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Author Topic: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1  (Read 2155 times)

Offline ramset

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Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« on: April 08, 2017, 09:31:33 PM »
here will be a gentleman's rules Terms of service investigation into the claims   [ 'supported claims"]
of member Synchro 1




I leave the floor to Synchro ...


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline synchro1

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2017, 01:24:02 PM »
here will be a gentleman's rules Terms of service investigation into the claims   [ 'supported claims"]
of member Synchro 1




I leave the floor to Synchro ...

@ramset,

You're a complete backside!



Keep it clean guys.
TM
« Last Edit: April 09, 2017, 02:09:03 PM by tinman »


Offline citfta

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2017, 01:55:35 PM »
Time to enforce the TOS!

Offline ramset

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2017, 04:01:28 PM »
well
since Synchro has chosen the Low road
I have chosen to attempt to understand his claim
since soo many readers here [myself included]

don't understand the claim?

Allen has been "flagged" in the past for poor conduct, I never had much to do with him
and always tried to share his thoughts with experimenters here [specifically member Luc[Gotoluc]
when he was working on Floor's work....

I also never asked for him to be "flagged "

here is his most recent thought on his claim from energetic forum

I will post the link here to energetic thread

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20714-magnetic-field-bifilar-pancake-coil.html

Bifilar Coil for Electro-Magnets

-Allen
Quote-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

These two videos share a basic underlying principle; The bifilar and single wire nail core solenoid coils in the first video were both "Shock Pulsed" before the wire ends were attached to the battery electrodes. We can see how the solenoid coils were pulsed in the 48 Hex nut locking video that follows:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mxtwS2OsaA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeJ5wHBpaf4

We know that the serial bifilar coil can cancel self inductance, and also that the single wire is not an inductor.

end quote

I honestly don't know if Synchro will contribute here
but understanding this claim would be good for the community.

respectfully
Chet K


Offline ramset

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2017, 06:11:29 PM »
here is one unanswered question from Synchro


Which way does current flow in a Ruhmkopff Secondary Coil when the current's interrupted in the primary and can you define "Negative Current"?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2017, 06:11:29 PM »
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Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2017, 07:58:24 PM »
here is one unanswered question from Synchro


Which way does current flow in a Ruhmkopff Secondary Coil when the current's interrupted in the primary and can you define "Negative Current"?

That strawman "question" has been asked and answered, several times already, and the answer is fully contained in Faraday's Law of Induction and Lenz's Law:

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/electric/farlaw.html

And current is the flow of charge. Whether you want to call it "negative" or "positive" depends entirely on your reference point and your conventions. In England people drive cars on the left side of the road from the perspective of the driver looking forward. This is a convention. If a passenger is facing rearwards, the car is driving on the right side of the road from the passenger's perspective. This is a reference point. "Conventional" current direction is a result of a "guess" made by Benjamin Franklin, before it was understood that the electron is actually the carrier of what we call (reference point) the unit _negative_ charge, and it is this negative charge that flows in metal wires in an electric circuit. So we are stuck with Franklin's convention, or guess, that current flows from the Positive pole of a battery to the Negative pole, when in fact we now know that _charge_ actually flows the other way, from the pole or position that has an excess of negative charge, to the place or pole which has an excess of positive charge (which is really a _shortage_ of negative charge in almost every case.) Convention and reference point.

Faraday's law tells us that when a magnetic field is CHANGING over time ... this is what is meant by the differential d(B)/dt ... there will be an EMF (voltage) induced in conductors within that changing field that is proportional to the rate of change (the slope d(B)/dt) and Lenz's law tells us that the polarity of this EMF will be in the direction to oppose that change (the minus sign of the equation -E=d(B)/dt.) 

In systems like electrolysis or electrophoresis or battery chemistry, charge can be transferred by ions (charged partial molecules) which can travel in opposite directions across a potential (voltage) gradient, with positively charged ions going one way and negatively charged ions going the other way simultaneously. Convention and reference point.

So in the strawman _secondary_ coil subjected to the pulsations of a _primary_ coil, or even when a _single coil_ is subjected to an alternately growing and falling magnetic field ---- that is, the SIGN of the slope d(B)/dt changes from negative to positive and back as B grows and shrinks -- the induced EMF also reverses SIGN back and forth, indicating an alternating current response.  This however is different from the case where a steady state current through a coil (dB/dt = 0, no change in magnetic field, horizontal or zero slope) is interrupted (B is falling so d(B)/dt has negative slope), which as we have seen in demonstrations over and over, causes a reversal of the _sign_ of the EMF (voltage) produced in accord with Faraday's Law and Lenz's Law, which causes the current to continue to flow in the _same direction_ as before.

Why do you think engineers and circuit designers put a so-called "flyback" diode across a relay coil, "negatively biased" with respect to the DC current used to actuate the coil? In which direction does current flow through this diode when the current to the coil is interrupted? In my demonstrations I use the LED as the "flyback diode" to show clearly and unambiguously in which direction the current flows when the magnetic field is decreasing due to the supply current being interrupted.

You can find literally thousands of illustrations of this if you bother to look. And flyback diodes are used in many devices we all probably use every day, to give that current some place to go so that the EMF (voltage) induced by the collapsing field doesn't rise to the point of damaging some component.


Offline synchro1

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2017, 08:52:26 PM »
I completed my measurements on Tesla's bifilar coil for electro-magnets and posted my final conclusions on "evostars" thread at Energetic Forum as Allen Burgess.

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2017, 08:52:26 PM »
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Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2017, 09:27:43 PM »
And how do you explain the results of my two LED demonstrations? And how do you explain the ubiquitous use of flyback diodes as shown in the above diagram (and thousands more on google images)?
 
Current flowing in both directions at the same time in a wire? Then why don't both LEDs light up at the same time? You are doubling down on a losing hand.

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2017, 09:33:40 PM »
Quote
We know that the serial bifilar coil can cancel self inductance, and also that the single wire is not an inductor.

YOU may "know" that but your "knowledge" is wrong.

http://www.consultrsr.net/resources/eis/induct5.htm

Quote
Even a single, straight piece of wire has some inductance!
We generally associate inductance with a loop or coil of wire. However, even a straight piece of wire, or your electrode, has some self-inductance. This can be important if you are dealing with low impedances (< 1 ohm) at high frequencies (> 10kHz).
[/left]
and many many other references and calculators can be found.

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2017, 09:42:30 PM »
Here is another claim of the member Synchro1:

@evostars,

Discharging a capacitor is like decanting water from a five gallon jug; Slow starting, followed by a strong gush  at .67, tapering off to a slow flow: Charging exactly the reverse, max charge rate at .33 capacity:
(emphasis mine)

with which he posted this _correct_ graph which immediately refutes his own claim:

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2017, 09:42:30 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2017, 11:24:04 PM »
Here's another claim, just made today.

@Tinman,

Current reverses direction and travels in the same direction at the same time like the 60 Hz A.C. current in our overhead transmission lines; Like boarding a bus and moving toward the rear while the bus is accelerating forward. It may appear to a stationary observer that the bus passenger is standing still.

(emphasis mine)

So why don't both LEDs flash in my Coil Current Direction (2) demonstration? 

And I'll bet that a lot of power distribution system engineers would be very surprised to hear that electrical current in wires flows in two opposite directions at the same time.

Of course if some solid experimental proof exists of this claim......................  we all would like to know about it. 








Offline AlienGrey

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2017, 07:45:57 AM »
Here's another claim, just made today.

(emphasis mine)

So why don't both LEDs flash in my Coil Current Direction (2) demonstration? 

And I'll bet that a lot of power distribution system engineers would be very surprised to hear that electrical current in wires flows in two opposite directions at the same time.

Of course if some solid experimental proof exists of this claim......................  we all would like to know about it.
Ha, Ha! you do know some of these people are anly ten years old ;) yeah!
How about doing a test on fly back while your on the subject, find out the min/ max pulse width for maximum BEMF in voltage or energy return, in other words is it possible to get a 'gain or not' ?


Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2017, 11:52:42 AM »
 :D Well, the answer to the first part is right there in Faraday's Law of Induction.
 
-E=d(B)/dt     

So to maximize E, you want to maximize the change in B and/or minimize the change in time. This means it isn't the pulse _width_ that is most important for high EMF, but rather the pulse rise and fall times for a given current in the pulse. High currents coming on and going off in the minimum amount of time. The pulse _width_ will then be important (in the form of frequency and duty cycle of pulsation) to allow the RLC bits enough time to charge/discharge to the required degree before the next pulse comes along. A well-designed Tesla Coil of modern form does all this explicitly, and it is the reason why Tesla spent so much time on spark gaps of various kinds.

Is it possible to get a "gain" or not? Well that all depends on what you mean by "gain". Certainly you can push the EMF or BEMF to ridiculously high voltages by using fast rise/fall times. By the right combination of frequency and VRSWR (voltage rise by standing wave resonance) can you entrain extra energy from "somewhere" (environment, space, vacuum, water, ten-year-olds, etc)... well, that's the 64 dollar question, isn't it.   ???

(But I wouldn't put my money on the ten-year-olds.)   ;)

Offline AlienGrey

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #13 on: April 10, 2017, 03:26:30 PM »
:D Well, the answer to the first part is right there in Faraday's Law of Induction.
 
-E=d(B)/dt     

So to maximize E, you want to maximize the change in B and/or minimize the change in time. This means it isn't the pulse _width_ that is most important for high EMF, but rather the pulse rise and fall times for a given current in the pulse. High currents coming on and going off in the minimum amount of time. The pulse _width_ will then be important (in the form of frequency and duty cycle of pulsation) to allow the RLC bits enough time to charge/discharge to the required degree before the next pulse comes along. A well-designed Tesla Coil of modern form does all this explicitly, and it is the reason why Tesla spent so much time on spark gaps of various kinds.

Is it possible to get a "gain" or not? Well that all depends on what you mean by "gain". Certainly you can push the EMF or BEMF to ridiculously high voltages by using fast rise/fall times. By the right combination of frequency and VRSWR (voltage rise by standing wave resonance) can you entrain extra energy from "somewhere" (environment, space, vacuum, water, ten-year-olds, etc)... well, that's the 64 dollar question, isn't it.   ???

(But I wouldn't put my money on the ten-year-olds.)   ;)
Hi, Mr Tinsel, i'm aware of the characteristics you mention above but I do so hate reinventing the wheel so to speak, you must have noticed some of Nelson's experiments he calls 'electron traps' I would have thought you might have some 'light' to through on this subject, with your background as we are still learning. 

Regards AG


Offline ramset

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Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2017, 03:44:55 PM »
AlienGrey
sir,
not trying to speak for TinselKoala here, this Topic "Nelson circuit"[or other name ??] will be opened soon [with Nelson's permission [already approved]]
and some have asked Tinsel for a build up of this circuit ,for discussion here so as to learn
what is possible there [others will be building too]

it will be a moderated topic [been much disrespect of Topics lately Stefan will be fixing that soon ].

respectfully
Chet K

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Investigating the claims of member Synchro 1
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2017, 03:44:55 PM »

 

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