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Author Topic: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope  (Read 2040 times)

Offline norman6538

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I have been intreagued by the Skinner machine and so decided to look into what potential there is in harvesting the centrifugal force power. So I started by rotating a weight on and arm attached to a battery operated screwdriver.
And that simple experiment gave me hope because it could lift more weight than the weight on the arm's leverage could lift.
Since I did not know the work in from the screw driver I replaced it with a weight on a string to drive the rotation so I could know by weight and distance how much work in was required. And likewise I could know the work out but the lifted weight times the lifted distance.

I made the rotating arm so it could move back and forth like a seesaw so that it could lift a weight. So here are my current measurements.
I use nuts and washers for weights since they can be changed easily.
I drove the rotation via 3 nuts (5/16 inch) on a string. I lifted 4+  (5/16 inch nuts   4.66 units ). The driving weights dropped 3.125 inches for each revolution giving 9.375 units of work in. The lifted 4.66 unit of weight lifted 1.125 inches giving 5.245 units of work out but I only lifted weight on one side so with the other side it would be 10.485 units out.  That is almost
112% output.
Along the way I found that tweaking the speed/weight on the string and
tweaking the weight on the arm and the weight lifted gave various results.
So with my very crude device presented here I hope you can see this for yourself and maybe improve on what I did.
I believe that what Skinner did was to cascade his OU multiple times. So I theorize that if we had 1:2 ie 200% cascading would indeed give some very significant power.
Here are some referenced to the Skinner machine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEat-8zOjlE  15 mins

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTR9r5-sENc  Mario Gudec annimation




Published on Dec 25, 2015
being discussed here
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/17195-william-f-skinner-1939-gravity-power-23.html
good stuff here....
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/17195-william-f-skinner-1939-gravity-power.html

http://overunity.com/14655/1939-gravity-power-multiply-power-by-1200/msg430676/#msg430676

Attached is a photo of my crude work. I had a lot of fun making and tweaking this  from scratch in about 2 days.

I see hope that there is power in the centrifugal principle...
Norman
 

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline norman6538

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2017, 03:47:11 PM »
Here is a little better photo that blocks out some of the extra things that are not part of the device.

Notice the clever u-joint that drives the device so that when the rotating
weight shifts left and right it still keeps turning. - very simple and effective.
The pivot is a 3/16 bolt at the bottom of the shifting wood and there are stops
 half way up to limit its travel.

Norman


Offline norman6538

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2017, 02:00:37 AM »
There are 3 variables to change. 1. driving down weight, 2. lifted
weights, 3. rotation weights. And by adding rotation weight I got the
efficiency up to 120%.
I posted this because of its simplicity and crude and quick and dirty construction. I never waste a lot of time in a beautify  machine that
does not perform. I used soft iron bailing wire, string,  and clementine box
 plywood and hot glue to hold things in place...
And I choose not to use measuring meters - just raw weight and distance
so there is no instrument calibration arguments.
So here is your chance to make OU in a day with the photo from this thread.

I only wish I understood how Skinner got 1200%. That might take another year or so.....my brain bursts come in spurts and this one has been a good burst in about 4 days.

Norman

Offline seychelles

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2017, 05:18:26 AM »
well when one listen to this utube one hears 1/8 hp motor power all his
whole work shop ,hacksaw, lathe..and that was done through this mechanical belt system..
 


Offline Acca

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2017, 07:20:53 PM »
Norman if you want help with the "Skinner" device only through private contact, I post here no more...Resident trolls will skin you to your bones and destroy you..


I will answer within 24 hours...


Acca..


ps Aron  has patents in mind and he is a shark after himself only, not to help anyone... at energetic forum.. look out..!

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2017, 07:20:53 PM »
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Offline norman6538

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2017, 10:10:32 PM »
Today I made a new version that balances the gravity factor out to zero and
then I get 192% work out vs work in.

I driving the rotation with
2 5/16 nuts traveling 3.125 inches giving 6.25 units of work in.
2 5/16 nuts are lifted 3 inches for 180 degrees and with 360 then
we have 2 x 56 = 12 units out....

That is way better than I was expecting.

That is strictly centrifical/centrifugal force only....

Norman
« Last Edit: September 01, 2017, 01:49:13 AM by norman6538 »

Offline FreeEnergy

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2017, 07:56:04 PM »
Today I made a new version that balances the gravity factor out to zero and
then I get 192% work out vs work in.

I driving the rotation with
2 5/16 nuts traveling 3.125 inches giving 6.25 units of work in.
2 5/16 nuts are lifted 3 inches for 180 degrees and with 360 then
we have 2 x 56 = 12 units out....

That is way better than I was expecting.

That is strictly centrifical/centrifugal force only....

Norman


Can you post a video of your machine in operation please? thank you.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2017, 07:56:04 PM »
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Offline norman6538

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2017, 02:32:26 AM »
My upload to youtube of my first build fails. I'll work on that.
I am now way past that...
Meanwhile focus on the basics.

I started with Skinner and then got curious about centrifical force
and went here.

 You have seen various centrifical forces..

 1. water in bucket swung over your head does not fall out.
 2. moon, satelites keep their orbit because centrifical
  force and speed and gravity are matched.
 
 No. 3 below really got me convinced...

 3. rope and 2 weights by wacky scientist

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3BSkMj1wLc
 Centrifugal Force : Dramatic demonstrations in Physics by Prof
 Julius Sumner Miller
 rope 1 gram lifts 10 gram at  8m 25sec
 
 4. screwdriver or drill rotating a weight goes wacko
     with its wobble....  can't take that to the bank....
   
II. Then I got more curious - how could I measure that to know how much work in/out

 5. I made the device above to measure centrifical force and got work in/out  120%   -- impressive.  Now I'm off an running....

As you can guess the device above is very sensitive to the balance
of the weight dropping to rotate the rotating weight and the weight
being lifted... The faster it spins the more centrifical force and the more
weight lifted....

It really works. The above design has some serious losses in it but I have measured it in two devices and both are OU - more work out than in.

You basically know all you need to know now...
But it needs some enhancements to get more power.
I'm working on them now...Then comes the power out
feedback. That is very difficult because the "make power" and
"apply power" must be two entirely separate systems -
they can't be coupled directly together very tightly like gears/belts.....
I have those plans but not yet built....
My brain bursts come slowly....but they do come...
 I have worked at this stuff for about 15 years and have boxes
 and boxes of stuff I made and tried.

I do rapid prototype to show the concept then I can
always go on to a Naudin type impecable presentation.

I am so excited I can hardly rest these days. I can't believe this
has been overlooked all these years...We fly airplanes everyday
and use satellites for internet communication but have not harnessed
centrifical force for power.

Norman
« Last Edit: September 04, 2017, 01:30:59 PM by norman6538 »

Offline Low-Q

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2017, 03:53:19 PM »
This reminds me of a vacuum centrifugal pump that first suck air to lift water which finally enters the pump.
With enough RPM's you can essentially lift anything with the centrifugal force. However, the further out the mass that is being rotating is (as the weight you want to lift moves upwards), you must apply energy to keep up the RPM, because angular velocity of that rotating mass will increase.
You can easily calculate kinetic energy of the rotating mass, and compare it to the potential energy in the weight you lift up from the ground. They should be very similar.


If you have reached 20% overunity (120% efficiency), then congratulations :-)


Vidar

Offline norman6538

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2017, 05:39:23 PM »
This reminds me of a vacuum centrifugal pump that first suck air to lift water which finally enters the pump.
With enough RPM's you can essentially lift anything with the centrifugal force.



Thanks for your comment Vidar.  I never thought that far.
I guess that is part of the Tesla turbine and the Schuamberger stuff.

My enhancements gave me 192%. I never expected that much.

Norman




However, the further out the mass that is being rotating is (as the weight you want to lift moves upwards), you must apply energy to keep up the RPM, because angular velocity of that rotating mass will increase.
You can easily calculate kinetic energy of the rotating mass, and compare it to the potential energy in the weight you lift up from the ground. They should be very similar.


If you have reached 20% overunity (120% efficiency), then congratulations :-)


Vidar

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2017, 05:39:23 PM »
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Offline Low-Q

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2017, 06:42:15 PM »
The Tesla-turbine is driven by high pressure air or water. As a pump, it is quite inefficient. Well, the Tesla-turbine is quite inefficient in both ways as it relies on friction between the discs. There are no actual solid obstacles that is pushed by the flowing meduim.


A centrifugal pump is what you find in vacuum cleaners. A turbine with blades :-)


Anyway, I look forward to your progress on your experiment, Norman. Watch people build things is allways fun  :)

Offline citfta

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2017, 07:25:00 PM »
Your information about the Tesla turbine is incorrect.  It does not depend on friction.  It works on the boundary layer effect and in fact is very efficient when used as a pump or as a turbine.  They are being used more and more in industry because of their durability and efficiency.  Here is a link to an article that gives some real data from actual builders of Tesla turbines. 

http://www.teslaengine.org/images/teba17p11.pdf

Respectfully,
Carroll


Offline Low-Q

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #12 on: September 05, 2017, 05:49:48 PM »
Thanks for the information about the tesla turbine, Carroll.


Vidar

Offline norman6538

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2017, 05:03:54 PM »
Ok folks, I'm going to move on to the skinner oval movement. I really want to get a measurement similar to this setup. I'd like to measure the Skinner trick.  I have learned much from this setup. 

So I put out the YELLOW CAUTION FLAG.

You can learn from this like me but I'm not sure its very useful.

I'm still not sure you can lift 2 times in the 360 degree rotation.
The mechanism to do that has too much slop in it to work well.

As I was waking this week I thought Skinner stuff and realized that he might
be using the amusement ride we liked as a kid - the whip. The car
went around an oval and when it got to the turn at the end the car swung out to the side and gave you a dose of centrifical force.....and I was reminded
that iceskaters did the same thing with a line and the skater at the end
went really fast. But he cleverly disconnected  the input from the output.
The only connection was the axle that the output was connected to by a bearing to.

Now I have to reread my Skinner notes and make up a test device.


Norman


Offline profitis

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Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2017, 05:46:19 PM »
"The mechanism to do that has too much slop in it to
work well."


Unless the mechanism can overtake the slop

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Skinner 1939 gravity machine centrifugal force tests and hope
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2017, 05:46:19 PM »

 

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