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Author Topic: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems  (Read 19671 times)

Offline Magluvin

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #75 on: September 16, 2017, 10:41:38 PM »
Efficiency in speakers are very relative. We talk about 1 meter from the source. Half meter measurement distance of a 112dB@1m sensitivity speaker does not mean that the measured 118dB is more than 100% efficiency.


Horn loaded speakers easily exceed 112dB/1W@1m because the horn does not have a 4pi distribution of sound.
Also, a large area of the membrane emits a more narrow pressure wave, so a measurement at 1 meter might not mean a difference at 0.5 meter measurement by as much as 6dB.


Vidar.

I know that the 112db 100% eff is at 1 meter and that is just relative to that distance, but it is a standard measurement procedure and if at 1 meter it is 112db @1w then that tells us that the efficiency of the speakers input vs real output is 100%. Same energy in is same energy out. Like I said earlier, coreless motors are some of the most eff motors and these are coreless, meaning that the armature for each has only the windings and light weight but strong mounting support of the windings. Like the pancake cooling fan motor TK has shown recently, the flat disk armature is basically its windings encased in a thin disk of plastic, possibly Bakelite type or something close to it. Very efficient and able to accelerate or change speeds very quickly.

But, a very eff way can be made to be less eff by design. From what I read increased flux density will increase a speakers eff. So the pancake motor has a ceramic ring magnet that has opposing poles in say 6 pie sections. So what ever eff that motor is, it can be improved upon by substituting neos for each pole. Or buy pie section neos to remake the ring, NSNSNS.  So could the 112db @1w speaker eff be increased by installing stronger magnets?  I dont care about sound quality and more damping by doing so and so on, Im just interested in power in and power out even if it is just 1 freq. A ported box with a Q of 7 produces the flattest response for sound quality purposes down to the bottom tuned freq. Here again I dont care if it only plays 60hz and is useless for audio. Im just looking at in and out powers. Pioneer has 3 suggested box types for the pro 12. Sealed enclosure, vented tuned port and what they call turbo. It is a 4th order bandpass where the sub is mounted in a small sealed enclosure inside a larger enclosure that is port tuned to 60hz. The response is just a huge spike peak at 60hz and the rest is useless for sound reproduction. Why do they show this turbo box? Because at the DB Drag Races at car audio shows, the upper limit for db drag is 60hz. ;) That is all that box is good for is DB drag to see who is louder. And having that 105db advantage for a $100 sub, it can beat a $600 massive 15in 88db@1w sub playing 5kw with only 800w on the pro 12.  Funny thing is nobody seems to try it cuz most of them dont understand what Im telling you all here. The pro 2 is a shrimpy looking thing compared to the 15in that is longer than it is wide in dia and 60lb.

Mags

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #75 on: September 16, 2017, 10:41:38 PM »

Offline lancaIV

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #76 on: September 16, 2017, 10:51:38 PM »
        "We talk about 1 meter from the source."
It is common in physics and technics to conditionize the measurement.
For comparison of results by strictly same tests methods.

Clearly 1,5 or 0,5 meter distance gives other results,
different humidity,test chamber/room volume et cet. also !

https://www.google.com/patents/US5130608
https://www.google.com/patents/US5942858
In a specific application of the above-outlined principle of load control, the invention provides that the load is an electronic horn or siren.
Electronic sirens are known. An electronic transducer (loudspeaker) is driven by means of a modulation stage via an amplifier final stage. The mode of operation of this known electronic siren is basically analog. When commonly required loudnesses are to be achieved (e.g. 115 dB at a distance of 32 m), considerable power must be fed to the transducer. It is necessary to adapt the chracteristic output impedance of the final stage of the amplifier to the impedance of the load. This causes considerable losses.
The electronic siren according to the invention comprises a needle pulse generator which, via an electronic switch of the final stage, connects the electroacoustic transducer to a voltage source, in particular a battery

The load L in the instant case specifically is an ohmic load, in particular an electric incandescent bulb. The embodiments described herein are also suitable for inductive and capacitive loads or complex loads (loads of a combination of ohmic, inductive and capacitive elements). However, the invention is used in particular with ohmic, inductive and capacitive loads with low efficiency, such as incandescent bulbs, electro-acoustic and piezoelectric transformers and the like.
As an example of the application in an electroacoustic transducer as load, an electronic siren will be described further below, which constitutes a good example of the excellent energy exploitation


Practical tests show that an electronic siren 100 according to the invention can produce the acoustic power of a conventional electronic siren with only about one third of the electric power. It can thus be built with electronic parts of lower price.


Offline Magluvin

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #77 on: September 16, 2017, 11:16:33 PM »
Here is the computer model of the pro 12 at 1w below in the recommended Turbo enclosure by Pioneer. The peak is at 118.75db @1w.  100% efficiency is 112db@1w.  There ya go. Boom!! Overunity! ;) How can we say it is not? Ive provided most all the sources here that show it is correct.

The key was me finding that conversion calculator today. Magluving it. ;D

Mags

Offline Magluvin

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #78 on: September 16, 2017, 11:29:16 PM »
With just a bit of fiddling I changed the sealed internal enclosure to .3cu and the larger ported enclosure to 4cu. just changed box sizes.

123.37db@1w    That equates to 1370.88% eff of input vs output.  :o ;D   Can anyone tell me if Im wrong here? If so please provide sources and references for your arguments.

Mags


Offline Low-Q

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #79 on: September 16, 2017, 11:44:32 PM »
The efficiency cannot be greater than the mechanical force x exursion of the actual speaker cone.
If you put two 112dB speakers in the same sealed enclosure, and power up one of them at resonance frequency, do you expect the same electrical energy output of the other speaker?


Even if you short circuit the second speaker, the powered speaker will still play. This proves that the speaker cannot have 100% efficiency.
You have 100% efficiency when the system (with one short circuit driver) is perfectly scilence no matter how many Watt you put in.


Vidar

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #79 on: September 16, 2017, 11:44:32 PM »
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Offline lancaIV

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #80 on: September 17, 2017, 12:09:49 AM »
                        tubi or not tubi ::)
          https://www.abacus-electronics.de/
                          Joachim Rieder

                     interestant,but not the target
          https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=19860312&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP&CC=EP&NR=0173724A1&KC=A1&ND=5#
                        but here
https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=19900104&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP&CC=DE&NR=3821856A1&KC=A1&ND=4#

It is known how a capacitor behaves on the network. Although this apparent current passes through, it does not consume any current. A capacitor absorbs current during the amplitude increase and supplies exactly this current during the amplitude drop back to the mains. However, if the capacitor is switched to the mains in the charged state during the amplitude drop, the charge is discharged into the mains, even if the charge does not originally originate from the network. When the mains voltage is zeroed, the capacitor must be disconnected from the mains again because otherwise it would be recharged from the mains with opposite polarity. Thus, when the capacitor is charged before any amplitude waste from any current source, and is discharged into the network during the amplitude drop, current is supplied to the network. If this capacitor makes this during the positive half-wave, a second capacitor can do this during the negative half-wave. The principle also works with only one half wave. In order to operate this principle, it is not necessary for the capacitor to be charged from the current source to the peak voltage, but any charge can be supplied with an arbitrarily lower voltage into the grid if either the residual charge is carried out up to the grid peak voltage or from the grid Capacitor is not connected to the mains until the mains voltage drops below the capacitor voltage. The capacitor is charged in the half wave break. The principle therefore supplies current to the network for as long as half the time of any number of periods. It actually produces the current consumed by phase-cut control, and it operates as a capacitive phase shifter. Both are very welcome in public networks. Due to the parallel operation, the primary energy carriers which are already present are used as memories and thus a further problem of regenerative energy forms is solved.  A practically constructed system uses triacs as switches, which are ignited by a mains frequency-controlled electronics.  The capacitors have no irrational size even at high power. Although these capacitors are operated only polarized, so-called MP capacitors should be used for safety reasons.  Two capacitors with 167 uF each provide a current of 10 amperes during the half-period at 50 Hz. This corresponds to a power of 1100 watts at 220 volts effective mains voltage when fully charged to the mains voltage. For this output power of a maximum of 20 watts is required. This principle also works effectively when considerably less regenerative energy is available in time.

     ex-urs-ion : jeah,Baerig gut

https://www.allaboutcircuits.com/textbook/alternating-current/chpt-11/true-reactive-and-apparent-power/

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anergie
            Anergie + Exergie = Energie

Offline Magluvin

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #81 on: September 17, 2017, 12:42:02 AM »
The efficiency cannot be greater than the mechanical force x exursion of the actual speaker cone.
If you put two 112dB speakers in the same sealed enclosure, and power up one of them at resonance frequency, do you expect the same electrical energy output of the other speaker?


Even if you short circuit the second speaker, the powered speaker will still play. This proves that the speaker cannot have 100% efficiency.
You have 100% efficiency when the system (with one short circuit driver) is perfectly scilence no matter how many Watt you put in.


Vidar

I can understand that. But you are loading it differently and very badly to a point of stressing out the speaker as a whole and contorting the cone, inverting the rubber surrounds due to the pressures. That test would have to be the coil formers in direct physical connection with each other. Like if we had 2 of the 112db subs that are supposedly 100%eff this would test the drive motor of the speaker directly  If we took the pancake motor and put the armature in a vice to keep it from spinning, motor mounted to bench, then eff is 0%. Thats what I was saying earlier that its possible we need to look at how we load resonant circuits for the gain on output to be attained properly for best eff. Moving air, making sound waves through the air is the speakers load. It takes power to make the cone move back and forth at 1kw to rumble the window frames and nick nack on the mantle and metal garage doors in every house in the whole neighborhood. Do that with a 1kw fan, or power tool, what ever. The energy is realized at great distances in all directions. So we cannot say that moving air as a load is not a realistic load. Ask TK what he thinks of the amount of energy his home absorbs and rattles things from a distance when a guy booms down the street. Its real power.


Also, I had found in my resonant pendulum experiments where the pen had a magnet on the left side and one on the right, identical mags, and identical speaker coils for a driver and gen/pickup coil. I was able to get more voltage out of the gen coil than the supply was putting in the drive coil. Just that fact of more voltage should suggest something and we have seen many times if we put 2 identical dc motors shaft to shaft, the output voltage from the gen side will never ever reach the voltage of the drive motor and that is unloaded. And the other interesting thing I found with the pendulum experiments was that the positioning of the identical speaker coils to each magnet had to be a bit different in order to get the higher voltage out than in. What does that mean you may ask? Im in the belief that a dc motor that is specifically designed to be most eff at being a motor is not the best design for being a gen, and probably vice verse. I set the driver coil and pendulum to positions for max throw at given input, then bring in the gen coil for max voltage. Then I adjust both a bit at a time and I got more out than in on the voltage unloaded. Show me that you or anyone has accomplished that without using resonance and Ill quit the forum. lol. It cant be done without the resonance factored in. The positionings are not the same for each side. All using the identical mags and coils for the drive and the gen side.

Im dead set that me being able to get more voltage out on the gen side vs the input side at the freq of pendulum resonance is a big accomplishment. Nobody has shown that with an identical driver running a gen of the same magnets and coils, and they are operating at the same freq and speed of movement, not geared up in speed on the gen side. Im talking same as shaft to shaft identical motors. Now there may be a way to alter one of the motors to be a better gen, similar to me making the critical adjustments to the drive side and the gen side of the resonant pendulum experiments, but without resonance the altered motor to be a better gen still will not come close to the drive motor input voltage.


In the end, what Im hoping for is the possibility of 112db@1w may not be the upper limit. OU may be simpler than we think. Ill get into that later on. As in it might be possible that the speaker could be modified or redesigned to go above 112db@1w.   Like if the speaker really puts out 112db@1w, how do we account for resistance heat loss? Would the magnet/coil remain cool at continuous max rms power? If it is 100%eff comparing in and out, is it actually more eff than stated after we factor in the resistance heat losses, etc? Or is it the same as the cap discharge into an identical 0v empty cap where the resistance is not the reason for the 50%energy loss in doing so? ;) 112db@1w 100%eff in/out, plus free heat. lol

Lets see.

Mags




Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #81 on: September 17, 2017, 12:42:02 AM »
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Offline lancaIV

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #82 on: September 17, 2017, 01:25:19 AM »
                            fluid dynamics
http://www.crystalinks.com/moving_sidewalks.html

http://www.crystalinks.com/vortex_in_vortex_out.gif
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/ae/World_line-de.svg/250px-World_line-de.svg.png

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vortex_tube
this equation was published in 2012; it explains the fundamental operating principle of vortex tubes. The search for this explanation began in 1933 when the vortex tube was discovered and continued for more than 80 years.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2017, 10:06:04 AM by lancaIV »

Offline forest

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #83 on: September 17, 2017, 08:54:53 AM »
(...)                     
It is known how a capacitor behaves on the network. Although this apparent current passes through, it does not consume any current. A capacitor absorbs current during the amplitude increase and supplies exactly this current during the amplitude drop back to the mains. However, if the capacitor is switched to the mains in the charged state during the amplitude drop, the charge is discharged into the mains, even if the charge does not originally originate from the network. When the mains voltage is zeroed, the capacitor must be disconnected from the mains again because otherwise it would be recharged from the mains with opposite polarity. Thus, when the capacitor is charged before any amplitude waste from any current source, and is discharged into the network during the amplitude drop, current is supplied to the network. If this capacitor makes this during the positive half-wave, a second capacitor can do this during the negative half-wave. The principle also works with only one half wave. In order to operate this principle, it is not necessary for the capacitor to be charged from the current source to the peak voltage, but any charge can be supplied with an arbitrarily lower voltage into the grid if either the residual charge is carried out up to the grid peak voltage or from the grid Capacitor is not connected to the mains until the mains voltage drops below the capacitor voltage. The capacitor is charged in the half wave break. The principle therefore supplies current to the network for as long as half the time of any number of periods. It actually produces the current consumed by phase-cut control, and it operates as a capacitive phase shifter. Both are very welcome in public networks. Due to the parallel operation, the primary energy carriers which are already present are used as memories and thus a further problem of regenerative energy forms is solved.  A practically constructed system uses triacs as switches, which are ignited by a mains frequency-controlled electronics.  The capacitors have no irrational size even at high power. Although these capacitors are operated only polarized, so-called MP capacitors should be used for safety reasons.  Two capacitors with 167 uF each provide a current of 10 amperes during the half-period at 50 Hz. This corresponds to a power of 1100 watts at 220 volts effective mains voltage when fully charged to the mains voltage. For this output power of a maximum of 20 watts is required. This principle also works effectively when considerably less regenerative energy is available in time.
(..)


This text is very interesting, is that a citation from patent ? Which one ?

Offline lancaIV

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #84 on: September 17, 2017, 09:34:40 AM »
                            Good morning,forest (PT-time ;) )

This one :                                        net-infeeder
https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=19900104&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP&CC=DE&NR=3821856A1&KC=A1&ND=4#

and included "Citing documents" Applicant(s):  PETERS, HELMUT, 2854 LOXSTEDT, DE
https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=19921015&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP&CC=DE&NR=9107538U1&KC=U1&ND=6#

The invention thus makes use of the fact that the inductor coil acts as a current store, which must first be "charged" when a voltage is applied, thus preventing a sudden rise in current, and that the current is subsequently passed through a choke coil by 90 ° of the alternating voltage applied thereto hurries.  According to the invention, the reactor coil is then switched as a buffer between the DC voltage network and the AC voltage network, whereby, in cooperation with the controllable switch, the surprising effect is obtained of being able to feed direct current directly into the AC voltage network without a short circuit between these two networks. This results in a considerably higher efficiency, in contrast to the known inverters, which results in a better energy yield. In addition, the waveform of the current fed into the alternating current network via the inductor coil is continuous and can be approximated to the ideal sinusoidal shape
better than the current generated by an inverter. 

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=9&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=19581014&CC=US&NR=2855860A&KC=A#
rexresearch : syphon Hydromat https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uhm22kxHhd8

                                                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFOXnp1pL_U
                                                    run forever: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouroboros

to  electric amplifying syphon circuit :
https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=1&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=19940318&CC=FR&NR=2695768A3&KC=A3#

Sonance and Resonance circuit system : https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=19760504&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP&CC=US&NR=3955201A&KC=A&ND=4#

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #84 on: September 17, 2017, 09:34:40 AM »
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Offline lancaIV

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #85 on: September 17, 2017, 10:04:07 AM »
With just a bit of fiddling I changed the sealed internal enclosure to .3cu and the larger ported enclosure to 4cu. just changed box sizes.

123.37db@1w    That equates to 1370.88% eff of input vs output.  :o ;D   Can anyone tell me if Im wrong here? If so please provide sources and references for your arguments.

Mags

https://www.google.com/patents/US8004250

Offline Low-Q

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #86 on: September 17, 2017, 10:49:44 AM »
Mag,
I can't fully understand how you can get overunity out of a resonance system.
It's easier to understand the resonance concept by using a low loss spring, and a mass attached to it. The spring is the capacitor and the mass is the inductor.


If you try to extract output from the mechanical system, you also remove the reason why it resonate.
Say you put cotton whool inside the spring. The cotton is the load you want to put energy in to.
Now the resonance system has a low Q, and is no longer willing to sustain oscillation without energy supply.


My nick, btw, reflects this low Q as a speaker system with controlled audioable output. You cant get controll without effort.


Vidar


Offline lancaIV

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #87 on: September 17, 2017, 11:24:21 AM »
                                                                          Good morning,Low-Q
question and answer source : probably ( ::) ) https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reginald_Fessenden
                                                 https://worldwide.espacenet.com/searchResults?submitted=true&locale=en_EP&DB=EPODOC&ST=advanced&TI=&AB=&PN=us&AP=&PR=&PD=&PA=&IN=+fessenden&CPC=&IC=&Submit=Search

less (easy,simple and uncomplicated) and fancy if you understand french (frank und frei) :
https://worldwide.espacenet.com/searchResults?submitted=true&locale=en_EP&DB=EPODOC&ST=advanced&TI=&AB=&PN=&AP=&PR=&PD=&PA=&IN=louis+charles+beaupre&CPC=&IC=&Submit=Search

compare( if sufficient freetime avail):

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=20040219&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP&CC=JP&NR=2004056987A&KC=A&ND=5#

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=20050616&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP&CC=JP&NR=2005160215A&KC=A&ND=5#

Profil(e) "Tanaka Saburo" ?


                              Lord Kelvin capacitor/metal spring analogon
                              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charge_pump


                                                                            in-/con- version
                                                                actio  -         ?                 reactio
                                                                active-         ?                 passive
                                                            emission-   antenna             receiving

https://cleantechnica.com/2011/09/20/okayama-solar-absorbers-use-%E2%80%9Cgreen-ferrite%E2%80%9D-to-generate-super-cheap-electricity-from-heat/
                                search for Naoshi Ikeda et al. and their cristal phaenomen/effect findings and development

http://www.astrofoil.net/     http://www.astrofoil.net/astrofoil.insulation.tech1.html
                                             RADIANT ENERGY TRANSFER DEFINED
                                             transfer or telefer,trans-port or tele-port
                                             http://www.astrofoil.net/astrofoil.insulation.r-values.html
                                             http://www.astrofoil.net/img51.gif
                                             " ...... emit infra-red rays,which have no temperature ....."

                        anergy and exergy = complete energy
             http://www.udo-leuschner.de/energie/e00inhalt.htm
                               google translated
https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.udo-leuschner.de%2Fenergie%2Fe00inhalt.htm&edit-text=
                                 
                                  e-specially
             http://www.udo-leuschner.de/energie/SB102-07.htm
                               google translated
https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.udo-leuschner.de%2Fenergie%2FSB102-07.htm&edit-text=



http://www.energie.pt/en/ based by Jacques Bernier invention,1997 also sold by com(m)ercial name : Axergie
https://www.amazon.fr/La%C3%A9rosolaire-pompe-chaleur-assist%C3%A9e-solaire/dp/2862431109
and more :
https://www.google.pt/search?q=jacques+bernier+pompe&client=firefox-b&dcr=0&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwit35OM_KvWAhXlJsAKHckKCfMQsAQIVQ&biw=1366&bih=667

                    energy:                             decelerated becomes : matter/materie/material
                    material/materie/matter : becomes accelerated  : energy 
                    https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=8&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=19931118&CC=DE&NR=4215818A1&KC=A1#
                       Andrew Crosse: Abiogenesis of Acari - Rex Research                      incubator ? teleporter ? energy or materie-converter ?
                                    not such important-the answer- then the free energy device in house

Have a good Sunday and a nice successfull week
                                                                             OCWL
« Last Edit: September 17, 2017, 03:06:02 PM by lancaIV »

Offline Belfior

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #88 on: September 17, 2017, 01:37:48 PM »
playing around with capacitors and non-polarized and polarized (electrolytic) is pretty clear, but how about frequency? Can I use just any cap with 50kHz AC or square wave? What if the voltage is is in the range on megahertz?

What if the pulses are square wave from 0 to 5V of 50 kHz? Is that considered pulsed DC and AC only when it goes negative too?

Some of these signal / power sources are pretty unclear what they mean when they say AC or DC. They say AC if it is something else than a constant 5V



Offline lancaIV

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #89 on: September 17, 2017, 02:01:48 PM »
playing around with capacitors and non-polarized and polarized (electrolytic) is pretty clear, but how about frequency? Can I use just any cap with 50kHz AC or square wave? What if the voltage is is in the range on megahertz?

What if the pulses are square wave from 0 to 5V of 50 kHz? Is that considered pulsed DC and AC only when it goes negative too?

Some of these signal / power sources are pretty unclear what they mean when they say AC or DC. They say AC if it is something else than a constant 5V

     DC , pulsed DC ,square root AC, sinusoidal AC :
     (universal ?) consumer drive freedom degree

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Re: Resonance Circuits and Resonance Systems
« Reply #89 on: September 17, 2017, 02:01:48 PM »

 

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