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Author Topic: Witness the Free Energy effect  (Read 7115 times)

Offline Theoretical Research

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #30 on: April 19, 2017, 12:17:14 AM »
It's not an easy task.

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #30 on: April 19, 2017, 12:17:14 AM »

Offline kEhYo77

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #31 on: April 19, 2017, 02:32:43 AM »

KehYo77
  In your drawing, if I understand, you are putting the HV AC output of the step up RF transformer (aka Tesla Coil) onto the capacitor plates. It is not being rectified to DC before application correct? Do you have any ideas about how this device is started and tested for effects?

Kind Regards
I just drew it from Akula's video of dismantling this TPU type unit, which was self-looped, providing 1 W output power.
I just find it interesting that polarizing space with HV AC E-field can induce currents in the vicinity around it.


Offline Zephir

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #32 on: April 19, 2017, 02:34:36 AM »
Quote
It's not an easy task

I would say that..  8) You could try to eliminate the current/voltage demands/loses of powering source, if you would make the ferrite capacitor a portion of parallel LC resonance circuit. Though I don't know, if it wouldn't make the draining overunity energy from it more difficult, after than.

Let say, you could achieve quality factor of resonance circuit ~ 20 (a typical value for RC circuits) you can supply your device with twenty-times smaller current (~100 mA), and the circuit will still oscillate at 1.9 A. But the ESR loses cannot be eliminated in this way anyway. You can attempt to measure them at lower input voltage/current and attempt to extrapolate them to expected working voltage in 15 kV range. It would help you to estimate, whether your device has a chance for success (i.e. the overunity).

Quote from: KehYo77
I just find it interesting that polarizing space with HV AC E-field can induce currents in the vicinity around it.

Yes, but this is common aspect of all Tesla coils - they induce currents  all around them. A more powerful Tesla coil will fill up whole your house with AC field like the waveguide. It can form sparks and ignite fire at the places, where you wouldn't expect it (not to say about destruction of common electronics in sight).

Offline Theoretical Research

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #33 on: April 19, 2017, 05:20:27 AM »
Zephir, I don't want to mislead you. You're mixing two completely different devices. Here's my quote,

I hate spending time posting at forums. For anyone who works without my guidance trying to see the free energy effect, you MUST first test your entire setup in spice. There are a lot of gotchas. For example, signal gen leakage signal is out of phase with the voltage from the free energy effect. So if your sig gen produces say 20Vpp @ 900KHz, which causes a 2mV leakage signal, and the FE effect is 0.4mV, then you're not going to see much change when rotating the device relative to earth, about 50uV. That's why you need my guidance or you need to seriously know what you're doing and spend a lot of time thinking it out. As for self-runners, when you have a good core and everything's correct with 15KV+ on the core cap you should in the very least see 2V output with at least a few watts.

The 20Vpp @ 900KHz reference is talking about the free energy effect experiment, not the self runner. The 15KV is the self runner. It's not advisable to do the self-runner at 900KHz.

If you want to produce 15KV, efficiently, on the 20pF core cap, then you will want to find a good high permeability core. My first circuit using an amidon core (20uF, 2.3 ohm non reactive, @ 75KHz) produced 15KV on a 20pF cap with 2.6W core loss and 0.5W wire loss. It only gets better after that, my friend. Find a better core, better design, and you can get below a watt. Lower the frequency, even less loss. Now the not so easy task has become easy. :)


Offline Zephir

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #34 on: April 20, 2017, 03:03:45 AM »
Quote
If we place that charge inside a magnetic core/toroid, the charge magnetizes the cores in the same way electrical current flowing in a wire through a core would.  ... My first circuit using an amidon core (20uF, 2.3 ohm non reactive, @ 75KHz) produced 15KV on a 20pF cap with 2.6W core loss and 0.5W wire loss.

Well - but AMIDON cores are nonmagnetic ones, many of them are even composed of iron dust, so that they're conductive. Your first picture above illustrates yellow AMIDON core, which is just composed of iron dust It's insulated with thin layer of varnish, so it's surface isn't conductive - but you cannot create 15 kV voltage difference on block of iron dust molded with ceramic or epoxy.

So you have to use ferrite core (this one without varnish) and a pair of windings: one for magnetization of core, the second one for draining voltage from it. Or are you telling me, that the plain voltage pulse across material induces magnetic field within ferrite or ferrite dust? Why it should do it - and in which direction such a field should be oriented with respect to voltage pulse? Without additional magnetic field such a situation would be solely symmetric.

I hope you didn't push a current through a layer of iron dust with using of high voltage pulse and didn't detect the magnetic field induced with this pulse by coil. This would be very lame outcome of your alleged overunity - but everything is possible at this very forum... ;-)

Why not to draw some circuit scheme finally? If you would document your alleged experiments completely/properly, you wouldn't have to support anyone here - no matter if publicly or via PM. It would save your time - and our one too..
« Last Edit: April 20, 2017, 05:31:39 AM by Zephir »

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #34 on: April 20, 2017, 03:03:45 AM »
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Offline vasik041

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #35 on: April 20, 2017, 10:24:22 AM »
According to the standard model, applying ac voltage to the cap should NOT produce a voltage on the cores winding, but it does exist.

According to "standard model" there is magnetic field inside capacitor with all the following consequences...

http://teacher.nsrl.rochester.edu/phy122/Lecture_Notes/Chapter35/chapter35.html


Offline Zephir

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #36 on: April 20, 2017, 07:19:14 PM »
Quote
According to "standard model" there is magnetic field inside capacitor with all the following consequences

I also got into the same conclusion: even if the core would be completely nonconductive, some stray AC current should be detectable around capacitor, i.e. around ferrite. Even without theory of some displacement current and similar stuffs - because: why it shouldn't be? The plates of capacitor serve as a dipole antenna spreading oscillating EM field between them. Why this field couldn't be detectable with common coil detector at every place of volume between capacitor plates?

Therefore the stray capacitive AC current should be detectable with coil even without any current leaking through ferrite. This doesn't mean, that @Technical_Research couldn't be on something - but the inductive source of output voltage should be definitely subtracted from results in his experiment.

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #36 on: April 20, 2017, 07:19:14 PM »
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Offline ARMCORTEX

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #37 on: April 20, 2017, 08:37:39 PM »
Zephir you came to no conclusion.

You dont even understand differential equations, nor do you have a single overunity design to your name.

You are gonna talk on this forum for the next 10 years I know it.

Offline Vortex1

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #38 on: April 20, 2017, 08:49:52 PM »
The coil windings in TR's device are 90 degrees different than shown in the  drawing just posted by Zephir reply #36.

In other words, the coil is not between the capacitor plates, but forms a loop that encompasses the capacitor plates.

So just turn the coil in that drawing 90 degrees.

Regards

Offline Zephir

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #39 on: April 20, 2017, 08:49:54 PM »
@Armcortex: I see, A) how long you're posting here and B) which overunity design do you have (link)?

Quote from: Vortex1
The coil windings are 90 degrees different than shown in the  drawing just posted.

You're perfectly right, the coil perpendicular to plane of capacitor plates would capture only subtle tensor component of passing capacitive current. Sorry for misinterpretation of geometry of @Technical_Research's device.

The existence of the displacement current component is indisputable, but it cannot have large practical meaning here - we all know, that the output signal from ferrite coil based radio ceases to zero, once we keep its wrong orientation with respect to transceiver. So that once we measure substantial signal under such a situation, then something would be wrong with our interpretation of Maxwell's equations. What @Technical_Research is saying in essence is, his ferrite not only detects radio-signal during wrong orientation with respect to transceiver, but it is even able to achieve overunity during it.

One explanation of this controversy could be just the Floyd Sweet (1, 2, 3) and Manelas effect, which I mentioned above. At high intensities of electric field the magnetic domains within ferromagnetic materials can be reoriented in similar way, like with passing magnetic field (which is opposite of ferroelectric effect in essence). What Floyd/Manelas is saying, with proper electric pulse the magnetic domains within block of ferrite could be reoriented in such a metastable way, they will create a new Bloch wall boundary within their volume and structured magnetic field capable to levitate magnetic bodies around it (between others).

In my theory the overunity may follow from metastable reorientation of ferromagnetic domains (analogy of negentropic phenomena like the undercooling or overheating). The return of magnetic domains into their equilibrial state can be assisted with vacuum/thermal fluctuations of the material, which would exert an usable work in this way. These non-equilibrial negentropic phenomena (which are all around us) can therefore serve as a key for practical utilization of overunity in analogous way, like the equilibrial phenomena are already utilized for entropic transitions and conversion of energy in accordance to thermodynamics laws (Carnot cycle for example).

The metastability of magnetic domains can be observed easily as so-called magnetic hysteresis, magnetic delay (viscosity) and Barkhaussen noise effects. During changes of magnetic field the magnetic domains of ferromagnets don't follow the changes of magnetic field smoothly, but they reorient itself just after while in step-wise manner - these jumps in magnetization can be detected with coil wound around material. In my theory just the moments during which the magnetic domains "wait" for their reorientation under tension can be utilized for conversion of heat into electric energy against II. law of thermodynamics and into drawing "free energy" from it.

If this theory is correct, then we should detect the Barkhaussen noise from ferrite rods not only during their magnetization, but also during its polarization within electric field in similar way, which @Technical_Research is using. Sweet recommends the usage of barium ferrite for it, which is more conductive than the common ferrites used today.

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #39 on: April 20, 2017, 08:49:54 PM »
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Offline Zephir

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #40 on: April 21, 2017, 03:22:37 AM »
@Vortex1 kindly pointed me again to the fact, that the coil collecting output signal should be placed over capacitor plates, not beneath them. But because the device requires high AC voltage at the capacitor, I'd recommend to decouple the coil and capacitor completely and to measure output signal from longer ferrite rod, where the capacitor can be shielded from induction coil with grounded cover. This will eliminate the stray current, which @Theoretical_Research did talk about at the beginning and the need of their complex separation (FFT?) from output.

Or you can measure the signal from another arm of ferrite core, than this one, which you will use for energizing with capacitor. Such an arrangement will indeed decrease the power output, because portion of ferrite volume will not be energized anymore - but it will eliminate the risk of leaking of stray currents from capacitor into the coil.

Offline Theoretical Research

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #41 on: April 21, 2017, 04:23:41 AM »
Hi guys. Sorry if there's any confusion. The first post in this thread shows a photo of the first core I used for the EGS effect experiment.

http://overunity.com/17236/witness-the-free-energy-effect/msg504603/#msg504603

Hopefully it's clear in the photo that the outter core has copper foil (connect to ground), and the inner part of the core also has copper foil. The two copper foils are not connected to each other. See the link for LTspice file if you're interested in building the EGS effect experiment. It is extremely important to enter all the correct parameters in the spice file according to your core and equipment, even your scope probe capacitance. Generally speaking probe cap in 10X is 12pF and 1X is 120pF, but can vary a lot. It is extremely important to measure the core inductance and the capacitance of the two copper foil plates at the frequency you will be using. LCR meters will give you incorrect readings because that's usually low frequency inductance and capacitance. Again I only recommend using the tv high voltage flyback rectangle cores. I'm certain there are much better cores, but they're the best ones I've tested. Measure the resistance of the core with your DVM to be certain it's not a good electrically conductor. Place your DMV leads near each other. It should be over 100Mohm.

LTspice file
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-xHtkgb2eiJM2VFaVFLR1h2d2c


When time permits I'll pass on the digital EGS effect experiment LTspice circuit.


Offline Zephir

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #42 on: April 21, 2017, 06:22:36 AM »
Hi, Theoretical Research,

thank You for your attention and kind support...:-) I'll check the Spice file for sure.

Quote
It's difficult because the electro-gravity-space effect voltage is extremely small compared to the voltage on the capacitor, which produces significant leakage due to stray capacitance.

What do you say about my proposal for elimination of the stray capacitance by separation of coil and capacitor with shielding? Will the effect still persist in your device? It should..

Offline vasik041

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #43 on: April 21, 2017, 01:22:06 PM »
Hi guys. Sorry if there's any confusion. The first post in this thread shows a photo of the first core I used for the EGS effect experiment.

http://overunity.com/17236/witness-the-free-energy-effect/msg504603/#msg504603

Hopefully it's clear in the photo that the outter core has copper foil (connect to ground), and the inner part of the core also has copper foil. The two copper foils are not connected to each other. See the link for LTspice file if you're interested in building the EGS effect experiment. It is extremely important to enter all the correct parameters in the spice file according to your core and equipment, even your scope probe capacitance. Generally speaking probe cap in 10X is 12pF and 1X is 120pF, but can vary a lot. It is extremely important to measure the core inductance and the capacitance of the two copper foil plates at the frequency you will be using. LCR meters will give you incorrect readings because that's usually low frequency inductance and capacitance. Again I only recommend using the tv high voltage flyback rectangle cores. I'm certain there are much better cores, but they're the best ones I've tested. Measure the resistance of the core with your DVM to be certain it's not a good electrically conductor. Place your DMV leads near each other. It should be over 100Mohm.

LTspice file
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-xHtkgb2eiJM2VFaVFLR1h2d2c


When time permits I'll pass on the digital EGS effect experiment LTspice circuit.

Hi Theoretical Research,

It would be nice if you can draw simple diagram to illustrate your setup.
I still not sure what you propose to test.







Offline Vortex1

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #44 on: April 21, 2017, 03:06:20 PM »
Shielding as suggested by Zephir is certainly a good idea and worth exploring, in fact the whole device should also be foil shielded to eliminate stray mains and other interference.

You may be interested in my early experiments with a core here under username ION:

http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=302.msg60861#msg60861

I am considering using a simple passive bridge arrangement where the output signal is nulled against the input signal in the hopes of higher differentation of the gravity signal.

This can be accomplished simply with a multiturn potentiometer across the driving source. One end of the coil output comes to the slider of the potentiometer. Proper phasing of the coil should allow  for a null signal when the potentiometer is adjusted to match the coil output. Then variations of position should yield a reasonable signal.

With the addition of some simple R's and C's even the phase can be nulled. The final output can be further amplified if desired or necessary. An op amp can also be used to null the signal against the drive, but I like passive.

Regards

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Re: Witness the Free Energy effect
« Reply #44 on: April 21, 2017, 03:06:20 PM »

 

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