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Mechanical free energy devices => mechanic => Topic started by: vineet_kiran on May 17, 2016, 11:05:09 AM
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http://contest.techbriefs.com/2016/entries/automotive-transportation/6521-0506-151410-atmospheric-pressure-engine-using-sponge-piston (http://contest.techbriefs.com/2016/entries/automotive-transportation/6521-0506-151410-atmospheric-pressure-engine-using-sponge-piston)
Any thoughts on this experiment?
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@Vineet_Kiron
Greatings
My observations
1. Compressing the sponge will only press the air that is inside the sponge,
from in side the sponge to out side of the sponge (into the surrounding cylinder).
This will not change the amount of air that is inside of the cylinder.
2. Pulling the central rod downward will reduce the total volume of material inside
the cylinder. This is because the volume of the rod that is pulled through the air tight pad is
some amount of material removed from the cylinder. The "emptying of the central rod" from the
cylinder will create a little bit of a vacuum inside the cylinder.
3. The pressure of the surrounding air will then be able to push the piston into the cylinder, by
an amount that is equal to the volume of the central rod which you have pulled through the air tight pad.
4. The sponge being inside the cylinder will not add to this process.
5. The atmospheric pressure is pushing upon both the piston and the central rod with the same
amount of force per square centimeter.
The central rod is also acting as a piston (since the rubber pad makes it air tight) What your design represents is a kind of air pressure lever. This is because the diameter of your piston is larger than the diameter of your central rod. It is a useful principle, but I do not know of a way to get free energy from this kind of device.
May be try experimenting with the following.
Take 2 plastic syringes of different diameters (the kind used for injections but with the needles removed). Connect their ends together (where the needles were attached before) with plastic tubing (air tight). This will not be an over unity device, but you may increase your Knowledge of how air pressure behaves in a closed system.
best wishes
floor
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@Floor,
Thanks for your observations.
I have conducted this experiment, it works fine.
1) Sponge is a solid material consisting of pores. The volume of air present inside these pores is almost negligible compared to volume of
sponge. When you compress a solid material, the reduction in volume created has to be occupied by air in open system and in a closed
system, it should cause drop of pressure.
2) Volume of thin rod is negligible compared to volume of sponge hence reduction in volume by pulling out the rod is also negligible.
3) The pressure of surrounding air (atmospheric pressure) pushes the piston into the cylinder corresponding to drop of pressure created
by reduction in volume of sponge.
4) Sponge will not experience any force due to drop of pressure because it experiences equal pressure on all sides but its volume gets
reduced, creating drop of pressure.
5) Atmospheric pressure pushes the piston with huge force depending on drop of pressure inside the cylinder whereas the piston rod
experiences negligible force because its cross sectional area is negligible. (Force = pressure X area)
This experiment can be conducted in another method also :
http://overunity.com/10798/pumping-water-with-atmospheric-pressure/msg288269/#msg288269 (http://overunity.com/10798/pumping-water-with-atmospheric-pressure/msg288269/#msg288269)
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@Vineet Kiran
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When you use a solid piston, obviously outer atmospheric pressure pushes back into the cylinder. hence you have to do work against external atmospheric pressure.
But if you use a flexible tube as shown in the picture below, the atmospheric pressure cannot push is to back to the cylinder because it acts alround the tube. Hence you are not doing work against external atmospheric pressure while pulling the tube out.
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@ Vineet_Kiran
Thanks for your interesting ideas, they inspire me in many directions.
In the drawing on the right, the hollow piston part of the
syringe is acting as an extension of the flexible tube.
floor
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@ Vineet_Kiran
I was thinking about your compressing sponge and...
see the drawing below
floor
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Those designs will not work. Compressing air(or any gas) in a air bag is not so easy. Tremendous force is required to compress any gas. Volume of spring remains same before and after compression. It will not create any change in volume.
Sponge creates change in volume after compression because of its fibrous structure.
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@Vineet_kiran
Yes I agree that they will not work That is what I am saying with the
drawings. They are to make this clear. I don't think atmospheric pressure
works the way you are saying it does.
Sorry if I have wasted your time
floor