mgh) =0
I think it is the same as just spinning a wheel


It just seems mathematically confusing.
I was incorrect by using the wheel analysis
To use that, the weights must revolve a full circle
around the axis.


The lever analysis gives the correct answer.
Change in E is -


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Why this seesaw is working against physics laws
« Reply #89 on: February 01, 2018, 06:38:26 PM »

 

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